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2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread

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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#601 » by RunDogGun » Tue Jan 7, 2014 11:57 pm

parson wrote:
RunDogGun wrote:That was like saying, "You don't want to pay me $100, how about $200?" :lol:

I already posted that the per 36 stats of Markieff is almost equal to Milsap's and Marcus is right behind that. So we are getting almost double the production out of them than if we added Milsap. Asking for Plumlee, to me, shows you have no idea the value of our players.

No, it was like me saying, "If you're planning on playing Len at Center, how about trading the other guy to me?" You might remember, I asked for Len, assuming you were going to continue to play Plumlee in front of him.

But if your organization is going to field 2 teams and needs 2 starting Centers, I apologize.

As for your posting of numbers that make the twins being each as good as Millsap, I've already reached my sarcasm limit for the day.


Per36, was the only stats I can use to compare them, because there are limited games where Milsap plays the minutes the twins do. But since you won't do the research yourself, so your comments won't seem stupid here, let's look at Milsaps games where he played between 20-29 minutes. (13.4 points, 7.3 rebounds, 2.2 assists in 27.8 minutes per game). His averages of those ten games are very similar to the twins. I don't know why you think that is funny. By the way, Markieff averages 12.2/6.1/1.7 in 25.6 minutes. You don't think those numbers are pretty close?

Do some research. And I say your trade sucks for us. And that is just the twins, yet you want even more? :lol:
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#602 » by parson » Wed Jan 8, 2014 12:04 am

carey wrote:
parson wrote:But if your organization is going to field 2 teams and needs 2 starting Centers, I apologize.


I can't figure out if you're being deliberately obtuse or you just don't understand the long term approach required to rebuild a team. Let me spell it out for you. Plumlee is our starting C. He's playing very well. Len is the C of the future, and that future is probably 3 to 4 years down the line. It takes most big men a long time to develop. You need to realize that Plumlee is already 25. He's got 5 years of basketball on Alex Len. So, no, we're not fielding 2 teams and we won't have 2 starting C's. We have one starting Center and one back-up Center that hopefully one day will be a starting Center.

This is why it's so hard to go on other boards - visitors always end up bothering someone.

I was simply presenting a trade where you noticeably upgrade your PF position at the cost of the twins and whichever Center you don't want.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#603 » by RunDogGun » Wed Jan 8, 2014 12:08 am

parson wrote:
carey wrote:
parson wrote:But if your organization is going to field 2 teams and needs 2 starting Centers, I apologize.


I can't figure out if you're being deliberately obtuse or you just don't understand the long term approach required to rebuild a team. Let me spell it out for you. Plumlee is our starting C. He's playing very well. Len is the C of the future, and that future is probably 3 to 4 years down the line. It takes most big men a long time to develop. You need to realize that Plumlee is already 25. He's got 5 years of basketball on Alex Len. So, no, we're not fielding 2 teams and we won't have 2 starting C's. We have one starting Center and one back-up Center that hopefully one day will be a starting Center.

This is why it's so hard to go on other boards - visitors always end up bothering someone.

I was simply presenting a trade where you noticeably upgrade your PF position at the cost of the twins and whichever Center you don't want.


But you didn't do your research before making your trade. And when presented with the numbers, you ignore them, and then make a smartarse comment. Then you wonder why you may be offensive? :lol:
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#604 » by Qwigglez » Wed Jan 8, 2014 12:14 am

BurningHeart wrote:We're not going to be making major trades involving contributors to our team unless a superstar comes along with it. Don't you guys see how amazing our chemistry is this year? If you think McDonough is as smart as he is, you'd realize there's no way he's going to mess with what's happening right now unless it's clearly worth it.

Millsap? Young? C'mon now.


Even with amazing chemistry this team isn't gonna get far the way it's currently constructed...
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#605 » by RunDogGun » Wed Jan 8, 2014 12:22 am

Qwigglez wrote:
BurningHeart wrote:We're not going to be making major trades involving contributors to our team unless a superstar comes along with it. Don't you guys see how amazing our chemistry is this year? If you think McDonough is as smart as he is, you'd realize there's no way he's going to mess with what's happening right now unless it's clearly worth it.

Millsap? Young? C'mon now.


Even with amazing chemistry this team isn't gonna get far the way it's currently constructed...

Totally, and we won't win 25 games as currently constructed. :D
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#606 » by carey » Wed Jan 8, 2014 12:22 am

parson wrote: I was simply presenting a trade where you noticeably upgrade your PF position at the cost of the twins and whichever Center you don't want.


It's funny because I love Paul Milsap's game, I really do. It's just that he's already 28 and I'm not sure if he's going to be part of the core going forward like a Thad Young would.

I think Paul is the kind of guy Cotton would have loved to coach. I don't mind acquiring him either but I wouldn't give up assets of consequence. Not too mention he was a FA that we could have just signed if we wanted to six months ago.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#607 » by JDLAW » Wed Jan 8, 2014 12:27 am

carey wrote:
JDLAW wrote:Show me. I do not see any posts about trading for Thad Young before January 5, 2014, the day of the tweet. Maybe I missed them as I only went back a couple of days.


He's been mentioned several times as a possible target on here for weeks. Sorry you don't remember but he shouldn't have to comb through hundreds of posts because you won't take his word for it. Do it yourself.


I have looked through a lot of pages in this thread and do not see any discussion of Young, maybe it was in the previous version of this thread. But hey I'll take your word for it. Nevertheless, my point remains the same the Tweeter - Fischer - is the only Philadelphia stating that the Suns have interest in Young and I am raising doubts about his sources and the veracity of his comments.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#608 » by Wannabe MEP » Wed Jan 8, 2014 12:39 am

MrMiyagi wrote:Los Soles, doesn't Plumlee fit the quickness bill for us even though he plays center? I mean according to their Draft Express profiles, Lou and Miles had similar lane agility and 3/4 sprint (Lou was slightly quicker). Plumlee also recorded better times than Thad. I know those numbers are probably different now, but it's interesting to consider.


:jawdrop:

I hadn't seen Plumlee's numbers. I mean, just watching him play, he looked very mobile for a big. But...holy **** :o

Draft measurement history for centers:
http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-dra ... ll&sort=12

Draft measurement averages:
http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-dra ... s&year=All

Plumlee is in the conversation for most athletic center in DraftExpress's database. Scratch that: he is the most athletic center in the database.

I mean, max vert, e.g.:
Blake Griffin -- 35.5
Dwight Howard -- 35.5
JaVale McGee -- 32.5
Amare Stoudemire -- 35.5
Miles Plumlee -- 40.5

That's crazy.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#609 » by carey » Wed Jan 8, 2014 12:44 am

[tweet]https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/status/420708349450010624[/tweet]

This is something I'd like to get in on. If he could be had for the Indiana pick I'd be interested. Wouldn't give up much else, but I think Motie has a lot of potential. I know smaller moves like this and Pierre Jackson that I've been advocating don't move the needle much but I think they are long view potential players, like Goodwin & Len.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#610 » by JDLAW » Wed Jan 8, 2014 12:45 am

Qwigglez wrote:
BurningHeart wrote:We're not going to be making major trades involving contributors to our team unless a superstar comes along with it. Don't you guys see how amazing our chemistry is this year? If you think McDonough is as smart as he is, you'd realize there's no way he's going to mess with what's happening right now unless it's clearly worth it.

Millsap? Young? C'mon now.


Even with amazing chemistry this team isn't gonna get far the way it's currently constructed...


Who cares how far we get this year. We have gone farther than anyone anticipated in a rebuilding process. Now is not the time to squander assets on middle of the road players like Milsap or Young. If the price is very cheap maybe but when you are talking about 2-3 firsts and a player or two, you have lost all connection with sanity. Milsap is a nice player whose game has become more and more perimeter oriented over the years. He is undersized at 6'8' and has difficulty getting shots in the interior against the bigger players and has trouble defending longer post players - one of the reasons the Jazz were willing to part with him and go with bigger players. Substituting him for Frye does not make Suns better, but does make them shorter. Young is a different dynamic, he is 6'8 and slender. As a consequence he is a perimeter player and slasher.

I do not know why there is the clamor to replace a player who is playing very well at the 4 and 5 spot with shorter more expensive players during the season and taking the risk of fouling up the chemistry of this team.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#611 » by grumpysaddle » Wed Jan 8, 2014 12:46 am

DRK wrote:
grumpysaddle wrote:Guys... guys. GUYS! I KNOW... let's trade Len/Plumlee/Morris Bros./3 picks for Paul Millsap. WHY YOU NOT DO?!?!

I prefer Gasol over Millsap to be honest. Older, less athletic, and worse on offence.
Even better, I wonder if we can give Chicago a call and ask about Boozer?

Plumlee, the Morris Twins and Okafor should do it.


Why not throw in Dragic?!?
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#612 » by Frank Lee » Wed Jan 8, 2014 12:55 am

It all seems rather silly at this point. I am imagining McDo's calls to other teams involves trying to help them facilitate a trade as the third wheel and/or peddling off Okafor and a pick for something of value.

It would be rather surprising to see him mess with what we have, unless of course, it brings back somebody who can legitimately fit in for the next two or three yrs.... and is an upgrade.

This team can beat anybody on any given night, and as is, will be a very risky 1st round opponent to face. Getting there is the potatoes, anything else is gravy.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#613 » by BurningHeart » Wed Jan 8, 2014 1:12 am

Qwigglez wrote:
BurningHeart wrote:We're not going to be making major trades involving contributors to our team unless a superstar comes along with it. Don't you guys see how amazing our chemistry is this year? If you think McDonough is as smart as he is, you'd realize there's no way he's going to mess with what's happening right now unless it's clearly worth it.

Millsap? Young? C'mon now.


Even with amazing chemistry this team isn't gonna get far the way it's currently constructed...


Yeah tell the 2010 Suns that.

Excuse me if I don't listen to anyone prattling on about what the Suns are or aren't going to be able to do this year. This team has already made fools of the basketball world and a vast majority of Suns fans.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#614 » by parson » Wed Jan 8, 2014 1:14 am

RunDogGun wrote:But you didn't do your research before making your trade. And when presented with the numbers, you ignore them, and then make a smartarse comment. Then you wonder why you may be offensive? :lol:

Listen, you've won: I'm leaving. You've gotten offended long enough that the idea's dead.

Leaving aside YOUR smart remarks (several of them, if you want to count), can you see how you had to twist the "research" to show your results? Are you capable of realizing that any "research" that shows that 2 bench players are better than Paul Millsap is, to say the least, curious?

I offered a huge improvement over your present PF - at the cost of 3 backups. You pick the backups between Len and Plumlee - I take the one you say's a backup; between Morris and Frye and between - again, I'll take the backup; between ...well, you should get the idea.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#615 » by lilfishi22 » Wed Jan 8, 2014 1:29 am

Los Soles wrote:
MrMiyagi wrote:Los Soles, doesn't Plumlee fit the quickness bill for us even though he plays center? I mean according to their Draft Express profiles, Lou and Miles had similar lane agility and 3/4 sprint (Lou was slightly quicker). Plumlee also recorded better times than Thad. I know those numbers are probably different now, but it's interesting to consider.


:jawdrop:

I hadn't seen Plumlee's numbers. I mean, just watching him play, he looked very mobile for a big. But...holy **** :o

Draft measurement history for centers:
http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-dra ... ll&sort=12

Draft measurement averages:
http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-dra ... s&year=All

Plumlee is in the conversation for most athletic center in DraftExpress's database. Scratch that: he is the most athletic center in the database.

I mean, max vert, e.g.:
Blake Griffin -- 35.5
Dwight Howard -- 35.5
JaVale McGee -- 32.5
Amare Stoudemire -- 35.5
Miles Plumlee -- 40.5

That's crazy.

Wonder why we don't see more dunks over people from him. We see guys like Dwight, prime Amare and Blake Griffin, routinely dunk on or over defenders.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#616 » by thamadkant » Wed Jan 8, 2014 1:57 am

Qwigglez wrote:
BurningHeart wrote:We're not going to be making major trades involving contributors to our team unless a superstar comes along with it. Don't you guys see how amazing our chemistry is this year? If you think McDonough is as smart as he is, you'd realize there's no way he's going to mess with what's happening right now unless it's clearly worth it.

Millsap? Young? C'mon now.


Even with amazing chemistry this team isn't gonna get far the way it's currently constructed...



That's fine...

Rome wasn't built in a day...

Making moves for the sake of moves is bad...
Don't want no mcDonalds in the middle of the Rome as center piece if you get my drift...
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#617 » by INFORMER-93 » Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:16 am

gaspar wrote:
INFORMER-93 wrote:I'm not sure McDonough would be interested in giving up any assets for Paul Millsap. I don't think he would see him as enough of an upgrade over the Morris Twins.

Now that's funny. You think Millsap is not enough of an upgrade over the twins but Thad Young is?
They both have same contracts (Thad will opt out after next season IMO) and Millsap is arguably the better player. Millsap is as efficient as a scorer but a much better rebounder and post defender.


I don't think Millsap is a better player. And I don't think he's still getting better. I don't think he is as good of a scorer as Young, and he's not as athletic. And Young is younger. So yes, I prefer Young over Millsap.

And I didn't say Millsap isn't enough of an upgrade over the Morris Twins. I said I didn't think McDonough would think Millsap is enough of an upgrade over the Morris Twins.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#618 » by INFORMER-93 » Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:22 am

carey wrote:[tweet]https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/status/420708349450010624[/tweet]

This is something I'd like to get in on. If he could be had for the Indiana pick I'd be interested. Wouldn't give up much else, but I think Motie has a lot of potential. I know smaller moves like this and Pierre Jackson that I've been advocating don't move the needle much but I think they are long view potential players, like Goodwin & Len.


On the contrary, I love both of those suggestions. I was really high on DMo the year he was drafted. Ditto for Pierre Jackson. I loved watching him at Baylor.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#619 » by Revived » Wed Jan 8, 2014 3:47 am

I like Taj Gibson a lot. He's actually capable of knocking down jumpers and is a beast defensively and good rebounding wise also. Tough guy.

Perfect PF for the Suns. Space the floor enough and bring some toughness to our soft front court.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#620 » by carey » Wed Jan 8, 2014 4:35 am

SF88 wrote:I like Taj Gibson a lot. He's actually capable of knocking down jumpers and is a beast defensively and good rebounding wise also. Tough guy.

Perfect PF for the Suns. Space the floor enough and bring some toughness to our soft front court.


I was a big Gibson fan. Ask anyone from.net. Then he got paid. It's not too to bad, you can see he's more valuable when Boozer is out. It's a lot of scratch for a backup PF tho. I do love his game.

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