2020 NBA Draft Prospect Watch - Revised Poll

[bwgood77]

https://fansided.com/2020/06/29/2020-nba-draft-big-board-summer-update/amp/

Interesting tiers!

Thanks for sharing, I've seen Killian Hayes ranked really high in some other drafts as well (and in our draft range in others). I've never watched him play but he looks very interesting from his description alone.

Going by these descriptions, there should be a couple of interesting guys in this draft that could slide to #10.

Weisman and Obi Toppin ranked at the bottom end of the lottery are shockers.

I don't see how Ball and Hayes don't go 1-2. If a team at the top doesn't want those players, they should trade back.

I wouldn't be shocked to see Toppin drop to 10, and I think we'd probably take him. Wiseman dropping so far would shock me, unless there's a personality thing there.

I really, really don't think we're in the market for a PG in this draft unless it's a clear BPA issue. Our best player is a starting PG, we drafted a backup PG last year, we're letting two young PGs go this summer, and we just decided to use our open Orlando contract slot on a PG. We need help literally everywhere else.

I think we are definitely in the market for a PG, thus the reason we are trying out all these other PGs. I don't know that anyone behind Rubio would prevent us from taking one if we like the player. As many others have said, I do with free agency was before the draft though, because if it's a toss up between a PG and a PF, or even a 2 guard, that could help us decide.

[Mr Puddles]

Thanks for sharing, I've seen Killian Hayes ranked really high in some other drafts as well (and in our draft range in others). I've never watched him play but he looks very interesting from his description alone.

Going by these descriptions, there should be a couple of interesting guys in this draft that could slide to #10.

Weisman and Obi Toppin ranked at the bottom end of the lottery are shockers.

I don't see how Ball and Hayes don't go 1-2. If a team at the top doesn't want those players, they should trade back.

I wouldn't be shocked to see Toppin drop to 10, and I think we'd probably take him. Wiseman dropping so far would shock me, unless there's a personality thing there.

I really, really don't think we're in the market for a PG in this draft unless it's a clear BPA issue. Our best player is a starting PG, we drafted a backup PG last year, we're letting two young PGs go this summer, and we just decided to use our open Orlando contract slot on a PG. We need help literally everywhere else.

I think we are definitely in the market for a PG, thus the reason we are trying out all these other PGs. I don't know that anyone behind Rubio would prevent us from taking one if we like the player. As many others have said, I do wish free agency was before the draft though, because if it's a toss up between a PG and a PF, or even a 2 guard, that could help us decide.

Yes, I agree. Our backup PG rotation was a revolving door this past season. Not to mention, non of the guys on our roster can really be considered a long term replacement for Rubio, once his contract expires, unless guys like Jerome make tremendous progress.

We still have so many holes in our roster, I think it comes down to best player available; whether it be a PF, back up PG or back up SG.

[bwgood77]

I don't see how Ball and Hayes don't go 1-2. If a team at the top doesn't want those players, they should trade back.

I wouldn't be shocked to see Toppin drop to 10, and I think we'd probably take him. Wiseman dropping so far would shock me, unless there's a personality thing there.

I really, really don't think we're in the market for a PG in this draft unless it's a clear BPA issue. Our best player is a starting PG, we drafted a backup PG last year, we're letting two young PGs go this summer, and we just decided to use our open Orlando contract slot on a PG. We need help literally everywhere else.

I think we are definitely in the market for a PG, thus the reason we are trying out all these other PGs. I don't know that anyone behind Rubio would prevent us from taking one if we like the player. As many others have said, I do wish free agency was before the draft though, because if it's a toss up between a PG and a PF, or even a 2 guard, that could help us decide.

Yes, I agree. Our backup PG rotation was a revolving door this past season. Not to mention, non of the guys on our roster can really be considered a long term replacement for Rubio, once his contract expires, unless guys like Jerome make tremendous progress.

We still have so many holes in our roster, I think it comes down to best player available; whether it be a PF, back up PG or back up SG.

Ideally, whatever we draft position wise, I really hope we get a high IQ player who can be a playmaker. I really want the front office to focus on high IQ players who can set up others, shoot and defend well. I don't need the flashiest players, but the more playmakers you have at other positions, it just gives you more options with lineups, and you may not need a traditional PG there if you have several other players who move the ball well and set up others.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

I think we are definitely in the market for a PG, thus the reason we are trying out all these other PGs. I don't know that anyone behind Rubio would prevent us from taking one if we like the player. As many others have said, I do wish free agency was before the draft though, because if it's a toss up between a PG and a PF, or even a 2 guard, that could help us decide.

Yes, I agree. Our backup PG rotation was a revolving door this past season. Not to mention, non of the guys on our roster can really be considered a long term replacement for Rubio, once his contract expires, unless guys like Jerome make tremendous progress.

We still have so many holes in our roster, I think it comes down to best player available; whether it be a PF, back up PG or back up SG.

Ideally, whatever we draft position wise, I really hope we get a high IQ player who can be a playmaker. I really want the front office to focus on high IQ players who can set up others, shoot and defend well. I don't need the flashiest players, but the more playmakers you have at other positions, it just gives you more options with lineups, and you may not need a traditional PG there if you have several other players who move the ball well and set up others.

I recall James Jones's mention of playmaking as the #1 thing we're looking for - but perhaps more than this, his clarification that defensive playmaking is just as important.

Only one player on the court can be the PG. There are four other players on the court, and if you're just looking at the players who are locked into contracts, we have only 6 players to play those 4 positions (and one of those players is Jalen Lecque). Rubio can defend the 2, so there's a bit of wiggle room, but you know what I'm saying.

Especially if we're continuing the plan of building around Booker, we need more defensive playmaking than just about anything else. More shooting won't hurt, but I've demonstrated in other posts that we have shooters, and that we're worse at pretty much everything else.

My desire for defensive playmaking in particular is why I'm so attracted to guys like Paul Reed, Tyler Bey, Devin Vassell and now, Josh Green. Haliburton blocks shots, too, so you can put him on that list as well, and heck, if you're looking at playmaking on both sides of the ball, clearly he's ahead of the rest of the guys on that list (and only he and Vassell have demonstrated the ability to knock down threes). Plus, you can play Haliburton at the 2 - at least in theory. Dude's a string bean so we're still just speculating that he can even crack this league. FWIW, I'm pretty sure that Vassell and Green will both make it. Reed I'm not so sure about, primarily because of his offense, but I think his ceiling is very high. As for Bey, from what I've seen, most of the negative commentaries are about his ability to work as a small ball 4. But he'll be a 3 in the NBA, and from what I can tell, all he needs to do is continue to work on that long ball and he'll stick in the league.

Most of all, I'm just jealous of the teams with the long 4's, who tend to give us problems and tend also to dominate the league. Davis and Giannis, Siakam and Boucher in Toronto. I love Christian Wood too but don't think we can grab him. Wish there were a guy like that in this draft. Reed is obviously the right prototype, but there's a reason he's projected by most to slip to the back of the first: he's not ready for the league and won't be very useful in year 1.

BTW... we're all talking about Rubio's successor, but dude is younger than when Nash first arrived. Why do we assume he won't be here for the long haul? Ricky's got a lot of game left in him. I guess I just don't understand the obsession, just the constant obsession among our fans to find a young PG. Sometimes I wonder if it's not all part of the obsession with shifting blame away from our *other* PG, Point Book. As in, Booker's not going to have a fair shot at winning games (in the eyes of the fans) until Magic Johnson is running the point. Truly I believe this: if Nash were PG of this team, we would not be as successful as the SSOL Suns, and the fans would blame Nash before they blame Devin.

[Ghost of Kleine]

I think we are definitely in the market for a PG, thus the reason we are trying out all these other PGs. I don't know that anyone behind Rubio would prevent us from taking one if we like the player. As many others have said, I do wish free agency was before the draft though, because if it's a toss up between a PG and a PF, or even a 2 guard, that could help us decide.

Yes, I agree. Our backup PG rotation was a revolving door this past season. Not to mention, non of the guys on our roster can really be considered a long term replacement for Rubio, once his contract expires, unless guys like Jerome make tremendous progress.

We still have so many holes in our roster, I think it comes down to best player available; whether it be a PF, back up PG or back up SG.

Ideally, whatever we draft position wise, I really hope we get a high IQ player who can be a playmaker. I really want the front office to focus on high IQ players who can set up others, shoot and defend well. I don't need the flashiest players, but the more playmakers you have at other positions, it just gives you more options with lineups, and you may not need a traditional PG there if you have several other players who move the ball well and set up others.

Well if IQ AND SHOOTING are obviously pretty important ( to which I agree), Then we may need to reconsider Tyrell Terry??

https://www.google.com/amp/s/therookiewire.usatoday.com/2020/06/16/tyrell-terry-broke-a-record-for-a-basketball-iq-test-given-by-teams/amp/ .

Ahead of the NBA Draft, teams have met virtually with prospects in recent weeks since they are prohibited from hosting in-person workouts and interviews due to the coronavirus pandemic. In addition, at least a handful of teams have also administered IQ tests with prospects.

Teams will often ask random questions during interviews to gauge how well a particular player dissects a problem and comes to a solution in a timely manner. Terry, according to Kalbrosky in the latest 2020 Rookie Wire NBA Mock Draft, “broke a record” during his IQ tests with teams around the league.

The former Stanford guard averaged 14.6 points, 4.5 rebounds, 3.2 assists and 1.4 steals in 31 games. He emerged as a strong shooting prospect after converting on 44.1% of his shots from the field and 40.8% from 3-point range, including an incredible 50.8% on catch-and-shoot 3-pointers.

Terry is projected to be the 16th overall pick given his ability on the offensive end of the floor, especially as a shooter that can help space the floor. He also performed well as a defender, averaging 1.4 steals per game on a strong defensive team.

He's not really number one on my board at 10 or later, As I of course have Kira Lewis at 1, Then Grant Riller at 2, But he is really moving up my board quickly due to his ELITE shooting and slick, crafty passing. I know he's currently a bit undersized and will need to get stronger certainly. However, His play does genuinely remind me of Steph Curry and his passing and long range shooting reminds me of Tre Young honestly. So I soon might find him tied for #2 on my big board.

I believe his shooting could give immense gravity on the perimeter, And open up the lanes for both Booker and Ayton.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/fansided.com/2020/02/20/2020-nba-draft-tyrell-terry-skill-makes-him-worthy-lottery-selection/amp/

Terry stars in maybe the other most important quality for an initiator prospect in the modern NBA: shooting. Simply, Tyrell Terry’s shooting projection is elite. Looking at the numbers — 90.2 percent on 82 free throws, 39.7 percent from 3 on 9.1 attempts per 100 possessions — it is easy to buy into Terry as a high-level NBA shooter. Looking further into the tape only bolsters this projection.

Terry’s 3s come from a diet of often-tough pull-ups, 3s off of movements and shots from well beyond the NBA line. A pick-and-roll orchestrator, Terry routinely pulls up after rounding a screen, unbothered by contests:

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Yes, I agree. Our backup PG rotation was a revolving door this past season. Not to mention, non of the guys on our roster can really be considered a long term replacement for Rubio, once his contract expires, unless guys like Jerome make tremendous progress.

We still have so many holes in our roster, I think it comes down to best player available; whether it be a PF, back up PG or back up SG.

Ideally, whatever we draft position wise, I really hope we get a high IQ player who can be a playmaker. I really want the front office to focus on high IQ players who can set up others, shoot and defend well. I don't need the flashiest players, but the more playmakers you have at other positions, it just gives you more options with lineups, and you may not need a traditional PG there if you have several other players who move the ball well and set up others.

Well if IQ AND SHOOTING are obviously pretty important ( to which I agree), Then we may need to reconsider Tyrell Terry??

https://www.google.com/amp/s/therookiewire.usatoday.com/2020/06/16/tyrell-terry-broke-a-record-for-a-basketball-iq-test-given-by-teams/amp/ .

Ahead of the NBA Draft, teams have met virtually with prospects in recent weeks since they are prohibited from hosting in-person workouts and interviews due to the coronavirus pandemic. In addition, at least a handful of teams have also administered IQ tests with prospects.

Teams will often ask random questions during interviews to gauge how well a particular player dissects a problem and comes to a solution in a timely manner. Terry, according to Kalbrosky in the latest 2020 Rookie Wire NBA Mock Draft, “broke a record” during his IQ tests with teams around the league.

The former Stanford guard averaged 14.6 points, 4.5 rebounds, 3.2 assists and 1.4 steals in 31 games. He emerged as a strong shooting prospect after converting on 44.1% of his shots from the field and 40.8% from 3-point range, including an incredible 50.8% on catch-and-shoot 3-pointers.

Terry is projected to be the 16th overall pick given his ability on the offensive end of the floor, especially as a shooter that can help space the floor. He also performed well as a defender, averaging 1.4 steals per game on a strong defensive team.

He's not really number one on my board at 10 or later, As I of course have Kira Lewis at 1, Then Grant Riller at 2, But he is really moving up my board quickly due to his ELITE shooting and slick, crafty passing. I know he's currently a bit undersized and will need to get stronger certainly. However, His play does genuinely remind me of Steph Curry and his passing and long range shooting reminds me of Tre Young honestly. So I soon might find him tied for #2 on my big board.

I believe his shooting could give immense gravity on the perimeter, And open up the lanes for both Booker and Ayton.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/fansided.com/2020/02/20/2020-nba-draft-tyrell-terry-skill-makes-him-worthy-lottery-selection/amp/

Terry stars in maybe the other most important quality for an initiator prospect in the modern NBA: shooting. Simply, Tyrell Terry’s shooting projection is elite. Looking at the numbers — 90.2 percent on 82 free throws, 39.7 percent from 3 on 9.1 attempts per 100 possessions — it is easy to buy into Terry as a high-level NBA shooter. Looking further into the tape only bolsters this projection.

Terry’s 3s come from a diet of often-tough pull-ups, 3s off of movements and shots from well beyond the NBA line. A pick-and-roll orchestrator, Terry routinely pulls up after rounding a screen, unbothered by contests:

Terry really is interesting. I can't rule out Terry becoming a great player in this league. He's just so young that it's hard to know. He's real light. Brandon Knight was light, smart, young and hit his free throws as well. Gah!

[bwgood77]

Yes, I agree. Our backup PG rotation was a revolving door this past season. Not to mention, non of the guys on our roster can really be considered a long term replacement for Rubio, once his contract expires, unless guys like Jerome make tremendous progress.

We still have so many holes in our roster, I think it comes down to best player available; whether it be a PF, back up PG or back up SG.

Ideally, whatever we draft position wise, I really hope we get a high IQ player who can be a playmaker. I really want the front office to focus on high IQ players who can set up others, shoot and defend well. I don't need the flashiest players, but the more playmakers you have at other positions, it just gives you more options with lineups, and you may not need a traditional PG there if you have several other players who move the ball well and set up others.

I recall James Jones's mention of playmaking as the #1 thing we're looking for - but perhaps more than this, his clarification that defensive playmaking is just as important.

Only one player on the court can be the PG. There are four other players on the court, and if you're just looking at the players who are locked into contracts, we have only 6 players to play those 4 positions (and one of those players is Jalen Lecque). Rubio can defend the 2, so there's a bit of wiggle room, but you know what I'm saying.

Especially if we're continuing the plan of building around Booker, we need more defensive playmaking than just about anything else. More shooting won't hurt, but I've demonstrated in other posts that we have shooters, and that we're worse at pretty much everything else.

My desire for defensive playmaking in particular is why I'm so attracted to guys like Paul Reed, Tyler Bey, Devin Vassell and now, Josh Green. Haliburton blocks shots, too, so you can put him on that list as well, and heck, if you're looking at playmaking on both sides of the ball, clearly he's ahead of the rest of the guys on that list (and only he and Vassell have demonstrated the ability to knock down threes). Plus, you can play Haliburton at the 2 - at least in theory. Dude's a string bean so we're still just speculating that he can even crack this league. FWIW, I'm pretty sure that Vassell and Green will both make it. Reed I'm not so sure about, primarily because of his offense, but I think his ceiling is very high. As for Bey, from what I've seen, most of the negative commentaries are about his ability to work as a small ball 4. But he'll be a 3 in the NBA, and from what I can tell, all he needs to do is continue to work on that long ball and he'll stick in the league.

Most of all, I'm just jealous of the teams with the long 4's, who tend to give us problems and tend also to dominate the league. Davis and Giannis, Siakam and Boucher in Toronto. I love Christian Wood too but don't think we can grab him. Wish there were a guy like that in this draft. Reed is obviously the right prototype, but there's a reason he's projected by most to slip to the back of the first: he's not ready for the league and won't be very useful in year 1.

BTW... we're all talking about Rubio's successor, but dude is younger than when Nash first arrived. Why do we assume he won't be here for the long haul? Ricky's got a lot of game left in him. I guess I just don't understand the obsession, just the constant obsession among our fans to find a young PG. Sometimes I wonder if it's not all part of the obsession with shifting blame away from our *other* PG, Point Book. As in, Booker's not going to have a fair shot at winning games (in the eyes of the fans) until Magic Johnson is running the point. Truly I believe this: if Nash were PG of this team, we would not be as successful as the SSOL Suns, and the fans would blame Nash before they blame Devin.

When I mentioned playmaking, I more or less meant guys that get assists/set up others, but in general, have a high iq, move the ball, keep moving, are good without the ball, etc.

I also mentioned I want guys who can defend.

What exactly do you mean when you say defensive playmakers? I don't typically hear being a playmaker being referred to as defensive. Of course you can make defensive highlight plays, so I assume you just mean blocks, steals, those types of things?

I definitely want solid fundamental defensive players who are great team defenders, and also love to see guys who will dive for balls, etc, like a PJ Tucker, and are just as focused on that side as the other side, and right now we only have maybe 3-4 or players you could maybe say that about. Maybe 5 at times.

Basically a high IQ player on both sides...guys who know where to move on offense, have good court vision, set up others, know where to be on team defense, communicate with others on floor, etc.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Ideally, whatever we draft position wise, I really hope we get a high IQ player who can be a playmaker. I really want the front office to focus on high IQ players who can set up others, shoot and defend well. I don't need the flashiest players, but the more playmakers you have at other positions, it just gives you more options with lineups, and you may not need a traditional PG there if you have several other players who move the ball well and set up others.

I recall James Jones's mention of playmaking as the #1 thing we're looking for - but perhaps more than this, his clarification that defensive playmaking is just as important.

Only one player on the court can be the PG. There are four other players on the court, and if you're just looking at the players who are locked into contracts, we have only 6 players to play those 4 positions (and one of those players is Jalen Lecque). Rubio can defend the 2, so there's a bit of wiggle room, but you know what I'm saying.

Especially if we're continuing the plan of building around Booker, we need more defensive playmaking than just about anything else. More shooting won't hurt, but I've demonstrated in other posts that we have shooters, and that we're worse at pretty much everything else.

My desire for defensive playmaking in particular is why I'm so attracted to guys like Paul Reed, Tyler Bey, Devin Vassell and now, Josh Green. Haliburton blocks shots, too, so you can put him on that list as well, and heck, if you're looking at playmaking on both sides of the ball, clearly he's ahead of the rest of the guys on that list (and only he and Vassell have demonstrated the ability to knock down threes). Plus, you can play Haliburton at the 2 - at least in theory. Dude's a string bean so we're still just speculating that he can even crack this league. FWIW, I'm pretty sure that Vassell and Green will both make it. Reed I'm not so sure about, primarily because of his offense, but I think his ceiling is very high. As for Bey, from what I've seen, most of the negative commentaries are about his ability to work as a small ball 4. But he'll be a 3 in the NBA, and from what I can tell, all he needs to do is continue to work on that long ball and he'll stick in the league.

Most of all, I'm just jealous of the teams with the long 4's, who tend to give us problems and tend also to dominate the league. Davis and Giannis, Siakam and Boucher in Toronto. I love Christian Wood too but don't think we can grab him. Wish there were a guy like that in this draft. Reed is obviously the right prototype, but there's a reason he's projected by most to slip to the back of the first: he's not ready for the league and won't be very useful in year 1.

BTW... we're all talking about Rubio's successor, but dude is younger than when Nash first arrived. Why do we assume he won't be here for the long haul? Ricky's got a lot of game left in him. I guess I just don't understand the obsession, just the constant obsession among our fans to find a young PG. Sometimes I wonder if it's not all part of the obsession with shifting blame away from our *other* PG, Point Book. As in, Booker's not going to have a fair shot at winning games (in the eyes of the fans) until Magic Johnson is running the point. Truly I believe this: if Nash were PG of this team, we would not be as successful as the SSOL Suns, and the fans would blame Nash before they blame Devin.

When I mentioned playmaking, I more or less meant guys that get assists/set up others, but in general, have a high iq, move the ball, keep moving, are good without the ball, etc.

I also mentioned I want guys who can defend.

What exactly do you mean when you say defensive playmakers? I don't typically hear being a playmaker being referred to as defensive. Of course you can make defensive highlight plays, so I assume you just mean blocks, steals, those types of things?

I definitely want solid fundamental defensive players who are great team defenders, and also love to see guys who will dive for balls, etc, like a PJ Tucker, and are just as focused on that side as the other side, and right now we only have maybe 3-4 or players you could maybe say that about. Maybe 5 at times.

Basically a high IQ player on both sides...guys who know where to move on offense, have good court vision, set up others, know where to be on team defense, communicate with others on floor, etc.

What I mean by defensive playmaking is mostly those things you mention - changing possessions, causing misses (as opposed to *merely* contesting), but also getting deflections, hounding ballhandlers, hitting guys, drawing offensive fouls and technicals, baiting players into bad shots/decisions, etc. Some guys who are solid defenders are more about avoiding embarrassment on defense, rather than making things happen. A lot of players seem to think defense is just part of the game rather than half the game (though if I'm being honest, I'd say defense is more like 45% of the game, but still).

I guess my problem with the focus on assists etc. (/"offensive" playmaking) is based on the following: last year, as a team, we got plenty of assists (thanks almost exclusively to Rubio and Devin) and had a good A/TO ratio (thanks to Rubio). We get assists from our backcourt. Sure, we would have better balance on offense if we had a front court player adding assists to the ledger (Toppin? I don't see anyone else...), but going after another PG to get more passing - I just don't know how much that adds, and I'd rather the focus be elsewhere.

[bwgood77]

I recall James Jones's mention of playmaking as the #1 thing we're looking for - but perhaps more than this, his clarification that defensive playmaking is just as important.

Only one player on the court can be the PG. There are four other players on the court, and if you're just looking at the players who are locked into contracts, we have only 6 players to play those 4 positions (and one of those players is Jalen Lecque). Rubio can defend the 2, so there's a bit of wiggle room, but you know what I'm saying.

Especially if we're continuing the plan of building around Booker, we need more defensive playmaking than just about anything else. More shooting won't hurt, but I've demonstrated in other posts that we have shooters, and that we're worse at pretty much everything else.

My desire for defensive playmaking in particular is why I'm so attracted to guys like Paul Reed, Tyler Bey, Devin Vassell and now, Josh Green. Haliburton blocks shots, too, so you can put him on that list as well, and heck, if you're looking at playmaking on both sides of the ball, clearly he's ahead of the rest of the guys on that list (and only he and Vassell have demonstrated the ability to knock down threes). Plus, you can play Haliburton at the 2 - at least in theory. Dude's a string bean so we're still just speculating that he can even crack this league. FWIW, I'm pretty sure that Vassell and Green will both make it. Reed I'm not so sure about, primarily because of his offense, but I think his ceiling is very high. As for Bey, from what I've seen, most of the negative commentaries are about his ability to work as a small ball 4. But he'll be a 3 in the NBA, and from what I can tell, all he needs to do is continue to work on that long ball and he'll stick in the league.

Most of all, I'm just jealous of the teams with the long 4's, who tend to give us problems and tend also to dominate the league. Davis and Giannis, Siakam and Boucher in Toronto. I love Christian Wood too but don't think we can grab him. Wish there were a guy like that in this draft. Reed is obviously the right prototype, but there's a reason he's projected by most to slip to the back of the first: he's not ready for the league and won't be very useful in year 1.

BTW... we're all talking about Rubio's successor, but dude is younger than when Nash first arrived. Why do we assume he won't be here for the long haul? Ricky's got a lot of game left in him. I guess I just don't understand the obsession, just the constant obsession among our fans to find a young PG. Sometimes I wonder if it's not all part of the obsession with shifting blame away from our *other* PG, Point Book. As in, Booker's not going to have a fair shot at winning games (in the eyes of the fans) until Magic Johnson is running the point. Truly I believe this: if Nash were PG of this team, we would not be as successful as the SSOL Suns, and the fans would blame Nash before they blame Devin.

When I mentioned playmaking, I more or less meant guys that get assists/set up others, but in general, have a high iq, move the ball, keep moving, are good without the ball, etc.

I also mentioned I want guys who can defend.

What exactly do you mean when you say defensive playmakers? I don't typically hear being a playmaker being referred to as defensive. Of course you can make defensive highlight plays, so I assume you just mean blocks, steals, those types of things?

I definitely want solid fundamental defensive players who are great team defenders, and also love to see guys who will dive for balls, etc, like a PJ Tucker, and are just as focused on that side as the other side, and right now we only have maybe 3-4 or players you could maybe say that about. Maybe 5 at times.

Basically a high IQ player on both sides...guys who know where to move on offense, have good court vision, set up others, know where to be on team defense, communicate with others on floor, etc.

What I mean by defensive playmaking is mostly those things you mention - changing possessions, causing misses (as opposed to *merely* contesting), but also getting deflections, hounding ballhandlers, hitting guys, drawing offensive fouls and technicals, baiting players into bad shots/decisions, etc. Some guys who are solid defenders are more about avoiding embarrassment on defense, rather than making things happen. A lot of players seem to think defense is just part of the game rather than half the game (though if I'm being honest, I'd say defense is more like 45% of the game, but still).

I guess my problem with the focus on assists etc. (/"offensive" playmaking) is based on the following: last year, as a team, we got plenty of assists (thanks almost exclusively to Rubio and Devin) and had a good A/TO ratio (thanks to Rubio). We get assists from our backcourt. Sure, we would have better balance on offense if we had a front court player adding assists to the ledger (Toppin? I don't see anyone else...), but going after another PG to get more passing - I just don't know how much that adds, and I'd rather the focus be elsewhere.

I mainly mention it for when Rubio is off the floor and long term, since he only has two years left. When he is off the floor, our offense does not move the ball nearly as well, and I think adding players who will likely play off the bench, perhaps often without Rubio will help make sure that we always have great ball movement.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

When I mentioned playmaking, I more or less meant guys that get assists/set up others, but in general, have a high iq, move the ball, keep moving, are good without the ball, etc.

I also mentioned I want guys who can defend.

What exactly do you mean when you say defensive playmakers? I don't typically hear being a playmaker being referred to as defensive. Of course you can make defensive highlight plays, so I assume you just mean blocks, steals, those types of things?

I definitely want solid fundamental defensive players who are great team defenders, and also love to see guys who will dive for balls, etc, like a PJ Tucker, and are just as focused on that side as the other side, and right now we only have maybe 3-4 or players you could maybe say that about. Maybe 5 at times.

Basically a high IQ player on both sides...guys who know where to move on offense, have good court vision, set up others, know where to be on team defense, communicate with others on floor, etc.

What I mean by defensive playmaking is mostly those things you mention - changing possessions, causing misses (as opposed to *merely* contesting), but also getting deflections, hounding ballhandlers, hitting guys, drawing offensive fouls and technicals, baiting players into bad shots/decisions, etc. Some guys who are solid defenders are more about avoiding embarrassment on defense, rather than making things happen. A lot of players seem to think defense is just part of the game rather than half the game (though if I'm being honest, I'd say defense is more like 45% of the game, but still).

I guess my problem with the focus on assists etc. (/"offensive" playmaking) is based on the following: last year, as a team, we got plenty of assists (thanks almost exclusively to Rubio and Devin) and had a good A/TO ratio (thanks to Rubio). We get assists from our backcourt. Sure, we would have better balance on offense if we had a front court player adding assists to the ledger (Toppin? I don't see anyone else...), but going after another PG to get more passing - I just don't know how much that adds, and I'd rather the focus be elsewhere.

I mainly mention it for when Rubio is off the floor and long term, since he only has two years left. When he is off the floor, our offense does not move the ball nearly as well, and I think adding players who will likely play off the bench, perhaps often without Rubio will help make sure that we always have great ball movement.

I don't disagree that - but for a few quarters with Jerome and a couple stretches by Carter - we were really hurting when Ricky came off the floor. Even then, I think there's a solid chance we'll be able to re-sign Rubio two years from now if we're fair, right? Y'all are always talking about how no one else wants him, so why can't we just re-sign him?

No doubt the better time to have this conversation would be after Orlando.

[bwgood77]

What I mean by defensive playmaking is mostly those things you mention - changing possessions, causing misses (as opposed to *merely* contesting), but also getting deflections, hounding ballhandlers, hitting guys, drawing offensive fouls and technicals, baiting players into bad shots/decisions, etc. Some guys who are solid defenders are more about avoiding embarrassment on defense, rather than making things happen. A lot of players seem to think defense is just part of the game rather than half the game (though if I'm being honest, I'd say defense is more like 45% of the game, but still).

I guess my problem with the focus on assists etc. (/"offensive" playmaking) is based on the following: last year, as a team, we got plenty of assists (thanks almost exclusively to Rubio and Devin) and had a good A/TO ratio (thanks to Rubio). We get assists from our backcourt. Sure, we would have better balance on offense if we had a front court player adding assists to the ledger (Toppin? I don't see anyone else...), but going after another PG to get more passing - I just don't know how much that adds, and I'd rather the focus be elsewhere.

I mainly mention it for when Rubio is off the floor and long term, since he only has two years left. When he is off the floor, our offense does not move the ball nearly as well, and I think adding players who will likely play off the bench, perhaps often without Rubio will help make sure that we always have great ball movement.

I don't disagree that - but for a few quarters with Jerome and a couple stretches by Carter - we were really hurting when Ricky came off the floor. Even then, I think there's a solid chance we'll be able to re-sign Rubio two years from now if we're fair, right? Y'all are always talking about how no one else wants him, so why can't we just re-sign him?

No doubt the better time to have this conversation would be after Orlando.

I guess it will depend on how good we are with our core then, how much he would need to be paid, if his shooting improves, etc. It's a little early to speculate, but I still would like to have a very solid backup/potential starter.

[Blonde]

I think Killian Hayes is the pretty ideal target in this draft for us but he’s trending to go before we pick. Is there a crappy asset we can attach to the 10th pick to move up and get him ala Minnesota did with Saric last year to get Culver?

However there will be players I like available at 10. Walking away with Okoro, Kira Lewis, Haliburton, or Cole would be successful to me. All of those guys rank inside my top 10.

[Ghost of Kleine]

I think Killian Hayes is the pretty ideal target in this draft for us but he’s trending to go before we pick. Is there a crappy asset we can attach to the 10th pick to move up and get him ala Minnesota did with Saric last year to get Culver?

However there will be players I like available at 10. Walking away with Okoro, Kira Lewis, Haliburton, or Cole would be successful to me. All of those guys rank inside my top 10.

Unfortunately for us, The only asset that we presently have that Minnesota or a few other top teams in the lottery may covet is Oubre. But are we willing to surrender him in exchange for a higher pick? IF so, Then he may be able to get us into the 5-8 range. So with that, Our best and most viable options for such a trade would be:
- New York. ( IF they somehow fall to 5)?
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y8nar7j2 . Oubre for Ellington/ Nitkilina/ Bullock.

- Detroit.
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ybpqsyx5 . Oubre for Henson/ McCrae/ Top 5 pick.

- Chicago.
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ydyloyco . Oubre for Young/ Arcidiacono/ 7th pick?

- Atlanta ( Maybe)???
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y9mdmu6q . The pick salary will make up for the difference in salary, But if this doesn't work salary wise, Then we'll just have to take back Dedmon. Which is no big deal really, As he's only guaranteed for 1 million **( If waived by 7/01/21.
https://www.spotrac.com/nba/atlanta-hawks/dewayne-dedmon-13536/ . But moreover, We do this for the additional lottery pick, giving us a top 5 pick and still having the 10th pick still.

With the 5th and 10th pick, We could possibly take any combination of:
- Toppin/ Lewis.
- Hayes/ Vassell.
- Okoro/ Lewis.
- Haliburton/ Vassell.
- Okungwu/ Lewis.
- Toppin/ Anthony.
- Okungwu/ Anthony.
- Avdija/ Lewis.
- Okungwu/ Anthony.
- Toppin/ Terry???
All of these many possibilities for a player that we may very well lose for nothing in free agency anyways. More importantly, We'd be able to address multiple positions at minimal overall cost ( rookie scale contracts).

[ATTL]

I'm still on the Haliburton and paul reed train.

[Ghost of Kleine]

I'm still on the Haliburton and paul reed train.

That's definitely not bad either man. I do love Reeds' ELITE defensive abilities, And think that if he can just correct his shooting mechanics, And perhaps his handle a bit, He'll potentially have immense Siakim like potential?

As for Haliburton, I like him well enough, Although I really don't think there's any way he's there whenst we pick. The top point guard options that I'm fairly certain will still be on the board at 10 for us to choose from are Kira Lewis ( ELITE SPEED) , Grant Riller ( ELITE PICK N' ROLL & SCORING AT THE RIM), Tyrell Terry ( ELITE PERIMETER SHOOTING) and very crafty passing skills. I like all three for those different elite skillsets that they each possess. And find the possibilities of possibly adding them to our core very exciting!

As for bigs, I'd love to get possibly get Toppin, But realize he's not likely to realistically fall to 10. So apart from that, I'd hope to secure another first round pick and take Jalen Smith, And Then go hard after Ibaka in free agency. Ibaka would be a perfect mentor for Smith, And would having both would potentially give us tremendous defensive depth and floor spacing in our frontcourt. However, IF we are able to trade Oubre for Markannen, Then I'd hope that we'd go really hard after Jerami Grant in free agency. And if we can't land Markannen, Then I'd target Paul Reed, And then in free agency, I'd go hard after Bertrans ( to play the 4) And Reed at the ( 3). Potent floor spacing with next to great length, defense and shotblocking!

And who knows, Perhaps Booker, Cam, Bertrans, etc. Could help Reed with his shooting mechanics??? But in terms of guards, As long as we get one of Lewis, Riller, Terry ( getting stronger on him) potentially tied with Riller for 2nd on my board. And then get one of either Jalen Smith ( 1) or Paul Reed ( 2), Then I'll look at draft night as a huge success!!!

[ATTL]

I'm still on the Haliburton and paul reed train.

That's definitely not bad either man. I do love Reeds' ELITE defensive abilities, And think that if he can just correct his shooting mechanics, And perhaps his handle a bit, He'll potentially have immense Siakim like potential?

As for Haliburton, I like him well enough, Although I really don't think there's any way he's there whenst we pick. The top point guard options that I'm fairly certain will still be on the board at 10 for us to choose from are Kira Lewis ( ELITE SPEED) , Grant Riller ( ELITE PICK N' ROLL & SCORING AT THE RIM), Tyrell Terry ( ELITE PERIMETER SHOOTING) and very crafty passing skills. I like all three for those different elite skillsets that they each possess. And find the possibilities of possibly adding them to our core very exciting!

As for bigs, I'd love to get possibly get Toppin, But realize he's not likely to realistically fall to 10. So apart from that, I'd hope to secure another first round pick and take Jalen Smith, And Then go hard after Ibaka in free agency. Ibaka would be a perfect mentor for Smith, And would having both would potentially give us tremendous defensive depth and floor spacing in our frontcourt. However, IF we are able to trade Oubre for Markannen, Then I'd hope that we'd go really hard after Jerami Grant in free agency. And if we can't land Markannen, Then I'd target Paul Reed, And then in free agency, I'd go hard after Bertrans ( to play the 4) And Reed at the ( 3). Potent floor spacing with next to great length, defense and shotblocking!

And who knows, Perhaps Booker, Cam, Bertrans, etc. Could help Reed with his shooting mechanics??? But in terms of guards, As long as we get one of Lewis, Riller, Terry ( getting stronger on him) potentially tied with Riller for 2nd on my board. And then get one of either Jalen Smith ( 1) or Paul Reed ( 2), Then I'll look at draft night as a huge success!!!

Siakam is who i keep going back to with Reed too. Reed just seems to have the traits we need at 4, I think his shooting will come around with more work and focus. Siakam shot much worse from 3 from what i remember.

Haliburton is a dream right now but I hope he falls or we jump up somehow. I just think if we're committed to booker long term we need length, defense, and shooting around him. To hide his major flaw and to enhance his strengths.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Grant Riller scouting video! Awesome

Watch on YouTube

[jredsaz]

Grant Riller scouting video! Awesome

Watch on YouTube

His FT rate is super exciting. Think he could be dynamic as an off the bench guard early in his career. Possibly more as he develops.

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Grant Riller scouting video! Awesome

Watch on YouTube

His FT rate is super exciting. Think he could be dynamic as an off the bench guard early in his career. Possibly more as he develops.

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

I'm really hoping we use the #10 to trade back for multiple picks, because this roster needs at least three more young, unproven point guards.

Rubio/Payne/Riller/Jerome/Carter/Okobo/Dotson/Flynn
Booker/Lecque
Bridges/Johnson
Oubre
Ayton/Diallo

Perfect.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Grant Riller scouting video! Awesome

Watch on YouTube

His FT rate is super exciting. Think he could be dynamic as an off the bench guard early in his career. Possibly more as he develops.

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

I'm really hoping we use the #10 to trade back for multiple picks, because this roster needs at least three more young, unproven point guards.

Rubio/Payne/Riller/Jerome/Carter/Okobo/Dotson/Flynn
Booker/Lecque
Bridges/Johnson
Oubre
Ayton/Diallo

Perfect.

I do agree man!

In that I also wouldn't prefer to carry as big a stable of mediocre bench guards as what we have been carrying to date! So you're not wrong at all in that regard. However, Multiple picks (** IF actually addressing different positions of need) as I've mentioned before would not actually be a bad thing considering that we absolutely do need to address multiple critical positional issues. Especially when considering the declining cap, And our need to minimize cost, Whilst adding depth that we clearly lacked this season. Also with extra consideration the importance of maintaining cap flexibility so that we can extend both Bridges and Ayton in the event they should have a breakout season and drastically increase the market place value. At that point, these rookie scale cost controlled contracts would obviously prove invaluable to our interests.

Also, it's honestly not like we'd have to keep 3 young guards on our roster obviously, As we'd likely waive Okobo, Move Jerome to our 3rd string shooting guard position, Or he can join Lecque in the League for further seasoning. And Paynes contract is only minimally guaranteed after all too. So upon review, We'd likely have the Rookie guard and Carter holding our 2nd and 3rd guard positions for now or until our major contractual core obligations are completed. And the others can quite easily be released, traded, or put in the G league for further development. And with respect to Riller, He is likely the most NBA ready guard in this draft, And has proven to be ELITE ( 97th percentile in the pick and roll/ isolation scoring) and is also absolutely elite at scoring at/ around the rim.

https://www.thestepien.com/2020/03/30/case-grant-riller/

According to Synergy Riller ranked in the 97th percentile as the ‘Pick and Roll’ scorer. Similar to his ability to score in isolation, Riller uses his athleticism and really good handles to get to the basket, or can decide to shoot off-the-dribble depending on what the defense gives up. His versatile skillset allows him to score against different PnR coverages, which is what makes him such a dangerous offensive player. 

Future Outlook (Primary / Secondary):                                                                        

Starter / Rotation

Outcomes:

High: An above-average starter. Scoring guard (3 level scorer) who can create for himself by shooting off-the-dribble, and uses his handles and burst to put pressure on the rim. Improved passing can make him even more dangerous out of the PnR. Improved motor on defense stops him from being a liability on that end and could even become a slight positive on that end.

So he'd likely be a contributor even in his rookie season. And his two major listed weaknesses being passing and defense, Really, Who better at point guard to mentor him on passing on playing solid defense at guard than Rubio himself.

*** Most importantly is the added depth at key positions these young players would add, AND again being at the lowest contractual cost/ impact possible, Would obviously afford us greater cap space with which to add higher value VETERANS to important roster positions as well. My goal in this is to add tremendous depth as needed, Whilst maintaining cap flexibility with interest to our critical and immenent looming core extensions. These rookie scale contracts would be considered a drop in the bucket as the saying goes, So they'd really have no negative impact overall on our abilities to add much needed veteran talent at the key positions of interest. And the BONUS also being in that should any combination of these rookie prospects prove to become solid/ positive contributors, They'd obviously carry major value ( production and potential vs cost) to be used as prime trade assets ( **which we are currently lacking) to be used in part of a bigger trade, for an potential 3rd star player??

This is my short and long term plan, To maintain cap flexibility and add supportive veteran pieces, With the goal of keeping our core together and using the added depth to cushion our team during further development and individual progression of their respective skillsets.