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Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2014 11:26 pm
by bwgood77
The times and the job titles may have changed, but Kevin Johnson's me-against-the-world wiring has not.

He is the same as he ever was — fiercely competitive, determined to fell whichever giants dare stand in his path. As Hakeem Olajuwon and so many others can attest, that was the case during the playing days that finally have him on the ballot for the Naismith Basketball Hall of Fame. And that remains true now, when there's still the occasional need to dunk on a big man's head in his post-playing life as Sacramento mayor and resident savior of the Sacramento Kings.

Just ask Phil Jackson, who was involved with the group that tried to move the Kings to Seattle last year and who recently questioned the notion that Johnson would be able to get the arena built that is a prerequisite for the team staying put in his native city.

"I read your (recent interview with Jackson), and the only thing I remember were (Jackson's comments about Sacramento)," Johnson told USA TODAY Sports about the interview that was more than 5,000 words long. "When people doubt what you as a person or a community in this case or a city can do, it fuels you. And as an athlete, it motivated me back then and it motivates me as much or more today.

"I would say to Phil that, yes, he has 11 NBA championship rings, and no one can dispute that. But his ability to prognosticate on what we can do in Sacramento? He's going to come up a little short on that one."

HALL OF FAME: Stern leads 2014 class

JOHNSON: His resolve in keeping Kings

This is what Johnson has been doing since he exploded on the Phoenix Suns scene back in 1988, and this is why there's such a strong sentiment from fellow NBA greats that he belongs in the Hall. As a player then and a politician now, he is a force to be reckoned with, a pint-sized point guard who packed serious punch and whose days of running the underdog team have only continued in his current role.

In a way, this Sacramento saga that began when former owners Joe and Gavin Maloof were talking to Anaheim officials about a possible move back in early 2011 has been his version of a championship. He helped keep the Maloofs from skipping town on several occasions, then played middle man for the new ownership group led by Vivek Ranadive that paid a league-record valuation of $535 million for the team in May. All the while, he became an even bigger fan favorite of David Stern's as the then-NBA Commissioner championed the value of remaining in small markets like Sacramento.

Johnson never won it all as a player, of course, falling to Michael Jordan's Chicago Bulls in the 1993 NBA Finals and twice falling in the Conference Finals. Yet these days — and especially in light of the fact that his efforts to build a new arena that must be in place by 2017 in order for Sacramento to keep the Kings continue to progress — it seems he's winning almost every time out. None of which surprises his former rival, longtime friend and Hall of Fame inductee Isiah Thomas.

"He was always civic minded, going back to when we first started talking during his rookie year in the league," Thomas said of Johnson, who became Sacramento's first African-American mayor in 2008 and will be taking over as president of the U.S. Conference of Mayors in April. "We would talk about how you have to go about winning championships as a small man in this league, fighting against the giants, fighting against the 6-(foot)-9 point guard in Magic Johnson or the 6-7 and 6-8 point guards that everyone had back then. And then you've got to deal with Olajuwon — those kinds of players.

"But then we also talked about his responsibility off the court, making sure that he became that role model in the community…If all they can say about Kevin Johnson is that he had a great jumpshot and a great first step, then he wasted his opportunity. And Kevin Johnson did not waste his opportunity because he went far beyond the playing field…He's absolutely a Hall of Fame player.

Johnson's Hall of Fame case is a strong one even without his off-court accomplishments, as he remains one of the most underrated players in league history in large part because of who he battled with on a nightly basis.

"Think about the era in terms of guards," Johnson said. "I played against Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson, Isiah Thomas, John Stockton, Gary Payton, Maurice Cheeks."

To pick one fitting comparison, his production during his 12 seasons with the Suns (18.7 points, 9.5 assists per game, 49.4% shooting) is on par with Thomas' storied 13-year career with the Detroit Pistons (19.2 points, 9.3 assists per game, 45.2% shooting).

Johnson is fifth all time in career assists per game among former players (9.1), with only Hall of Famers Magic Johnson, John Stockton, Oscar Robertson and Thomas ahead of him. He is one of four players all time with at least three 20 point, 10 assist seasons (Thomas, Robertson and Johnson are the others). Only Robertson and Johnson had more seasons averaging at least 18 points and nine assists per game than Johnson's seven (nine and eight, respectively, while Thomas had five).

Thomas, of course, won two titles with the Pistons and thus faced less of an uphill battle on his path to the Hall. Yet as he pointed out, plenty of players have been given the honor of entering Springfield, Mass. with nary a ring to call their own, among them Johnnson's longtime Suns teammate Charles Barkley.

"If winning the championship was the only criteria that you were judged by, there would be a lot of guys — I mean a lot of guys — who wouldn't be in the Hall of Fame," Thomas said. "If you can string together 10 solid, good years of play in the NBA at a very high level, then that automatically should put you in the debate for Hall of Fame induction. But in Kevin's case, to me there's really no debate if he's a Hall of Famer or not."

Johnson is one of 10 Hall of Fame finalists, with the inductees set to be announced in conjunction with the NCAA men's basketball championship game on April 7. As he sees it, he's ecstatic to be considered and even more thrilled that his exploits from the last century haven't been forgotten.

Future Hall of Famer Allen Iverson put Johnson and his playing talents back in the spotlight recently when reflecting on his own career, telling 2013 Hall of Fame inductee Gary Payton in an interview on Fox Sports Live that Johnson once made him cry early on in his NBA career.

"I was always the one…destroying somebody else," Iverson said. "I can remember he had gave me 36 (points), nine (assists) and nine (rebounds). It was the first time somebody tore me up like that. I was in the locker room and I was actually crying."

Then, of course, there's the YouTube clip (535,582 views and counting) of Johnson's timeless dunk over Olajuwon in the 1993 Western Conference Semifinals that makes him cool with all the kids he interacts with as Sacramento's mayor. The Suns, who went from 28-54 during the season in which Johnson was traded there from the Cleveland Cavaliers as a rookie in Feb. 1988 to 55-27 and a Conference Finals appearance the following season, recently celebrated the 20-year anniversary of the dunk with "KJ Dunk Night."

"That was kind of one moment in time that got captured and allows me to still be cool and hip with the next generation," Johnson said.

But Johnson is quick to point out that his current efforts are what matter most now. With so many former players often struggling to find their way, he has been lauded as an example of what players can accomplish when their playing days are done. As Thomas noted, the spirit of this plan was in the works all along.

"I had a grandfather who was a sheet metal worker, and he raised me because my father passed away (in a drowning accident in Sacramento) when I was three," Johnson said. "I remember right when I got drafted, he came and sat me down, and he said, 'You need to have an exit strategy. So before you start playing in the NBA, you need to think about what you're going to be doing when you come out of it.

"He said, 'If you're lucky, you can play in the league for four years. If you're really lucky, you can play in the league four to eight (years). And if you're super lucky, you can play more than 10. But you can not go into the league thinking that's the end-all, because it's only such a short timespan of your life, a very short timespan."

Johnson, make no mistake, considers himself a lucky man whether he gets into the Hall or not.

"I'm giddy about the possibility," he said. "This is a powerful moment. If I get in, I think it's incredible…If it doesn't happen, it's still an unbelievable honor and it's not going to impact what I do day in and day out. But you're competitive, and you have an opportunity and you want to make the most of it."

Then and now, the same as he ever was.


http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nb ... t/6383389/

Re: Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Mon Apr 6, 2015 4:05 pm
by bwgood77
He missed the cut again...

One of the great point guards of the 90's, Kevin Johnson could both score and distribute the ball. A very good player at the University of California, Johnson was drafted 7th by the Cavs in the 1987 draft. Stuck behind Mark Price, the Cavs unloaded Johnson to the Suns in a huge trade that also involved Larry Nance coming back to Cleveland. It is with Phoenix where Johnson made his impact. Johnson was one of the quickest guards in league history and could get to the hoop at any time getting a shot for himself or one of his teammates. He averaged 20 points and 10 assists in his first 3 seasons in Phoenix; something only two others have done (the others being HOFers Oscar Robertson and Isaiah Thomas). The Suns were serious title contenders throughout the mid 90's especially when they made the move to get Charles Barkley form Philly. Johnson gladly accepted the role of second fiddle to Barkley's huge personality. Close title runs marked this team, with the closest being a trip to the finals against eventual champion Chicago in 1993. Ironically that looks like what his legacy will be as far as getting into the Hall. Close but no cigar.

Re: Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Tue Apr 7, 2015 7:45 am
by RunDogGun
He should be in. What an underrated player.

Re: Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Tue Apr 7, 2015 3:33 pm
by bwgood77
RunDogGun wrote:He should be in. What an underrated player.


Yes, no other player in history averaged over 20 and 10 3x in their first four years in the league. The guys who did it twice are rated significantly higher in the minds of the majority.

The only thing that killed him is longevity and also deferring to Barkley once he arrived knocked it stats down a couple of pegs too.

But take a look at this list.

http://bkref.com/tiny/hJnmM

He also had like 19.7 and 10 in his 5th year, so he almost did it four times out of his first five years (and didn't play much of his rookie year until he got to the Suns, where he went on a tear, and probably came close to averaging 20 and 10 in March and April of that rookie year.

Re: Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 2:34 pm
by TheBobster
The only reason he's not in is because he wasn't a compiler. His production was impressive, but it'll take him a little longer because he didn't have a long career.

But he'll get in sometime in the next few years.

Re: Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Fri May 15, 2015 5:16 am
by GMATCallahan
TheBobster wrote:The only reason he's not in is because he wasn't a compiler. His production was impressive, but it'll take him a little longer because he didn't have a long career.

But he'll get in sometime in the next few years.


While K.J. was not a "compiler," as you said, and he did not play for fifteen-to-twenty years like some other players on his basic level (largely by choice, as he wanted to leave the game on his terms while he could still play), he was a much better player for much longer than most people realize. In the nine seasons where he started the majority of his games (1989-1997), K.J. averaged 19.8 points, 10.0 assists, and a .497 field goal percentage—despite playing four of those seasons with at least one undiagnosed sports hernia (a tear in his abdominal wall), including two undiagnosed hernias by the end of that four-year span in 1996. In other words, over the span of virtually a decade, K.J. nearly averaged 20.0 points, 10.0 assists, and a .500 field goal percentage, a feat that only he (twice), Magic Johnson (twice), and Chris Paul (once) have ever accomplished in one season. And K.J. nearly averaged it over a decade—only matched or bettered by Magic in that regard—and probably would have done so had he not played through serious injury for four seasons due to medical misdiagnosis (as former teammate and eventual coach Danny Ainge stated in 1997, for four seasons, K.J. "was in pain all the time").

In his tenth season, '96-'97, K.J. almost certainly constituted the best guard in the NBA after Jordan and enjoyed one of the best seasons ever by a guard, even though he absurdly failed to make any of the All-NBA Teams. More than eight years after first receiving the NBA Player of the Month Award in February 1989, K.J. received the award again in April 1997 (back when there was only one award for the entire league, as opposed to splitting it by conference in order to generate greater publicity). The year before, in '95-'96, K.J. was the best guard in the league after Jordan during the second half of the schedule—despite playing through two undiagnosed hernias. But by 1996 or 1997, he had become the "lost sheep" of the NBA's hype machine, which is largely what determines judgments on players by most media members and fans.

Indeed, even though K.J. did not play for a terribly long time and left the game while he could still play (he turned aside interest or offers from at least a dozen NBA teams after the 1998 season), he nevertheless ranks third all-time in seasons averaging at least 18.0 points and 9.0 assists, as noted in that article, behind only Oscar Robertson and Magic Johnson—two big guards. And K.J. shot .498 from the field over the course of his seven 18.0/9.0 seasons, too. He also ranks third all-time in assists per game as a starter at 10.0, behind only Magic and John Stockton. Paul is fourth at 9.9, but what is intriguing about K.J. is that not only did he play four seasons with at least one undiagnosed hernia, but he only fully dominated an offense—Chris Paul-style—for about four seasons. Then he started playing with Barkley, whose ball-stopping post-up game substantially altered the nature of the Suns' offense, and pretty soon after Phoenix traded Barkley, the Suns acquired another All-Star point guard in Jason Kidd. Nevertheless, in terms of assists per start (or assists per game as a starter), the list looks as follows:

1. Magic Johnson 12.2
2. John Stockton 11.2
3. Kevin Johnson 10.0
4. Chris Paul 9.9
5. Oscar Robertson 9.5
6. Steve Nash 9.4
7. Isiah Thomas 9.3

Indeed, one could make a pretty easy argument that for prime or peak value, Kevin Johnson was the best small guard in the history of the game. The hype machine, however, won't tell you that.

Anyway, I don't want to go into any further details or arguments on that subject right now. Rather, I just wanted to note—for longtime Suns' fans or people interested in franchise history—that twenty years ago today, on May 14, 1995, K.J. posted one of his most memorable performances. The previous day in Houston, the Suns had been annihilated by the Rockets, 118-85. After averaging 25.0 points, 12.5 assists, and 4.5 rebounds, along with a .667 field goal percentage and .889 free throw percentage, over the first two games, K.J. had continued to play well in Game Three, scoring 14 points in the first half. But this game was the infamous one where Charles Barkley failed to hit a field goal—he shot 0-10 from the field and finished with 5 points—after boarding the team charter to Houston with one of his partying pals. Knowing that the Suns would need to play again twenty-four hours later (a rare back-to-back during the playoffs for NBA-on-NBC television purposes), head coach Paul Westphal held both Barkley and K.J. out of the fourth quarter of Game Three.

Barkley responded with 19 points in the first half of Game Four before customarily fading after halftime. K.J. started slightly stiffly—1-4 from the field—and then buried 15 of his next 16 field goal attempts. His one miss during that span, which stretched from the first quarter to the fourth, was a missed driving layup in the second quarter that drew a leaping Hakeem Olajuwon and freed Barkley for a point-blank offensive rebound dunk. In other words, for 16 consecutive possessions where K.J. attempted a field goal, the Suns scored—for a total of 34 points. Overall, he sank 17 of his last 20 field goal attempts, tallying 43 points on 18-24 field goal shooting (2-2 on threes) and 5-7 free throw shooting. Playing all 48 minutes on the second day of a back-to-back set on the road in the playoffs (with an undiagnosed hernia to boot) versus the defending champions, K.J. only threw away one pass, finishing with 9 assists, 6 rebounds, 3 steals, and just 1 turnover.

Barkley also played all 48 minutes, but after he and K.J. each scored 19 points in the first half, Sir Charles told Johnson in the third quarter, "You take the third quarter. I'll take the fourth." K.J. scored 15 points in the third quarter on 5-5 field goal shooting, rallying the Suns from a 15-point deficit with help from rookie shooting guard Wesley Person, but Barkley did not have much in the fourth quarter, either—he finished with 7 points in the second half. But K.J. ended up with 24 points after halftime to lead the Suns to victory, with NBC's Bill Walton analogizing him to a boxer at one point. After the game, the Suns' starting center, Joe Kleine, perhaps put it best:

When Kevin plays like that, you just get out of his way. Go where he tells you to go and then just stand there and watch the master.

http://www.si.com/vault/1995/05/22/8094186/phoenix-rising-with-a-3-1-series-lead-the-suns-were-poised-to-avenge-last-years-playoff-loss-to-the-rockets


One can view a six-minute highlight compilation here, twenty years ago today:


Watch on YouTube


[url]

Watch on YouTube
[/url] (I've included the link as a URL in case one wants to watch it at Youtube with a greater assortment of size options.)

It would not, by the way, be his highest-scoring game of the series.

Re: Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Fri May 15, 2015 6:12 am
by TASTIC
GMATCallahan wrote:
TheBobster wrote:The only reason he's not in is because he wasn't a compiler. His production was impressive, but it'll take him a little longer because he didn't have a long career.

But he'll get in sometime in the next few years.


While K.J. was not a "compiler," as you said, and he did not play for fifteen-to-twenty years like some other players on his basic level (largely by choice, as he wanted to leave the game on his terms while he could still play), he was a much better player for much longer than most people realize. In the nine seasons where he started the majority of his games (1989-1997), K.J. averaged 19.8 points, 10.0 assists, and a .497 field goal percentage—despite playing four of those seasons with at least one undiagnosed sports hernia (a tear in his abdominal wall), including two undiagnosed hernias by the end of that four-year span in 1996. In other words, over the span of virtually a decade, K.J. nearly averaged 20.0 points, 10.0 assists, and a .500 field goal percentage, a feat that only he (twice), Magic Johnson (twice), and Chris Paul (once) have ever accomplished in one season. And K.J. nearly averaged it over a decade—only matched or bettered by Magic in that regard—and probably would have done so had he not played through serious injury for four seasons due to medical misdiagnosis (as former teammate and eventual coach Danny Ainge stated in 1997, for four seasons, K.J. "was in pain all the time").

In his tenth season, '96-'97, K.J. almost certainly constituted the best guard in the NBA after Jordan and enjoyed one of the best seasons ever by a guard, even though he absurdly failed to make any of the All-NBA Teams. More than eight years after first receiving the NBA Player of the Month Award in February 1989, K.J. received the award again in April 1997 (back when there was only one award for the entire league, as opposed to splitting it by conference in order to generate greater publicity). The year before, in '95-'96, K.J. was the best guard in the league after Jordan during the second half of the schedule—despite playing through two undiagnosed hernias. But by 1996 or 1997, he had become the "lost sheep" of the NBA's hype machine, which is largely what determines judgments on players by most media members and fans.

Indeed, even though K.J. did not play for a terribly long time and left the game while he could still play (he turned aside interest or offers from at least a dozen NBA teams after the 1998 season), he nevertheless ranks third all-time in seasons averaging at least 18.0 points and 9.0 assists, as noted in that article, behind only Oscar Robertson and Magic Johnson—two big guards. And K.J. shot .498 from the field over the course of his seven 18.0/9.0 seasons, too. He also ranks third all-time in assists per game as a starter at 10.0, behind only Magic and John Stockton. Paul is fourth at 9.9, but what is intriguing about K.J. is that not only did he play four seasons with at least one undiagnosed hernia, but he only fully dominated an offense—Chris Paul-style—for about four seasons. Then he started playing with Barkley, whose ball-stopping post-up game substantially altered the nature of the Suns' offense, and pretty soon after Phoenix traded Barkley, the Suns acquired another All-Star point guard in Jason Kidd. Nevertheless, in terms of assists per start (or assists per game as a starter), the list looks as follows:

1. Magic Johnson 12.2
2. John Stockton 11.2
3. Kevin Johnson 10.0
4. Chris Paul 9.9
5. Oscar Robertson 9.5
6. Steve Nash 9.4
7. Isiah Thomas 9.3

Indeed, one could make a pretty easy argument that for prime or peak value, Kevin Johnson was the best small guard in the history of the game. The hype machine, however, won't tell you that.

Anyway, I don't want to go into any further details or arguments on that subject right now. Rather, I just wanted to note—for longtime Suns' fans or people interested in franchise history—that twenty years ago today, on May 14, 1995, K.J. posted one of his most memorable performances. The previous day in Houston, the Suns had been annihilated by the Rockets, 118-85. After averaging 25.0 points, 12.5 assists, and 4.5 rebounds, along with a .667 field goal percentage and .889 free throw percentage, over the first two games, K.J. had continued to play well in Game Three, scoring 14 points in the first half. But this game was the infamous one where Charles Barkley failed to hit a field goal—he shot 0-10 from the field and finished with 5 points—after boarding the team charter to Houston with two of his partying pals. Knowing that the Suns would need to play again twenty-four hours later (a rare back-to-back during the playoffs for NBA-on-NBC television purposes), head coach Paul Westphal held both Barkley and K.J. out of the fourth quarter of Game Three.

Barkley responded with 19 points in the first half of Game Four before customarily fading after halftime. K.J. started slightly stiffly—1-4 from the field—and then buried 15 of his next 16 field goal attempts. His one miss during that span, which stretched from the first quarter to the fourth, was a missed driving layup in the second quarter that drew a leaping Hakeem Olajuwon and freed Barkley for a point-blank offensive rebound dunk. In other words, for 16 consecutive possessions where K.J. attempted a field goal, the Suns scored—for a total of 34 points. Overall, he sank 17 of his last 20 field goal attempts, tallying 43 points on 18-24 field goal shooting (2-2 on threes) and 5-7 free throw shooting. Playing all 48 minutes on the second day of a back-to-back set on the road in the playoffs (with an undiagnosed hernia to boot) versus the defending champions, K.J. also never threw away a pass, finishing with 9 assists, 6 rebounds, 3 steals, and just 1 turnover.

Barkley also played all 48 minutes, but after he and K.J. each scored 19 points in the first half, Sir Charles told Johnson in the third quarter, "You take the third quarter. I'll take the fourth." K.J. scored 15 points in the third quarter on 5-5 field goal shooting, rallying the Suns from a 15-point deficit with help from rookie shooting guard Wesley Person, but Barkley did not have much in the fourth quarter, either—he finished with 7 points in the second half. But K.J. ended up with 24 points after halftime to lead the Suns to victory, with NBC's Bill Walton analogizing him to a boxer at one point. After the game, the Suns' starting center, Joe Kleine, perhaps put it best:

When Kevin plays like that, you just get out of his way. Go where he tells you to go and then just stand there and watch the master.

http://www.si.com/vault/1995/05/22/8094186/phoenix-rising-with-a-3-1-series-lead-the-suns-were-poised-to-avenge-last-years-playoff-loss-to-the-rockets


One can view a six-minute highlight compilation here, twenty years ago today:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dB_xKFIJgg

It would not, by the way, be his highest-scoring game of the series.

AWESOME post. Thoroughly enjoyed reading that and furthered (most of) our opinions that he should be in the HoF.

Mitch Richmond? Nice shooter/scorer/tough, but KJ over him 6 days a week.

Re: Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Sat May 16, 2015 4:23 am
by GMATCallahan
TASTIC wrote:AWESOME post. Thoroughly enjoyed reading that and furthered (most of) our opinions that he should be in the HoF.

Mitch Richmond? Nice shooter/scorer/tough, but KJ over him 6 days a week.


Thanks.

And, yeah, Richmond was a fine scorer and defender, as was K.J. (although K.J. constituted a more efficient scorer and field goal shooter), but there is a huge difference between the two. Like most shooting guards, Richmond could only marginally elevate the players around him—which explains why he only marginally elevated the fortunes of the Sacramento Kings once he arrived there. (They made the playoffs once in his seven seasons in Sacramento, never reaching 40 wins, and won one playoff game.) Conversely, while K.J. has received little recognition in this regard, he created a major inflationary effect on most of the players around him—one of the biggest effects ever—in addition to being more than capable of carrying a team with scoring, even dueling the likes of Hakeem Olajuwon and Magic Johnson in the playoffs. In the CBS pregame introduction to its Super Bowl Sunday telecast of the Suns at the Celtics on January 28, 1990, Hubie Brown said the following about K.J. while speaking to play-by-play man Dick Stockton:

Second only to Magic Johnson as a complete point guard, Dick. He makes every player better than they were. Also, he can end the play: he's an outstanding, twenty, twenty-point-plus player, and we can look for him with the electrifying execution.


And remember, this statement came at a time when Isiah Thomas was winning championships, John Stockton was setting assists records, and Mark Price was at his peak—averaging 19.6 points, 9.1 assists, and a .589 True Shooting Percentage that season. But K.J.'s numbers were literally mirroring Magic Johnson's in many instances.

Hubie Brown's comment echoes what an intelligent longtime basketball observer—not a Suns' fan—that I know has said about K.J.: namely, that he created more "good looks" than any point guard of his era other than Magic Johnson. And K.J.'s halcyon days came during probably the greatest era ever for point guards, even though—unlike these days—the league's rules, officiating, lineups, and spatial concepts were not oriented toward point guards at all.

After Game Three of the 1992 Western Conference Semfinals versus Portland, when Phoenix forward Tim Perry scored 27 points on 14 field goal attempts, Clyde Drexler echoed Brown's comments as well.

"I don't think we stopped Kevin (Johnson) because he was able to get the ball to Perry and those other guys. I believe he might as well have scored Perry's 27 points," Drexler said.

http://articles.latimes.com/1992-05-10/sports/sp-2412_1_phoenix-suns

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/199205090PHO.html


Or one could just look to what Perry himself had said earlier in the season after scoring 20 points during a Suns' victory in Boston:

K.J. gets people the ball and gets guys shots. He's a lot like Magic Johnson in that he knows where everyone is.


http://www.basketballreference.com/teams/boxscore.htm?yr=1991&b=19920124&tm=bos

Indeed, a major reason why the Barkley trade proved so lopsided is that the players sent to Philadelphia could no longer play with Kevin Johnson.

... anyway, another day, another anniversary. Twenty-five years ago tonight, on May 15, 1990, the Suns vanquished the league-best, 63-win Lakers in the Western Conference Semifinals, winning Game Five at the Great Western Forum to take the series four games to one—the Lakers' earliest exit in nine years and the first time in four years that they would not be going to the NBA Finals. K.J. posted 37 points on 14-24 field goal shooting with 9 assists (the official box score says 14-23 field goal shooting with 8 assists, but official scorers are occasionally off here or there, at least in that era), including 14 points in the fourth quarter. Magic Johnson, the MVP recipient that season for the third time in four years, scored 43 points for the second straight game, but for the third straight game down the stretch in the fourth quarter, K.J. outplayed him. In the fourth quarter of Game Five, Magic scored 7 points (3-5 FG, 1-2 FT) with 2 assists, 3 turnovers, and 0 steals, while K.J. scored 14 points (5-8 FG, 4-4 FT) with 3 assists, 0 turnovers, and 2 steals. With 3:55 remaining and the Lakers leading 95-90, Magic scored 0 points (0-2 FG, including an air-ball, and 0-1 FT) with 0 assists, 1 turnover, and 0 steals, while K.J. scored 8 points (2-2 FG, 4-4 FT) with 1 assist, 0 turnovers, and 1 steal as the Suns outscored the Lakers 16-8. Afterwards, Pat Riley exclaimed, "Kevin Johnson is a unique player."

Unfortunately, I don't have a highlight package for this game, but one can see a seven-minute compilation of Magic and K.J. highlights from the previous game, Game Four in Phoenix on May 13, 1990, here:

[

Watch on YouTube


One can also view a mini-documentary on the series, which ended twenty-five years ago tonight, here:


Watch on YouTube


May 15—four years later—would also be the date that K.J. famously dunked on Hakeem Olajuwon. As remarkable as the dunk happened to be, the context may have been even more impressive. The dunk occurred late in the fourth quarter, just after K.J. had attempted a three-pointer, and he was of course playing with an undiagonsed sports hernia. That he possessed enough pop in his legs (or just willpower) to elevate over Olajuwon and jam at that point in the game proved astounding, especially considering that K.J. had played every second of the game to that juncture—the only player on either side to do so. He played the first 47 minutes and 21 seconds before Paul Westphal finally decided that the Suns could no longer come back—behind K.J., Phoenix had trimmed the deficit to three points, 86-83, a few minutes earlier—and thus removed his point guard after he had posted 38 points and 12 assists for the second straight game.

Moreover, Olajuwon was swatting shots left and right in that fourth quarter. He finished with 5 blocks for the game (along with 28 points, 12 rebounds, and 8 assists), including three blocks in the final period—blocking Barkley once and K.J. twice, among all manner of other shots that he contested and changed. His block on Barkley proved particularly impressive. K.J. drove the right side and got up in the air to draw Olajuwon, who ended up facing the baseline with his back to the foul line. With Olajuwon up in the air, Johnson dished to Barkley, who seemed to possess an open lane to the front of the rim, Olajuwon and Otis Thorpe having both been peeled away by K.J. Barkley went up with two hands for the jam at the front of the rim as the Suns' bench began to stir in anticipatory excitement, but Olajuwon managed to come down from his first leap, turn his body about 180 degrees, and go up for a second time, meeting Barkley at the top and swatting his dunk attempt nearly to the top of the key as Houston ran out on the break. Even among the legion of elite shot-blockers in NBA history, very few could have made that play, and a subsequent reaction by Olajuwon on a later possession forced Barkley to put up a limp left-handed attempt that missed badly.

Against K.J, Olajuwon twice swatted away left-handed layup attempts, resembling a gigantic panther. Once, he went over his teammate, Sam Cassell, to block Johnson. On two other occasions in the fourth quarter, Olajuwon's looming presence forced K.J. to put incredible arc on left-handed runners off the glass. K.J. hit one of the left-handed runners, while the other rimmed-out.

The point is that Olajuwon was either blocking everything in the basket area or forcing shots in the basket area to be attempted with very high degrees of difficulty, shots that were not likely to go in. His lateral agility and timing proved phenomenal, and he was not hindered by the modern, revamped defensive three-seconds rule, which remained years away.

One can see two of those fourth quarter blocks in this highlight package:


Watch on YouTube


So that was the context that K.J. was dunking into—anything softer was going to be rejected or contested to the point of a likely miss.


Watch on YouTube


One can see some more angles here:


Watch on YouTube


That was this date—May 15—twenty-one years ago.

Re: Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Sat May 16, 2015 7:58 am
by RunDogGun
Man, I was just talking about missing posters like yourself GMAT. Literally, just the other day. Nice to have you back, and enjoy reading your stuff.

Re: Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Mon May 18, 2015 3:08 am
by bwgood77
Spoiler:
GMATCallahan wrote:
TASTIC wrote:AWESOME post. Thoroughly enjoyed reading that and furthered (most of) our opinions that he should be in the HoF.

Mitch Richmond? Nice shooter/scorer/tough, but KJ over him 6 days a week.


Thanks.

And, yeah, Richmond was a fine scorer and defender, as was K.J. (although K.J. constituted a more efficient scorer and field goal shooter), but there is a huge difference between the two. Like most shooting guards, Richmond could only marginally elevate the players around him—which explains why he only marginally elevated the fortunes of the Sacramento Kings once he arrived there. (They made the playoffs once in his seven seasons in Sacramento, never reaching 40 wins, and won one playoff game.) Conversely, while K.J. has received little recognition in this regard, he created a major inflationary effect on most of the players around him—one of the biggest effects ever—in addition to being more than capable of carrying a team with scoring, even dueling the likes of Hakeem Olajuwon and Magic Johnson in the playoffs. In the CBS pregame introduction to its Super Bowl Sunday telecast of the Suns at the Celtics on January 28, 1990, Hubie Brown said the following about K.J. while speaking to play-by-play man Dick Stockton:

Second only to Magic Johnson as a complete point guard, Dick. He makes every player better than they were. Also, he can end the play: he's an outstanding, twenty, twenty-point-plus player, and we can look for him with the electrifying execution.


And remember, this statement came at a time when Isiah Thomas was winning championships, John Stockton was setting assists records, and Mark Price was at his peak—averaging 19.6 points, 9.1 assists, and a .589 True Shooting Percentage that season. But K.J.'s numbers were literally mirroring Magic Johnson's in many instances.

Hubie Brown's comment echoes what an intelligent longtime basketball observer—not a Suns' fan—that I know has said about K.J.: namely, that he created more "good looks" than any point guard of his era other than Magic Johnson. And K.J.'s halcyon days came during probably the greatest era ever for point guards, even though—unlike these days—the league's rules, officiating, lineups, and spatial concepts were not oriented toward point guards at all.

After Game Three of the 1992 Western Conference Semfinals versus Portland, when Phoenix forward Tim Perry scored 27 points on 14 field goal attempts, Clyde Drexler echoed Brown's comments as well.

"I don't think we stopped Kevin (Johnson) because he was able to get the ball to Perry and those other guys. I believe he might as well have scored Perry's 27 points," Drexler said.

http://articles.latimes.com/1992-05-10/sports/sp-2412_1_phoenix-suns

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/199205090PHO.html


Or one could just look to what Perry himself had said earlier in the season after scoring 20 points during a Suns' victory in Boston:

K.J. gets people the ball and gets guys shots. He's a lot like Magic Johnson in that he knows where everyone is.


http://www.basketballreference.com/teams/boxscore.htm?yr=1991&b=19920124&tm=bos

Indeed, a major reason why the Barkley trade proved so lopsided is that the players sent to Philadelphia could no longer play with Kevin Johnson.

... anyway, another day, another anniversary. Twenty-five years ago tonight, on May 15, 1990, the Suns vanquished the league-best, 63-win Lakers in the Western Conference Semifinals, winning Game Five at the Great Western Forum to take the series four games to one—the Lakers' earliest exit in nine years and the first time in four years that they would not be going to the NBA Finals. K.J. posted 37 points on 14-24 field goal shooting with 9 assists (the official box score says 14-23 field goal shooting with 8 assists, but official scorers are occasionally off here or there, at least in that era), including 14 points in the fourth quarter. Magic Johnson, the MVP recipient that season for the third time in four years, scored 43 points for the second straight game, but for the third straight game down the stretch in the fourth quarter, K.J. outplayed him. In the fourth quarter of Game Five, Magic scored 7 points (3-5 FG, 1-2 FT) with 2 assists, 3 turnovers, and 0 steals, while K.J. scored 14 points (5-8 FG, 4-4 FT) with 3 assists, 0 turnovers, and 2 steals. With 3:55 remaining and the Lakers leading 95-90, Magic scored 0 points (0-2 FG, including an air-ball, and 0-1 FT) with 0 assists, 1 turnover, and 0 steals, while K.J. scored 8 points (2-2 FG, 4-4 FT) with 1 assist, 0 turnovers, and 1 steal as the Suns outscored the Lakers 16-8. Afterwards, Pat Riley exclaimed, "Kevin Johnson is a unique player."

Unfortunately, I don't have a highlight package for this game, but one can see a seven-minute compilation of Magic and K.J. highlights from the previous game, Game Four in Phoenix on May 13, 1990, here:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUrFEd-g0hA[/youtube]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUrFEd-g0hA (I'm including the URLs in case one wants to see the videos at Youtube with a greater range of size options.)

One can also view a mini-documentary on the series, which ended twenty-five years ago tonight, here:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3Sz1W06Y5s[/youtube]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3Sz1W06Y5s

May 15—four years later—would also be the date that K.J. famously dunked on Hakeem Olajuwon. As remarkable as the dunk happened to be, the context may have been even more impressive. The dunk occurred late in the fourth quarter, just after K.J. had attempted a three-pointer, and he was of course playing with an undiagonsed sports hernia. That he possessed enough pop in his legs (or just willpower) to elevate over Olajuwon and jam at that point in the game proved astounding, especially considering that K.J. had played every second of the game to that juncture—the only player on either side to do so. He played the first 47 minutes and 21 seconds before Paul Westphal finally decided that the Suns could no longer come back—behind K.J., Phoenix had trimmed the deficit to three points, 86-83, a few minutes earlier—and thus removed his point guard after he had posted 38 points and 12 assists for the second straight game.

Moreover, Olajuwon was swatting shots left and right in that fourth quarter. He finished with 5 blocks for the game (along with 28 points, 12 rebounds, and 8 assists), including three blocks in the final period—blocking Barkley once and K.J. twice, among all manner of other shots that he contested and changed. His block on Barkley proved particularly impressive. K.J. drove the right side and got up in the air to draw Olajuwon, who ended up facing the baseline with his back to the foul line. With Olajuwon up in the air, Johnson dished to Barkley, who seemed to possess an open lane to the front of the rim, Olajuwon and Otis Thorpe having both been peeled away by K.J. Barkley went up with two hands for the jam at the front of the rim as the Suns' bench began to stir in anticipatory excitement, but Olajuwon managed to come down from his first leap, turn his body about 180 degrees, and go up for a second time, meeting Barkley at the top and swatting his dunk attempt nearly to the top of the key as Houston ran out on the break. Even among the legion of elite shot-blockers in NBA history, very few could have made that play, and a subsequent reaction by Olajuwon on a later possession forced Barkley to put up a limp left-handed attempt that missed badly.

Against K.J, Olajuwon twice swatted away left-handed layup attempts, resembling a gigantic panther. Once, he went over his teammate, Sam Cassell, to block Johnson. On two other occasions in the fourth quarter, Olajuwon's looming presence forced K.J. to put incredible arc on left-handed runners off the glass. K.J. hit one of the left-handed runners, while the other rimmed-out.

The point is that Olajuwon was either blocking everything in the basket area or forcing shots in the basket area to be attempted with very high degrees of difficulty, shots that were not likely to go in. His lateral agility and timing proved phenomenal, and he was not hindered by the modern, revamped defensive three-seconds rule, which remained years away.

One can see two of those fourth quarter blocks in this highlight package:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWucU4U69yI[/youtube]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWucU4U69y

So that was the context that K.J. was dunking into—anything softer was going to be rejected or contested to the point of a likely miss.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVcSndz52DE[/youtube]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVcSndz52DE

One can see some more angles here:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5e2ktYxP8g[/youtube]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5e2ktYxP8g

That was this date—May 15—twenty-one years ago.
These are phenomenal posts and great videos. Hope you stick around more for your insight on how you view the Suns now.

Re: Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Wed May 20, 2015 11:58 pm
by GMATCallahan
Thanks, guys. I'll try to provide some thoughts on the Suns' present situation over the summer. I'll give one line right now: the Morris twins for Greg Monroe in a sign-and-trade? Obviously, that thought is for another thread.

Twenty years ago today, May 20, 1995:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYfQMS2RIpI[/youtube]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYfQMS2RIpI

Here is what Hakeem Olajuwon wrote in his autobiography, Living the Dream, page 282:

So it came down to game seven back in Phoenix.

Charles Barkley was the Suns' most visible player, he was a superstar and his presence was felt. He was effective but with our defensive rotation we were making him pay. We put Robert Horry on him, and Robert is 6'10", active, and hard to shoot over, an excellent defender who gets key rebounds. Barkley is an excellent passer so he would find the open man, he did his damage, but we took that blow. Game seven was Kevin Johnson's.

K.J. finishes better than almost any guard in the league. He has one of the best crossover dribbles in the NBA. Tim Hardaway crosses over but then he has to hit his jump shot, K.J. crosses over and beats you and goes to the basket. That's different. He's coming full speed, then all of a sudden he changes direction and sees a clear path to the basket. When he's on his game, by the time I come over to block him I'm always a second too late, he's putting it on the glass before I get there. If I go too soon he draws the foul as well. He knows how to get you to foul him and how to make the basket at the same time. ...

Every time I looked K.J. was driving. When he wasn't penetrating he was pulling up and hitting his jump shots. He was just incredible. It's a trial just being on the same court as someone who is playing so well. I tried to encourage Kenny Smith and Sam Cassell, who were guarding him. I said, "You've got to contain him. When he's crossing over I can't get there. If you can delay him for a second I can help you. Meet him way out front, don't just let him come. Make him play defense on the other end. Don't worry, you're not by yourself, he has to beat the whole team, he has to beat us!"


People talk about duels in Game Sevens, and they refer to Larry Bird-Dominique Wilkins in the fourth quarter in 1988 (which indeed proved incredible), or Paul Pierce-LeBron James in 2008. But Hakeem Olajuwon and Kevin Johnson in the fourth quarter twenty years ago should be right up there.

Re: Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 1:19 am
by bwgood77
GMATCallahan wrote:Thanks, guys. I'll try to provide some thoughts on the Suns' present situation over the summer. I'll give one line right now: the Morris twins for Greg Monroe in a sign-and-trade? Obviously, that thought is for another thread.

Twenty years ago today, May 20, 1995:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYfQMS2RIpI[/youtube]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYfQMS2RIpI

Here is what Hakeem Olajuwon wrote in his autobiography, Living the Dream, page 282:

So it came down to game seven back in Phoenix.

Charles Barkley was the Suns' most visible player, he was a superstar and his presence was felt. He was effective but with our defensive rotation we were making him pay. We put Robert Horry on him, and Robert is 6'10", active, and hard to shoot over, an excellent defender who gets key rebounds. Barkley is an excellent passer so he would find the open man, he did his damage, but we took that blow. Game seven was Kevin Johnson's.

K.J. finishes better than almost any guard in the league. He has one of the best crossover dribbles in the NBA. Tim Hardaway crosses over but then he has to hit his jump shot, K.J. crosses over and beats you and goes to the basket. That's different. He's coming full speed, then all of a sudden he changes direction and sees a clear path to the basket. When he's on his game, by the time I come over to block him I'm always a second too late, he's putting it on the glass before I get there. If I go too soon he draws the foul as well. He knows how to get you to foul him and how to make the basket at the same time. ...

Every time I looked K.J. was driving. When he wasn't penetrating he was pulling up and hitting his jump shots. He was just incredible. It's a trial just being on the same court as someone who is playing so well. I tried to encourage Kenny Smith and Sam Cassell, who were guarding him. I said, "You've got to contain him. When he's crossing over I can't get there. If you can delay him for a second I can help you. Meet him way out front, don't just let him come. Make him play defense on the other end. Don't worry, you're not by yourself, he has to beat the whole team, he has to beat us!"


People talk about duels in Game Sevens, and they refer to Larry Bird-Dominique Wilkins in the fourth quarter in 1988 (which indeed proved incredible), or Paul Pierce-LeBron James in 2008. But Hakeem Olajuwon and Kevin Johnson in the fourth quarter twenty years ago should be right up there.


Interesting quote. Not sure I can watch that video again though because that was probably the most painful memory as a Suns fan for me. KJ is awesome in that game to see though.

Re: Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 3:53 am
by GMATCallahan
bwgood77 wrote:Interesting quote. Not sure I can watch that video again though because that was probably the most painful memory as a Suns fan for me. KJ is awesome in that game to see though.


Barkley has said that for him, the Mario Elie shot hurts more than the John Paxson one.

Re: Why KJ should be in the Hall of Fame

Posted: Thu May 21, 2015 4:03 am
by bwgood77
GMATCallahan wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:Interesting quote. Not sure I can watch that video again though because that was probably the most painful memory as a Suns fan for me. KJ is awesome in that game to see though.


Barkley has said that for him, the Mario Elie shot hurts more than the John Paxson one.


It hurt more for me because I truly thought we were the best team that year, and especially because we had them down 3-1. That 93 year I wasn't so sure we were better than the Sonics or Bulls. And it was the first year with the team, so I figured we would only get better.

I felt in 2007 we were the best team as well, and we all know how that series went.