The One And Only Offseason Thread 4

[SunsFanSSOL]

Honestly, it doesn't mean anything. Lots of athletes live in AZ in the off season.

You are trying to connect dots that are not associated with each other.

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Bledsoe doesn't live in Phoenix in the off-season though, and college would start in the fall, during the NBA season, while he (and his family) are living in AZ.

Distance learning? I assume most pro athletes would be doing college off campus because of time constraints like many people working full time.

It's Bledsoe's brother that is enrolling in classes, not Bledsoe. Why would his brother, (who lives with Bledsoe during the NBA season) move across the country from Alabama to Phoenix just to attend a community college if Bledsoe wasn't going to be playing here? They have community college's everywhere, in every NBA city. If Bledsoe's brother enrolled in Scottsdale Community College for the fall, then he is pretty much certain that he and Bledsoe are going to be back living in Phoenix for the NBA season next year.

It's just like the issue with LeBron's kids. He enrolled them in school in Cleveland for this upcoming year before he even made his decision. Everyone was saying it made no sense for him to do that if he was going to be living in Miami, so it started looking like he was coming back to Cleveland.

[JDLAW]

I think a trade is just as likely as a signing at this point. It's just a question on who/what is offered up. Detroit seems a likely candidate. Though we'd likely want Monroe, the Pistons could counter with Josh Smith and a pick. They could sign both bled and Monroe.

Like him or not, and I know many don't, Smith would be a valuable addition and our best defender. 2-3 yrs ago when he was a free agent, many we're comparing him to Amare. He is that athletic, ( I seem to remember some good battles they had)...His biggest rap is focus and shot selection.... Both of which can be corrected with proper coaching. SBnation did a nice piece on him a while back with a direct comparison to Marion and their ability to defend multiple positions.

Push comes to shove and Bled demands more or the same and a change(disgruntled), Smith and a pick could be the best we could get... And I'd rather have a player like Smith who would be flat out stoked to be a Sun, than a mumbly grumbly Bled so who feels disrespected.

Now go ahead and tell me why you don't want Smith, but be sure to consider how good we could be with him playing within this system.... And please no stretch four logic

I do not believe a trade is likely at all. Bledsoe has to want and agree to go to the particular team and he has to agree on the terms of the contract; then the Suns would have to agree on what to take back. I just do not believe Bledsoe has any interest in going to Detroit and even if he did, I do not think Detroit has any interest in paying what Bledsoe wants. They have their own issue with Monroe wanting more than the market will bear for him.

Nothing in Bledsoe' comment within the context that they ere made leads me to believe he thinks he is being disrespected by the Suns.

[Sunsdeuce]

Just want to see the general thought process here.

What do you guys think is more important to Bledsoe, money or location?


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[PhxSuns1]

Just want to see the general thought process here.

What do you guys think is more important to Bledsoe, money or location?


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[letsgosuns]

I think if Bledsoe signs, no one is going to remember or care about the interview that happened yesterday. If he is traded, people will point it out as well as the exit interview he did and claim he never wanted to be here in the first place. At this point I will be happy if he stays or fine with a trade as long as the Suns get back great value in return.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

I think a trade is just as likely as a signing at this point. It's just a question on who/what is offered up. Detroit seems a likely candidate. Though we'd likely want Monroe, the Pistons could counter with Josh Smith and a pick. They could sign both bled and Monroe.

Like him or not, and I know many don't, Smith would be a valuable addition and our best defender. 2-3 yrs ago when he was a free agent, many we're comparing him to Amare. He is that athletic, ( I seem to remember some good battles they had)...His biggest rap is focus and shot selection.... Both of which can be corrected with proper coaching. SBnation did a nice piece on him a while back with a direct comparison to Marion and their ability to defend multiple positions.

Push comes to shove and Bled demands more or the same and a change(disgruntled), Smith and a pick could be the best we could get... And I'd rather have a player like Smith who would be flat out stoked to be a Sun, than a mumbly grumbly Bled so who feels disrespected.

Now go ahead and tell me why you don't want Smith, but be sure to consider how good we could be with him playing within this system.... And please no stretch four logic

http://imgur.com/LEYPqxo

I vote no. If I'm talking to DET, I suppose I'd look at KCP. Beyond that, my interest is thin.

[letsgosuns]

Just want to see the general thought process here.

What do you guys think is more important to Bledsoe, money or location?


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Money all the way.

[JDLAW]

In addition to what most have been saying, I believe there exists a bit of a backlash against Bledsoe's (and LeBron's) agent and indirectly LeBron right now and this has hurt Bledsoe. The fact that there have been no reported offers (I understand there is one that a "insider" mentioned), but no one in the media had picked up on that.

The reason I believe there is a backlash is that there were a lot of grumblings about how Paul and Lebron handled LeBron's situation - essentially picking teams that could be of LeBron's interest and then forcing those to come to him without the opportunity to meet with LeBron. GMs and owners are not generally enamored with being forced to grovel, especially to someone who is viewed as inexperienced and somewhat incompetent as an agent. They also did not like the league and the free agent market begin held hostage while LeBron made up his mind. As a consequence, there is a reluctance to confer any additional success onto Paul by giving Bledsoe a contract above his market value, thereby more power to LeBron's circle, which included Paul. One way to take LeBron and Paul down a peg is to ensure that Bledsoe - the only player being represented by Paul that he has to work for - does not get the max deal he wants and the Paul is viewed as being responsible for a botched free agency.

[lilfishi22]

Bledsoe doesn't live in Phoenix in the off-season though, and college would start in the fall, during the NBA season, while he (and his family) are living in AZ.

Distance learning? I assume most pro athletes would be doing college off campus because of time constraints like many people working full time.

It's Bledsoe's brother that is enrolling in classes, not Bledsoe. Why would his brother, (who lives with Bledsoe during the NBA season) move across the country from Alabama to Phoenix just to attend a community college if Bledsoe wasn't going to be playing here? They have community college's everywhere, in every NBA city. If Bledsoe's brother enrolled in Scottsdale Community College for the fall, then he is pretty much certain that he and Bledsoe are going to be back living in Phoenix for the NBA season next year.

It's just like the issue with LeBron's kids. He enrolled them in school in Cleveland for this upcoming year before he even made his decision. Everyone was saying it made no sense for him to do that if he was going to be living in Miami, so it started looking like he was coming back to Cleveland.

Ahh I thought Bledsoe was going to college to finish his degree or something. Hmm that is peculiar. Perhaps he's taking the QO

[lilfishi22]

Just want to see the general thought process here.

What do you guys think is more important to Bledsoe, money or location?


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Without a doubt it's the mulla. If it's location, I'm sure his agent would have leaked that the other teams and taken a small discount to go some place else.

[Sunsdeuce]

In addition to what most have been saying, I believe there exists a bit of a backlash against Bledsoe's (and LeBron's) agent and indirectly LeBron right now and this has hurt Bledsoe. The fact that there have been no reported offers (I understand there is one that a "insider" mentioned), but no one in the media had picked up on that.

The reason I believe there is a backlash is that there were a lot of grumblings about how Paul and Lebron handled LeBron's situation - essentially picking teams that could be of LeBron's interest and then forcing those to come to him without the opportunity to meet with LeBron. GMs and owners are not generally enamored with being forced to grovel, especially to someone who is viewed as inexperienced and somewhat incompetent as an agent. They also did not like the league and the free agent market begin held hostage while LeBron made up his mind. As a consequence, there is a reluctance to confer any additional success onto Paul by giving Bledsoe a contract above his market value, thereby more power to LeBron's circle, which included Paul. One way to take LeBron and Paul down a peg is to ensure that Bledsoe - the only player being represented by Paul that he has to work for - does not get the max deal he wants and the Paul is viewed as being responsible for a botched free agency.

Very interesting theory. That may be true.


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[drewsprocket]

I think a trade is just as likely as a signing at this point. It's just a question on who/what is offered up. Detroit seems a likely candidate. Though we'd likely want Monroe, the Pistons could counter with Josh Smith and a pick. They could sign both bled and Monroe.

Like him or not, and I know many don't, Smith would be a valuable addition and our best defender. 2-3 yrs ago when he was a free agent, many we're comparing him to Amare. He is that athletic, ( I seem to remember some good battles they had)...His biggest rap is focus and shot selection.... Both of which can be corrected with proper coaching. SBnation did a nice piece on him a while back with a direct comparison to Marion and their ability to defend multiple positions.

Push comes to shove and Bled demands more or the same and a change(disgruntled), Smith and a pick could be the best we could get... And I'd rather have a player like Smith who would be flat out stoked to be a Sun, than a mumbly grumbly Bled so who feels disrespected.

Now go ahead and tell me why you don't want Smith, but be sure to consider how good we could be with him playing within this system.... And please no stretch four logic

I do not believe a trade is likely at all. Bledsoe has to want and agree to go to the particular team and he has to agree on the terms of the contract; then the Suns would have to agree on what to take back. I just do not believe Bledsoe has any interest in going to Detroit and even if he did, I do not think Detroit has any interest in paying what Bledsoe wants. They have their own issue with Monroe wanting more than the market will bear for him.

Nothing in Bledsoe' comment within the context that they ere made leads me to believe he thinks he is being disrespected by the Suns.

I suspect that Bledsoe would go anywhere that would pay him what he wants. I have little evidence other than his silly max expectations and ability to rationalize it. It seems that player who make similar gripes in public view think their loyalty is bought by your team that values you wherein anything less than what you ask is an insult. He was made a fair contract offer and had little way of using the restricted free agency to his own benefit unlike Haywood did this summer.
I love his quote below, although I think he needs to emphasize the part where he says EVERY NIGHT. I wouldn't expect someone to pay me top dollar after having an injury wrought year which kept us from making the playoffs. That's the bottom line right there for max dollars.

[kingstyyyle]

I think a trade is just as likely as a signing at this point. It's just a question on who/what is offered up. Detroit seems a likely candidate. Though we'd likely want Monroe, the Pistons could counter with Josh Smith and a pick. They could sign both bled and Monroe.

Like him or not, and I know many don't, Smith would be a valuable addition and our best defender. 2-3 yrs ago when he was a free agent, many we're comparing him to Amare. He is that athletic, ( I seem to remember some good battles they had)...His biggest rap is focus and shot selection.... Both of which can be corrected with proper coaching. SBnation did a nice piece on him a while back with a direct comparison to Marion and their ability to defend multiple positions.

Push comes to shove and Bled demands more or the same and a change(disgruntled), Smith and a pick could be the best we could get... And I'd rather have a player like Smith who would be flat out stoked to be a Sun, than a mumbly grumbly Bled so who feels disrespected.

Now go ahead and tell me why you don't want Smith, but be sure to consider how good we could be with him playing within this system.... And please no stretch four logic

Smith is negative value at this point. They would have to add a pick just to unload him IMO

[JDLAW]

I think a trade is just as likely as a signing at this point. It's just a question on who/what is offered up. Detroit seems a likely candidate. Though we'd likely want Monroe, the Pistons could counter with Josh Smith and a pick. They could sign both bled and Monroe.

Like him or not, and I know many don't, Smith would be a valuable addition and our best defender. 2-3 yrs ago when he was a free agent, many we're comparing him to Amare. He is that athletic, ( I seem to remember some good battles they had)...His biggest rap is focus and shot selection.... Both of which can be corrected with proper coaching. SBnation did a nice piece on him a while back with a direct comparison to Marion and their ability to defend multiple positions.

Push comes to shove and Bled demands more or the same and a change(disgruntled), Smith and a pick could be the best we could get... And I'd rather have a player like Smith who would be flat out stoked to be a Sun, than a mumbly grumbly Bled so who feels disrespected.

Now go ahead and tell me why you don't want Smith, but be sure to consider how good we could be with him playing within this system.... And please no stretch four logic

I do not believe a trade is likely at all. Bledsoe has to want and agree to go to the particular team and he has to agree on the terms of the contract; then the Suns would have to agree on what to take back. I just do not believe Bledsoe has any interest in going to Detroit and even if he did, I do not think Detroit has any interest in paying what Bledsoe wants. They have their own issue with Monroe wanting more than the market will bear for him.

Nothing in Bledsoe' comment within the context that they ere made leads me to believe he thinks he is being disrespected by the Suns.

I suspect that Bledsoe would go anywhere that would pay him what he wants. I have little evidence other than his silly max expectations and ability to rationalize it. It seems that player who make similar gripes in public view think their loyalty is bought by your team that values you wherein anything less than what you ask is an insult. He was made a fair contract offer and had little way of using the restricted free agency to his own benefit unlike Haywood did this summer.
I love his quote below, although I think he needs to emphasize the part where he says EVERY NIGHT. I wouldn't expect someone to pay me top dollar after having an injury wrought year which kept us from making the playoffs. That's the bottom line right there for max dollars.

You might be right about his willingness to go anywhere that would pay him, but there is nothing to back this up. He has not rationalized anything at this point because he has been very quiet. Nothing in his comment suggests to me that he will not discriminate on where he plays.

[drewsprocket]

[jcsunsfan]

I think a trade is just as likely as a signing at this point. It's just a question on who/what is offered up. Detroit seems a likely candidate. Though we'd likely want Monroe, the Pistons could counter with Josh Smith and a pick. They could sign both bled and Monroe.

Like him or not, and I know many don't, Smith would be a valuable addition and our best defender. 2-3 yrs ago when he was a free agent, many we're comparing him to Amare. He is that athletic, ( I seem to remember some good battles they had)...His biggest rap is focus and shot selection.... Both of which can be corrected with proper coaching. SBnation did a nice piece on him a while back with a direct comparison to Marion and their ability to defend multiple positions.

Push comes to shove and Bled demands more or the same and a change(disgruntled), Smith and a pick could be the best we could get... And I'd rather have a player like Smith who would be flat out stoked to be a Sun, than a mumbly grumbly Bled so who feels disrespected.

Now go ahead and tell me why you don't want Smith, but be sure to consider how good we could be with him playing within this system.... And please no stretch four logic

I do not believe a trade is likely at all. Bledsoe has to want and agree to go to the particular team and he has to agree on the terms of the contract; then the Suns would have to agree on what to take back. I just do not believe Bledsoe has any interest in going to Detroit and even if he did, I do not think Detroit has any interest in paying what Bledsoe wants. They have their own issue with Monroe wanting more than the market will bear for him.

Nothing in Bledsoe' comment within the context that they ere made leads me to believe he thinks he is being disrespected by the Suns.

To trade him, you have to find a team that is willing to pay him more than what we will pay him AND is willing to give up something good to get him. That is not happening. So, if the Suns WANTED to move him, they can't. The Suns and Bledsoe are basically stuck with one another. So they need to both make nice and work this out.

[JDLAW]

I think a trade is just as likely as a signing at this point. It's just a question on who/what is offered up. Detroit seems a likely candidate. Though we'd likely want Monroe, the Pistons could counter with Josh Smith and a pick. They could sign both bled and Monroe.

Like him or not, and I know many don't, Smith would be a valuable addition and our best defender. 2-3 yrs ago when he was a free agent, many we're comparing him to Amare. He is that athletic, ( I seem to remember some good battles they had)...His biggest rap is focus and shot selection.... Both of which can be corrected with proper coaching. SBnation did a nice piece on him a while back with a direct comparison to Marion and their ability to defend multiple positions.

Push comes to shove and Bled demands more or the same and a change(disgruntled), Smith and a pick could be the best we could get... And I'd rather have a player like Smith who would be flat out stoked to be a Sun, than a mumbly grumbly Bled so who feels disrespected.

Now go ahead and tell me why you don't want Smith, but be sure to consider how good we could be with him playing within this system.... And please no stretch four logic

I do not believe a trade is likely at all. Bledsoe has to want and agree to go to the particular team and he has to agree on the terms of the contract; then the Suns would have to agree on what to take back. I just do not believe Bledsoe has any interest in going to Detroit and even if he did, I do not think Detroit has any interest in paying what Bledsoe wants. They have their own issue with Monroe wanting more than the market will bear for him.

Nothing in Bledsoe' comment within the context that they ere made leads me to believe he thinks he is being disrespected by the Suns.

To trade him, you have to find a team that is willing to pay him more than what we will pay him AND is willing to give up something good to get him. That is not happening. So, if the Suns WANTED to move him, they can't. The Suns and Bledsoe are basically stuck with one another. So they need to both make nice and work this out.

I see we agree on this. Don't see a trade being likely either. I said before and I'll predict again there will be a compromise under which the Suns might give a little more base salary in the form of annual increases and some incentive clauses (i.e. $1M for all-star recognition like Dragic's contract) that would allow Bledsoe to earn more and will allow his idiot agent to save face.

[bwgood77]

I suspect that Bledsoe would go anywhere that would pay him what he wants. I have little evidence other than his silly max expectations and ability to rationalize it. It seems that player who make similar gripes in public view think their loyalty is bought by your team that values you wherein anything less than what you ask is an insult. He was made a fair contract offer and had little way of using the restricted free agency to his own benefit unlike Haywood did this summer.
I love his quote below, although I think he needs to emphasize the part where he says EVERY NIGHT. I wouldn't expect someone to pay me top dollar after having an injury wrought year which kept us from making the playoffs. That's the bottom line right there for max dollars.

You know what the strangest part about all of this is? Bledsoe didn't even VISIT another team did he? Remember when Gordon was a free agent and we met with him and another couple of teams met with him?

To add to JDLAW's point about backlash against an agent, even IF LeBron wanted his agent to handle it all and didn't want to meet with teams, that doesn't mean he should handle Bledsoe the same way. He should have, at a bare minimum schedule some visits with a few teams or something. But when you don't even VISIT anywhere else while everyone is spending their money, that just seems ludicrous unless no one even wanted to meet with him.

I think his agent REALLY botched this. Obviously he is inexperienced and has never really had to handle a restricted free agent, but he certainly didn't do it well.

If Bledsoe wanted to go anywhere that would have paid him, he should have at least visited places. Even the big names like Melo traveled to visit places.

This leads me to believe there was just little to no interest in teams even bothering, whether it be most teams not needing point guards or not dealing with his agent.

Either way, I agree about there not being a trade, because if that was a possibility, I think him and his agent would have gone to visit with Detroit and Milwaukee to discuss how it could all be worked out.

There is the possibility that the agent just wants to handle everything over the phone (or in Cleveland), which would likely make teams leery of dealing with him.

[irish22022]

He's gonna sign. We wont have to up our offer but we will in an attempt to keep him from getting disgruntled.

4 year, 53 million with a 4th year player option or something.

I'd rather see a sign and trade with detroit honestly. But I know they're looking forward to the two headed pg.

You had me until this line. I'd rather let Bledsoe walk for free than pay Monroe the kind of money it would take to make this happen. If Monroe were on a good team in the West and if he didn't have David Falk as his agent, someone would be offering him a 4 year/32 million dollar deal. And fans of his former team would be mocking the team foolish enough to spend that kind of money on a backup big man.

He'd be a good backup big man, better than most but I don't see how a team wins consistently with a 4 or 5 that can't guard his position, has no range, can't shoot free throws and isn't an efficient scorer. AFAIC, he'd need to average 20+ rebounds a game to make up for all his other weaknesses.

I agree about Monroe. I like josh smith.

[lilfishi22]

I see we agree on this. Don't see a trade being likely either. I said before and I'll predict again there will be a compromise under which the Suns might give a little more base salary in the form of annual increases and some incentive clauses (i.e. $1M for all-star recognition like Dragic's contract) that would allow Bledsoe to earn more and will allow his idiot agent to save face.

That's basically the argument I've been making while others are saying we should stick with a take it or leave it approach. We're not likely going to get it done with the $48m/4 offer and it does neither party any good just sitting on it. Suns will give a little bit more, make Rich Paul look like he single-handedly got Bledsoe more money and we won't have to hear from the guy for another 4 years (hopefully). Like you've mentioned, the compromise could come in the form of incentives. I'm definitely in support of that approach.