2016 Draft Thread Part 4

[carey]

How many polls have we had now? Can't you change your vote at any time? Lol.

[bwgood77]

How many polls have we had now? Can't you change your vote at any time? Lol.

Yes, I guess you can, but when I split this new thread from the last draft thread, it just dropped the poll, so I had just simply never re-added it so people would have to go back and look at that one if they wanted to see what the forum's thought were.

Plus I kind of like seeing snapshots at various points in time, which you kind of lose with ever changing polls.

[sunsbum]

We need a new poll every 2 hours anyways with how much we are all flip flopping.

[Kerrsed]

Im still not on the Chriss train.

Would rather get Skal later in the draft than blow #4 on Chriss. I think they are pretty even when it comes to upside and potential, but with Skal being a much better defender/rebounder. They both are going to take years to develop, so i would rather go for the guy with the better all-around game.

I'm off the Chriss train. His low D-rebounding right now I can live with but his low BBIQ is confronting. Many things can be taught but BBIQ is one of those things you can only truly develop through years and years of playing structured basketball. Some players just get it, nullifying a relatively short basketball developmental period like Tim Duncan, Hakeem, Amare etc. But the vast majority of players with low bball IQ, whether they played from a young age or not is always a big risk because a lot of times, reaching their potential relies heavily on understanding the game and understanding how to make the most of your natural talents. Chriss has the natural physical talents and has developed well in the 4-5 years he's been playing but his tendency to bite on high foul rate and lack of boxing out tells a lot about his low bbiq and whether it's something he can overcome.

Do you think Amare had a low bbiq?

I believe overall yes. He really got by on his athleticism, and once that went away, his game fell off a major cliff. With his athleticism gone, he had to resort to yelling "And 1" after every play, even when the ball didnt got through the hoop, thus not even making it an "And 1" situation. He yelled it just about anytime he was fouled, and i am sure that i even heard him yell it on defense a few times as well.

So all-in-all, yes, i think his basketball IQ was low and the only reason he was able to do what he did was because of his explosive athleticism.

[bwgood77]

We need a new poll every 2 hours anyways with how much we are all flip flopping.

I've been fairly constant about my top choice. I've changed a few times on my option if Bender is gone though and who I want at 13, and particularly have been flip flopping on Ellenson and kind of on Murray.

[bwgood77]

I'm off the Chriss train. His low D-rebounding right now I can live with but his low BBIQ is confronting. Many things can be taught but BBIQ is one of those things you can only truly develop through years and years of playing structured basketball. Some players just get it, nullifying a relatively short basketball developmental period like Tim Duncan, Hakeem, Amare etc. But the vast majority of players with low bball IQ, whether they played from a young age or not is always a big risk because a lot of times, reaching their potential relies heavily on understanding the game and understanding how to make the most of your natural talents. Chriss has the natural physical talents and has developed well in the 4-5 years he's been playing but his tendency to bite on high foul rate and lack of boxing out tells a lot about his low bbiq and whether it's something he can overcome.

Do you think Amare had a low bbiq?

I believe overall yes. He really got by on his athleticism, and once that went away, his game fell off a major cliff. With his athleticism gone, he had to resort to yelling "And 1" after every play, even when the ball didnt got through the hoop, thus not even making it an "And 1" situation. He yelled it just about anytime he was fouled, and i am sure that i even heard him yell it on defense a few times as well.

So all-in-all, yes, i think his basketball IQ was low and the only reason he was able to do what he did was because of his explosive athleticism.

If you really think about it, Amare was mostly a one trick pony finisher for some of his career who added a nice mid range jumper a little later. Not particularly good at anything else. I think Chriss is already better at several things. Sure, worse at several things but the way I look at players is I focus on their strengths and maximize those instead of focusing on weaknesses. I think Chriss is a major risk, but I'd be willing to take the gamble if Bender is gone and McD feels ok. (though if McD takes him it's not like I'm going to have a choice in the matter and I'll have to be willing to gamble).

But I feel comfortable enough that if teams, coaching staffs and GMs (particularly ours) feel like they can teach him and that he has a good head on his shoulder and will have a strong work ethic, I'm fine taking him. I mean who else do you take at 4 if Bender is gone?

[Kerrsed]

http://www.csnne.com/video/welsh-noel-okafor-play-possible-celtics-76ers-deal

Watch the video. Interesting about Bender....

[sunsbum]

I mean who else do you take at 4 if Bender is gone?

https://youtu.be/rNrVlspWe8c

[8on]

http://www.csnne.com/video/welsh-noel-okafor-play-possible-celtics-76ers-deal

Watch the video. Interesting about Bender....

"Kevin Love's still on the board, though. There's no doubt about that."

WHAT

[bwgood77]

http://www.csnne.com/video/welsh-noel-okafor-play-possible-celtics-76ers-deal

Watch the video. Interesting about Bender....

I had heard about that and good news for me if it's true. And if he really is unimpressive to McD as well, I doubt we take him. That's probably why he slid down to 7 in some mocks though.

[Kerrsed]

Like i said the past few days, If we trade our pick to LA for Russell and Bledsoe or Knight to SAC for #8, i still believe that either 1 or both of Chriss/Bender will still be there on the board at #8. I'd feel much better taking a chance on them there than @ #4.

[bwgood77]

Like i said the past few days, If we trade our pick to LA for Russell and Bledsoe or Knight to SAC for #8, i still believe that either 1 or both of Chriss/Bender will still be there on the board at #8. I'd feel much better taking a chance on them there than @ #4.

I think there is very little chance we are trading Bledsoe and also very little chance LA is trading Russell. But that future could be nice, especially if everyone panned out and we did get one of those guys at 8.

[JMac1]

Coro's mock has us taking Bender. Not sure how much insight he has.

http://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/nba/suns/2016/06/16/nba-mock-draft-paul-coros-second-edition/85975976/

Chad Ford just said that Bender is more pro ready and better than Chriss in shooting, rebounding, passing and some other things, but Sarver isn't patient and Mc'D job might be on the line, but in the same vein, says we ought to pick Chriss because of his upside!?!

Why would we pick a risky guy who could only be a little better than Bender if he hits his ceiling? Chad Ford has an infatuation with Chriss, not us.


Doesn't make sense.

Who isn't risky??? And please do not say Hield, because one season doesn't make him less risky, and again, history has not been kind to 'one-season-wonders'. NONE of these guys have played against NBA competition, so they are all risky. And Chriss' shooting is nt any more risky than Hields--they both produced for only one year.

As was said on that DX podcast psted earlier today--Hield, nor Chriss, were considered 1st Rd picks last year. Brown and Skal were, but both put up 'duds' for seasons. Jamal Murray exhibited questionable ability to play the Point. I like Ellenson, but his athleticism ha also been questioned. Poeltl might not be strong enough. So on and so forth...they are ALL risky. May as well pick a 'risky' prospect at a position of need.

How about riskier? If neither player grows from here IMO Bender is better at this time and Chad Ford pointed that out on the radio with Gambo. He said Bender is better but Chriss could be better. Both are 18, so I will take the better 18 year old now.

[DirtyDez]

Watch the video. Interesting about Bender....

Celtics taking Bender confirmed.

[TeamTragic]

Like i said the past few days, If we trade our pick to LA for Russell and Bledsoe or Knight to SAC for #8, i still believe that either 1 or both of Chriss/Bender will still be there on the board at #8. I'd feel much better taking a chance on them there than @ #4.

That is not a terrible deal. Highly unlikely we help the Lakers though especially if Lebron is potentially signing with them.

[sunsbum]

Like i said the past few days, If we trade our pick to LA for Russell and Bledsoe or Knight to SAC for #8, i still believe that either 1 or both of Chriss/Bender will still be there on the board at #8. I'd feel much better taking a chance on them there than @ #4.

That is not a terrible deal. Highly unlikely we help the Lakers though especially if Lebron is potentially signing with them.

Wait what?! Stop it.

[Kerrsed]

Like i said the past few days, If we trade our pick to LA for Russell and Bledsoe or Knight to SAC for #8, i still believe that either 1 or both of Chriss/Bender will still be there on the board at #8. I'd feel much better taking a chance on them there than @ #4.

That is not a terrible deal. Highly unlikely we help the Lakers though especially if Lebron is potentially signing with them.

Unlikely we help the Lakers? What if in reality its actually helping US out in the long run. We traded Nash to them for cheap, and every talked about how much it was helping the Lakers, not knowing in reality Nash was having major issues and in return the trade really helped us out more. I think this is one of those deals. We could either take a chance on a player @ #4 or grab a guy who went #2 in a better draft, already played a season in the league, and even through playing with a s**t team during Kobe's Farewell Tour, still managed to show signs of potential greatness.

And Lebron in Laker gold is laughable. I think they are one of the teams with the least amount of chance of him signing there. This isnt older guys signing with the Lakers due to Kobe or youngsters from small market teams signing to be a part of the fabled Laker Legacy, this is Lebron. He is different. He dances to the beat of his own drummer (Wade).

[letsgosuns]

http://www.csnne.com/video/welsh-noel-okafor-play-possible-celtics-76ers-deal

Watch the video. Interesting about Bender....

That is pretty strong criticism of Bender. That analyst said he heard he was awful in his workout and there were other teams there too and that he is not even on the board for the Celtics. I tend to believe that because why would the Celtics lie about his workout. Bender is pretty much guaranteed to be available with the third pick so it is not like the Celtics are trying to convince a team ahead of them to pass on him. The analyst also never even mentioned Chriss' name. He speculates that the Celtics will take a guard but it sure sounds like they are doing whatever they can to trade the pick.

[JMac1]

http://www.csnne.com/video/welsh-noel-okafor-play-possible-celtics-76ers-deal

Watch the video. Interesting about Bender....

That is pretty strong criticism of Bender. That analyst said he heard he was awful in his workout and there were other teams there too and that he is not even on the board for the Celtics. I tend to believe that because why would the Celtics lie about his workout. Bender is pretty much guaranteed to be available with the third pick so it is not like the Celtics are trying to convince a team ahead of them to pass on him. The analyst also never even mentioned Chriss' name. He speculates that the Celtics will take a guard but it sure sounds like they are doing whatever they can to trade the pick.

trying to build value for the pick. Make Philly and whoever else think they are taking everyone at #3. Remember at one time we were worried and Celts fans had us trading up to secure Bender, now it is Dunn, was Murray and Brown and Chriss. Teams will let them draft and go from there. They can only take one player.

Philly could be playing them and want Murray who we may be willing to trade for Okafor or Noel.

[Cactus Jack]

And Lebron in Laker gold is laughable. I think they are one of the teams with the least amount of chance of him signing there. This isnt older guys signing with the Lakers due to Kobe or youngsters from small market teams signing to be a part of the fabled Laker Legacy, this is Lebron. He is different. He dances to the beat of his own drummer (Wade).

He will sign with them next summer. You heard it here first.