Draft Thread: Who do you want with the 13th pick? Stanley Johnson and WCS added..change votes if you want

[MrMiyagi]

My boy Gambo mentioned on KTAR today that the Suns could be targeting Kaminsky!

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtoKhCX3qpE[/youtube]

[dmastro32]

Not really holiday was coming off of an all-star year.

[NavLDO]

Every time I hear Bledsoe's not on a good contract, I .

People are slow to adjust to the world of a $90 million cap. $14 million is the new $10 million. The reason we've been so eager to lock guys up is because the cap increase is going to make all of these deals a bargain. Just wait til you see the amounts handed out in the summer of '16.

You can roll your eyes all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that Bledsoe's contract is more 'player-favorable' than 'team- favorable'. It's not that I don't understand that the cap is going to go up, but that's a weak excuse to dismiss the fact that Bledsoe is not worth $14M per. And the cap hasn't gone up yet--when it goes up, then fine, maybe then he's worth $14M per, but this season, he did not play up to his $13M, plain and simple. $14M will be the new $10M then, but not yet--not this past or next season. just look at the contract values for PGs this past year.

http://www.spotrac.com/nba/rankings/point-guard/

Are you telling me that Bledsoe is the 6th best PG, NOT on a rookie contract? Is he $3+M better than Jrue Holiday (signed 2 years earlier)? An average $2M better than Ty Lawson (signed 2 years earlier)? An average $3M better than Tyreke Evans (signed one year earlier)? An average $6M more than Jeff Teague (signed one year earlier)? An average $2M better than Lowry, who signed his contract just 2 months prior, and actually showed more than Bledsoe did to earn it?

My point is, if your another team looking for a PG, and let's say the above 5 are also available. Who are you trading for? The cap didn't explode between 2012 to 2014 enough to account for that salary difference between Bledsoe and those guys.

Sorry, but you and LetsgoSuns are looking at this from the wrong perspective. I'm not saying we are cap-strained due to Bledsoe's deal, or even that it was a horrible contract for us. I'm looking at Bledsoe as a trade chip, and if I'm another team, and I can trade for Jeff Teague for $8M per, or Bledsoe for $14M per, who am I really going to try an get? I agree that if Dragic is maxed out, than it's a huge overpay on Miami's part, but I'm going to wait to see what he actually signs. Comparing a done deal to a rumor proves nothing.

So when we are all looking at what Bledsoe's value is as far as draft pick compensation, all I'm saying is that other PG contracts compared to Bledsoe's need to be factored in, as that weighs heavily on what his worth is, or even if he is worth trading for at all. I'm sorry, but I'm taking Teague at $8M, Holiday at $10M, or Lowry at $12M ALL DAY over Bledsoe at $14M, thus why Bledsoe is not worth as much as some of you all believe.

[bwgood77]

Every time I hear Bledsoe's not on a good contract, I .

People are slow to adjust to the world of a $90 million cap. $14 million is the new $10 million. The reason we've been so eager to lock guys up is because the cap increase is going to make all of these deals a bargain. Just wait til you see the amounts handed out in the summer of '16.

You can roll your eyes all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that Bledsoe's contract is more 'player-favorable' than 'team- favorable'. It's not that I don't understand that the cap is going to go up, but that's a weak excuse to dismiss the fact that Bledsoe is not worth $14M per. And the cap hasn't gone up yet--when it goes up, then fine, maybe then he's worth $14M per, but this season, he did not play up to his $13M, plain and simple. $14M will be the new $10M then, but not yet--not this past or next season. just look at the contract values for PGs this past year.

http://www.spotrac.com/nba/rankings/point-guard/

Are you telling me that Bledsoe is the 6th best PG, NOT on a rookie contract? Is he $3+M better than Jrue Holiday (signed 2 years earlier)? An average $2M better than Ty Lawson (signed 2 years earlier)? An average $3M better than Tyreke Evans (signed one year earlier)? An average $6M more than Jeff Teague (signed one year earlier)? An average $2M better than Lowry, who signed his contract just 2 months prior, and actually showed more than Bledsoe did to earn it?

My point is, if your another team looking for a PG, and let's say the above 5 are also available. Who are you trading for? The cap didn't explode between 2012 to 2014 enough to account for that salary difference between Bledsoe and those guys.

Sorry, but you and LetsgoSuns are looking at this from the wrong perspective. I'm not saying we are cap-strained due to Bledsoe's deal, or even that it was a horrible contract for us. I'm looking at Bledsoe as a trade chip, and if I'm another team, and I can trade for Jeff Teague for $8M per, or Bledsoe for $14M per, who am I really going to try an get? I agree that if Dragic is maxed out, than it's a huge overpay on Miami's part, but I'm going to wait to see what he actually signs. Comparing a done deal to a rumor proves nothing.

So when we are all looking at what Bledsoe's value is as far as draft pick compensation, all I'm saying is that other PG contracts compared to Bledsoe's need to be factored in, as that weighs heavily on what his worth is, or even if he is worth trading for at all. I'm sorry, but I'm taking Teague at $8M, Holiday at $10M, or Lowry at $12M ALL DAY over Bledsoe at $14M, thus why Bledsoe is not worth as much as some of you all believe.

No one thinks Bledsoe is the 6th best pg, but most of those guys entire contracts run during the lower cap. The cap rise is priced into Bledsoe's contract. When he is in the 4th year of his contract, he will probably be ranked about right. Personally I didn't think he was worth more than 12, but I wouldn't have let him walk for nothing either and would have paid him 14 before doing that, as long as it ran that extra year so he was locked in for longer.

[King4Day]

Dragic will get $108 million? In what world?

In other news, due to my boring day, I was playing the draft lottery on espn to see how many times it would take for the Suns to jump top 3, but I had to stop after seeing the Lakers pick drop to 6th and becoming a Sixers pick and them taking Porzingis four times.

You know that's going to happen and Porzingis will become the next Dirk or better and we will talk about it for years.

I look at it like this.
For the benefit of the Suns, it's best that Philly DOES get that pick. It might hurt if they nab someone who would have been good for us, but the Lakers are in our division and Philly in another conference. I'd rather the Lakers come away with nothing for this horrendous season and continue to be bad going into next season where the draft class isn't supposed to be good.
Lakerland looks to be awful for at least the next 2 years and bad for at least the next 3-4.

It'll def hurt but we can't go back now.

[RunDogGun]

If I were to bet on draft spots, I would bet that the Lakers get a top three pick this season. There are too many Laker fans around the world for the league to allow them to be cellar dwellers for 3-4 season. So I was thinking they get a top three this season, nab a decent FA, add a healthy Randle, and be back into the playoff picture next season, and we have seen from the past, the league will help them if possible.

[kennydorglas]

If I were to bet on draft spots, I would bet that the Lakers get a top three pick this season. There are too many Laker fans around the world for the league to allow them to be cellar dwellers for 3-4 season. So I was thinking they get a top three this season, nab a decent FA, add a healthy Randle, and be back into the playoff picture next season, and we have seen from the past, the league will help them if possible.

This is the only scenario available... Lakers wont lose this pick in the ****' lottery, guys.
Once they're in the bottom 5, it's done.

[Qwigglez]

If I were to bet on draft spots, I would bet that the Lakers get a top three pick this season. There are too many Laker fans around the world for the league to allow them to be cellar dwellers for 3-4 season. So I was thinking they get a top three this season, nab a decent FA, add a healthy Randle, and be back into the playoff picture next season, and we have seen from the past, the league will help them if possible.

A part of me agrees with this, but another part says the Clippers have been bad for a while and are now barely making the playoffs consistently. Maybe the league will allow the Lakers to drop and ride the Clips for a while in LA.

[NavLDO]

Every time I hear Bledsoe's not on a good contract, I .

People are slow to adjust to the world of a $90 million cap. $14 million is the new $10 million. The reason we've been so eager to lock guys up is because the cap increase is going to make all of these deals a bargain. Just wait til you see the amounts handed out in the summer of '16.

You can roll your eyes all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that Bledsoe's contract is more 'player-favorable' than 'team- favorable'. It's not that I don't understand that the cap is going to go up, but that's a weak excuse to dismiss the fact that Bledsoe is not worth $14M per. And the cap hasn't gone up yet--when it goes up, then fine, maybe then he's worth $14M per, but this season, he did not play up to his $13M, plain and simple. $14M will be the new $10M then, but not yet--not this past or next season. just look at the contract values for PGs this past year.

http://www.spotrac.com/nba/rankings/point-guard/

Are you telling me that Bledsoe is the 6th best PG, NOT on a rookie contract? Is he $3+M better than Jrue Holiday (signed 2 years earlier)? An average $2M better than Ty Lawson (signed 2 years earlier)? An average $3M better than Tyreke Evans (signed one year earlier)? An average $6M more than Jeff Teague (signed one year earlier)? An average $2M better than Lowry, who signed his contract just 2 months prior, and actually showed more than Bledsoe did to earn it?

My point is, if your another team looking for a PG, and let's say the above 5 are also available. Who are you trading for? The cap didn't explode between 2012 to 2014 enough to account for that salary difference between Bledsoe and those guys.

Sorry, but you and LetsgoSuns are looking at this from the wrong perspective. I'm not saying we are cap-strained due to Bledsoe's deal, or even that it was a horrible contract for us. I'm looking at Bledsoe as a trade chip, and if I'm another team, and I can trade for Jeff Teague for $8M per, or Bledsoe for $14M per, who am I really going to try an get? I agree that if Dragic is maxed out, than it's a huge overpay on Miami's part, but I'm going to wait to see what he actually signs. Comparing a done deal to a rumor proves nothing.

So when we are all looking at what Bledsoe's value is as far as draft pick compensation, all I'm saying is that other PG contracts compared to Bledsoe's need to be factored in, as that weighs heavily on what his worth is, or even if he is worth trading for at all. I'm sorry, but I'm taking Teague at $8M, Holiday at $10M, or Lowry at $12M ALL DAY over Bledsoe at $14M, thus why Bledsoe is not worth as much as some of you all believe.

No one thinks Bledsoe is the 6th best pg, but most of those guys entire contracts run during the lower cap. The cap rise is priced into Bledsoe's contract. When he is in the 4th year of his contract, he will probably be ranked about right. Personally I didn't think he was worth more than 12, but I wouldn't have let him walk for nothing either and would have paid him 14 before doing that, as long as it ran that extra year so he was locked in for longer.

Totally agree. We weren't in a position to do much better than we did, which is why I'm not arguing whether or not we made a good deal or not, I'm only arguing that his contract can't be viewed in a trade scenario as a 'positive', is all. And that effects what his value will be in a trade. Bledsoe is worth a lot more at $12M per, than he is at $14M per, and that could be the difference of a top 8 pick vs a top 5 pick, or whatever--not saying that's his exact value--I have no idea--just using those numbers as an example.

[bwgood77]

Totally agree. We weren't in a position to do much better than we did, which is why I'm not arguing whether or not we made a good deal or not, I'm only arguing that his contract can't be viewed in a trade scenario as a 'positive', is all. And that effects what his value will be in a trade. Bledsoe is worth a lot more at $12M per, than he is at $14M per, and that could be the difference of a top 8 pick vs a top 5 pick, or whatever--not saying that's his exact value--I have no idea--just using those numbers as an example.

Oh yeah, he doesn't necessarily have positive trade value. Point guards, in general don't hold a lot of trade value unless you are Brandon Knight.

[LukasBMW]

I wonder if the underworld workings of the NBA is what prompted Ryan to trade that pick?

"Well, the Lakers are going to finish in the bottom 5 and the league is probably going to reward them with a top 3 pick, so we might as well just trade it now."

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

I wonder if the underworld workings of the NBA is what prompted Ryan to trade that pick?

Probably just simple odds, combined with a reasonable guess about what the Lakers might accomplish in free agency, and a positive evaluation of Brandon Knight.

[RunDogGun]

If I were to bet on draft spots, I would bet that the Lakers get a top three pick this season. There are too many Laker fans around the world for the league to allow them to be cellar dwellers for 3-4 season. So I was thinking they get a top three this season, nab a decent FA, add a healthy Randle, and be back into the playoff picture next season, and we have seen from the past, the league will help them if possible.

A part of me agrees with this, but another part says the Clippers have been bad for a while and are now barely making the playoffs consistently. Maybe the league will allow the Lakers to drop and ride the Clips for a while in LA.

But the fan base around the world isn't anywhere close when you look at Clips verses Lakers. Plus the Clips weren't a go to team like Showtime was. The Lakers and Celtics were such a huge draw that the league went out of their way to have them meet in the finals two years in a row.

[schnakenpopanz]

should have lost that game to the jazz. but who knows, maybe once in a while suns might get lucky

[JMac1]

My boy Gambo mentioned on KTAR today that the Suns could be targeting Kaminsky!

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtoKhCX3qpE[/youtube]

Thanks dude....that was hilarious. I got the joke

[letsgosuns]

This league is so messed up. I do not know if the lottery is fixed or what. The Suns have never won the draft lottery in their history yet the Cavaliers have won it three out of the last four years. They did it last season with a 1.7% chance of winning. It is a joke. What are the Suns supposed to do. Even the one year they were really bad in 2012-2013 and had the fourth worst record in the league with a pretty decent chance of winning it, they actually went down a spot to number 5. Suns have had terrible luck with draft position. Maybe that will change this year and they will get lucky. Who knows.

Most people know the 1985 draft lottery was fixed for the Knicks as there is even real video proof of it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bX1kMlG8c7Y So ridiculous.

[RunDogGun]

Not really holiday was coming off of an all-star year.

True, but Jrue's allstar year consisted of a 17.7/4/8, right? Bledsoe has a 17/5/6 currently, which isn't too far off.

[kennydorglas]

This league is so messed up. I do not know if the lottery is fixed or what. The Suns have never won the draft lottery in their history yet the Cavaliers have won it three out of the last four years. They did it last season with a 1.7% chance of winning. It is a joke. What are the Suns supposed to do. Even the one year they were really bad in 2012-2013 and had the fourth worst record in the league with a pretty decent chance of winning it, they actually went down a spot to number 5. Suns have had terrible luck with draft position. Maybe that will change this year and they will get lucky. Who knows.

Most people know the 1985 draft lottery was fixed for the Knicks as there is even real video proof of it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bX1kMlG8c7Y So ridiculous.

Ohhh, it's fixed, you can bet your house on it.
Just see the recent examples of 'lucky':
- 3 #1's for Cleveland after 'The Decision' and a shameful letter from Gilbert (2 of that coming from impossible odds)
- #1 for New Orleans after Cp3's fiasco and a new owner trying to save the franchise (they jumped in front of that Bobcats team, maybe the worst of all time)
- #1 for Chicago to draft the hometown wonderkid to save the franchise (another impossible odd)

The system is completely broken.

[bwgood77]

The Lakers or Knicks will probably win the lottery because they are two of the worst teams, not because it is fixed. I'm not saying I wouldn't doubt the league WOULD do it if it could, but a big four accounting firm wouldn't risk it's entire firm on participating in that.

The league fixes plenty of other things though, like the Westbrook tech, Chris Paul trade, etc.

[RunDogGun]

The Lakers or Knicks will probably win the lottery because they are two of the worst teams, not because it is fixed. I'm not saying I wouldn't doubt the league WOULD do it if it could, but a big four accounting firm wouldn't risk it's entire firm on participating in that.

The league fixes plenty of other things though, like the Westbrook tech, Chris Paul trade, etc.

The coincidences make it is easy to question.