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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#221 » by WeekapaugGroove » Tue May 14, 2019 3:41 am

lilfishi22 wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:
lilfishi22 wrote:Impatience

They've been on this express path basically since they decided to move like half of their good core guys (Roco/Saric) to build a contender now. They've dealt with trying to integrate two big pieces into the starting line up on the fly and injuries from Embiid only to lose in G7 to a contender. I think that's far from a reason to get rid of their coach.

Brown is going to get his pick of HC jobs when he decides he wants to coach again should he get fired.
I don't know if it's that simple. There have been questions about brown for a couple years in regards to some of his systems and rotations. Now I think some of this is roster construction and that's not an easy group to coach but I'm also not sure he's that good of a coach.

Another factor is brown was a remnant of an old regime and it's natural for the new front office to want their own hand picked guy.

It's pretty common that the guys who was right for the building phase isn't the right guy for the compete phase.

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I'm just saying what they've done in the past year is consistent with a front office that is trying to fast track the team/core into a contender. Part of that is may be that they think they need to do *something* and it's easier to replace a coach with a "high level HC" than it is to rebuild the roster. They may also have seen that their window may not be as long as initially thought with Embiid's long term health which means more "win-now" moves needs to be made.

On the topic of Brown, I do think Brown is a high level coach but I think some perception changed because they lost on a buzzer beater in a G7 of the 2nd round of the playoffs when that shouldn't be the case. If they were thoroughly beaten from end to end for most of the series then fine but they went up against arguably the deepest team and 2nd most talented contender in the East and lost on a buzzer beater. Here's the key thing, perception and reality aren't always a match and I think that's the issue here. I think perception changed because the story is that the Sixers didn't make it to the ECF but the reality is that one buzzer beater doesn't suddenly make Brown an average coach or even a coach that isn't fit to be the HC of a contender.

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I personally think coaching is a little overrated. A small handful of coaches make a real positive impact, a few terrible ones make a negative impact, but the vast majority fall in the middle where if they have good players they look alright and if they don't they get fired. Brown falls in that middle ground IMO.

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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#222 » by jsierra1985 » Tue May 14, 2019 11:43 am

not getting excited yet about this hire.......the losing culture has been going on for a while to start thinking positive about this team..still need to land talent on this team regardless
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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#223 » by NavLDO » Tue May 14, 2019 5:21 pm

WeekapaugGroove wrote:
lilfishi22 wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:I don't know if it's that simple. There have been questions about brown for a couple years in regards to some of his systems and rotations. Now I think some of this is roster construction and that's not an easy group to coach but I'm also not sure he's that good of a coach.

Another factor is brown was a remnant of an old regime and it's natural for the new front office to want their own hand picked guy.

It's pretty common that the guys who was right for the building phase isn't the right guy for the compete phase.

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I'm just saying what they've done in the past year is consistent with a front office that is trying to fast track the team/core into a contender. Part of that is may be that they think they need to do *something* and it's easier to replace a coach with a "high level HC" than it is to rebuild the roster. They may also have seen that their window may not be as long as initially thought with Embiid's long term health which means more "win-now" moves needs to be made.

On the topic of Brown, I do think Brown is a high level coach but I think some perception changed because they lost on a buzzer beater in a G7 of the 2nd round of the playoffs when that shouldn't be the case. If they were thoroughly beaten from end to end for most of the series then fine but they went up against arguably the deepest team and 2nd most talented contender in the East and lost on a buzzer beater. Here's the key thing, perception and reality aren't always a match and I think that's the issue here. I think perception changed because the story is that the Sixers didn't make it to the ECF but the reality is that one buzzer beater doesn't suddenly make Brown an average coach or even a coach that isn't fit to be the HC of a contender.

FWIW

Read on Twitter
I personally think coaching is a little overrated. A small handful of coaches make a real positive impact, a few terrible ones make a negative impact, but the vast majority fall in the middle where if they have good players they look alright and if they don't they get fired. Brown falls in that middle ground IMO.

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I agree to a point; I mean, you need to hire a coach that can meet the basic requirements of the job, of course. But after that? I do believe in bad fits, though, and I personally don't think Kokoskov was nearly as bad as our record indicated, and think he could fare quite well on a team with more maturity and talent... For example, I find it difficult to believe, for instance, that Pat Riley just forgot how to coach in 2001-2003, or 2007-2008.

What will largely determine whether Monty Williams will be successful or not, will likely more have to do with how Ayton and Booker progress / stay healthy, and what we accomplish through the draft / FA. And this could largely be determined whetger we get the #1 overall, or number 6 overall.
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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#224 » by jcsunsfan » Wed May 15, 2019 4:58 am

NavLDO wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:
lilfishi22 wrote:I'm just saying what they've done in the past year is consistent with a front office that is trying to fast track the team/core into a contender. Part of that is may be that they think they need to do *something* and it's easier to replace a coach with a "high level HC" than it is to rebuild the roster. They may also have seen that their window may not be as long as initially thought with Embiid's long term health which means more "win-now" moves needs to be made.

On the topic of Brown, I do think Brown is a high level coach but I think some perception changed because they lost on a buzzer beater in a G7 of the 2nd round of the playoffs when that shouldn't be the case. If they were thoroughly beaten from end to end for most of the series then fine but they went up against arguably the deepest team and 2nd most talented contender in the East and lost on a buzzer beater. Here's the key thing, perception and reality aren't always a match and I think that's the issue here. I think perception changed because the story is that the Sixers didn't make it to the ECF but the reality is that one buzzer beater doesn't suddenly make Brown an average coach or even a coach that isn't fit to be the HC of a contender.

FWIW

Read on Twitter
I personally think coaching is a little overrated. A small handful of coaches make a real positive impact, a few terrible ones make a negative impact, but the vast majority fall in the middle where if they have good players they look alright and if they don't they get fired. Brown falls in that middle ground IMO.

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I agree to a point; I mean, you need to hire a coach that can meet the basic requirements of the job, of course. But after that? I do believe in bad fits, though, and I personally don't think Kokoskov was nearly as bad as our record indicated, and think he could fare quite well on a team with more maturity and talent... For example, I find it difficult to believe, for instance, that Pat Riley just forgot how to coach in 2001-2003, or 2007-2008.

What will largely determine whether Monty Williams will be successful or not, will likely more have to do with how Ayton and Booker progress / stay healthy, and what we accomplish through the draft / FA. And this could largely be determined whetger we get the #1 overall, or number 6 overall.

Guess Monty is doomed.



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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#225 » by Flying Colors » Wed May 15, 2019 5:58 am

jcsunsfan wrote:Guess Monty is doomed.




I wonder who we’ll hire next year as our next coach
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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#226 » by lilfishi22 » Wed May 15, 2019 6:07 am

Flying Colors wrote:
jcsunsfan wrote:Guess Monty is doomed.




I wonder who we’ll hire next year as our next coach

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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#227 » by Flying Colors » Wed May 15, 2019 6:10 am

lilfishi22 wrote:
Flying Colors wrote:
jcsunsfan wrote:Guess Monty is doomed.




I wonder who we’ll hire next year as our next coach

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The way he would rip apart sarver, Barkly would be the first coach in history to be fire before coaching one game.
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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#228 » by lilfishi22 » Wed May 15, 2019 6:33 am

Flying Colors wrote:
lilfishi22 wrote:
Flying Colors wrote:I wonder who we’ll hire next year as our next coach

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The way he would rip apart sarver, Barkly would be the first coach in history to be fire before coaching one game.

The comedy value would be priceless though
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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#229 » by Revived » Wed May 15, 2019 7:44 pm

Monty Williams ran slower paced offenses in New Orleans so I’m curious to see if that’s what he implements here as well.

The league overall has gone to a fast paced style of offense and I’m sure Monty has seen the adjustments during his time as an assistant coach. The Suns personnel also seems better fit for a fast paced style of offense than a grit n grind.
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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#230 » by lilfishi22 » Thu May 16, 2019 1:02 am

Revived wrote:Monty Williams ran slower paced offenses in New Orleans so I’m curious to see if that’s what he implements here as well.

The league overall has gone to a fast paced style of offense and I’m sure Monty has seen the adjustments during his time as an assistant coach. The Suns personnel also seems better fit for a fast paced style of offense than a grit n grind.

The hope is that having been at higher levels of the NBA with OKC and the Sixers would have helped develop and mature his system to fit today's NBA
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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#231 » by Saberestar » Thu May 16, 2019 11:09 am

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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#232 » by WeekapaugGroove » Thu May 16, 2019 7:35 pm

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Suns hiring a player development guy from Villanova

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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#233 » by proedros1908 » Thu May 16, 2019 7:42 pm

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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#234 » by Saberestar » Thu May 16, 2019 7:50 pm

WeekapaugGroove wrote:
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Suns hiring a player development guy from Villanova

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He is superyoung.

What was his job at Villanova?
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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#235 » by WeekapaugGroove » Thu May 16, 2019 7:56 pm

Saberestar wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:
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Suns hiring a player development guy from Villanova

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He is superyoung.

What was his job at Villanova?
From what I've read I think he was a grad assistant. Bridges tweeted and seemed pleased with the hire.

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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#236 » by BobbieL » Thu May 16, 2019 8:01 pm

WeekapaugGroove wrote:
Saberestar wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:
Read on Twitter


Suns hiring a player development guy from Villanova

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He is superyoung.

What was his job at Villanova?
From what I've read I think he was a grad assistant. Bridges tweeted and seemed pleased with the hire.

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I am not surprised that Monty is starting to fill out his staff even before his press conference. Its been two weeks since he was announced. My guess he already has his lead assistants in place as well.
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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#237 » by bwgood77 » Thu May 16, 2019 11:23 pm

Not sure if these guys are assistant coaches but even if they are I think it's a good move for young coaches to pluck these guys out of college from succesful programs....sometimes these younger coaches who haven't been long time NBA coaches probably have a harder time filling out their staffs....and they have to search for those around the NBA no one else wants.
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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#238 » by lilfishi22 » Fri May 17, 2019 12:53 am

bwgood77 wrote:Not sure if these guys are assistant coaches but even if they are I think it's a good move for young coaches to pluck these guys out of college from succesful programs....sometimes these younger coaches who haven't been long time NBA coaches probably have a harder time filling out their staffs....and they have to search for those around the NBA no one else wants.

It seems like we're taking the right path when it comes to these hires. These development coaches know how to work with young guys and hopefully help transition their college game into the NBA game. Monty should be good with dealing with the older "vets" on our team
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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#239 » by Crives » Fri May 17, 2019 4:31 am

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Re: WOJ BOMB: Monty Williams to PHX 

Post#240 » by proedros1908 » Fri May 17, 2019 8:51 pm

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