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2013 Draft Thread Part 3

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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#61 » by WallabyPie » Mon Jun 10, 2013 5:36 am

Kerrsed wrote:
jcsunsfan wrote:Someone on another board (not a Suns fan) is proposing

#1 and Varajao to the Suns.
#5, Gortat, and Dudley to the Cavs.

Thoughts.


In a heartbeat.

Even though he is older by a year, his 14/14 average last year was amazing, and that was on a crap team. Gortat on a crap team was full of fail. I look at the trade this way:

Varejao >>>>>>> Gortat/Dudley & #1 >>>>>>>> #5.

Varejao has 2 year remaining (1 as a team option), both under $10M. Thats less than what Gortat will be looking for after next season is over.

Trade looks too good to be true (in my eyes) and i dont see why Cleveland would do it.

A bigger question would be, if we now have Varejao on the team, who do we take with the #1 pick? Do we go with Noel? We would have our choice of whoever we want.

In the last 3 seasons Varejao played in 81 out of possible 230 games (35%), he's 2 years older, makes more money and has a tarde kicker on his contract (final year is $4M guaranteed, not a team option) but somehow he's still ">>>>>>>" than Gortat and Dudley combined.

last 3 seasons:
Gortat 13.3 pts, 9.3 reb, 1.5 blk, 30.9 mpg, .547 FG%, 18.5 PER, .137 WS/48
Varejao 11.2 pts, 11.7 reb, 0.9 blk, 33.1 mpg, .503 FG%, 18.4 PER, .135 WS/48

The only advantage Varejao has over Gortat is rebounding, but their career rebound rates are very similar (Gortat 17.6%, Varejao 17.2%). There's a risk that Varejao won't be able to keep up he's outstanding rebounding numbers when he has to play more than 25 games a year (will he be healthy ever again?).

And how do you know what kind of contract Gortat will be looking for after next season? Especially if he's as bad as you say.

Also, there's a good chance we could draft the same player at #5 as at #1 but on a MUCH cheaper contract.

Kerrsed wrote:Doing a Google search on "Varejao Boston Celtics" brings up quite a few old rumors about him going to Boston and how the Celtics have been very interested in him, but wouldnt pull the trigger, as they thought the price (at the time)was too steep and would diminish their bench depth. Who knows if it was McD or Ainge that was the one intrigued in Varejao, but it would be interesting to have him here in PHX.

And there's as many "Gortat to Boston Celtics" rumors. Perhaps it was McDonough who wanted Gortat in Boston, who knows?
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#62 » by Frank Lee » Mon Jun 10, 2013 12:25 pm

AndyV has had a broken wrist, a torn ankle tendon, a dislocated shoulder and a blood clot causing most of his lost time.... early on he had some knee tendonitis and a high ankle sprain.

Not exactly injuries to label the guy brittle.... more so unfortunate.

I'm with Wally on this one.... plus I don't see why Cleve would trade him let alone us.

Cavs should just draft Porter and be done with it.... Let Noel slide to Charlotte and Bennett to Wash. Thank you for the SG.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#63 » by PHX Maniak » Mon Jun 10, 2013 3:08 pm

For what it's worth, I had a dream last night that when the team before the Suns were up to pick Noel and McL were available, meaning Phoenix would have one of those two.

Also I think the team before the Suns was actually the Spurs and they traded up. That's about all I remember though.

Maybe I'm prophetic.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#64 » by rsavaj » Mon Jun 10, 2013 4:27 pm

Roundtable: How important is the 30th pick? http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2013/ ... no-30-pick

McDonough won't double down on one position: http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2013/ ... irst-round

Fun tidbit from this report on the Snell/Ledo/Goodwin workout: http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2013/ ... y-mccallum

Kris Habbas wrote:***The Suns are starting to get a reputation around the league with the prospects. According to Snell he received a few texts from other prospects about a specific running drill that is tough. He was prepared and said finished ahead of the pack.


Sounds like we're doing a lot more conditioning work than the other teams are in their workouts. This + the fact that all of the interviewed prospects saying that Horny wants to run makes me really excited. We were hearing similar news out of Suns training camp 9 years ago. We're never going to be THAT fast again(the league has adapted), and it's not like we were particularly slow this year(started off the season top 5 in pace, ended up at 11 I think), but with some better players and more shooters it'll be so much more enjoyable to watch this year's squad than last season's.

Oh, and while that report says Ledo shot the ball very well, there's also this from his scouting report: "One prep coach said, 'he’s the single worst human being I’d ever been associated with on a basketball court' and called him a 'program killer'"

That is some vociferous negativity right there. I can't imagine the organization is gonna gamble on a guy like that.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#65 » by Frank Lee » Mon Jun 10, 2013 5:32 pm

#5 will get us one of Len/Dipo/McLem/Bennet/Porter/Noel.

I see no point to give up any assets to change that. All of those guys will be positive additions. One may be a stud, but he's not wearing that badge now.

Use #30 and trade up? May be, and also secure a good early second rounder from Cleve or Portland.

#30 / # 33 / #57 could all yield guys who could find a spot on this roster with little risk/investment.

Muscala and Wolters are two guys I'd love to see here and definite possibilities as late picks.


My sleeper sleeper at #57.... Richard Howell, the next Chuck Hayes
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#66 » by GetYourPHX » Mon Jun 10, 2013 5:32 pm

Frank Lee wrote:AndyV has had a broken wrist, a torn ankle tendon, a dislocated shoulder and a blood clot causing most of his lost time.... early on he had some knee tendonitis and a high ankle sprain.

Not exactly injuries to label the guy brittle.... more so unfortunate.

I'm with Wally on this one.... plus I don't see why Cleve would trade him let alone us.

Cavs should just draft Porter and be done with it.... Let Noel slide to Charlotte and Bennett to Wash. Thank you for the SG.


I'm starting to believe that this is a more believable draft order. Reports have been coming out about Noel's knee not healing as fast as they expected, and I'd hate to be the GM who drafted the guy with the bum knee #1 overall.

Since the Suns waited so long to have Bennett come for a medical check up, I have to think that the front office sees him as a lock for the top 4.

Same with Porter, odd that the Suns haven't had him in for a workout.

I could also see Len sneaking into the top 5 somewhere, especially if teams are scared about Noel's knee and want a big.

Something like -

CLE - Porter
ORL - Dipo/Mac
WAS - Bennett
CHA - Noel/Len
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#67 » by PHX Maniak » Mon Jun 10, 2013 7:43 pm

To me it's very hard to forget that Cleveland is still that advanced statistics reach-y team that took Dion Waiters and Tristan Thompson. That's why I feel Otto Porter still is the guy (although I'm obviously very uncertain) as I remember back to someone on this board who posted that website with all the advanced stats that Otto Porter looked good in, just like Waiters and Thompson did in the past. Not saying they for sure take Porter but at this very moment he's the guy I'd wager on.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#68 » by JMac1 » Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:02 pm

Frank Lee wrote:#5 will get us one of Len/Dipo/McLem/Bennet/Porter/Noel.

I see no point to give up any assets to change that. All of those guys will be positive additions. One may be a stud, but he's not wearing that badge now.

Use #30 and trade up? May be, and also secure a good early second rounder from Cleve or Portland.

#30 / # 33 / #57 could all yield guys who could find a spot on this roster with little risk/investment.

Muscala and Wolters are two guys I'd love to see here and definite possibilities as late picks.


My sleeper sleeper at #57.... Richard Howell, the next Chuck Hayes



I agree with this. That is why I am always flip flopping on players...they are enough players to like where we are guaranteed to get our guy. We don't have to trade up....as a matter of fact, it would be stupid to trade up! Stay where we are and unfortunately we have to give up Gortat to get us where we should have been if the NBA wasn't so damn intent on getting the sorry ass Lakers into the playoffs!

No trades will happen until DURING the draft, because teams are targeting certain players and they will not know their availability until during the draft.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#69 » by PHX Maniak » Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:11 pm

At number five the decision is most likely going to made for Phoenix, and if it isn't, that's not so bad either.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#70 » by scooter_22 » Mon Jun 10, 2013 10:39 pm

What does the forum think of Seth Curry at #57? I know it is the lesser brother thing again, but he seems like someone who could shot the 3 well.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#71 » by RunSunRun » Mon Jun 10, 2013 11:27 pm

scooter_22 wrote:What does the forum think of Seth Curry at #57? I know it is the lesser brother thing again, but he seems like someone who could shot the 3 well.


He's got a good bball IQ and he definitely has the range and accuracy to be a decent perimeter player. However, he's pretty small for a 2-guard and his athleticism is questionable as well, don't really see him driving to the basket all that much.

If only he was like 3-5 inches taller, he'd be a first round pick for sure.

EDIT : Didn't really answer the question, lol, anyways, he could be a decent get in the second round, but I feel there are better options available for us. However, if those options are off the board when we pick at #57, maybe Seth Curry could be our guy.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#72 » by Krush32 » Tue Jun 11, 2013 12:49 am

Nate Walters looks like Hornecek with a crossover.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#73 » by Cutter » Tue Jun 11, 2013 1:32 am

Kerrsed wrote:
1UPZ wrote:That Varejao trade...

I'd try to find a 3rd team...

Varejao is a terrific rebounder and a good big man, but I would try to milk his value to a team desperate for his rebounding and defense....


One of those links i was talking about (http://www.celticslife.com/2012/12/coul ... oston.html) mentioned that OKC would be great with Varejao and would have more to offer (than Boston).

Step 1. Trade Gortat/Dudley/#5 to CLE for Varejao/#1

Step 2. Flip Varejao/Brown to OKC for Lamb/Thabeet/PJ3/Perkins/#12

2 separate trades, but i put it together as one for the trade Machine: http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=kfvv9uo
Very nice thought process! Well done.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#74 » by Frank Lee » Tue Jun 11, 2013 2:24 am

You guys do realize that OKC has to have 4 or 5 guys on rookie-like deals to mesh financially with their big 3 salaries. I think its very unlikely they will empty their cupboards of their good cheap young talent that they gave up Harden for. If they are adamant about cutting their salary, I think they still have their amnesty clause to get under the tax limit and/or can do a sign and trade involving Perkins + to get a solid Vet Center.

Tax wise they don't have to do anything till Jan. Talent wise maybe so too.

You guys need to build a trade from the other side of the fence for a change. I don't know their team all so well to tell you what they'd do and really need, but I damn sure would rather have Zeller/Adams/or Plumlee And Thabeet platooning behind Perk WITH Lamb and PJones3 sneaking minutes second fiddling than GORTAT or AndyV and whoever else is tossed in. Is it wonder why so many drool cupping suns fans are thumbs upping this ?

They have no reason to rush into a deal for theG, knowing full he will be available if he is still on our roster come Dec. They are not as desperate as what many of you must think.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#75 » by DirtyDez » Tue Jun 11, 2013 2:54 am

I'm interested in the Magic pick without trading #5. Something about Oladipo & Bennett together takes our athleticism to another level. Dudley and the twins are kinda stiff. We have no explosiveness on this roster.
fromthetop321 wrote:I got Lebron number 1, he is also leading defensive player of the year. Curry's game still reminds me of Jeremy Lin to much.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#76 » by JMac1 » Tue Jun 11, 2013 4:09 am

DirtyDez wrote:I'm interested in the Magic pick without trading #5. Something about Oladipo & Bennett together takes our athleticism to another level. Dudley and the twins are kinda stiff. We have no explosiveness on this roster.


It would be hard to get the number 2 pick in the draft unless you traded an outstanding player OR gave up a future unprotected....of ours! We wouldn't do that in a "strong" draft.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#77 » by DirtyDez » Tue Jun 11, 2013 9:37 am

JMac1 wrote:
DirtyDez wrote:I'm interested in the Magic pick without trading #5. Something about Oladipo & Bennett together takes our athleticism to another level. Dudley and the twins are kinda stiff. We have no explosiveness on this roster.


It would be hard to get the number 2 pick in the draft unless you traded an outstanding player OR gave up a future unprotected....of ours! We wouldn't do that in a "strong" draft.


We have no outstanding players and our 2014 pick is off-limits. So you're telling me there's no way in hell it can happen I suppose. :lol:
fromthetop321 wrote:I got Lebron number 1, he is also leading defensive player of the year. Curry's game still reminds me of Jeremy Lin to much.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#78 » by Frank Lee » Tue Jun 11, 2013 11:01 am

So true we have no explosiveness... thus, I wonder, if the emphasis on the running drill warnings circulating by the tryouts has become a benchmark for the watchful eyes. Hornecek and Co must be looking for athletes. (I was going to insert a quote by John Wooden about Speed here... couldn't find it, but ran across this list...)

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/j/john_wooden.html

He's the GD Ben Franklin of Basketball. Some very sound sayings.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#79 » by mbn23 » Tue Jun 11, 2013 2:15 pm

DirtyDez wrote:
JMac1 wrote:
DirtyDez wrote:I'm interested in the Magic pick without trading #5. Something about Oladipo & Bennett together takes our athleticism to another level. Dudley and the twins are kinda stiff. We have no explosiveness on this roster.


It would be hard to get the number 2 pick in the draft unless you traded an outstanding player OR gave up a future unprotected....of ours! We wouldn't do that in a "strong" draft.


We have no outstanding players and our 2014 pick is off-limits. So you're telling me there's no way in hell it can happen I suppose. :lol:


How is there no way in hell it can be moved? There are no outgoing 1st rd picks for your team.
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Re: 2013 Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#80 » by mbn23 » Tue Jun 11, 2013 2:20 pm

JMac1 wrote:
DirtyDez wrote:I'm interested in the Magic pick without trading #5. Something about Oladipo & Bennett together takes our athleticism to another level. Dudley and the twins are kinda stiff. We have no explosiveness on this roster.


It would be hard to get the number 2 pick in the draft unless you traded an outstanding player OR gave up a future unprotected....of ours! We wouldn't do that in a "strong" draft.


Player wise (as a Magic fan) there is no one really on your team that the #2 pick is worth that you would trade. The only player I could see tradng for would be Dragic.

So I think getting an unprotected 1st in the '14 draft, and some provision if the pick is above 11 or something the Magic also get a 2nd rd draft pick
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