Game 2: The Rise of the Rookies

[Fo-Real]

I would give up actual assets to get Jalil Okafor at this point. On a team oozing with young talent, he could be that final piece to put with the young bucks that make us dangerous for years. With Their current glut at C. he can be had.... and that is the only reason a guy of his caliber would be available. Young bucks going forward of Booker/ Okafor is a formidable one two, add Tj, Chriss, Bender, ULIS to that talent pool 3 years down the line.... could be a talented bunch.

[nashrambler13]

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V important analysis.

[PackSuns]

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V important analysis.

Interesting analysis. Maybe I watched a different game.

[nashrambler13]

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V important analysis.

Interesting analysis. Maybe I watched a different game.

Yeah I realize I am probably somewhat of a Booker homer already, but it's good to see maybe the best objective analyst saying he looked "so good" in a game where he shot so poorly. It's possible that I am just always looking for the positives, but the way I look at it is this:

Booker got to his spots tonight. Every time he missed one of those wide-open threes, or one of those leaners in the lane, or one of those drives against a big I was legitimately shocked. He can and does hit those shots most nights, even if they look like tough/bad shots after a miss. Also, I can't really point at the "1 assist/25 shots ratio" as there were at least 4 passes from Book to WIDE OPEN 3 point shooters (one to BK, one to Dudley, and two to Bled) that got bricked. It's not like he wasn't making the right passes or looking off open shooters. He was choosing to get to his spots and made the "right" decision on most plays.

And look (and this could sound very homer-y, and for that I apologize): we want Booker to be a superstar. A good amount of us think he could be a superstar type player. The reality of it is that Book played like a superstar would last night. Not in statistical performance, but in mentality. Not in makes, but in the type of shots he was getting. And, again, I know that sounds a little over the top, and I do think he could've played better, but the dude is 19. He's going to have nights where the shots don't fall.

[PackSuns]

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V important analysis.

Interesting analysis. Maybe I watched a different game.

Yeah I realize I am probably somewhat of a Booker homer already, but it's good to see maybe the best objective analyst saying he looked "so good" in a game where he shot so poorly. It's possible that I am just always looking for the positives, but the way I look at it is this:

Booker got to his spots tonight. Every time he missed one of those wide-open threes, or one of those leaners in the lane, or one of those drives against a big I was legitimately shocked. He can and does hit those shots most nights, even if they look like tough/bad shots after a miss. Also, I can't really point at the "1 assist/25 shots ratio" as there were at least 4 passes from Book to WIDE OPEN 3 point shooters (one to BK, one to Dudley, and two to Bled) that got bricked. It's not like he wasn't making the right passes or looking off open shooters. He was choosing to get to his spots and made the "right" decision on most plays.

And look (and this could sound very homer-y, and for that I apologize): we want Booker to be a superstar. A good amount of us think he could be a superstar type player. The reality of it is that Book played like a superstar would last night. Not in statistical performance, but in mentality. Not in makes, but in the type of shots he was getting. And, again, I know that sounds a little over the top, and I do think he could've played better, but the dude is 19. He's going to have nights where the shots don't fall.

Not criticizing your quote. Booker is a stud but he didn't look "so good" last night on either end of the floor. Also Oladipo was very "involved" in the game. He played better than our guards on both ends. It's just 1 game. I'm excited for the season.

[Thespianoid]

You know what is absolutely nuts? Bender has looked more NBA ready in his minutes than Marquese. No one would have thought that was possible a week ago.

not sure Watson/coaches realize this though. Pretty sure they'll continue to give more minutes/opportunity to Chriss.

There's a subtle but important difference between bringing someone along slowly and limiting a player you believe isn't ready to contribute. Bender's IQ on both ends has always been NBA-ready - we've seen the contributions defensively, just needs consistent opportunity to showcase his skillset on offense and not relegated to corner-standing duty.

Basically comes down to this: if a player is ready to contribute in specific areas, what rationale is there to limit those potential contributions?

[bwgood77]

You know what is absolutely nuts? Bender has looked more NBA ready in his minutes than Marquese. No one would have thought that was possible a week ago.

not sure Watson/coaches realize this though. Pretty sure they'll continue to give more minutes/opportunity to Chriss.

There's a subtle but important difference between bringing someone along slowly and limiting a player you believe isn't ready to contribute. Bender's IQ on both ends has always been NBA-ready - we've seen the contributions defensively, just needs consistent opportunity to showcase his skillset on offense and not relegated to corner-standing duty.

Basically comes down to this: if a player is ready to contribute in specific areas, what rationale is there to limit those potential contributions?

I agree. Bender has looked far more ready with probably a higher bbiq than anyone else on the team. It's infuriating when he is playing with Knight though and never touches the bsll.

[Thespianoid]

You know what is absolutely nuts? Bender has looked more NBA ready in his minutes than Marquese. No one would have thought that was possible a week ago.

not sure Watson/coaches realize this though. Pretty sure they'll continue to give more minutes/opportunity to Chriss.

There's a subtle but important difference between bringing someone along slowly and limiting a player you believe isn't ready to contribute. Bender's IQ on both ends has always been NBA-ready - we've seen the contributions defensively, just needs consistent opportunity to showcase his skillset on offense and not relegated to corner-standing duty.

Basically comes down to this: if a player is ready to contribute in specific areas, what rationale is there to limit those potential contributions?

I agree. Bender has looked far more ready with probably a higher bbiq than anyone else on the team. IT'S infuriating through when he is playing with Knight though and never touches the bsll.

I thought in the first game Knight was the one who passed to Bender for both his made 3's? Seems like Bender standing in the corner is by design though, mostly in the floor spacing role while the other 4 players on the floor are involved in the offensive play.

Probably an easy tweak to Bender's usage to put him in positions that take advantage of his skillset - run the same plays as usual but have him at the 4 role that Dudley/Chriss usually play. Double High PnP, elbow DHO, post mismatches, etc. Occasional 4/5 side and high PnR.

[letsgosuns]

I wonder what the front office is thinking about Bledsoe and Knight. They obviously can see how bad these guys are at running the offense. With guys like Booker, Warren, Chriss, Bender, Chandler, and even Dudley, racking up assists should be easy, but it is not happening.

Another thing is how many losses will it take until Knight starts complaining about coming off the bench? He basically stated that he is fine coming off the bench as long as the team is winning. Well so far the Suns do not like they are anything close to a winning team.

[kennydorglas]

Another thing to keep in my about the Chriss/Watson decision:
He's not a rim protector when he's not jumping (6'9 7'0 pretty much like Randle).

Watson even adressed the issue in the post game interviews?

[Damkac]

That was exciting game. It's bad Suns lose it but at least it increases the chance for high pick
Great game by Warren but I wish he were more aggressive. I bet if Booker was shooting so good he would want the ball more and try to score 40 at least. Warren was more like "Oh cool I scored many points. Mayby that's enought for today?" Actually Booker was shooting terrible and wanted the ball more anyway. Take few shoots from Booker/Knight/Bledsoe and give it to Warren and Suns should won that game without OT.

[Blackification]

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V important analysis.

Yup, I could see why Lowe thinks he looked good, he made some pretty good moves and had misses that were just tough misses on good shots. There were bad ones as well but overall he had some tough breaks on shots he usually makes, and that still didn't stop him from being pretty good when it mattered in overtime.

[kennydorglas]

not sure Watson/coaches realize this though. Pretty sure they'll continue to give more minutes/opportunity to Chriss.

There's a subtle but important difference between bringing someone along slowly and limiting a player you believe isn't ready to contribute. Bender's IQ on both ends has always been NBA-ready - we've seen the contributions defensively, just needs consistent opportunity to showcase his skillset on offense and not relegated to corner-standing duty.

Basically comes down to this: if a player is ready to contribute in specific areas, what rationale is there to limit those potential contributions?

I agree. Bender has looked far more ready with probably a higher bbiq than anyone else on the team. IT'S infuriating through when he is playing with Knight though and never touches the bsll.

I thought in the first game Knight was the one who passed to Bender for both his made 3's? Seems like Bender standing in the corner is by design though, mostly in the floor spacing role while the other 4 players on the floor are involved in the offensive play.

Probably an easy tweak to Bender's usage to put him in positions that take advantage of his skillset - run the same plays as usual but have him at the 4 role that Dudley/Chriss usually play. Double High PnP, elbow DHO, post mismatches, etc. Occasional 4/5 side and high PnR.

I dont know what's going on with Watson, because he was freaking thrilled when talked about Bender and how he'd use him.
He's shining even playing off his comfort zone, so I guess this is the silver lining here.
Hopefully Watson will unleash our baby unicorn ASAP

[KLEON]

We all know Westbrook is a mitch but why does he always behave extra mitchy when he plays against the Suns? Did you guys see him come near the bench after the game and talking trash?

[DaleyBlind]

We all know Westbrook is a mitch but why does he always behave extra mitchy when he plays against the Suns? Did you guys see him come near the bench after the game and talking trash?

Yeah i seen that, thought it was quite funny. Some people may not like it but i thought it was hilarious. I also seen him and Booker go at it as well. Love me some trash talk

[KLEON]

We all know Westbrook is a mitch but why does he always behave extra mitchy when he plays against the Suns? Did you guys see him come near the bench after the game and talking trash?

Yeah i seen that, thought it was quite funny. Some people may not like it but i thought it was hilarious. I also seen him and Booker go at it as well. Love me some trash talk

Hey, I noticed that you're a MANU fan. Whats up with your team? A draw against Burnley at the Theatre of Dreams,YIKES!!!!

[bigfoot]

Len should get a max of 10 games in the bench unit. If he doesn't changes things up by then he is a lost cause and it will be time to give his minutes to Williams or Chriss.

Ah, but then we might win a few more games and keep us from that top 3 pick we keep seeking! Bad plan. Keep starting Len until at least the trade deadline, then include him in as a 'throw-away' piece to make the salaries match.

Seriously, I have no idea what happened between the end of last year, to the beginning of this year, to cause him to lose so much 'game'. I was Len's last 'bastion of hope' within the fan-base here, but sadly, he's losing me as well, and rather quickly, I might add. But I'd seriously give him more than 10 games. I'm good with 20-25 games, and if he hasn't improved significantly, we just need to, again, add him as filler in a trade pkg this season.

I say this, because there is at least one GM/HC out there who will value Len an think they can coach him up, and while he may not even be worth a 2nd Rd pick right now to most, I guarantee there is a team that could use him, and may actually save his career. And I'd rather get SOMETHING for him, than get nothing at all at the end of the season.

Very simply Len needs to focus solely on rebounding and defense. His offensive game is pathetic yet somehow he is the second option behind Knight for the bench unit. I'd rather see Chriss and Bender get those opportunties on offense because it is clear Len does not have a post game, face up game, or ball handling abilities. He has little fluidity in his movements. And this is why we can not count the draft eggs before they hatch. Len looks like one of those major busts as a high draft pick. I would much rather have three mid-range draft picks than one top 5.

[bwgood77]

Len should get a max of 10 games in the bench unit. If he doesn't changes things up by then he is a lost cause and it will be time to give his minutes to Williams or Chriss.

Ah, but then we might win a few more games and keep us from that top 3 pick we keep seeking! Bad plan. Keep starting Len until at least the trade deadline, then include him in as a 'throw-away' piece to make the salaries match.

Seriously, I have no idea what happened between the end of last year, to the beginning of this year, to cause him to lose so much 'game'. I was Len's last 'bastion of hope' within the fan-base here, but sadly, he's losing me as well, and rather quickly, I might add. But I'd seriously give him more than 10 games. I'm good with 20-25 games, and if he hasn't improved significantly, we just need to, again, add him as filler in a trade pkg this season.

I say this, because there is at least one GM/HC out there who will value Len an think they can coach him up, and while he may not even be worth a 2nd Rd pick right now to most, I guarantee there is a team that could use him, and may actually save his career. And I'd rather get SOMETHING for him, than get nothing at all at the end of the season.

Very simply Len needs to focus solely on rebounding and defense. His offensive game is pathetic yet somehow he is the second option behind Knight for the bench unit. I'd rather see Chriss and Bender get those opportunties on offense because it is clear Len does not have a post game, face up game, or ball handling abilities. He has little fluidity in his movements. And this is why we can not count the draft eggs before they hatch. Len looks like one of those major busts as a high draft pick. I would much rather have three mid-range draft picks than one top 5.

I wonder how much different we would look today had we taken Gorgui Dieng. People have mentioned Adams, Noel, Gobert, etc, but Dieng has been extremely impressive with rebounding, assists, blocks, and steals and efficiency.

His first two games this year.

http://www.espn.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400899484

http://www.espn.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400899386

[Zelaznyrules]

Very simply Len needs to focus solely on rebounding and defense. His offensive game is pathetic yet somehow he is the second option behind Knight for the bench unit. I'd rather see Chriss and Bender get those opportunties on offense because it is clear Len does not have a post game, face up game, or ball handling abilities. He has little fluidity in his movements. And this is why we can not count the draft eggs before they hatch. Len looks like one of those major busts as a high draft pick. I would much rather have three mid-range draft picks than one top 5.

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. And often times, you know it at the time and not just hindsight. The year we drafted Len, for example, even prior to the draft it was clear we'd be better off with 2 first round picks outside of the lottery than the number 1 pick. But that was highly unusual. Last year I wouldn't have traded the number 1 pick for 3 picks in the top 10 and now, viewing after the fact, I still wouldn't.

JMO but I don't think Len really qualifies as a major bust as it was a known weak draft and there really weren't huge expectations for any of them as a result. He'll likely be a bust but he's just 23 and there's still a small chance that he will eventually play to his draft position and a good chance that he'll improve enough to make someone's rotation. And even if he doesn't, it's hard to call anyone else a major bust when you have Anthony Bennett going number 1 in that same draft.

[Zelaznyrules]

I wonder how much different we would look today had we taken Gorgui Dieng. People have mentioned Adams, Noel, Gobert, etc, but Dieng has been extremely impressive with rebounding, assists, blocks, and steals and efficiency.

You're right, there were a bunch of bigs in that draft that would really change the look of this team had we selected any of them (except Noel, IMO, overrated and still a big health risk). But I'd settle for just having the player that Len looked like he was becoming even if that guy isn't at the level of a Gobert, Adams or even Dieng. A serviceable center would make a world of difference for us right now.