The Draft Thread: Ayton Vs Doncic 1

[Mjee]

I think I want Doncic - simply put - he is the most NBA ready player in the draft. Sure, some other players might have more upside potential (Ayton) - but that will require time. Doncic can help the team this next season and there is no reason to think that he won't become better at aspects of his game over time.

Really? For me it’s the exact opposite. While I am not against Doncic I could see him struggling to adapt to the speed of the NBA. Then as a fan base we would talk about how he is more of a work in progress like the rest of our guys and he’ll take a couple of years to develop.
With Ayton I feel he can come in immediately and at least give us 13 and 10 every night. He won’t need any plays really drawn up for him besides a pick and roll and I can see him feeding off the offensive glass and or getting fouls drawn on him. His defense likely won’t be very good this year but it’s not that big a deal for me as long as he stay out of foul trouble and gets 30 minutes a night.

I totally agree. Ayton will average a minimum of 13 and 10 per night. The problem I see with adding Doncic is who's gaurding the other teams opposing PG's? Jackson? That's a hell of a lot to ask from him every night! Book and Doncic would get torched by other teams opposing 1's. In addition, with that line-up, do we roll with Tyson, Quese, and Bender again ? PUKKKKKKKE in my mouth. Ayton would immediate take over for the 100 year old Tyson and become our dominate force down low for the next decade. Guys with his size and skill set don't just fall in our laps like this.

Take Ayton when you can and run because bigs like that a rarely available .....teams will match Gordon and Capela

[BobbieL]

I think I want Doncic - simply put - he is the most NBA ready player in the draft. Sure, some other players might have more upside potential (Ayton) - but that will require time. Doncic can help the team this next season and there is no reason to think that he won't become better at aspects of his game over time.

I also think he is the most ready because of his Euroleague success. However, Ayton does have a higher ceiling and is a better positional fit for this squad.

I guarantee once Deandre comes to PHX for his workout and interview, he will solidify his spot as the #1 pick.

I promise you Devin Booker will be pushing hard for him as well over Luka.

McD can not afford to get this one wrong ..... if you read and listen to all the experts Ayton > Doncic

This just isn't true. If you look at some very respected experts at places like the ringer or Sepian they favor Doncic.


Side note: is anyone else getting a bunch of weird pop ups when on this site on chrome on their phone? I have and I swear it only happens on the Suns board.

I get a pop up that plays a wheel of fortune type thing -- spinning

BAck to DOncic V Ayton
Yes the lack of defense for Luka will be a problem - as he will not be guarding the PG. And drafting Doncic - where do you play him with Josh and Booker. My thing -if he truly is the better player, you are helping the league by takng Ayton to "fill the center" position. Like when I read from Bordow they are targeting PG at pick 16 - and my thought again, at 16 don't target take top flight talent. Stop try to check boxes - just get talent.

I would be fine with Ayto - just today think I am in Lukas camp.

[Mulhollanddrive]

There seems to be more uncertainty about Doncic's position from scouting reports I've read. He may need a PG alongside him like McConnell with Simmons.

[oddity]

In 25 minutes Luka, RMD's point guard, takes almost as many free throws as Ayton does in 34 minutes in a league where the average center is 6'9. If that doesn't say something about who the more aggressive player is and who the better scorer is I don't know what does.

[King4Day]

Most are probably already aware how close we were to not getting the top pick but if not, here's cool little read:

https://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/nba/suns/2018/05/19/phoenix-suns-nba-draft-deandre-ayton-lottery/619132002/

[Mjee]

In 25 minutes Luka, RMD's point guard, takes almost as many free throws as Ayton does in 34 minutes in a league where the average center is 6'9. If that doesn't say something about who the more aggressive player is and who the better scorer is I don't know what does.

U of A played a **** motion offense the entire year that did not showcase Ayton's ability to its fullest and he still averaged 20 and 11. That's insane especially when a guy like Ristic is clogging the lane most games.

"Better scorer" is debatable

[WeekapaugGroove]

I also think he is the most ready because of his Euroleague success. However, Ayton does have a higher ceiling and is a better positional fit for this squad.

I guarantee once Deandre comes to PHX for his workout and interview, he will solidify his spot as the #1 pick.

I promise you Devin Booker will be pushing hard for him as well over Luka.

McD can not afford to get this one wrong ..... if you read and listen to all the experts Ayton > Doncic

This just isn't true. If you look at some very respected experts at places like the ringer or Sepian they favor Doncic.


Side note: is anyone else getting a bunch of weird pop ups when on this site on chrome on their phone? I have and I swear it only happens on the Suns board.

I get a pop up that plays a wheel of fortune type thing -- spinning

BAck to DOncic V Ayton
Yes the lack of defense for Luka will be a problem - as he will not be guarding the PG. And drafting Doncic - where do you play him with Josh and Booker. My thing -if he truly is the better player, you are helping the league by takng Ayton to "fill the center" position. Like when I read from Bordow they are targeting PG at pick 16 - and my thought again, at 16 don't target take top flight talent. Stop try to check boxes - just get talent.

I would be fine with Ayto - just today think I am in Lukas camp.

That pop up is super annoying. I get the fake Amazon add phishing page sometimes.


As far as Luka on D. I think he would play all over and you could have some lineups where he's the 4 with Jackson and Booker. If they did play him at the 1 on O I would just have Booker guard PG's. He won't be good at it bu unless Booker improves he's a liability whomever he guards and on the ball PG defense is probably the least important of the positions.

[bwgood77]

There seems to be more uncertainty about Doncic's position from scouting reports I've read. He may need a PG alongside him like McConnell with Simmons.

McConnell didn't start....well, he started 1 game. Positions not a huge deal though...this isn't football or baseball.

[Mjee]

"The Suns can always find guards/wing players in free agency. But a physically dominant center who fits today’s NBA game? How can the Suns pass that up?" - Scott Bordow

[JMac1]

"The Suns can always find guards/wing players in free agency. But a physically dominant center who fits today’s NBA game? How can the Suns pass that up?" - Scott Bordow

Thank God. I need more affirmation like that. I’m nervous.....

[oddity]

In 25 minutes Luka, RMD's point guard, takes almost as many free throws as Ayton does in 34 minutes in a league where the average center is 6'9. If that doesn't say something about who the more aggressive player is and who the better scorer is I don't know what does.

U of A played a **** motion offense the entire year that did not showcase Ayton's ability to its fullest and he still averaged 20 and 11. That's insane especially when a guy like Ristic is clogging the lane most games.

"Better scorer" is debatable

Better scorer is absolutely not debatable. Luka on the ball is eons ahead of Ayton. His dribble moves are more advanced for a guard than Ayton's post moves are for a center. If you watched Ayton play you'll notice that his pullup is nice.... because he rarely drives the ball. A significant chunk of Ayton's scoring was standing jumpers off the catch, while Luka can shoot off the catch and off the dribble. Ayton will for sure be a great finisher inside, but Luka has been posting great numbers in the paint the too, where he uses his soft touch and floaters to get shots over size. Is the difference in inside finishing going to make up for Doncic's far more advanced perimeter game? When you look at a scorer it is a matter of how many different places can you be a threat from and how big that threat is. Luka, much like our own Devin Booker, is a threat from damn near the whole court, and also like Booker, scores at an elite level inside for his position. I mean, seriously. If you had both, the game was on the line and your team needs a bucket, do you allow Luka or Ayton to isolate? Even if you decide to run a pick and roll for Ayton, you'd probably STILL have Luka making the pass. Ayton does a lot of things well and better than Luka but you just can't make a case for scoring.
You also cannot blame it all on U of A's system. Just last year U of A's Lauri Markkanen got to the line almost as much as Ayton in less minutes playing mostly on the perimeter and with lesser physical tools. But go on, make excuses and hide in the numbers we can't see to avoid talking the uncomfortable numbers we can.

[sleepyvato]

1. Phoenix Suns: Deandre Ayton, C, Arizona | Fr.

Height: 7'0" | Weight: 260 pounds | Age: 19 | Last Mock: 1
Stats: 20.1 PPG, 11.6 RPG, 61.2% FG

Ayton has become the consensus top pick around the league, fits neatly into the Suns’ situation, and appears set to remain in Arizona on draft night and in the foreseeable future. The top-rated prospect on our Big Board since the start of the season, Ayton has elite physical traits, a developing inside-out skill set and a superstar ceiling if all goes according to plan. He’ll immediately be one of the most athletic centers in the league. Phoenix is developing a youthful roster and conveniently has a hole at center, where Ayton would be able to step in immediately. He needs to get better defensively but has all the tools to be a quality rim protector. There’s a sense he may need to be pushed harder than some to reach his full potential, but Ayton has the best chance of anyone in the draft to become a franchise player.

https://www.si.com/nba/2018/05/21/2018-nba-mock-draft-combine-lottery-projections-deandre-ayton-luka-doncic-donte-divincenzo

[bwgood77]

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[bigfoot]

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The "lots of space" comment is easily overlooked. Euroleague there is no 3-second defensive violation. Defensive players camp out all the time in the paint. Doncic makes incredible passes and dribbles in confined space. With the open space he will see in the NBA, longer games, and faster pace, he could easily be more like Magic Johnson with 17pts/8rbs/12ast type of player.

[bwgood77]

Read on Twitter

The "lots of space" comment is easily overlooked. Euroleague there is no 3-second defensive violation. Defensive players camp out all the time in the paint. Doncic makes incredible passes and dribbles in confined space. With the open space he will see in the NBA, longer games, and faster pace, he could easily be more like Magic Johnson with 17pts/8rbs/12ast type of player.

The entire floor and way teams play is more spread out too (or will be if/when we have more perimeter shooters) which open things up for Booker and would for Doncic and others.

[Mulhollanddrive]

Can you pick Doncic no.1 if he defers to another guard like Dragic in FIBA as that will affect his ceiling without the ball in his hands.

[thamadkant]

There seems to be more uncertainty about Doncic's position from scouting reports I've read. He may need a PG alongside him like McConnell with Simmons.

He plays next to Redick

Redick is a combo guard. Who can dribble and handle the ball.


Then you have Saric.... Who is as big as Simmons... Who isn't far behind him in dribbling either. Under rated player for 76ers.

[thamadkant]

Yeah Doncic's ability to pass and IQ... Again I see those translating easily


I want him used like early days Larry Bird was for Celtics when he was fresh off college.
I think he would be absolutely be an amazing play maker against slower players

He's 6'9... He's not 6'7 .... He's thick too and I think he can fight for rebounds wasily. He's got that nasty thing going for him.

I don't like as PG.... They just switch the fastest player on him and draw fouls on him... He's probably as bad as Booker in staying in front of quick fast players.

But against the slower ones he would be a triple double threat of given high usage

Someone tell Booker and Jackson that and see if they support it

[JMac1]

Read on Twitter

The "lots of space" comment is easily overlooked. Euroleague there is no 3-second defensive violation. Defensive players camp out all the time in the paint. Doncic makes incredible passes and dribbles in confined space. With the open space he will see in the NBA, longer games, and faster pace, he could easily be more like Magic Johnson with 17pts/8rbs/12ast type of player.

The entire floor and way teams play is more spread out too (or will be if/when we have more perimeter shooters) which open things up for Booker and would for Doncic and others.

It will open things up for Ayton as well. No Ristic in the middle.

[bigfoot]

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