Ghost of Kleine wrote:lilfishi22 wrote:Ghost of Kleine wrote:
I'm sorry man, but none of what you're saying adds up or makes legitimate sense. The fact that their friendship doesn't preclude them from making deals is completely irrelevant. The connections denote clear implicit favoritism well outside the duties of Harrison as a GM. Otherwise he wouldn't of intentionally withheld the information that the Mavs were looking to trade Luka from the entire rest of the league.
The legitimacy comes into question on the premise that Harrison knowingly withheld key information from 90% of the league suppressing legitimate interest from literally every other team out there that obviously could have fielded much better offers and Harrison instead caters to his BFFs' interests that resulted in the lakers being able to get Luka on a much reduced offer by not having to even bid against any other teams with clear interests and assets.
I mean it's only obvious to anyone that the lakers severely underpaid ( to their benefit) for a player of Lukas' value throughout the league. Now regardless of how imbicillic the Mvs owner may be, it's only common sense that when you're giving up your franchise player/ generational talent, you actually field more than just a singular low end offer.
Again, Lukas' availability was kept hidden to literally every other team/ GM until the trade was already completed by Harrison, who had those connections/ history with Pelinka. The premise of collusion comes from the context of Harrison intentionally keeping Lukas' availability in trade entirely secret allowing the lakers to be the sole bidders resulting in a very limited or suppressed value outcome significantly favoring the lakers interests. Again whom Harrison had history with and was/ is very good friends with.
And even their flimsy damage control excuses make no logical sense or logistical legitimacy either given the longstanding process of how trades are initiated through to completion. Everything that happened in this situation was secretive and the process very anomalous to the distinct benefits of the flakers themselves.
lol having a friendship in the NBA does not preclude them from making a legitimate deal. Otherwise you cannot make a deal with probably half of the NAB because more than likely you become a GM via having made a lot of relationships and connections over time. A lot of GM's come up having help high level positions (such as assistant GM) for other teams. Are we saying they cannot make a deal because of that? Are we going to say it's collusion if we deal with the Heat because James Jones played for Riley and clearly looks up to him as GM?
I don't doubt collusion happens in the NBA (just look at how many deals get done on the stroke of midnight when FA opens) but does that mean there is no other explanation than collusion that this trade was made?
Also there's no rule saying a GM has to make a public statement saying a player is available. Vast majority of the time, they don't, the information just come through the grapevines. If you know what you want and who to deal with to get a deal done, there's no need to advertise said player. Now, it's probably to their detriment a bidding war didn't happen but again, Nico/Dumont knew who they wanted and they may know Luka might make things difficult in getting AD if he and the rest of the NBA knew he was available.
Lakers absolutely underpaid, there's no question about it. If I'm Pelinka, I did my job. If I'm Nico, I still may have done my job if that's exactly what Dumont wanted.
The fact that they are friends doesn't mean it can only be collusion
You know that I've pointed out my clear distinctions on why I view this as a blatant example of collusion man. The shared relationship between the two of Harrison and Pelinka is just a small piece to the bigger picture of how/ why this played out with the lakers getting a generational value player for almost nothing.
Sure it's easy to argue that NBA GMs forming relationships and friendships is common. And there's of course ourse nothing unusual to that. I fully understand that aspect of this situation. But what is unusual is a number of key aspects involved with this situation that you and a few others seem to be willingly ignoring in support of your perspectives.
You argue that it's not uncommon for trades to be kept secret until they're completed......right? Then feel free to give examples of trades wherein a team had a generational franchise player become available and the team trading their extreme value franchise player opted to keep it hidden from literally every oth er r potential trade partner that could/ would have interest so that a singular team with limited assets could actually get that player at a significant discount because they didn't have any other offers to compete against.
Also on the premise of trading that franchise player due to concerns over conditioning and potential injuries when also taking back an older player with the exact concerning injury history that they were claiming to be intent on avoiding.
In simple terms,
"We chose to trade our franchise player for pennies on the dollar" in a trade because had concerns over his conditioning and durability going forward. So logically we traded for an older player with a well documented extensive injury history that until recently has rarely played due to those frequent injuries..
And the fact that it solely benefitted that specific team/ GM whom just happens to be very good friends with our GM that suppressed the trade information from the entire rest of the league is merely random coincidence. Also the franchise player himself stated that he never wanted the trade and was blindsided by it. And also, that very player just took his team to a conference finals a few months earlier, and that same GM just brought in players to compete more around him.
But again randomly just conveniently opted to trade their younger generational franchise player for an older frequently injured lesser star player on the premise of injury concerns and being able to be more competitive. And it all just randomly happened when that GMs besties team needed a new young marketable franchise player to replace their aging retiring one.
Lastly, even if the owner himself wanted to aggressively move on from Doncic over injury concerns. It makes absolutely no logical sense to suppress or keep Doncics'trade availability hidden from every other team except the lakers themselves. Unless you're saying that the owner and their GM to had the intention of purposely sabotaging themselves in order to end up with a low end unfavorable value return for their franchise player.
Again, if this is not uncommon and could be deemed standard practice sometimes, give me any example of this contextual situation happening before wherein a franchise decides to randomly just trade their 25 yr old multi time MVP level generational player for an aging frequently injured star and a singular 1st. When it's incontestable knowledge to even the most basic fans that the more teams that can field an offer, the bigger the value return in a bidding war.
Is there honestly even one other example of a situation being handled or kept hidden with a player of Lukas' notoriety and market value wherein in the trading team accepts very limited value return for their MVP LEVEL franchise player just to take back an older player who has the same redundant injury concerns as the younger more highly valued player they traded. And whom that franchise player stated himself that he didn't even know about the trade nor wanted to be traded.
Trading of a generational star in general is extremely rare. But I gave you reasons why Nico might've wanted to keep it quiet. For example if we wanted to move KD for the best package available but it happens to be like the Wizards or something, do you think it's better to let him know so he can "veto" it or just get it done?
I already said the Mavs got back less than what they traded away but....NBA GM's make dumb trades, this happens to be a really really dumb trade. Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity. It seem Nico or better yet, Dumont were stupid for wanting AD this much for their 3 years window that they would trade away Luka for it. But they did it, you
don't need collusion to happen if you're dumb enough to only involve one team because you want one specific player.
I also said most trades take place without the GM announcing that player is on the block. Generally what happens is that GM calls a few opposing GM's with trade packages and quite often, it leaks out that player might be on the move. It doesn't need to be announced. And I would also wager A LOT more conversations, potential trades get discussed that never goes anywhere nor leaks. But the more calls you make, the more likely is that to leak and as I pointed out before, the Mavs specifically wanted AD or Giannis, nobody else in their mind fit the bill of who'd they trade AD for. Maybe they don't want a Bam Adebayo and picks, maybe they didn't want Booker and other assets. Maybe they only wanted AD or Giannis. And for a secret to be kept, it only needs 2 people motivated enough to keep the secret. Nico wanted a deal to get done without Luka blowing it up and clearly Rob wants to get it done without getting into a bidding war. Both parties had a desire to keep it a secret.
If that's the case, it's not so crazy to keep negotiations with your main trade partner a secret from the rest of the league and maybe specifically Luka who could do a bunch of things as a superstar to nuke their preferred trade (rightfully or wrongly.)
Ultimately, it only takes one stupid owner, stupidly only wanting one specific player, at whatever stupid cost, for this to happen
without collusion. A bunch of fans on here (possibly you as well) think the KD trade was a ridiculous overpay and again, it only takes one owner, wanting one specific player, at whatever cost, to throw in that final MIkal Bridges in the trade to get it done. Sure, it's not on the level of the Luka/AD trade but it just shows, owners, especially new ones, aren't prone to making savvy value deals.
