Training Camp Scrimmage

[jolbin]

Be patient with Zoran, you remeber the original "Tragic" ?
It ended quite well, no?

[jcsunsfan]

Be patient with Zoran, you remeber the original "Tragic" ?
It ended quite well, no?

I am not worried about Zoran because I do not expect him to play. Its clear Archie is better right now, and that is a good thing.

[RunDogGun]

So is there any way to watch the scrimmage now that is long over? Been a busy few days.

[Gorilla Warfare]

So is there any way to watch the scrimmage now that is long over? Been a busy few days.

http://www.nba.com/suns/training-camp-2014

First video on that page. Game starts about 16 minutes into the feed.

[Jdiddy701]

^ any highlight package? I will watch it all when I get home but been on vaca all weekend


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[RunDogGun]

So is there any way to watch the scrimmage now that is long over? Been a busy few days.

http://www.nba.com/suns/training-camp-2014

First video on that page. Game starts about 16 minutes into the feed.

Thank you kind sir, I've been celebrating my 44th, and Grant Hill's 42nd.

[lilfishi22]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aw7Xbr3D9Ew[/youtube]
in case it hasn't been posted yet. It's a bit more stable for me

[jolbin]

Be patient with Zoran, you remeber the original "Tragic" ?
It ended quite well, no?

I am not worried about Zoran because I do not expect him to play. Its clear Archie is better right now, and that is a good thing.

Archie isnt a better player (Yet), Zoran just needs a bit of an adjustment period

[Revived]

Be patient with Zoran, you remeber the original "Tragic" ?
It ended quite well, no?

I am not worried about Zoran because I do not expect him to play. Its clear Archie is better right now, and that is a good thing.

Archie isnt a better player (Yet), Zoran just needs a bit of an adjustment period

Based on what? I don't think anyone in their right mind would pick Zoran over him.

[mybloodisorange]

Zoran just changed teams, leagues and countries. Its going to take time for him to adapt to the NBA and allow his jet lag to wear off. It's perfect since we have a glut at guard and the kid just finished the FIBA tournament and now he's gasping for air in Flagstaff...patience Suns fans!

[jolbin]

I am not worried about Zoran because I do not expect him to play. Its clear Archie is better right now, and that is a good thing.

Archie isnt a better player (Yet), Zoran just needs a bit of an adjustment period

Based on what? I don't think anyone in their right mind would pick Zoran over him.

I have followed Zoran closely for cca 5 years now, know what he is capable of and what kind of player he is.. He always needs longer to adapt and gel into the coaches ideas.
I cant back it up with any stats, but i think Zoran will be in rotation, while Goodwin will be waiting for his minutes...

[Revived]

Archie isnt a better player (Yet), Zoran just needs a bit of an adjustment period

Based on what? I don't think anyone in their right mind would pick Zoran over him.

I have followed Zoran closely for cca 5 years now, know what he is capable of and what kind of player he is.. He always needs longer to adapt and gel into the coaches ideas.
I cant back it up with any stats, but i think Zoran will be in rotation, while Goodwin will be waiting for his minutes...

We'll see. I'm not saying Zoran sucks but I just don't see how he's better than Goodwin (right now) though.

[lilfishi22]

I don't think either players are rotation guys at the moment. Zoran might be a little more refined just because of the experience he's had playing in the pros but he will need time to get acclimated to playing in the NBA, which means he'll need to really impress in practice to make it to the floor. As for Archie, his shot is still flat and he plays out of control a lot of the time. I straight up don't think he's ready to contribute more than garbage minutes yet.

[mybloodisorange]

My guess is that Ennis will be the odd man out of the rotation minutes and Toronto makes a trade for him. We'll play him a bit early to show that he can play but if he isn't wearing a Raptors jersey by the trade deadline I'll be shocked. Not that I don't like him but they actually need him and he can get minutes there; if he stays here I could easily see him getting buried behind Bledsoe, Dragic, IT, Goodwin & Green. Keep in mind when we drafted Ennis we hadn't yet signed IT, Zoran or resigned Bledsoe so on draft day it looked like we might possibly need him. Now we don't.

[TASTIC]

I don't think Zoran's going to see anything but mop up duty for at least the first few months.

Going to take him a while to catch up to the nuances of the NBA game and lifestyle, especially going from being a legit starter to NBA rookie, even if his big bro is our best player.

Goodwin's athleticism and physical gifts (especially on D) really looked awesome, BUT, his shot is god awful and I'm not sure if it can be fixed to be honest cos he said he'd be working on it in the off-season but I didn't see any improvement. His FT form is bad, as is his set 3pt shot. He looks more and more like a slasher than a shooter; love his length and hustle on D though.

Zack Lowe's latest podcast basically said Green's the guy who will be dealt most likely, which sucks. I watched some highlights of last year's games and man did he get hot, and often. The excitement he brought was insane last year, very few Suns players have made me go 'WOW' repeatedly like he did - ie Nash, Amare, Marion...He and Amin also touched on the loss of Frye and how he'll greatly impact the team, which I definitely agree with and HOPE like hell Kieff can keep the D honest with min. 1.2x 3s per game at say 37%.

I think we've got ourselves into a spot with this brother situation, it does worry me slightly - we have Marcus and PJ both being paid decent money, yet we have Warren who could be better than both in less than two years. Then there's the back-court which was already crowded BEFORE we signed Zoran (obviously with an eye on Goran's FA, so fair call).

Has to be a trade brewing, you can't legitimately bang in the West with a C rotation of Plumlee/Len/Shavlik...

[Sun Scorched]

I don't think Zoran's going to see anything but mop up duty for at least the first few months.

Going to take him a while to catch up to the nuances of the NBA game and lifestyle, especially going from being a legit starter to NBA rookie, even if his big bro is our best player.

Goodwin's athleticism and physical gifts (especially on D) really looked awesome, BUT, his shot is god awful and I'm not sure if it can be fixed to be honest cos he said he'd be working on it in the off-season but I didn't see any improvement. His FT form is bad, as is his set 3pt shot. He looks more and more like a slasher than a shooter; love his length and hustle on D though.

Zack Lowe's latest podcast basically said Green's the guy who will be dealt most likely, which sucks. I watched some highlights of last year's games and man did he get hot, and often. The excitement he brought was insane last year, very few Suns players have made me go 'WOW' repeatedly like he did - ie Nash, Amare, Marion...He and Amin also touched on the loss of Frye and how he'll greatly impact the team, which I definitely agree with and HOPE like hell Kieff can keep the D honest with min. 1.2x 3s per game at say 37%.

I think we've got ourselves into a spot with this brother situation, it does worry me slightly - we have Marcus and PJ both being paid decent money, yet we have Warren who could be better than both in less than two years. Then there's the back-court which was already crowded BEFORE we signed Zoran (obviously with an eye on Goran's FA, so fair call).

Has to be a trade brewing, you can't legitimately bang in the West with a C rotation of Plumlee/Len/Shavlik...

McD strikes me as the type that has at least three contingencies. I agree with you - there is something going on, or some near term roster shift that is a goal of the FO, but I also don't think McD is the type to get antsy and pull the trigger too early.

Green has more value now than he will in a few months - this simply as a result of restricted playing time - and so there is some urgency there. But who trades you a center prospect for a hot/cold wing on a one year contract? I think, perhaps, and extend-and-trade makes sense for all involved, including Green who could capitalize on last season before his value drops. I would guess MLE-type money for Gerald, for four years, in a potential package.

But again, for who?

It seems to me like the FO is content with Plumlee/Len at this point. McD even made the comment that he was impressed with those two specifically.

And finally, because I've had to train myself to this end, we all need to stop looking at our roster situation as a potential lack of playing time for some of our guys and as a luxury that the depth we have will provide throughout the season.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

My guess is that Ennis will be the odd man out of the rotation minutes and Toronto makes a trade for him. We'll play him a bit early to show that he can play but if he isn't wearing a Raptors jersey by the trade deadline I'll be shocked. Not that I don't like him but they actually need him and he can get minutes there; if he stays here I could easily see him getting buried behind Bledsoe, Dragic, IT, Goodwin & Green. Keep in mind when we drafted Ennis we hadn't yet signed IT, Zoran or resigned Bledsoe so on draft day it looked like we might possibly need him. Now we don't.

We like Ennis, though. He hasn't dazzled yet, but I think he's going to be very good, and I think the Suns do too. Kinda like our situation with Nash: we already had Kidd. So we traded Nash during the draft for Garrity and a future pick (which turned into Shawn Marion). So, one pick for two picks. We're not going to undersell Ennis, and we might wait a couple years if that's what it takes to get best value. Remember, we're going after superstars, and they're only available at a rate of 1-2/year. Patience.

Zack Lowe's latest podcast basically said Green's the guy who will be dealt most likely, which sucks. I watched some highlights of last year's games and man did he get hot, and often. The excitement he brought was insane last year, very few Suns players have made me go 'WOW' repeatedly like he did - ie Nash, Amare, Marion...

Agree with you and with Lowe. But trade for whom? For what? I wonder if there's anything to be had.

He and Amin also touched on the loss of Frye and how he'll greatly impact the team, which I definitely agree with and HOPE like hell Kieff can keep the D honest with min. 1.2x 3s per game at say 37%.

I was encouraged by the scrimmage. Kieff and Marcus decided to extend their range to make up for their lower releases - and it worked Saturday, so we'll see. But also, Randolph was 2/2. They say Tolliver hits. I think we can replace Channing's shooting, just not his post D.

I think we've got ourselves into a spot with this brother situation, it does worry me slightly - we have Marcus and PJ both being paid decent money, yet we have Warren who could be better than both in less than two years. Then there's the back-court which was already crowded BEFORE we signed Zoran (obviously with an eye on Goran's FA, so fair call).

I think we're comfortable sitting PJ or using him as a bully off the bench at the 2 and 3. He's only on a two-year deal, really. And he's a team player by all appearances. I think this will be resolved by next training camp at the latest, when TJ is made the starting SF on a permanent basis (and immediately averages 20+ PPG).

Has to be a trade brewing, you can't legitimately bang in the West with a C rotation of Plumlee/Len/Shavlik...

I... I just don't know. I see things in Alex, but maybe he'll never put it together. His offense is non-existent at this point. Defensively, his hands are bad. You know how they say that if Zoki goes to the floor he always comes up with the ball? Well Alex is the opposite of that. Alex does rebound the ball at a solid rate, and he's hard to shoot over near the basket. But how many times will we see Alex's man score after he switches to the ballhandler? I... I just don't know. I propose this nickname for Alex: the Skinny Hibbert. Whaddaya think?

Miles is good. It looks like he improved at the line. That's big. I think we're adequate - not exceptional - at the C spot because of Miles. Would we be better with Marc Gasol? Yes, surely. With Brook Lopez? I don't think so, honestly.

Patience

[phrazbit]

I would not take quotes from the team at face value. They wisely do not say what they're thinking. Last season right about now, according to the team, Gortat was a dude they liked and they were not looking to trade... and by opening night he was a Wizard.

[JDLAW]

My guess is that Ennis will be the odd man out of the rotation minutes and Toronto makes a trade for him. We'll play him a bit early to show that he can play but if he isn't wearing a Raptors jersey by the trade deadline I'll be shocked. Not that I don't like him but they actually need him and he can get minutes there; if he stays here I could easily see him getting buried behind Bledsoe, Dragic, IT, Goodwin & Green. Keep in mind when we drafted Ennis we hadn't yet signed IT, Zoran or resigned Bledsoe so on draft day it looked like we might possibly need him. Now we don't.

We like Ennis, though. He hasn't dazzled yet, but I think he's going to be very good, and I think the Suns do too. Kinda like our situation with Nash: we already had Kidd. So we traded Nash during the draft for Garrity and a future pick (which turned into Shawn Marion). So, one pick for two picks. We're not going to undersell Ennis, and we might wait a couple years if that's what it takes to get best value. Remember, we're going after superstars, and they're only available at a rate of 1-2/year. Patience.

Zack Lowe's latest podcast basically said Green's the guy who will be dealt most likely, which sucks. I watched some highlights of last year's games and man did he get hot, and often. The excitement he brought was insane last year, very few Suns players have made me go 'WOW' repeatedly like he did - ie Nash, Amare, Marion...

Agree with you and with Lowe. But trade for whom? For what? I wonder if there's anything to be had.

He and Amin also touched on the loss of Frye and how he'll greatly impact the team, which I definitely agree with and HOPE like hell Kieff can keep the D honest with min. 1.2x 3s per game at say 37%.

I was encouraged by the scrimmage. Kieff and Marcus decided to extend their range to make up for their lower releases - and it worked Saturday, so we'll see. But also, Randolph was 2/2. They say Tolliver hits. I think we can replace Channing's shooting, just not his post D.

I think we've got ourselves into a spot with this brother situation, it does worry me slightly - we have Marcus and PJ both being paid decent money, yet we have Warren who could be better than both in less than two years. Then there's the back-court which was already crowded BEFORE we signed Zoran (obviously with an eye on Goran's FA, so fair call).

I think we're comfortable sitting PJ or using him as a bully off the bench at the 2 and 3. He's only on a two-year deal, really. And he's a team player by all appearances. I think this will be resolved by next training camp at the latest, when TJ is made the starting SF on a permanent basis (and immediately averages 20+ PPG).

Has to be a trade brewing, you can't legitimately bang in the West with a C rotation of Plumlee/Len/Shavlik...

I... I just don't know. I see things in Alex, but maybe he'll never put it together. His offense is non-existent at this point. Defensively, his hands are bad. You know how they say that if Zoki goes to the floor he always comes up with the ball? Well Alex is the opposite of that. Alex does rebound the ball at a solid rate, and he's hard to shoot over near the basket. But how many times will we see Alex's man score after he switches to the ballhandler? I... I just don't know. I propose this nickname for Alex: the Skinny Hibbert. Whaddaya think?

Miles is good. It looks like he improved at the line. That's big. I think we're adequate - not exceptional - at the C spot because of Miles. Would we be better with Marc Gasol? Yes, surely. With Brook Lopez? I don't think so, honestly.

Patience

Agree with most of your points except G Green. I do not think they trade him. I do not think a trade of him returns much because he is an expiring on a low salary. I also think the Suns will want him to space the floor and fill the lane on fast breaks. Would not be surprised to see a speed/shock lineup of Morris, Green, Dragic, Bledsoe (or Thomas) and fill in the blank just to hyper charge the speed of the game.

[jcsunsfan]

I don't think Zoran's going to see anything but mop up duty for at least the first few months.

Going to take him a while to catch up to the nuances of the NBA game and lifestyle, especially going from being a legit starter to NBA rookie, even if his big bro is our best player.

Goodwin's athleticism and physical gifts (especially on D) really looked awesome, BUT, his shot is god awful and I'm not sure if it can be fixed to be honest cos he said he'd be working on it in the off-season but I didn't see any improvement. His FT form is bad, as is his set 3pt shot. He looks more and more like a slasher than a shooter; love his length and hustle on D though.

Zack Lowe's latest podcast basically said Green's the guy who will be dealt most likely, which sucks. I watched some highlights of last year's games and man did he get hot, and often. The excitement he brought was insane last year, very few Suns players have made me go 'WOW' repeatedly like he did - ie Nash, Amare, Marion...He and Amin also touched on the loss of Frye and how he'll greatly impact the team, which I definitely agree with and HOPE like hell Kieff can keep the D honest with min. 1.2x 3s per game at say 37%.

I think we've got ourselves into a spot with this brother situation, it does worry me slightly - we have Marcus and PJ both being paid decent money, yet we have Warren who could be better than both in less than two years. Then there's the back-court which was already crowded BEFORE we signed Zoran (obviously with an eye on Goran's FA, so fair call).

Has to be a trade brewing, you can't legitimately bang in the West with a C rotation of Plumlee/Len/Shavlik...

McD strikes me as the type that has at least three contingencies. I agree with you - there is something going on, or some near term roster shift that is a goal of the FO, but I also don't think McD is the type to get antsy and pull the trigger too early.

Green has more value now than he will in a few months - this simply as a result of restricted playing time - and so there is some urgency there. But who trades you a center prospect for a hot/cold wing on a one year contract? I think, perhaps, and extend-and-trade makes sense for all involved, including Green who could capitalize on last season before his value drops. I would guess MLE-type money for Gerald, for four years, in a potential package.

But again, for who?

It seems to me like the FO is content with Plumlee/Len at this point. McD even made the comment that he was impressed with those two specifically.

And finally, because I've had to train myself to this end, we all need to stop looking at our roster situation as a potential lack of playing time for some of our guys and as a luxury that the depth we have will provide throughout the season.

I don't know. Maybe Green for removal of protection on the Laker pick? grasping at straws here.