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2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V

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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#881 » by Ghost of Kleine » Wed Apr 2, 2025 11:54 pm

Saberestar wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
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The actual 3 minute Pat McAfee clip discussing the potential KD trade destinations and teams he's rumored to like this summer.

That’s why people need to be more positive about our position next summer.

We are gonna have serveral options with KD on the roster or trading KD for a nice package. He has high value around the league because he is great yet, everyone can see it.


It'd be surprising news if it were to somehow, actually to happen, but it's far more likely that we really won't have several options (as a 2nd apron team) with KD still on the roster man. These premises (tweet above) are based upon the idea of trading KD for smaller cost-controlled contracts, and or draft assets, etc., but without moving KD or Beal, we're still a 2nd apron team with almost zero options aside from maybe vet minimums and two-way players. We'd have to offload BOTH of Allen and O'neale and decline Milicic, and waive stretch Martin just to clear around 40 million.

But even then, unless we're planning on filling out our roster with a ton of vet mins and two ways, we'll end up right back over the 2nd apron if we trade for any mid-level or greater-salaried players. Neither are good options/ outcomes really! Now,if you're referencing trading Beal as the primary mechanism for your "several options with KD on the roster" statement, we've already tried that and failed repeatedly because of that very important detail that everyone absentmindedly ignores or otherwise just sidesteps entirely! Beal's No-Trade Clause.

So unless he's actually willing to waive his NTC this summer and agree to go to someplace that'll give us something good back, we're not going to really have several options that'll move the needle for us or come close to changing our overall competitive trajectory. Because even if by some anomalous miracle, some team actually does agree to take on his money, it'll cost us anywhere from one or two picks, leaving us with no picks now to utilize in trades and we'll also still have to be taking back some equitable levels of bad contracts/ bad money on top of those picks just to move off of him.

And that's a really shortsighted outcome that'll only set us back further in asset/value loss! We'd be much better served to just hold onto him one more season or at least until next seasons' deadline when he'll be viewed as a huge expiring that will change his scalable value perception under this current CBA, with the outcome hopefully being us no longer needing to add picks/ incentives in a trade. And in his final year, after next season, he'll be much more receptive to waiving his NTC in a trade so he could audition for his new team and the next (possibly last big contract)! Otherwise, if he doesn't agree to waive it, we could just play hardball and sit him for a bit, and his market value will plummet further,r affecting his next contract value, and he definitely won't want that.

In the meantime, hold onto him and have him come off the bench as a nuclear super 6th man microwave scorer to not only bolster our bench production but also make it more potent! But with the mutual understanding that he's showcasing himself for his next contract! So he'll have to show out if he wants to score one last big contract! :nod:
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#882 » by MrMiyagi » Wed Apr 2, 2025 11:55 pm

Let's get Harden too while we're at it.
SHAZAM!

Suns traded Mikal Bridges, Cam Johnson, Jae Crowder and 4 1st round picks and a swap so some Vegas Bookies would like us.
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#883 » by MrMiyagi » Wed Apr 2, 2025 11:56 pm

I've got a feeling that KD will convince us not to trade him and then he'll sign a vet minimum to play with LeBron and Luka in LA once his contract expires.
SHAZAM!

Suns traded Mikal Bridges, Cam Johnson, Jae Crowder and 4 1st round picks and a swap so some Vegas Bookies would like us.
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#884 » by Ghost of Kleine » Thu Apr 3, 2025 12:05 am

sunsbg wrote:
Saberestar wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter


The actual 3-minute Pat McAfee clip discusses the potential KD trade destinations and teams he's rumored to like this summer.

I will say that if not rebuilding and reloading around Booker is all Ishbia is willing to consider ( even though I will go on record to say this is a huge mistake), I am intrigued by the idea of KD to Boston ( his top option according to Mcaffee/ Shams).

The me mechanisms would be super difficult, but I'd look at something like a multi-team trade with:

- Porzingas coming back to Phoenix in the deal.
- Holiday going to Orlando for Isaac/ filler/ Denver / 25' 1st ( 25th pick)/ ORL 25' 2nd (45th pick).
25- Yaxel Lendeborg. PF/C Budget Bam Adebayo.
29- Carter Bryant. SF/ PF PJ Washington/ Richard Jefferson.
45- Cedric Coward or John Tonje. SG Michal Redd/ SG version of Keldon Johnson with much better shooting (Coward)/ Devin Booker (John Tonje).
55- Maxime Raynuad. PF/C Pau Gasol is a taller, lankier, less physical version of Alperen Sengun/ Pau Gasol.

- Trade O'neale/ Martin/ CLE 27' 1st to Washington for Marcus Smart/ CHI 26' 2nd/ PHX 26' 2nd.
- Trade Allen/ Milicic CLE 29' 1st to Utah for Sexton.

Smart/ Booker/ J Isaac/ Nance Jr/ Porzingis.
Sexton/ Trent Jr/Dunn/ Bol Bol/ Richards.
Gillespie/ Coward/ Bryant/ Lendeborg/ Ighodaro.

G League two ways (3 allowed):
1- Maxime Raynaud. (Stanford) 7'1 Center. Bigger, more finesse version of Sengun/ Pau Gasol.
2- Donnie Freeman. (Syracuse) 6'11 PF. Budget KD/ more fluid/ smooth Jabari Smith Jr.
3- Obinna anochili-killen. (Marshall) 6'8 SF/ PF. Toumani Camara/ Herb Jones.

I think that If we trade KD, it is gonna be a trade more simple than that.

Shams said that there was a MUTUAL interest between those teams and KD. He is open probably for a trade to any of those destinations (but not GSW), so we will have some leverage because a couple of those teams will be out of the playoffs early, and they are gonna feel the need for an upgrade in the offseason.

And I think we are gonna want an All-Star or borderline All-Star player back (ala Butler) as a primary piece in the package.


If his top choice is the Celtics, may as well go to Warriors again. Will look better. Bus rider.


Honestly, I couldn't care less where he ends up and the optics as long as we can pull solid value for him. :dontknow:
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#885 » by Ghost of Kleine » Thu Apr 3, 2025 12:11 am

Saberestar wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter


The actual 3-minute Pat McAfee clip discusses the potential KD trade destinations and teams he's rumored to like this summer.

I will say that if not rebuilding and reloading around Booker is all Ishbia is willing to consider ( even though I will go on record to say this is a huge mistake), I am intrigued by the idea of KD to Boston ( his top option according to Mcaffee/ Shams).

The me mechanisms would be super difficult, but I'd look at something like a multi-team trade with:

- Porzingas coming to Phoenix.
- Holiday going to Orlando for Isaac/ filler/ Denver / 25' 1st ( 25th pick)/ ORL 25' 2nd (45th pick).
25- Yaxel Lendeborg. PF/C Budget Bam Adebayo.
29- Carter Bryant. SF/ PF PJ Washington/ Richard Jefferson.
45- Cedric Coward or John Tonje. SG Michal Redd/ SG version of Keldon Johnson with much better shooting (Coward)/ Devin Booker (John Tonje).
55- Maxime Raynuad. PF/C Pau Gasol a taller, lankier, less physical version of Alperen Sengun/ Pau Gasol.

- Trade O'neale/ Martin/ CLE 27' 1st to Washington for Marcus Smart/ CHI 26' 2nd/ PHX 26' 2nd.
- Trade Allen/ Milicic CLE 29' 1st to Utah for Sexton.

Smart/ Booker/ J Isaac/ Nance Jr/ Porzingis.
Sexton/ Trent Jr/Dunn/ Bol Bol/ Richards.
Gillespie/ Coward/ Bryant/ Lendeborg/ Ighodaro.

G League two ways (3 allowed):
1- Maxime Raynaud. (Stanford) 7'1 Center. Bigger, more finesse version of Sengun/ Pau Gasol.
2- Donnie Freeman. (Syracuse) 6'11 PF. Budget KD/ more fluid/ smooth Jabari Smith Jr.
3- Obinna anochili-killen. (Marshall) 6'8 SF/ PF. Toumani Camara/ Herb Jones.

I think that If we trade KD is gonna be a trade more simple than that.

Shams said that there were MUTUAL interest between those teams and KD. He is open probably for a trade to any of those destinations (but not GSW) so we will have some leverage because a couple of those team will be out of the playoffs early and they are gonna feel the need for an upgrade in the offseason.

And I think we are gonna want an All-Star or borderline All-Star player back (ala Butler) as a primary piece in the package.


Possibly so man.
That premise is just a theoretical on how it could be accomplished IF that was his top option. For sure, these other trades would be much simpler if not in the same predicament as Boston is now. I'll be intrigued to see what his list would end up being! I'd have to think he'd have Miami, Dallas, and New York atop his list for sure! Ultimately though, IF he does get traded, as long as we get good value back, I'm cool with wherever he ends up! :D
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#886 » by Ghost of Kleine » Thu Apr 3, 2025 12:37 am

Read on Twitter


Still looking to try and find the link to this, but this would/could change a whole lot if true! :o
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#887 » by Ghost of Kleine » Thu Apr 3, 2025 12:52 am

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KD would look great on the Rockets for a very reasonable package of J Green/ Smith/ Whitmore/ PHX 25' 1st/ PHX 27' 1st. :wink:
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#888 » by BobbieL » Thu Apr 3, 2025 1:11 am

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter


Still looking to try and find the link to this, but this would/could change a whole lot if true! :o


That just means Ishbia will stretch Beal - short term gain, long term pain

Or trade him for PG13 or Embiid
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#889 » by KdoubleDees23 » Thu Apr 3, 2025 1:22 am

The options listed. What is possible and what is the best?:

Golden State - I don't think they can do this trade, unless more teams involved. Kuminga , Looney is the only 2 I would want from them
Minnesota - Randle, Reid and 1sts?
New York - OG or Bridges , Josh Hart , and 1sts?
Houston - FVV, Eason, Jabari Smith, and a 1st?
Miami - Wiggins, Robinson, Rozier, and a 1st?
San Antonio - Vassell, Castle, and a 1st? or Vassell, Barnes, and couple 1sts?
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#890 » by Ghost of Kleine » Thu Apr 3, 2025 1:43 am

BobbieL wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter


Still looking to try and find the link to this, but this would/could change a whole lot if true! :o


That just means Ishbia will stretch Beal - short term gain, long term pain

Or trade him for PG13 or Embiid


Better not stretch him! That'd be insanely stupid! But if it happens, I guess it'll be just another black mark to add to our clown show front office's dubious resume of gross negligence!
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#891 » by Slim Charless » Thu Apr 3, 2025 1:45 am

KdoubleDees23 wrote:The options listed. What is possible and what is the best?:

Golden State - I don't think they can do this trade, unless more teams involved. Kuminga , Looney is the only 2 I would want from them
Minnesota - Randle, Reid and 1sts?
New York - OG or Bridges , Josh Hart , and 1sts?
Houston - FVV, Eason, Jabari Smith, and a 1st?
Miami - Wiggins, Robinson, Rozier, and a 1st?
San Antonio - Vassell, Castle, and a 1st? or Vassell, Barnes, and couple 1sts?


Of those listed? San Antonio, easily. Castle would be a great fit as our new PG next to Book. I'm also of the opinion that Miami will give up Ware in that deal along with that other stuff.

That'd be really funny if we traded Durant back to the NYC area for Bridges. Coming full circle.
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#892 » by BobbieL » Thu Apr 3, 2025 2:14 am

Slim Charless wrote:
KdoubleDees23 wrote:The options listed. What is possible and what is the best?:

Golden State - I don't think they can do this trade, unless more teams involved. Kuminga , Looney is the only 2 I would want from them
Minnesota - Randle, Reid and 1sts?
New York - OG or Bridges , Josh Hart , and 1sts?
Houston - FVV, Eason, Jabari Smith, and a 1st?
Miami - Wiggins, Robinson, Rozier, and a 1st?
San Antonio - Vassell, Castle, and a 1st? or Vassell, Barnes, and couple 1sts?


Of those listed? San Antonio, easily. Castle would be a great fit as our new PG next to Book. I'm also of the opinion that Miami will give up Ware in that deal along with that other stuff.

That'd be really funny if we traded Durant back to the NYC area for Bridges. Coming full circle.


If the Suns are keeping Booker .. castle does make sense

Bridges would be good. Make it a monster trade

The thing is - maybe moving Beal with Durant could make the team exciting again around Booker. I will be positive ..though I want Booker traded
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#893 » by KLEON » Thu Apr 3, 2025 2:14 am

So the Kings still gift giving
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#894 » by BobbieL » Thu Apr 3, 2025 2:15 am

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
BobbieL wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter


Still looking to try and find the link to this, but this would/could change a whole lot if true! :o


That just means Ishbia will stretch Beal - short term gain, long term pain

Or trade him for PG13 or Embiid


Better not stretch him! That'd be insanely stupid! But if it happens, I guess it'll be just another black mark to add to our clown show front office's dubious resume of gross negligence!


If the Suns were about to get say a draft pick for O’Neale or Allen - add that pick to move Beal
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#895 » by SunsRback4Good » Thu Apr 3, 2025 2:17 am

KLEON wrote:So the Kings still gift giving


I wish we had an extra 20 more games to catch the Kings and Mavs. This season seems too short for my liking. ;)
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#896 » by Slim Charless » Thu Apr 3, 2025 2:33 am

BobbieL wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
KdoubleDees23 wrote:The options listed. What is possible and what is the best?:

Golden State - I don't think they can do this trade, unless more teams involved. Kuminga , Looney is the only 2 I would want from them
Minnesota - Randle, Reid and 1sts?
New York - OG or Bridges , Josh Hart , and 1sts?
Houston - FVV, Eason, Jabari Smith, and a 1st?
Miami - Wiggins, Robinson, Rozier, and a 1st?
San Antonio - Vassell, Castle, and a 1st? or Vassell, Barnes, and couple 1sts?


Of those listed? San Antonio, easily. Castle would be a great fit as our new PG next to Book. I'm also of the opinion that Miami will give up Ware in that deal along with that other stuff.

That'd be really funny if we traded Durant back to the NYC area for Bridges. Coming full circle.


If the Suns are keeping Booker .. castle does make sense

Bridges would be good. Make it a monster trade

The thing is - maybe moving Beal with Durant could make the team exciting again around Booker. I will be positive ..though I want Booker traded


If we decide to run back a version of this then I'd rather keep KD and trade Booker still.

I wonder what going on in MIL and if they **** the bed will Giannis want out? A straight swap of Booker for him would give us:

Gillespie
Beal
Dunn
Durant
Giannis

That team looks so much better than our current one. I feel it's an even swap but I'm not sure that the Bucks would. They can follow that up with trading Dame for more youth and picks to build around Booker-who is locked up for another 4 years at least.
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#897 » by Ghost of Kleine » Thu Apr 3, 2025 2:43 am

KdoubleDees23 wrote:The options listed. What is possible and what is the best?:

Golden State - I don't think they can do this trade, unless more teams involved. Kuminga , Looney is the only 2 I would want from them.

- Kuminga and Looney are not under contract so they couldn't be included in a trade this summer. It'dhsve to be something like Green/ Moody/ Podziemski/ TJD justto get close enough for matching purposes.

And then at least 3 1sts because that package doesn't offer premium value.
But even then, shoulder want that package??


Minnesota - Randle, Reid and 1sts?
- Reid will opt out of his PO to seek upwards of 30 million annually just like Kuminga is seeking too. It'd have to be something like Randle/McDaniels/ DET 25' 1st/ MIN 32' 1st.

Or McDaniels/ Divencenzo/ Conley/ Dillingham/ Minott/ DET 25' 1st. ** I'd think they'd prefer to keep McDaniels but will keep Randle to acquire more cap flexibility around KD/ ANT, and Gobert if possible.


New York - OG or Bridges , Josh Hart , and 1sts?
- I'd prefer Bridges over Anunoby for his money and injury issues. Also, New York doesn't really have any picks to give in a trade unless were willing to take back 2nds for KD.

Currently they also just don't have the contracts to get a KD trade done for matching under the 2nd apron as Achiuwa is a free agent. And can't really aggregate contracts as a 2nd apron team either unfortunately.


Houston - FVV, Eason, Jabari Smith, and a 1st?
- This would be a decent not great value trade, but I wouldn't really want Van Vleet back because it'd limit the return by virtue of his salary amount.

I'd rather do D Brooks/ J Smith Jr/ Whitmore/ PHX 25' 1st/"PHX 27' 1st. Or D Brooks/ Sheppard/ Smith Jr/ Whitmore/ PHX 25' 1st/ PHX 27' 1st And Houston will likely prefer to keep an Vleet because he's their best vet guard/ vet leader.


Miami - Wiggins, Robinson, Rozier, and a 1st?
- I wouldn't agree to take back Wiggins multi-year salary unless Ware was coming back in the deal. And without Ware, the deal would have to be Rozier/ Robinson/ Jovic/ Jacquez/ Miami 25' 1st / GS 25' 1st.

Rozier and Robinsonwould give us close to 44 million in expirings, Jovic and Jacquez could be kept or flipped elsewhere,
and the two 1sts would be solid!


San Antonio - Vassell, Castle, and a 1st? or Vassell, Barnes, and couple 1sts?
- Castle would be a huge get for us, and you'd have to at least ask! But there's no way they'd give up Castle for KD. Vassell, Barnes/ Sochan/ SAS 25' 1st/ ATL 25' 1st would be the offer I'd accept!

If they wouldn't be willing to give up both 25' 1sts for KD then the ATL 1st they can keep, but will have to surrender one of the Dallas 2030 (unprotected) or Minnesota 2030 ( top 1 protected) 1sts for the 2nd pick.

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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#898 » by Hitachi77 » Thu Apr 3, 2025 2:45 am

KLEON wrote:So the Kings still gift giving


We could lose all but the final 2 games and still make the playin. Fun times.
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#899 » by Ghost of Kleine » Thu Apr 3, 2025 2:57 am

BobbieL wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
BobbieL wrote:
That just means Ishbia will stretch Beal - short term gain, long term pain

Or trade him for PG13 or Embiid


Better not stretch him! That'd be insanely stupid! But if it happens, I guess it'll be just another black mark to add to our clown show front office's dubious resume of gross negligence!


If the Suns were about to get say a draft pick for O’Neale or Allen - add that pick to move Beal


Allen could probably pull a late 1st like 25th from Orlando. Or maybe the 24th pick from Atlanta, or the 27th pick from Brooklyn ( as they're way below the salary floor for next season.

And have a bunch of 1sts in the 19-27 range. Possibly even the 21st pick from the Jazz?? Or two early 2nds from Charlotte most likely.

O'neale could maybe pull 2 nds or possibly even a first from a team like Miami ( 22nd), ATL ( 24th), 26th from Brooklyn, a future 1st or multiple 2nds from Toronto or San Antonio, or New Orleans perhaps?

But I personally wouldn't choose to attach any picks just to move Beal. And besides, it's highly unlikely that any team will take Beal for a non premium mid to late first anyways.
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Re: 2024-25 Season Discussion and Speculation Part V 

Post#900 » by Ghost of Kleine » Thu Apr 3, 2025 3:05 am

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