2022-23 Season Discussion and Speculation 4 - Trade season continues - No player trade restrictions

[KLEON]

My two cents: resign Cam Johnson and continue with the core of Book, Da, Mikal, Cam, upgrade the PF this trade deadline and try to find good CP3 replacement in a year time.

This team is going nowhere with a C making max money. Especially when that C isn't even close to being your best player.

Tell them again

[shrink]

The most recent variation people have promoted on here being a Crowder/Saric/Shamet/ 24 (lotto protected) 1st for Russell.
OR
a Crowder/Saric/Craig/Payne/ future (lotto protected) 1st for Russell.

I saw those trades, and I also liked the idea of spinning Crowder to MIL, since he’d have less value to MIN, with KAT and Kyle Anderson so important at PF. I ended up with this:

PHX GIVES: Jae Crowder + Cam Payne + Dario Saric + Landry Shamet + 2023 PHX 1st (too 14 protected)
PHX GETS: D’Angelo Russell + Pat Connaughton + George Hill + 2023 NYK 2nd

MIN GIVES: D’Angelo Russell + Bryn Forbes + 2023 NYK 2nd
MIN GETS:: Jevon Carter + Cam Payne + Grayson Allen + Dario Saric + 2023 PHX 1st (top 14 protected)

MIL GIVES: Grayson Allen + Pat Connaughton + George Hill + Jevon Carter
MIL GETS. Jae Crowder + Landry Shamet + Bryn Forbes

PHX gets DLo for the ghost of Crowder and downgrading a lottery protected pick. Connaughton could help too.

MIN gets a late 1st and Jevon Carter for defense. Cam Payne meets Connelly’s rumored desire for a PG if DLo goes out. Grayson Allen can shoot, and all are on two year deals that match MIN’s timeline. Saric is used in another trade to salary match with Naz.

MIL gets Crowder for their playoff rotation, swapping Grayson Allen for Landry Shamet.[/quote]

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2023/01/scottos-latest-reddish-bucks-holmes-russell-suns.html

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Former Thunder VP and chief of staff Paul Rivers and former NBA point guard Mateen Cleaves have been mentioned by multiple NBA executives as candidates to join the Suns‘ organization, Scotto reports. Cleaves played with incoming Suns owner Mat Ishbia at Michigan State.

This is the latest suns rumor from Scotto. I really hope that IF the suns are bring in some new front office personnel, They'll aim higher than this otherwise I imagine many (myself included) will be significantly disappointed!

No doubt Ishbia needs to bring someone from outside to look at the front office. You can't just have the people who are already here judging their own process and performance. Not sure how that all shakes out, but in any event he needs some perspective.

[shrink]

Although I'm not sure If you guys would find that equitable in contrast to a Paul swap honestly as I know that you guys are trying to compete on a higher level for multiple reasons and a Paul swap would likely accommodate that much better than just expiring pieces and a pick?? But either way, I really hope our front office has the foresight to actually do this move by the deadline!

I wanted to address this specifically.

I think the Wolves have four main priorities right now, and the fanbase differs on which ones are the most important.

1. Win now. Winning is fun, and we don’t want to give Utah a lottery pick.
2. Win later. The Gobert trade was meant to be a longterm move to be a contender for several seasons.
3. Analyze the Gobert experiment. We haven’t seen nearly enough of KAT and Rudy together.
4. Develop Anthony Edwards. He’s the potential superstar, and KAT a Rudy as #2 and #3 looks good.

I think a Chris Paul addition checks box 1 and 4. 4 is important, because Ant is a sponge, and CP in his ear could be a big deal.

But like I said, I don’t know what to expect out of Paul’s health, so I can’t make value judgements on a fair deal.

[Slim Charless]

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2023/01/scottos-latest-reddish-bucks-holmes-russell-suns.html

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Former Thunder VP and chief of staff Paul Rivers and former NBA point guard Mateen Cleaves have been mentioned by multiple NBA executives as candidates to join the Suns‘ organization, Scotto reports. Cleaves played with incoming Suns owner Mat Ishbia at Michigan State.

This is the latest suns rumor from Scotto. I really hope that IF the suns are bring in some new front office personnel, They'll aim higher than this otherwise I imagine many (myself included) will be significantly disappointed!

No doubt Ishbia needs to bring someone from outside to look at the front office. You can't just have the people who are already here judging their own process and performance. Not sure how that all shakes out, but in any event he needs some perspective.

Meh. If we can't get Presti (which I still think is possible) then 1 of his main guys is good. He's a big help for Presti in OKC. I found this about him:

"Rivers, for example, is known as the glue guy. Ever wonder how, say, Steven Adams can shake the commissioner’s hand on draft night in New York City and suddenly is in Oklahoma City the next day to meet the media? Or how the Thunder-owned NBA Developmental League team can uproot from Tulsa to OKC in a matter of days? Rivers is the one spearheading those logistics.

Sam has a saying about Paul,” said Winger. “He says ‘Paul knows how things are supposed to be.’ And Paul puts in a tremendous amount of time, effort and passion to help everybody in the building get things to where they’re supposed to be.”

https://www.oklahoman.com/story/sports/nba/thunder/2015/04/09/oklahoma-city-thunder-the-brain-trust-behind-general-manager-sam-presti/60754449007/

I wonder what Cleaves is gon a do here? Probably just Ishbia bringing in his buddy I guess.

[Slim Charless]

PS:

****IF**** Presti were coming here, it would be a smart idea for him to have his main glue guy here as someone who he can rely on. Someone he knows can handle all the little things while he takes the challenge of building a championship team.

[sunsbum]

The most recent variation people have promoted on here being a Crowder/Saric/Shamet/ 24 (lotto protected) 1st for Russell.
OR
a Crowder/Saric/Craig/Payne/ future (lotto protected) 1st for Russell.

I saw those trades, and I also liked the idea of spinning Crowder to MIL, since he’d have less value to MIN, with KAT and Kyle Anderson so important at PF. I ended up with this:

PHX GIVES: Jae Crowder + Cam Payne + Dario Saric + Landry Shamet + 2023 PHX 1st (too 14 protected)
PHX GETS: D’Angelo Russell + Pat Connaughton + George Hill + 2023 NYK 2nd

MIN GIVES: D’Angelo Russell + Bryn Forbes + 2023 NYK 2nd
MIN GETS:: Jevon Carter + Cam Payne + Grayson Allen + Dario Saric + 2023 PHX 1st (top 14 protected)

MIL GIVES: Grayson Allen + Pat Connaughton + George Hill + Jevon Carter
MIL GETS. Jae Crowder + Landry Shamet + Bryn Forbes

PHX gets DLo for the ghost of Crowder and downgrading a lottery protected pick. Connaughton could help too.

MIN gets a late 1st and Jevon Carter for defense. Cam Payne meets Connelly’s rumored desire for a PG if DLo goes out. Grayson Allen can shoot, and all are on two year deals that match MIN’s timeline. Saric is used in another trade to salary match with Naz.

MIL gets Crowder for their playoff rotation, swapping Grayson Allen for Landry Shamet.

[/quote] actually seems like good value for everyone although I haven’t seen Bryan Forbes play to be completely honest.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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Whatever they might be working on in this, I see this ending up as a 3 team trade wherein Collins goes elsewhere, And we'd get other pieces, assets back in return for facilitating the deal.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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32.5 per year? Is he worth that though? If we were to trade for him alternatively, would it be worth it to pay that much for him considering his strengths and weaknesses?

[Qwigglez]

If Suns were to get John Collins I think that spells a trade of Ayton. And no, I don't think Suns would trade Ayton for Collins, but I do think Hawks would accept Dario and Crowder plus a 1st for Collins if they get desperate enough.

[Slim Charless]

If Suns were to get John Collins I think that spells a trade of Ayton. And no, I don't think Suns would trade Ayton for Collins, but I do think Hawks would accept Dario and Crowder plus a 1st for Collins if they get desperate enough.

Lmao

I was just on the Hawks board talking about that exact same thing. I think if we got both Capela and Collins....that's a fair deal for Ayton. Seems pretty even for both sides. We'll need a big and ATL won't need both Ayton and Capela.

[TeamTragic]

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Whatever they might be working on in this, I see this ending up as a 3 team trade wherein Collins goes elsewhere, And we'd get other pieces, assets back in return for facilitating the deal.

Absolutely meh. We are not trading Ayton for Collins/Capela.

What is wrong with you dudes?

[Puff]

An absolute no for me on Van Vleet. If he cannot win with the current group in Toronto, why would he do any better with our group? He wants 32.5 Mil, wtf. He would fit right in with Ayton, wouldn't he?

My three wants are all and have been in Atlanta

1. Capella
2. Bogdan Bogdanović
3. John Collins

I would prefer Capella and Bogadanovic. Quite frankly all three would be great, take your pick. Of course, that would be the end of Ayton in Phoenix, which would be fine if we can obtain two of the three in this group while including Crowder.

All three of these guys fill a position of need, unless you think Ayton gives us 100 % effort on every possession.

[TeamTragic]

An absolute no for me on Van Vleet. If he cannot win with the current group in Toronto, why would he do any better with our group? He wants 32.5 Mil, wtf. He would fit right in with Ayton, wouldn't he?

My three wants are all and have been in Atlanta

1. Capella
2. Bogdan Bogdanović
3. John Collins

I would prefer Capella and Bogadanovic. Quite frankly all three would be great, take your pick. Of course, that would be the end of Ayton in Phoenix, which would be fine if we can obtain two of the three in this group while including Crowder.

All three of these guys fill a position of need, unless you think Ayton gives us 100 % effort on every possession.

I find it hilarious that you mention FVV and then act like Collins/etc have won jack **** with the Hawks.

FVV would make this team significantly better and if Matt cares about winning then why not.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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Whatever they might be working on in this, I see this ending up as a 3 team trade wherein Collins goes elsewhere, And we'd get other pieces, assets back in return for facilitating the deal.

Absolutely meh. We are not trading Ayton for Collins/Capela.

What is wrong with you dudes?

I don't see that being the situation premise here at all brother! I don't think Ayton is even a consideration in this deal. I see it as being 1 of 2 scenarios:

1- We trade some combinations of expirings and a future draft asset for Collins to add his presence in the paint NEXT TO Ayton.

2- We facilitate a trade in a 3 team scenario with Collins going to another team and we get back different target players/ assets???

[Qwigglez]

If Suns were to get John Collins I think that spells a trade of Ayton. And no, I don't think Suns would trade Ayton for Collins, but I do think Hawks would accept Dario and Crowder plus a 1st for Collins if they get desperate enough.

Lmao

I was just on the Hawks board talking about that exact same thing. I think if we got both Capela and Collins....that's a fair deal for Ayton. Seems pretty even for both sides. We'll need a big and ATL won't need both Ayton and Capela.

Is that what the Hawks organization wants though? I thought they wanted to relieve some cap space, and Ayton doesn't accomplish that. That is why everything that I feel has been out there has been about the Hawks getting cap relief, a role player, and a pick or two back. Also unsure who would start at the PF spot. Would the Suns bring Cam Johnson back off the bench? What do the Suns do with Saric? Unless the Suns do Ayton and Saric for Collins and Capela.

Could we then do a three team trade with the Bucks and Jazz?

Spoiler:

Suns get -
Jordan Clarkson

Bucks get -
Jae Crowder

Jazz get -
Grayson Allen
DWJ
Suns 2023 1st

Suns could look a lot more well rounded and a lot of depth everywhere I feel.

[TeamTragic]

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Whatever they might be working on in this, I see this ending up as a 3 team trade wherein Collins goes elsewhere, And we'd get other pieces, assets back in return for facilitating the deal.

Absolutely meh. We are not trading Ayton for Collins/Capela.

What is wrong with you dudes?

I don't see that being the situation premise here at all brother! I don't think Ayton is even a consideration in this deal. I see it as being 1 of 2 scenarios:

1- We trade some combinations of expirings and a future draft asset for Collins to add his presence in the paint NEXT TO Ayton.

2- We facilitate a trade in a 3 team scenario with Collins going to another team and we get back different target players/ assets???

I don't think we should be sending out any picks and Gambo has said multiple times that we don't want Collins.

The fact that anyone wants to trade Ayton for scraps is hilarious.

[Qwigglez]

Wow I didn't realize they could structure salary like this...

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Basically get to keep Turner for two more years at $20 mil, but give him an extra $17 million for the remainder of this season. That seems like cheating.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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If Ayton is traded in the offseason, Do we look at this again knowing Turner's making 30 million? Is his value even positive at that amount ? I can't imagine how it would be??

[TeamTragic]

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If Ayton is traded in the offseason, Do we look at this again knowing Turner's making 30 million? Is his value even positive at that amount ? I can't imagine how it would be??

Are you saying Ayton is overpaid or that Turner is overpaid?