2018 Free Agency and Trade Discussion continued

[BobbieL]

For all the talk the suns did this spring about being aggressive this summer and the speculation of major roster shuffling it pretty surprising that we're in mid July and the only moves have been 3 rookies and ariza. They could end up bringing back 11 guys from last year's roster. I certainly wouldn't have predicted that. Now it's not necessary a bad thing because sometimes the moves you don't make turn out to be your best moves.

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Not really a surprise for me because McDonough has been saying the same for the last 5 years.

It is getting old.

I don't disagree - but in his defense - there are 5 players that were basically hard to trade

Chandler, Daniels and Dudley have little to know value as expiring contracts it seems. Maybe this February but not now. Granted, still the offseason. But not much "noise"

Bender and Chriss probably have only value as Elfrid Payton type deals. Throw aways. I think actually wiser to keep unless the right deal came along. Believe you me, I was hoping for a bit more turnover from a 21 win team. Alec Peters, Elfrid Payton and Alec Peters - woohooo! Thats really not much of any turnover.

So pretty hard to turn over the roster - at this point. I mean, he might need to keep Chandler as opposed to buying him out for the sheer purpose of having a "contract" to match salaries with at the trade deadline - which kind of sucks right.

[Gorilla Warfare]

Would Kahwi be the best Power Forward we've had since Barkley? (let's be real, Amare was a Center)

[Barkley6]

Would Kahwi be the best Power Forward we've had since Barkley? (let's be real, Amare was a Center)

McDyess is probably the only other name in that conversation. Maybe Marion if you're counting Amare as C.

[LukasBMW]

If Butler and Kawai are available, let's start shuffling. Only Booker and Ayton are untouchable. I'm sick of losing and after what I saw in summer league, we don't have any sure fire next superstars other then Book/Ayton.

Pair either Butler or Claw at the 3 with Booker at the 2, Ariza at the 4, and Ayton at the 5, and all of a sudden...we start to look like a damn playoff team.

Bledsoe was moved for a crummy 1st round pick.
Boogie was moved for a decent 1st and a young player with questionable potential.
The low risk/high reward bargain trades are out there.

[lilfishi22]

For all the talk the suns did this spring about being aggressive this summer and the speculation of major roster shuffling it pretty surprising that we're in mid July and the only moves have been 3 rookies and ariza. They could end up bringing back 11 guys from last year's roster. I certainly wouldn't have predicted that. Now it's not necessary a bad thing because sometimes the moves you don't make turn out to be your best moves.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

It's probably a combination of 3 things

1. They were waiting on the market to blow their load so they can pick up guys on the cheap now that there isn't much money around
2. They were working the trade market possibly get guys through trades like Lin, Teodosic etc
3. They were surprised Okobo fell to 31, with Shaq's emergence in SL and Knight's supposed change in attitude, they are more comfortable with not making any moves just to make a move, especially since roster spots are at a premium.

Somewhat agree with your last point. Adding to the PG position just to add to that position might not be the best thing to do, especially when the talent upgrade available might not be significant.

[Frank Lee]

For all the talk the suns did this spring about being aggressive this summer and the speculation of major roster shuffling it pretty surprising that we're in mid July and the only moves have been 3 rookies and ariza. They could end up bringing back 11 guys from last year's roster. I certainly wouldn't have predicted that. Now it's not necessary a bad thing because sometimes the moves you don't make turn out to be your best moves.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

It's probably a combination of 3 things

1. They were waiting on the market to blow their load so they can pick up guys on the cheap now that there isn't much money around
2. They were working the trade market possibly get guys through trades like Lin, Teodosic etc
3. They were surprised Okobo fell to 31, with Shaq's emergence in SL and Knight's supposed change in attitude, they are more comfortable with not making any moves just to make a move, especially since roster spots are at a premium.

Somewhat agree with your last point. Adding to the PG position just to add to that position might not be the best thing to do, especially when the talent upgrade available might not be significant.

Yeah fish.... that or McD is just inept. If he would have done ‘nothing’ more, we wouldn’t be in this mess, imo

As for Dudley, Chandler, and Daniels...I’d release them all, sign both Williams and Harrel to 2 yr deals. Hungry guys, not paycheckers....But nope, pimply faced McDumboEars is bound and determined to ask the homecoming queen/court to the prom next year. His strategy again is based on next yr. wtf.... it gets old.

[BobbieL]

For all the talk the suns did this spring about being aggressive this summer and the speculation of major roster shuffling it pretty surprising that we're in mid July and the only moves have been 3 rookies and ariza. They could end up bringing back 11 guys from last year's roster. I certainly wouldn't have predicted that. Now it's not necessary a bad thing because sometimes the moves you don't make turn out to be your best moves.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

It's probably a combination of 3 things

1. They were waiting on the market to blow their load so they can pick up guys on the cheap now that there isn't much money around
2. They were working the trade market possibly get guys through trades like Lin, Teodosic etc
3. They were surprised Okobo fell to 31, with Shaq's emergence in SL and Knight's supposed change in attitude, they are more comfortable with not making any moves just to make a move, especially since roster spots are at a premium.

Somewhat agree with your last point. Adding to the PG position just to add to that position might not be the best thing to do, especially when the talent upgrade available might not be significant.

Yeah fish.... that or McD is just inept. If he would have done ‘nothing’ more, we wouldn’t be in this mess, imo

As for Dudley, Chandler, and Daniels...I’d release them all, sign both Williams and Harrel to 2 yr deals. Hungry guys, not paycheckers....But nope, pimply faced McDumboEars is bound and determined to ask the homecoming queen/court to the prom next year. His strategy again is based on next yr. wtf.... it gets old.

Totally agree that I would see if Daniels can be waived or traded. Throw in a 2020 2nd rounder and 1.6m salary to the team if need be. Dudley and Chandler - ask for a buyout - see if they will be willing - if not eat it. And I like your two names Harrell and Williams. Still have the 4.4m for a PG - if one becomes available

Part of me thinks McD is holding onto Chandler or Dudley because they are a big chunk of salary to add as a trade chip in February. I am not sure that is wise - but he might do that. As if he buys each of those two out - his trade options go in the toilet basically for a big contract.

[Revived]

Ross, @LegionofHoops is a bit like Schultz and Kyler, but this one is interesting> Thibs might be done with Butler. Courtney Lee and Malcolm Thomas maybe. A first round pick.

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We can certainly beat that, but would Butler have any interest in re-signing with us? Can't imagine Thibs would have a ton of interest in JJ given the presence of Wiggins.

Butler turns 29 or 30 by the start of next season. And he’s played so many minutes already in his career because of Thibs.

Will be wanting a max contract. No thanks.

[lilfishi22]

For all the talk the suns did this spring about being aggressive this summer and the speculation of major roster shuffling it pretty surprising that we're in mid July and the only moves have been 3 rookies and ariza. They could end up bringing back 11 guys from last year's roster. I certainly wouldn't have predicted that. Now it's not necessary a bad thing because sometimes the moves you don't make turn out to be your best moves.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

It's probably a combination of 3 things

1. They were waiting on the market to blow their load so they can pick up guys on the cheap now that there isn't much money around
2. They were working the trade market possibly get guys through trades like Lin, Teodosic etc
3. They were surprised Okobo fell to 31, with Shaq's emergence in SL and Knight's supposed change in attitude, they are more comfortable with not making any moves just to make a move, especially since roster spots are at a premium.

Somewhat agree with your last point. Adding to the PG position just to add to that position might not be the best thing to do, especially when the talent upgrade available might not be significant.

Yeah fish.... that or McD is just inept. If he would have done ‘nothing’ more, we wouldn’t be in this mess, imo

As for Dudley, Chandler, and Daniels...I’d release them all, sign both Williams and Harrel to 2 yr deals. Hungry guys, not paycheckers....But nope, pimply faced McDumboEars is bound and determined to ask the homecoming queen/court to the prom next year. His strategy again is based on next yr. wtf.... it gets old.

Entirely possible. Not a big fan of McD and sometimes it's hard to give him the benefit of the doubt but I guess I would've been more up in arms if it wasn't for the fact that Shaq and Okobo played well enough that they can be a stop gap solution this season. Who know what we'll get from Knight but I'm not super hopeful despite the recent narrative that he's a changed.

Of course, we could always make moves mid-season when teams have need to for those expiring contracts and we happen to have a few.

[King4Day]

Ross, @LegionofHoops is a bit like Schultz and Kyler, but this one is interesting> Thibs might be done with Butler. Courtney Lee and Malcolm Thomas maybe. A first round pick.

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Reading the main board, people are suggesting it would take Knox and Frank and change.
I think for the Knicks, knowing he likely would stay in NY, Trading for him could be worth a glance.
But some package involving Hardaway, Frank, picks. I doubt NY moves KP or Knox. Just depends on how desperate the Wolves are to get him out.
Other teams will probably put together a better offer.
I wouldn't move JJ but I bet if we offered him, the Wolves would seriously consider it (regardless of their needs)

[King4Day]

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/250741/Raptors-Have-Made-Most-Compelling-Offer-To-Spurs-For-Kawhi-Leonard

I'm not sure I'd want the Raps getting him. I don't think there's chance he'd stay and he'll just go to LA. At least with Philly there's a chance.

[bwgood77]

Would Kahwi be the best Power Forward we've had since Barkley? (let's be real, Amare was a Center)

McDyess is probably the only other name in that conversation. Maybe Marion if you're counting Amare as C.

Do we just automatically refer to all current SFs as PFs now? Kawhi would be the best 3 we've probably had if he got back to where he was at the peak....but Marion was very very good, but Kawhi was close to being top 3 player or so before the injury stuff.

[lilfishi22]

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/250741/Raptors-Have-Made-Most-Compelling-Offer-To-Spurs-For-Kawhi-Leonard

I'm not sure I'd want the Raps getting him. I don't think there's chance he'd stay and he'll just go to LA. At least with Philly there's a chance.

I've come around to the rationale behind the Raps going all in to get him. Raptor's window is definitely much shorter (some might argue it's already closed) than the C's and Sixers and with Lebron moving West, this might be their best chance to make the ECF/Finals. With the countdown on DD's probable leaving of Toronto, might as well give it one last shot with a former MVP candidate.

[bwgood77]

For all the talk the suns did this spring about being aggressive this summer and the speculation of major roster shuffling it pretty surprising that we're in mid July and the only moves have been 3 rookies and ariza. They could end up bringing back 11 guys from last year's roster. I certainly wouldn't have predicted that. Now it's not necessary a bad thing because sometimes the moves you don't make turn out to be your best moves.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

It's probably a combination of 3 things

1. They were waiting on the market to blow their load so they can pick up guys on the cheap now that there isn't much money around
2. They were working the trade market possibly get guys through trades like Lin, Teodosic etc
3. They were surprised Okobo fell to 31, with Shaq's emergence in SL and Knight's supposed change in attitude, they are more comfortable with not making any moves just to make a move, especially since roster spots are at a premium.

Somewhat agree with your last point. Adding to the PG position just to add to that position might not be the best thing to do, especially when the talent upgrade available might not be significant.

Well and they cashed in their major trade chip to move up a few spots for Bridges. Bridges is a big get though. He's polished on both sides of the ball, and ready to go....he's not a regular rookie..older than Booker....we control him for quite some time.

We don't have much for assets after that unless we want to start trading our own unprotected picks which would be dumb. Jackson might have some value, but not sure how much.

Personally even though I'm not sure I would have added so many wings (despite that I like the players), I'm glad we didn't make some huge long term signing to a RFA. I never expected us to make some huge trade unless we gave up stuff people here probably would have been unhappy with..unprotected picks, Jackson, etc. I don't even know how much value someone like Jackson has now after his disappointing rookie year.

[Gorilla Warfare]

Would Kahwi be the best Power Forward we've had since Barkley? (let's be real, Amare was a Center)

McDyess is probably the only other name in that conversation. Maybe Marion if you're counting Amare as C.

Do we just automatically refer to all current SFs as PFs now? Kawhi would be the best 3 we've probably had if he got back to where he was at the peak....but Marion was very very good, but Kawhi was close to being top 3 player or so before the injury stuff.

Kahwi would 100% be our starting PF even though he is definitely a SF.

[Mjee]

I would seriously consider putting together a serious offer for Kawhi ... centered around picks and JJ and fillers (Bender, warren, Chriss)

This could also potentially attract other FA’s to play with us next year

[lilfishi22]

There's a chance Kawhi stays but I think when you're dealing with a guy who's forgoing a supermax extension in part because he'd like to end up in LA, I think you have to operate on the assumption that there's a good chance he's a one and done if you trade for him.

[jcsunsfan]

For all the talk the suns did this spring about being aggressive this summer and the speculation of major roster shuffling it pretty surprising that we're in mid July and the only moves have been 3 rookies and ariza. They could end up bringing back 11 guys from last year's roster. I certainly wouldn't have predicted that. Now it's not necessary a bad thing because sometimes the moves you don't make turn out to be your best moves.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

Not really a surprise for me because McDonough has been saying the same for the last 5 years.

It is getting old.

I don't disagree - but in his defense - there are 5 players that were basically hard to trade

Chandler, Daniels and Dudley have little to know value as expiring contracts it seems. Maybe this February but not now. Granted, still the offseason. But not much "noise"

Bender and Chriss probably have only value as Elfrid Payton type deals. Throw aways. I think actually wiser to keep unless the right deal came along. Believe you me, I was hoping for a bit more turnover from a 21 win team. Alec Peters, Elfrid Payton and Alec Peters - woohooo! Thats really not much of any turnover.

So pretty hard to turn over the roster - at this point. I mean, he might need to keep Chandler as opposed to buying him out for the sheer purpose of having a "contract" to match salaries with at the trade deadline - which kind of sucks right.

I do not why we think anyone we have would have any more value as expiring contracts to anyone more than to us! We want to be players in free agency. We want those expirings for ourselves. We would rather waive them for nothing than take back salary.

[Kerrsed]

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[lilfishi22]

I remember there was a ton of talk about Papa G when he was taken in the lottery that there were virtually no scouts that had him in the 1st round.