2020 Preseason Speculation - Lineup battles underway

AtheJ415 · Post #4561 » by **AtheJ415** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:57 am

Frank should never play. He's a bottom 10 player in the league. What, realistically, is he good at? He's bad at plenty and his 1 strength is supposed to be shooting / scoring but he's horrendously inefficient. Also, I kind of don't understand the common conception that we need big depth that much. If we drafted Smith that high and already have Ayton and Saric, that is 3 guys who can play center, and 2 who can play PF. You also have Cam or Bridges who can guard the 4 well enough to play there much of the time. Remember our best lineup last year was small ball, and it was one of the best in the entire league. Maybe we shouldn't have signed Jones and instead gotten a 4?

I'm hoping Frank was only signed because he knows the system and we have a game soon. It's non-guaranteed, and I would rather use that spot on a guy like Frank Jackson or a flier on Zhaire Smith, who has had insanely bad luck to start his career.

AtheJ415 · Post #4562 » by **AtheJ415** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:23 am

Even assuming Kaminsky is not here all year, I don't get why people assume we need another big. Smith needs to be able to play SOME minutes now. We have Ayton, him, Saric, and our 2-3 big wings who should eat up all of the minutes at the 4/5. We still have Jones as yet another 5. I get some don't like Jones but how many centers do we really need? Saric is our backup 5. That's where he excelled in the bubble and why he was brought back. If we do have Kaminsky, we have yet ANOTHER 4 / 5. We really don't need another big.

We should 10000% take a flier on Jackson, Smith, or Musa imo. Having Jackson's shooting or Smith's defense could be a big help. Not sure either got a good chance. Jackson had a couple moments. Smith got an infectious disease and it derailed the entire start to his career, but he was a monster defender in college with the athleticism to carry over into the NBA.

Revived · Post #4563 » by **Revived** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:30 am

RedIndian wrote:
Revived wrote:
Kerrsed wrote:I was really hoping we would grab Dewayne Dedmon. Even at 31 years old he was still good for 8 points, 8 rebounds, a block and a steal in 20 minutes a game last season.

I was hoping we end up with McLaughlin (did well in limited mins and showed some promise) and Dedmon for our final roster spots.

McLaughlin re-signed with the Wolves on a 2-way.

That’s a shame. Should’ve signed him before that, he was on the market for some time.

Mulhollanddrive · Post #4564 » by **Mulhollanddrive** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 11:08 am

All we need is a guy who can catch lobs off Chris Paul for 5 minutes a half.

Jones > Diallo > Kaminsky

Saberestar · Post #4565 » by **Saberestar** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 11:18 am

Frank Lee wrote:True to form... fans here drooling over other team table scraps

Shank redux?? Come on... Y’all Trollin me?

This post didn't age well. :lol:

grumpysaddle · Post #4566 » by **grumpysaddle** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 11:45 am

Flying Colors · Post #4567 » by **Flying Colors** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 12:25 pm

NTB wrote:You have to consider our 0.5 seconds system though. I don't think Dedmon can play in that style, not a good fit for the system we play. Monty and James Jones seem to focus on certain type of players with their moves. (Tbh Damien Jones is not a good fit either but they signed him for 2 years...)

What exactly is our 0.5 seconds system really?

Frank Lee · Post #4568 » by **Frank Lee** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 12:53 pm

That was uncalled for Grump :kissmybutt:

But well played
8-)

Beetlejuice · Post #4569 » by **Beetlejuice** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:39 pm

How are you dealing with this wonderful feature on leaguepass ?

NTB · Post #4570 » by **NTB** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:43 pm

Beetlejuice wrote:How are you dealing with this wonderful feature on leaguepass ?

I would like to know the answer to this as well.

NTB · Post #4571 » by **NTB** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:05 pm

Flying Colors wrote:
NTB wrote:You have to consider our 0.5 seconds system though. I don't think Dedmon can play in that style, not a good fit for the system we play. Monty and James Jones seem to focus on certain type of players with their moves. (Tbh Damien Jones is not a good fit either but they signed him for 2 years...)

What exactly is our 0.5 seconds system really?

It is a philosophy that is focused on constant motion via either passing, shooting or driving. Player handling the ball must make a decision in 0.5 seconds (ideally) and go with it. As Monty and Jones told the media repeatedly the system needs players that has high BBIQ and quick decision-making. I am not sure if Dedmon is capable playing in this system. I didn't watch him a lot but he gives me the impression of a slow pace player. I mean Kaminsky is not a basketball genius either but at least he spent 1 year with Monty and the team.

You can read further explanation and analysis below.

https://www.nba.com/suns/features/coach-williams-05-system-calls-faster-pace-and-quicker-decision-making

“You either shoot it, pass it or drive it,” Williams said. “Just don’t hold the ball. It has to happen in 0.5 seconds. I just want them to play with pace and play together. ‘0.5’ is just a way to play faster… For me, it’s a free way to play basketball.”

The system allows for a more simplistic flow, but in order for it to run smoothly, the right players must be in place. Williams feels that him and General Manager James Jones have acquired the right pieces in terms of basketball IQ and talent to bring ‘0.5’ to The Valley.

“I think that’s were James and I have synergy,” Williams said. “We know the kinds of guys we want in our system. High character guys who make the right plays from a basketball stand point, but know how to work, know how to handle a video sessions, but they can play in ‘0.5’. I think that’s where the league is headed.”

You can also find a analysis of the system here with some clips. https://theathletic.com/1398122/2019/11/21/the-read-and-react-principles-of-the-suns-0-5-second-offense/

Iceman36 · Post #4572 » by **Iceman36** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:11 pm

Beetlejuice wrote:How are you dealing with this wonderful feature on leaguepass ?

When logged in, I hold my hand over the left part of the screen and try to click the game link without spoilering me...

NBA should fix this quick!

NTB · Post #4573 » by **NTB** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:12 pm

Beetlejuice wrote:How are you dealing with this wonderful feature on leaguepass ?

Can you open this thread in General Board? Hopefully we will get more answers there.

Flying Colors · Post #4574 » by **Flying Colors** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:14 pm

NTB wrote:
Flying Colors wrote:
NTB wrote:You have to consider our 0.5 seconds system though. I don't think Dedmon can play in that style, not a good fit for the system we play. Monty and James Jones seem to focus on certain type of players with their moves. (Tbh Damien Jones is not a good fit either but they signed him for 2 years...)

What exactly is our 0.5 seconds system really?

It is a philosophy that is focused on constant motion via either passing, shooting or driving. Player handling the ball must make a decision in 0.5 seconds (ideally) and go with it. As Monty and Jones told the media repeatedly the system needs players that has high BBIQ and quick decision-making. I am not sure if Dedmon is capable playing in this system. I didn't watch him a lot but he gives me the impression of a slow pace player. I mean Kaminsky is not a basketball genius either but at least he spent 1 year with Monty and the team.

You can read further explanation and analysis below.

https://www.nba.com/suns/features/coach-williams-05-system-calls-faster-pace-and-quicker-decision-making

“You either shoot it, pass it or drive it,” Williams said. “Just don’t hold the ball. It has to happen in 0.5 seconds. I just want them to play with pace and play together. ‘0.5’ is just a way to play faster… For me, it’s a free way to play basketball.”

The system allows for a more simplistic flow, but in order for it to run smoothly, the right players must be in place. Williams feels that him and General Manager James Jones have acquired the right pieces in terms of basketball IQ and talent to bring ‘0.5’ to The Valley.

“I think that’s were James and I have synergy,” Williams said. “We know the kinds of guys we want in our system. High character guys who make the right plays from a basketball stand point, but know how to work, know how to handle a video sessions, but they can play in ‘0.5’. I think that’s where the league is headed.”

You can also find a analysis of the system here with some clips. https://theathletic.com/1398122/2019/11/21/the-read-and-react-principles-of-the-suns-0-5-second-offense/

Ahh okay, I understand now, thanks for the explanation.

WeekapaugGroove · Post #4575 » by **WeekapaugGroove** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:26 pm

AtheJ415 wrote:Even assuming Kaminsky is not here all year, I don't get why people assume we need another big. Smith needs to be able to play SOME minutes now. We have Ayton, him, Saric, and our 2-3 big wings who should eat up all of the minutes at the 4/5. We still have Jones as yet another 5. I get some don't like Jones but how many centers do we really need? Saric is our backup 5. That's where he excelled in the bubble and why he was brought back. If we do have Kaminsky, we have yet ANOTHER 4 / 5. We really don't need another big.

We should 10000% take a flier on Jackson, Smith, or Musa imo. Having Jackson's shooting or Smith's defense could be a big help. Not sure either got a good chance. Jackson had a couple moments. Smith got an infectious disease and it derailed the entire start to his career, but he was a monster defender in college with the athleticism to carry over into the NBA.

I'm not a fan of Franks game but in the short term I understand this move. Looks like Saric is going to miss a week or two. I'm sure smith will get a shot but he's also a rookie with a short training camp and as I've been saying since they drafted him he's more raw than people may realize. Jones is meh. So taking all that into the equation I can see why Frank was appealing because he can play right now and while he's not going to be good he knows the O and shouldn't kill them if he plays 10-15 mins until Saric is back.

I think his deal is non guaranteed so if everyone gets healthy and Stix looks ready they can release Frank and/or Jones (only partially guaranteed) and grab someone else.

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Beetlejuice · Post #4576 » by **Beetlejuice** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:24 pm

NTB wrote:
Beetlejuice wrote:How are you dealing with this wonderful feature on leaguepass ?

Can you open this thread in General Board? Hopefully we will get more answers there.

Yeah sure.

NapoleonII · Post #4577 » by **NapoleonII** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:44 pm

I honestly hope Ricky will consider us when his free agency comes up in 2022.

He'll be 32 by then. Booker will be in his prime, and hopefully content here with a core of Bridges/Ayton/Cam Johnson. CP3 will probably be retired or doing a Rondo contender tour.

Flying Colors · Post #4578 » by **Flying Colors** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:41 pm

I would gladly accept Rubio back in two years, hopefully no hard feelings. I mean we tend to do this with most of our white PGs

grumpysaddle · Post #4579 » by **grumpysaddle** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 8:10 pm

Frank Lee wrote:That was uncalled for Grump

But well played

I was about to change my profile pic, but the Suns did me a solid and saved me from having to make the effort. Thanks James Jones!

Mulhollanddrive · Post #4580 » by **Mulhollanddrive** » Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:01 pm

Pre-Season 2 Point %, 3 Point %:

Paul: 30, 0
Booker: 62, 40
Bridges: 50, 31
Crowder: 46, 50
Ayton: 60, 0
---
Payne: 50, 20
Carter: 35, 33
Galloway: 38, 52
Johnson: 33, 33
Saric: DNP
---
Moore: 35, 33
Nader: 12, 50
Smith: 44, 15
Jones: 71, 0

Pre-Season Plus/Minus:

Paul -1
Booker +3
Bridges -10
Crowder +4
Ayton -3
---
Payne -24
Carter -32
Galloway -21
Johnson -13
Saric DNP
---
Moore -29
Nader -10
Smith -21
Jones -13