RealGM

+3 Bender
+2 Booker
+1 Bled

-1 Tucker
-2 LB
-3 Knight

batsmasher wrote:8-)

Question...do we have to make all cactus votes?

My Nashty ones are

+3 Bledsoe best game of season
+2 Tucker 5 steals? solid d...great assists, boards no turnovers
+1 Bender just doing so much after a few DNPs...has to be commended
It was tough to leave Warren and Booker out but Booker was empty across the board...I mean NOTHING? Other than 1 steal and 2 turnovers? Not passing the ball enough to start the game cost us big that first quarter.

bwgood77 wrote:

batsmasher wrote:8-)

Question...do we have to make all cactus votes?

Not at all. Voting is non-compulsory.

If you do vote in either the Nashty or the Cactus it has to be a full vote.. not a partial vote. I.e no -3 only or no +3 +2 only.

For Cactus mine would be:

-3 Knight (tough between him and Len, but Len had solid rebounds despite shooting 20% but he still didn't shoot too much and 9 boards in 17 minutes good.) Knight way too many boneheaded turnovers despite the assists and shooting finally at least ok
-2 for Len because of shooting 20%
-1 Dudley edges out barbs for 2 turnovers

+3 Bledsoe
+2 Booker
+1 Bender

-3 Len
-2 Chriss
-1 Dudley

+3 Bled - gotta give credit where credit is due
+2 Booker
+1 Bender

-1 Warren - this is really harsh i know, but he has to be more aggressive
-2 Len
-3 Knight

+3 Eric Bledsoe: Best game of the year for him. I wish he did a bit better on the defensive end but not much you can do against Dame when he's hitting his shots.
+2 Dragan Bender: Came in the game and was disruptive on the defensive end and effective on offense. Didn't fill the stat sheet, but he is a much better option for guarding pick and rolls at the 5 than either Len or Chandler because he can actually stick with guards when they attack the lane on screens. He earned more minutes, he better get them from now on regardless of Chandler being in or out.
+1 PJ Tucker: Seemed like the old PJ Tucker we love to hate around here. Got it done in terms of counting stats and did a good job on the defensive end, just too many fouls. Really wish he could have pulled in that rebound on the missed free throw at the end of the game, but oh well.

-1 Brandon Knight: Not a bad game statistically and he was in the lineup that was keeping us in the game, but 5 turnovers and a bunch of unwise plays gets him a -1 from me. I just never feel like his stats fully represent what he does on the court.
-2 Jared Dudley: Not overly productive in his time on the court, isn't stretching the floor out like I'd hoped he would when we brought him in. I don't feel like he matches up well with Portland either, they play their 4's in a similar role to what we do with Dudley but they are younger and much more athletic than Duds is.
-3 Alex Len: More of the same from Len. No touch around the rim, liability in pick and roll, not much of a rim protector. I felt like we were playing much better defense against them when Bender was manning the 5.

Overall not a bad game, at least we fought. I can't make myself give Booker Nashty points when he wasn't productive on the court at all besides scoring and was getting lit up by CJ. Chriss and Bender getting decent PT was a nice turn of events too. Well, time to drink myself into a coma, see ya'll in 2018.

batsmasher wrote:

bwgood77 wrote:

batsmasher wrote:8-)

Question...do we have to make all cactus votes?

Not at all. Voting is non-compulsory.

If you do vote in either the Nashty or the Cactus it has to be a full vote.. not a partial vote. I.e no -3 only or no +3 +2 only.

Go ahead and keep mine in. No reason to not vote on Nashty when some players didn't contribute much to winning.

+3 Bledsoe
+2 Tucker
+1 Bender

-3 Chriss
-2 Len
-1 Knight

+3 Bledsoe - He was a tank in the 4th quarter.
+2 for Bender - He was making all his shots pre-game and at halftime. Seriously think he should have gotten the ball more.
+1 for Booker - He scored, would have done more but ref 71 kept stopping any momentum we had.

-1 for Warren - Just seemed he couldn't get anything going
-2 for Len - I didn't see him do anything. How many minutes did he even play?
-3 for Knight - Seriously there was about 5 or 6 plays that I just couldn't believe how idiotic Knight was. Made a silly foul that ended up being an And1. Bad passes, bad shots, the usual for Knight really.

IDK what you guys saw with LB, but I thought he played pretty well. Tucker also played pretty well IMO.

Qwigglez wrote:+3 Bledsoe - He was a tank in the 4th quarter.
+2 for Bender - He was making all his shots pre-game and at halftime. Seriously think he should have gotten the ball more.
+1 for Booker - He scored, would have done more but ref 71 kept stopping any momentum we had.

-1 for Warren - Just seemed he couldn't get anything going
-2 for Len - I didn't see him do anything. How many minutes did he even play?
-3 for Knight - Seriously there was about 5 or 6 plays that I just couldn't believe how idiotic Knight was. Made a silly foul that ended up being an And1. Bad passes, bad shots, the usual for Knight really.

IDK what you guys saw with LB, but I thought he played pretty well. Tucker also played pretty well IMO.

Tucker was #2 for me on the positive side. The worst player was still probably Knight despite shooting fairly well and 6 assists, but 5 turnovers kind of cancels that..and some really bad ones.

They are simply just a better team, but a solid effort on the road, particularly with I think the 2 youngest guys in the league getting a good number of minutes....I'll take a loss with those guys getting great minutes, particularly a competitive one over them getting DNPs with our vets earning a meaningless win.

+3 Bledsoe
+2 Bender
+1 Booker

-3 Knight
-2 Tucker
-1 Chandler (harsh, perhaps)

In most of our losses, it was easy to find fall guys but not so much tonight. I didn't really like putting anyone on the cactus side for this one.

You guys are out of control with your Knight hate. Yes, he's been the Suns worst player this season but there's no way he was the worst Suns player tonight. Dudley, Len and Chriss were easily worse than him. Knight made a couple of classic dumb Knightmare plays, but he was the only Suns guard who was able to stay in front od CJ and Dame tonight and he was pushing the tempo and moving the ball every minute he was on the court.

Everyone who gave -3 to Knight tonight should probably have their voting rights rescinded, just like a big chunk of Americans after the presidential election yesterday

gaspar wrote:You guys are out of control with your Knight hate. Yes, he's been the Suns worst player this season but there's no way he was the worst Suns player tonight. Dudley, Len and Chriss were easily worse than him. Knight made a couple of classic dumb Knightmare plays, but he was the only Suns guard who was able to stay in front od CJ and Dame tonight and he was pushing the tempo and moving the ball every minute he was on the court.

Everyone who gave -3 to Knight tonight should probably have their voting rights rescinded, just like a big chunk of Americans after the presidential election yesterday

It's probably a case of comparing performance to expectations. I guess after awhile we'll start giving him a +3 for nights like tonight once we all start viewing him equal to his current play level. Yes, he outplayed Chriss, Len and Dudley but Chriss is an extremely low BBIQ teenaged rookie in his first start, Dudley is a smart role player whose limited physical skills are in decline and Len is, well, Len.

Zelaznyrules wrote:

gaspar wrote:You guys are out of control with your Knight hate. Yes, he's been the Suns worst player this season but there's no way he was the worst Suns player tonight. Dudley, Len and Chriss were easily worse than him. Knight made a couple of classic dumb Knightmare plays, but he was the only Suns guard who was able to stay in front od CJ and Dame tonight and he was pushing the tempo and moving the ball every minute he was on the court.

Everyone who gave -3 to Knight tonight should probably have their voting rights rescinded, just like a big chunk of Americans after the presidential election yesterday

It's probably a case of comparing performance to expectations. I guess after awhile we'll start giving him a +3 for nights like tonight once we all start viewing him equal to his current play level. But, all in all, he stinks Gaspar, I really don't understand your continuing defense of him. Yes, he outplayed Chriss, Len and Dudley but Chriss is an extremely low BBIQ teenaged rookie in his first start, Dudley is a smart role player whose limited physical skills are in decline and Len is, well, Len.

I don't like Knight at all but I hate even more this extreme demonizing and scapegoating that is going on in here. I've seen it before with Gortat and IT, when at some point you couldn't have a reasonable discussion about those players. Even when it was pretty obvious that they weren't the cause of all of Suns struggles. Knight is playing bad, really, really bad this season but tonight he wasn't he worst Suns player on the court IMO.

I wasn't a big fan of this idea to vote for the worst Suns player after every loss because at some point it just becomes a negative circlejerk. Since the season started almost every thread is about Knight's suckiness and rookies playing time. It gets boring really fast.

+3 Bledsoe - Did pretty good. Defense was pretty good against one of the leagues best backcourts.
+2 Bender - Came in and made a difference right away.
+1 Tucker - All around decent game. 9 rebounds is great, the 5 steals really helped as well.

-3 Len - Had his big shot at starting against a weak frontcourt team.......and blew it! The total rebounds look nice, but once again you have to factor in his 4 offensive rebounds, most he got from his own in-the-paint misses. Its becoming a very common thing with him where his rebounding stats are inflated due to offensive rebounding his own gimmies.
-2 Knight - eh...took a few shots that i considered bad. 5 turnovers in 19 minutes OUCH!
-1 Booker - Im starting to get scared. He put up some decent points, but no other stats. Seriously, NO OTHER STATS! No assists, no rebounds, bleh. If he is going to be our future, he really needs to step up in other factions for us besides just being a high scorer.

+3 Bledsoe
+2 Bender
+1 Tucker

-3 Knight - I know he was 5/10 with 6 ast but he just plays dumb. I'm not sure if his bb iq is any better than Archie's.
-2 Watson - for not giving Ulis even a single minute
-1 Warren - too passive

This was good game and can't say anybody played really bad. Lillared and Cj was just too good for us.

+3 Bledsoe
+2 Bender
+1 Tucker

gaspar wrote: should probably have their voting rights rescinded, just like a big chunk of Americans after the presidential election yesterday

So 50 million Americans don't agree with you, so they deserve their rights to get revoked? That's 1 vote for monarchy...anyone else?

See how even if joking; some can be pretty sensitive about this and could take it the wrong way, such as my example above.

I don't care, but maybe better stated here...

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=1463286&hilit=politics#start_here

...before a perfectly good thread gets ruined...no offense taken here, Gaspar...I promise!