Season Speculation, Trade Ideas & Discussion 3: About Last Knight

[carey]

Yes, just having a team that I feel has some sort of chance at the title, even if it's not certain, or even just getting to the second round and having great battles, etc....this is what makes it fun.

Titles are unrealistic. We will probably never see them. If every team had an equal chance at a title, you would on avg win one about every 30 years. Right now we have juggernauts, and the bad thing is, the Warriors are young.

But realistically the same 3-5 teams will dominate championships over a 10 year period. So can we get into that top 3-5 teams? Tough. If we can even get into the next tier, I'm happy. Yes, it's easy to agree with "We need to make every move to make sure we win the title" and such statements, but it's unrealistic. It takes a TON of luck and a ton of great management, coaching, etc. We have none of that currently. BUT, we have a rookie GM and coach and a very young team. So there is a lot more hope for me now than Blanks, Babby, Hunter, Beasley, Brown, Scola, Gortat, etc.

Trading a boatload for Cousins (who likely signs his $200M deal with the Kings this summer anyway) or Butler only sets us back long term...it might help a tad to get us a 6-8 seed and get destroyed first round. What's the point, and our future and assets are gone.

Sarver has been shortsighted ever since he bought the team. This would be the absolute WORST time to be shortsighted.

Good post, but our GM isn't a rookie, this is going to be his 5th draft with us.

[OGBAH]

To the Toronto poster asking about Tucker how bout straight up for Pat Pat?

[bwgood77]

Yes, just having a team that I feel has some sort of chance at the title, even if it's not certain, or even just getting to the second round and having great battles, etc....this is what makes it fun.

Titles are unrealistic. We will probably never see them. If every team had an equal chance at a title, you would on avg win one about every 30 years. Right now we have juggernauts, and the bad thing is, the Warriors are young.

But realistically the same 3-5 teams will dominate championships over a 10 year period. So can we get into that top 3-5 teams? Tough. If we can even get into the next tier, I'm happy. Yes, it's easy to agree with "We need to make every move to make sure we win the title" and such statements, but it's unrealistic. It takes a TON of luck and a ton of great management, coaching, etc. We have none of that currently. BUT, we have a rookie GM and coach and a very young team. So there is a lot more hope for me now than Blanks, Babby, Hunter, Beasley, Brown, Scola, Gortat, etc.

Trading a boatload for Cousins (who likely signs his $200M deal with the Kings this summer anyway) or Butler only sets us back long term...it might help a tad to get us a 6-8 seed and get destroyed first round. What's the point, and our future and assets are gone.

Sarver has been shortsighted ever since he bought the team. This would be the absolute WORST time to be shortsighted.

Good post, but our GM isn't a rookie, this is going to be his 5th draft with us.

Oh, sorry you really thought I thought he was a first year guy. By rookie, I meant first time GM, so sub that in for your purposes.

[Fo-Real]

To the Toronto poster asking about Tucker how bout straight up for Pat Pat?

GET THAT MINUS ONE BUTTON MODS!!!!

[carey]

Oh, sorry you really thought I thought he was a first year guy. By rookie, I meant first time GM, so sub that in for your purposes.

Of course not. I'm not an idiot so I knew you meant "still relatively new." It is just not true. This is his 5th draft. Some GMs don't even get 5 drafts.

[GotEm]

Read on Twitter

Feels like McDonough has been trying to do this since 2013 but with no luck.

Obviously it's all easier said than done. I think Morey would've been fired if he didn't land Harden that summer and maybe Ainge doesn't have a job right now if IT didn't fall in his lap either.

[bwgood77]

Oh, sorry you really thought I thought he was a first year guy. By rookie, I meant first time GM, so sub that in for your purposes.

Of course not. I'm not an idiot so I knew you meant "still relatively new." It is just not true. This is his 5th draft. Some GMs don't even get 5 drafts.

I just meant his first GM process. I think he has shown enough good, but also some very bad...he works with a difficult owner though. To hire a new one now I think would be a mistake. But hopefully he doesn't have to make a big trade for a "star" to deplete our assets to prevent that from happening.

[carey]

Listening to Earl Waton on Newsmakers week. I'm starting to hate listening to his interviews. It's all nonsense. http://arizonasports.com/player/?a=329456

At one point he says he's never taken the court feeling like he'd lose. Odd since he's only been on losing teams as a professional.

Forgive me if this was posted earlier. I missed a few posts today and too tired to read all of them.

[carey]

Feels like McDonough has been trying to do this since 2013 but with no luck.

Obviously it's all easier said than done. I think Morey would've been fired if he didn't land Harden that summer and maybe Ainge doesn't have a job right now if IT didn't fall in his lap either.

Ainge engineered a Championship. He'll have a job as long as he wants one. The Nets heist and luring Stevens from Butler helps though.

The thing about the Harden trade is that it is by far the exception than the rule. At some point you have to just stop hoping it will happen and build a team instead of collect assets.

[Zelaznyrules]

Oh, sorry you really thought I thought he was a first year guy. By rookie, I meant first time GM, so sub that in for your purposes.

Of course not. I'm not an idiot so I knew you meant "still relatively new." It is just not true. This is his 5th draft. Some GMs don't even get 5 drafts.

I just meant his first GM process. I think he has shown enough good, but also some very bad...he works with a difficult owner though. To hire a new one now I think would be a mistake. But hopefully he doesn't have to make a big trade for a "star" to deplete our assets to prevent that from happening.

I tend to support McDonough, partly because I believe stability is important all the way up to the point where change is mandatory and IMO we haven't quite reached that point. The only reason I'm leaning towards accepting that we're almost to that point is that he still seems to be focusing on the idea that he needs to trade away his assets for a star. IMO that's like setting out to make an Oscar winning movie, that approach almost always fails. Just keep building towards a competitive team, if the opportunity arises to make that killer deal, great, but you can't force that kind of thing and it just shouldn't be your primary goal.

[bwgood77]

Read on Twitter

Feels like McDonough has been trying to do this since 2013 but with no luck.

Obviously it's all easier said than done. I think Morey would've been fired if he didn't land Harden that summer and maybe Ainge doesn't have a job right now if IT didn't fall in his lap either.

I think Ainge was pretty set after getting KG and Allen in on summer leading to a championship and nearly two. Plus he killed it on the Brooklyn trade, Dallas trade (Rondo and Powell for Crowder, Jameer Nelson, Brandan Wright, a first round pick, and a second round pick)?, and the trade with us. All three of those trades were killer trades.

[carey]

I just meant his first GM process. I think he has shown enough good, but also some very bad...he works with a difficult owner though. To hire a new one now I think would be a mistake. But hopefully he doesn't have to make a big trade for a "star" to deplete our assets to prevent that from happening.

Yes, I've said here a few times that I kind of feel like it's a devil you know situation because Sarver refuses to spend on the front office and always hires first-time talent. I'm scared of sitting through another learning process with a new GM. It takes time and I feel like teams would be licking their chops if we brought in another new GM, just ready to try and fleece us of our young players and draft picks.

[DirtyDez]

CBA rules questions:
- What's the soonest Cousins can sign an extension with Sacramento?
- When he can he sign an extension with a team that trades for him say draft night? Is it when the season ends or when the new league year begins July 1?

It might have to be one if those situations where we draft a guy and he's a Sun until 7/1 (ala Andrew Wiggins)...

[phnart]

It's sad that the interest in this team is at an all-time low. I fear that Sarver is going to ask McDonough to pull the trigger on a trade to shake things up that will ultimately set us back even further in the rebuilding process just to get 500 more butts in seats for the rest of the season. As much as I'd like to see the Suns have a leader and a perennial all-star, I don't see anyone worthwhile being available in a trade that wouldn't absolutely gut any talent we have (and we don't have much, really). As much as I like Booker, he would have been sixth man on the best teams in the Suns past at best. There's no one on this team that cracks the Suns all-time lineup, even with a 15 man roster.

[TeamTragic]

- Ainge is untouchable legend status right now (in fact he deserves to be in the HOF for his GM work)
- Sarver knows that we aren't contending and therefore is letting McD create a foundation
- Even if we get Cousins I'm not sure ticket sales will go through the roof (merchandising sales would improve though)

[Kerrsed]

The article posted states that the writer spoke with another teams GM and he was the one that was quoted as saying, "that the Suns would love to package their assets to acquire a star" and that he was "stunned that the Suns haven’t been talked about more leading up to the trade deadline because they are looking to make a big move.".

That has been McD's mission for a while now, re-create what he helped do in Boston. With that anonymous GM being quoted, it sounds like maybe we have put out more than a few offers out there or even some feelers on star players. With all that being said, and me racking my brain to come up with a Boston-Big-3-ish move that could be somewhat possible with damn near all our valuable assets, there is one that seems at least somewhat plausible.

One of the biggest "disgruntled" stars that is known to be looking for a new team is Melo. Say what you want about him, he is still a star player that puts up crazy stats and still has a great PER. Now the issue with Melo is his No-Trade clause in his contract, and he has to agree to waive it before being traded, and lets face it, as the Suns roster currently sits, there is no way in hell he would even entertain the idea of playing here.

Now this is where things could get interesting. Just like when we were courting Aldridge, we approached and signed a friend of his, one that he always wanted to play with (Chandler) to help lure him to the valley, which worked......until Coach Pop pulled off his black magic voodoo in the 11th hour. Now when i think of who would help Melo change his mind about playing in Phoenix, a few names pop into my head, but one of them seems like the most realistic route to take. He too is currently an all-star on a playoff-bound team, but that team is also headed for a rough road as he is currently expected to miss the next month or so. Yes, i am talking about CP3. Since his injury, the Clippers have gone 5-7, and even though they are currently 4th in the West, the are only 3 games ahead of being knocked all the way down to the 8th spot.

Now why would LA entertain such a trade? Because we have on of their old fan favorites, many of whom were pissed off when he was traded away for scraps, Bledsoe. While we could let CP3 heal for the rest of the season if so be, the Clippers could slide Bledsoe right in and keep their playoff position in tact. It could also make them major players when the Kings decide to move on from Cousins, and i dont know about you guys, but a Bledsoe/Griffin/Cousins trio would be a very exciting trio to watch.

But back to the Suns... with CP3 added to the squad, i think Melo would be more than ok with playing in a Suns jersey. So next season could start out with CP3/Booker/??????/Melo/Chandler. Yes, its an older squad again, but one that would bring us much much much close to a title. We also know there is another name out there (that many people HATE, but cant deny that he is one of the greatest), that is also a part of the "Superfriends" and is hoping to play with the other two as well, and he is conveniently on a year-to-year contract, allowing him to leave his current team when he see's fit. Someone that we might be in favor with his agent after sending Bledsoe to the big market LA team.

Sure it could cost us an arm and a leg to accomplish this, but i think it could be done while also keeping Booker and a few more of our assets. Melo? maybe something like Warren/Len/Knight/and a 1st. This deal would also save the Knicks around $6M right off the back this season. I think we could get CP3 (if McD talks to them right) for Bledsoe/Bender or Chriss/a future 1st. They too would be taking back less in salary and would be saving around $5M this season.

All in all, with all our outgoing players in those trade going into effect, and the addition of CP3 and Melo, our team would be sitting at around $83M next season, while the cap is set at $102M.

[bwgood77]

Spoiler:

The article posted states that the writer spoke with another teams GM and he was the one that was quoted as saying, "that the Suns would love to package their assets to acquire a star" and that he was "stunned that the Suns haven’t been talked about more leading up to the trade deadline because they are looking to make a big move.".

That has been McD's mission for a while now, re-create what he helped do in Boston. With that anonymous GM being quoted, it sounds like maybe we have put out more than a few offers out there or even some feelers on star players. With all that being said, and me racking my brain to come up with a Boston-Big-3-ish move that could be somewhat possible with damn near all our valuable assets, there is one that seems at least somewhat plausible.

One of the biggest "disgruntled" stars that is known to be looking for a new team is Melo. Say what you want about him, he is still a star player that puts up crazy stats and still has a great PER. Now the issue with Melo is his No-Trade clause in his contract, and he has to agree to waive it before being traded, and lets face it, as the Suns roster currently sits, there is no way in hell he would even entertain the idea of playing here.

Now this is where things could get interesting. Just like when we were courting Aldridge, we approached and signed a friend of his, one that he always wanted to play with (Chandler) to help lure him to the valley, which worked......until Coach Pop pulled off his black magic voodoo in the 11th hour. Now when i think of who would help Melo change his mind about playing in Phoenix, a few names pop into my head, but one of them seems like the most realistic route to take. He too is currently an all-star on a playoff-bound team, but that team is also headed for a rough road as he is currently expected to miss the next month or so. Yes, i am talking about CP3. Since his injury, the Clippers have gone 5-7, and even though they are currently 4th in the West, the are only 3 games ahead of being knocked all the way down to the 8th spot.

Now why would LA entertain such a trade? Because we have on of their old fan favorites, many of whom were pissed off when he was traded away for scraps, Bledsoe. While we could let CP3 heal for the rest of the season if so be, the Clippers could slide Bledsoe right in and keep their playoff position in tact. It could also make them major players when the Kings decide to move on from Cousins, and i dont know about you guys, but a Bledsoe/Griffin/Cousins trio would be a very exciting trio to watch.

But back to the Suns... with CP3 added to the squad, i think Melo would be more than ok with playing in a Suns jersey. So next season could start out with CP3/Booker/??????/Melo/Chandler. Yes, its an older squad again, but one that would bring us much much much close to a title. We also know there is another name out there (that many people HATE, but cant deny that he is one of the greatest), that is also a part of the "Superfriends" and is hoping to play with the other two as well, and he is conveniently on a year-to-year contract, allowing him to leave his current team when he see's fit. Someone that we might be in favor with his agent after sending Bledsoe to the big market LA team.

Sure it could cost us an arm and a leg to accomplish this, but i think it could be done while also keeping Booker and a few more of our assets. Melo? maybe something like Warren/Len/Knight/and a 1st. This deal would also save the Knicks around $6M right off the back this season. I think we could get CP3 (if McD talks to them right) for Bledsoe/Bender or Chriss/a future 1st. They too would be taking back less in salary and would be saving around $5M this season.

All in all, with all our outgoing players in those trade going into effect, and the addition of CP3 and Melo, our team would be sitting at around $83M next season, while the cap is set at $102M.

Well GMAT, I mean Kerrsed, this is a read after some sleep, but nice for a long post...now you need to re-open the sig shop...I know you are busy with video games, but time to post your funny gifs and great sigs for some entertainment.

[WeekapaugGroove]

I don't fault mcd for not landing some big star in a trade but i do fault him for putting too many of his team building eggs into that strategy basket. Sure he saw it work in Boston but its not a super viable strategy overall. I wish he would have put more of an emphasis on mining that diamond in a rough later draft pick or trade for a guy who breaks out. Find that draymond green or jokic in round 2. Ill give him credit for landing bledsoe in a good trade and booker late lotto but hes missed more than hit so far. Its an important 12 months coming up for him because if he doesn't do some good things by the end of next year he should be gone.

Sent from my SM-G930V using RealGM mobile app

[MrMiyagi]

The article posted states that the writer spoke with another teams GM and he was the one that was quoted as saying, "that the Suns would love to package their assets to acquire a star" and that he was "stunned that the Suns haven’t been talked about more leading up to the trade deadline because they are looking to make a big move.".

That has been McD's mission for a while now, re-create what he helped do in Boston. With that anonymous GM being quoted, it sounds like maybe we have put out more than a few offers out there or even some feelers on star players. With all that being said, and me racking my brain to come up with a Boston-Big-3-ish move that could be somewhat possible with damn near all our valuable assets, there is one that seems at least somewhat plausible.

One of the biggest "disgruntled" stars that is known to be looking for a new team is Melo. Say what you want about him, he is still a star player that puts up crazy stats and still has a great PER. Now the issue with Melo is his No-Trade clause in his contract, and he has to agree to waive it before being traded, and lets face it, as the Suns roster currently sits, there is no way in hell he would even entertain the idea of playing here.

Now this is where things could get interesting. Just like when we were courting Aldridge, we approached and signed a friend of his, one that he always wanted to play with (Chandler) to help lure him to the valley, which worked......until Coach Pop pulled off his black magic voodoo in the 11th hour. Now when i think of who would help Melo change his mind about playing in Phoenix, a few names pop into my head, but one of them seems like the most realistic route to take. He too is currently an all-star on a playoff-bound team, but that team is also headed for a rough road as he is currently expected to miss the next month or so. Yes, i am talking about CP3. Since his injury, the Clippers have gone 5-7, and even though they are currently 4th in the West, the are only 3 games ahead of being knocked all the way down to the 8th spot.

Now why would LA entertain such a trade? Because we have on of their old fan favorites, many of whom were pissed off when he was traded away for scraps, Bledsoe. While we could let CP3 heal for the rest of the season if so be, the Clippers could slide Bledsoe right in and keep their playoff position in tact. It could also make them major players when the Kings decide to move on from Cousins, and i dont know about you guys, but a Bledsoe/Griffin/Cousins trio would be a very exciting trio to watch.

But back to the Suns... with CP3 added to the squad, i think Melo would be more than ok with playing in a Suns jersey. So next season could start out with CP3/Booker/??????/Melo/Chandler. Yes, its an older squad again, but one that would bring us much much much close to a title. We also know there is another name out there (that many people HATE, but cant deny that he is one of the greatest), that is also a part of the "Superfriends" and is hoping to play with the other two as well, and he is conveniently on a year-to-year contract, allowing him to leave his current team when he see's fit. Someone that we might be in favor with his agent after sending Bledsoe to the big market LA team.

Sure it could cost us an arm and a leg to accomplish this, but i think it could be done while also keeping Booker and a few more of our assets. Melo? maybe something like Warren/Len/Knight/and a 1st. This deal would also save the Knicks around $6M right off the back this season. I think we could get CP3 (if McD talks to them right) for Bledsoe/Bender or Chriss/a future 1st. They too would be taking back less in salary and would be saving around $5M this season.

All in all, with all our outgoing players in those trade going into effect, and the addition of CP3 and Melo, our team would be sitting at around $83M next season, while the cap is set at $102M.

I'm sorry, but **** this plan. We would be getting significantly older while helping another team (Clippers) get better than us with a pretty significant age gape in their favor. Everything about this post is how you become the Brooklyn Nets.

Are you going JVC on us? Jumping ship for the Clippers? Good God, snap out of it man!

[asudevil]

I don't fault mcd for not landing some big star in a trade but i do fault him for putting too many of his team building eggs into that strategy basket. Sure he saw it work in Boston but its not a super viable strategy overall. I wish he would have put more of an emphasis on mining that diamond in a rough later draft pick or trade for a guy who breaks out. Find that draymond green or jokic in round 2. Ill give him credit for landing bledsoe in a good trade and booker late lotto but hes missed more than hit so far. Its an important 12 months coming up for him because if he doesn't do some good things by the end of next year he should be gone.

Sent from my SM-G930V using RealGM mobile app

I cannot really agree with much of this.

Putting your eggs in a 2nd round basket is not really viable. Of course their are guys who pan out in the 2nd. But you'd be hard pressed to find teams who absolutely WANTED their guy in the 2nd AND have that guy pan out. More often than not GMs shrug their shoulders and say "well i guess that's the best i guess" and hope that guy pans out.

He also did the best he could with the Marcus/Markieff situation. The two had become a cancer to the team. We basically gave away the lesser of the two in the hopes that it would straighten Markieff out. It only made Markieff more bitter. Then he did something nobody would have ever thought possible....we traded him for a late lotto pick. Most thought we'd have to give up an asset, but we didnt.

In the last draft there were MANY who were hooked on Bender, and others who thought Chriss should be our pick. What did he do? He got both. And IF either/both dont pan out, fans who were happy we drafted them have nothing to complain about.

Signing Chandler and not getting LMA....well i have NO PROBLEM with that. Chandler is putting up 8.5/11.5 on 67% shooting. He is a quality C, and while older, is living up to his contract. And signing Dudley/Barbosa, again its not like either of those two are preventing us from doing anything.

And Dragic. He was not happy, so he was traded for two potentially extremely valuable lotto picks. He made the best of that situation with that.

We must not also forget:

Scola for Green/Plumlee/First (Ennis)
He did resign both Marcus/Markieff to team friendly contracts (at the time they were steals)
Signed IT to a crazy good contract
Trading Gortat for a First (TJ Warren)
--------------

IMO though he will never live down the IT/Dragic/Lakers pick fiasco.

At the time though, that Lakers pick was seen to be EXTREMELY volatile. Who would have figured that the Lakers would end the career of a top5 player of all time as a lotto team. I was CERTAIN they would pull a Lakers move and AT LEAST earn themselves a playoff seed at any cost. And i was CERTAIN that pick would be a late lotto pick at worst when it was finally given up. At the time would i have made the same trade with the same players leaving and coming in? Absolutely not. But honestly both the Suns and Bucks probably regret that trade today.

And IT, i believe that the suns saw him only as an asset. Nothing useful for the longterm success of the team. They signed him cheap with the idea of flipping him for something. They did sell low, and the thought at the time was that it was a win trade because they added a first rounder for free. And that trade was useful in acquiring Chriss.

At the end of the 12/13 season the roster was something like:

Gortat/O'Neal
Scola/Markieff
Tucker/Marcus/Beasley
Dudley/Brown
Dragic/Marshall

An ABSOLUTE DISASTER.

Today:

Chandler/Len
Chriss/Dudley
Warren/Tucker/Bender
Booker/Knight
Bledsoe/Ulis/Barbosa

2017 First top3
2018 Heat First (top7 protected)
2021 Heat First (unprotected)

-------------

Of course at this point i'd be MUCH happier with the idea of having the Lakers pick and not have to moan about having Knight....but after inheriting a mess, this franchise looks 10x better than it did 3 years ago (and i'm speaking about from July 13 to July 16). And this roster has more promise than at least half of the bottom ten teams in the league today.

The direction of this franchise will be dictated in the next 6 months (trade deadline/draft/FA) and that is when i will start being super critical of McD. Until then, i can fault some of the things he has done, but i honestly have to be happy with where we are RIGHT NOW.