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I am not sure if you guys have seen this video already.

Frank Lee wrote:

Saberestar wrote:

Frank Lee wrote:Is this the most talented team, top to bottom, Rubio has played on ?

Quick answer... no.

The Jazz from the last couple of years were a really talented team.

Ok
Let me rephrase that
Is this the best offensive talent around Rubio?

Going by league offensive rating, the best TWolves team was the 2014 team with Love, Martin and Pekovic. They were the 9th best offense in the league. In 2017, the Wolves had the 10th best offense with KAT, Wiggins, Lavine. That was probably the most weapons that Rubio ever had, and when Thibs finally realized that it was better to put the ball in Rubio's hands instead of letting Wiggins play point forward, Rubio averaged 16/10 after AS break.

Ricky some days ago in Spain´s national team first preparation match:
21 points

Saberestar wrote:

Watch on YouTube

If he plays with this much confidence in the NBA he's a borderline All-Star. This is the swagger we saw from his as a rookie and as a 17 year old in Olympics. Just look at those spinning layups..it's be a long time since he's been doing that stuff consistently.

Saberestar wrote:

Watch on YouTube

What's interesting is his shot doesn't look bad. He is a superb free throw shooter too. If he somehow develops a reliable three point shot ala Jason Kidd I can see great things for the Suns.

bigfoot wrote:

Saberestar wrote:

Watch on YouTube

What's interesting is his shot doesn't look bad. He is a superb free throw shooter too. If he somehow develops a reliable three point shot ala Jason Kidd I can see great things for the Suns.

His shot looks better than ever this summer, but we've seen some stretches before were he had more arc on his shot and a more natural and fluid release, and he never fully changed his form in the end. Hopefully this is the year he changes his shot for good, but even if he doesn't, I'm still really happy that he's finishing so well around the basket. The level of competition is way lower, but he already improved by leaps and bounds last season in that area, which to me has always been even more important than his outside stroke, as he can put much more pressure on the defense with his drives, and that's an integral part of his game.

Sugarless wrote:

bigfoot wrote:

Saberestar wrote:

Watch on YouTube

What's interesting is his shot doesn't look bad. He is a superb free throw shooter too. If he somehow develops a reliable three point shot ala Jason Kidd I can see great things for the Suns.

His shot looks better than ever this summer, but we've seen some stretches before were he had more arc on his shot and a more natural and fluid release, and he never fully changed his form in the end. Hopefully this is the year he changes his shot for good, but even if he doesn't, I'm still really happy that he's finishing so well around the basket. The level of competition is way lower, but he already improved by leaps and bounds last season in that area, which to me has always been even more important than his outside stroke, as he can put much more pressure on the defense with his drives, and that's an integral part of his game.

Wonder if the shooting has anything to do with that FIBA ball.

Crives wrote:

Sugarless wrote:

bigfoot wrote:
What's interesting is his shot doesn't look bad. He is a superb free throw shooter too. If he somehow develops a reliable three point shot ala Jason Kidd I can see great things for the Suns.

His shot looks better than ever this summer, but we've seen some stretches before were he had more arc on his shot and a more natural and fluid release, and he never fully changed his form in the end. Hopefully this is the year he changes his shot for good, but even if he doesn't, I'm still really happy that he's finishing so well around the basket. The level of competition is way lower, but he already improved by leaps and bounds last season in that area, which to me has always been even more important than his outside stroke, as he can put much more pressure on the defense with his drives, and that's an integral part of his game.

Wonder if the shooting has anything to do with that FIBA ball.

Really? Like the difference in how you throw a softball vs a shot put?

bigfoot wrote:

Saberestar wrote:

Watch on YouTube

What's interesting is his shot doesn't look bad. He is a superb free throw shooter too. If he somehow develops a reliable three point shot ala Jason Kidd I can see great things for the Suns.

I'm doubtful. He hasn't been able to do it for 8 seasons now and we are in the era of shooting. Plus 3 point line in FIBA is closer than in NBA. Maybe he'll be able to knock down corner 3 at a decent %? That would already be something.

sasquatchBob wrote:

bigfoot wrote:

Saberestar wrote:

Watch on YouTube

What's interesting is his shot doesn't look bad. He is a superb free throw shooter too. If he somehow develops a reliable three point shot ala Jason Kidd I can see great things for the Suns.

I'm doubtful. He hasn't been able to do it for 8 seasons now and we are in the era of shooting. Plus 3 point line in FIBA is closer than in NBA. Maybe he'll be able to knock down corner 3 at a decent %? That would already be something.

It took Kidd 10 years to develop a three point shot. Interestingly Rubio and Kidd have very similar career numbers.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=1&player_id1_hint=Jason+Kidd&player_id1_select=Jason+Kidd&y1=2013&player_id1=kiddja01&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Ricky+Rubio&player_id2_select=Ricky+Rubio&y2=2019&player_id2=rubiori01&idx=players#stats-per_minute::none

bigfoot wrote:

sasquatchBob wrote:

bigfoot wrote:
What's interesting is his shot doesn't look bad. He is a superb free throw shooter too. If he somehow develops a reliable three point shot ala Jason Kidd I can see great things for the Suns.

I'm doubtful. He hasn't been able to do it for 8 seasons now and we are in the era of shooting. Plus 3 point line in FIBA is closer than in NBA. Maybe he'll be able to knock down corner 3 at a decent %? That would already be something.

It took Kidd 10 years to develop a three point shot. Interestingly Rubio and Kidd have very similar career numbers.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=1&player_id1_hint=Jason+Kidd&player_id1_select=Jason+Kidd&y1=2013&player_id1=kiddja01&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Ricky+Rubio&player_id2_select=Ricky+Rubio&y2=2019&player_id2=rubiori01&idx=players#stats-per_minute::none

Jason Kidd was on another level.

Those numbers mean nothing, because Kidd played until he was 40 years old. Obviously his stats were way worse the last four/five seasons because he was really old.

Ricky Rubio himself would say that he is not as good as Kidd .... not even improving his shot. Kidd was a perennial All Star player and a physical specimen.

Saberestar wrote:

bigfoot wrote:

sasquatchBob wrote:
I'm doubtful. He hasn't been able to do it for 8 seasons now and we are in the era of shooting. Plus 3 point line in FIBA is closer than in NBA. Maybe he'll be able to knock down corner 3 at a decent %? That would already be something.

It took Kidd 10 years to develop a three point shot. Interestingly Rubio and Kidd have very similar career numbers.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=1&player_id1_hint=Jason+Kidd&player_id1_select=Jason+Kidd&y1=2013&player_id1=kiddja01&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Ricky+Rubio&player_id2_select=Ricky+Rubio&y2=2019&player_id2=rubiori01&idx=players#stats-per_minute::none

Jason Kidd was on another level.

Those numbers mean nothing, because Kidd played until he was 40 years old. Obviously his stats were way worse the last four/five seasons because he was really old.

Ricky Rubio himself would say that he is not as good as Kidd .... not even improving his shot. Kidd was a perennial All Star player and a physical specimen.

Actually Kidd's 3-pt percentage over the last few years improved his career numbers quite a bit. If you compare Rubio and Kidd's first eight seasons then their numbers per 36 minutes or 100 possession are damn close. Even their per game numbers are similar. Not claiming Rubio is as good as Kidd but if Rubio improves his shot like Kidd did in the later part of his career we will have made a very good pickup. I don't see why Rubio can't be a better shooter especially with his excellent free throw shooting percentage. That was what I was trying to point out but somehow you jumped to the wrong conclusion that I was saying Rubio is as a good as Kidd.

http://bkref.com/tiny/LCrrA

bigfoot wrote:

Saberestar wrote:

bigfoot wrote:
It took Kidd 10 years to develop a three point shot. Interestingly Rubio and Kidd have very similar career numbers.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=1&player_id1_hint=Jason+Kidd&player_id1_select=Jason+Kidd&y1=2013&player_id1=kiddja01&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Ricky+Rubio&player_id2_select=Ricky+Rubio&y2=2019&player_id2=rubiori01&idx=players#stats-per_minute::none

Jason Kidd was on another level.

Those numbers mean nothing, because Kidd played until he was 40 years old. Obviously his stats were way worse the last four/five seasons because he was really old.

Ricky Rubio himself would say that he is not as good as Kidd .... not even improving his shot. Kidd was a perennial All Star player and a physical specimen.

Actually Kidd's 3-pt percentage over the last few years improved his career numbers quite a bit. If you compare Rubio and Kidd's first eight seasons then their numbers per 36 minutes or 100 possession are damn close. Even their per game numbers are similar. Not claiming Rubio is as good as Kidd but if Rubio improves his shot like Kidd did in the later part of his career we will have made a very good pickup. I don't see why Rubio can't be a better shooter especially with his excellent free throw shooting percentage. That was what I was trying to point out but somehow you jumped to the wrong conclusion that I was saying Rubio is as a good as Kidd.

http://bkref.com/tiny/LCrrA

OK. I would not get your hopes up.

Kidd played in an era where a three-point shot was not as critical. Kidd was more athletic and much more aggressive than Rubio. He could depend on that part of his game to be very effective. While people criticized Kidd's shooting it was not considered as much as a detriment as Rubio's because of the other parts of Kidds game and the era.

I have no doubt that Rubio would LOVE to have a three-point shot. That shot is the bread and butter of the Euro league. Shooting has been drilled into him since very young. It is much more likely that Rubio just is not good at shooting from distance--if he hasn't gotten it by now, he is not likely to get it. I do not think Kidd bothered to try until later.

jcsunsfan wrote:

bigfoot wrote:

Saberestar wrote:Jason Kidd was on another level.

Those numbers mean nothing, because Kidd played until he was 40 years old. Obviously his stats were way worse the last four/five seasons because he was really old.

Ricky Rubio himself would say that he is not as good as Kidd .... not even improving his shot. Kidd was a perennial All Star player and a physical specimen.

Actually Kidd's 3-pt percentage over the last few years improved his career numbers quite a bit. If you compare Rubio and Kidd's first eight seasons then their numbers per 36 minutes or 100 possession are damn close. Even their per game numbers are similar. Not claiming Rubio is as good as Kidd but if Rubio improves his shot like Kidd did in the later part of his career we will have made a very good pickup. I don't see why Rubio can't be a better shooter especially with his excellent free throw shooting percentage. That was what I was trying to point out but somehow you jumped to the wrong conclusion that I was saying Rubio is as a good as Kidd.

http://bkref.com/tiny/LCrrA

OK. I would not get your hopes up.

Kidd played in an era where a three-point shot was not as critical. Kidd was more athletic and much more aggressive than Rubio. He could depend on that part of his game to be very effective. While people criticized Kidd's shooting it was not considered as much as a detriment as Rubio's because of the other parts of Kidds game and the era.

I have no doubt that Rubio would LOVE to have a three-point shot. That shot is the bread and butter of the Euro league. Shooting has been drilled into him since very young. It is much more likely that Rubio just is not good at shooting from distance--if he hasn't gotten it by now, he is not likely to get it. I do not think Kidd bothered to try until later.

After following his career for many seasons i believe Rubio's struggles are mental more than anything. Your theory that he just doesnt have a touch is not convincing - he has been >90% from the FT line a few times and is among the top FT shooters every season consistently. He can pass the ball for an alley oop precisely while running at full speed, over half court. Hand-Eye-coordination wise he does not have a precision problem with the 3pt line. Its all confidence or lack thereof.

LesGrossman wrote:

jcsunsfan wrote:

bigfoot wrote:
Actually Kidd's 3-pt percentage over the last few years improved his career numbers quite a bit. If you compare Rubio and Kidd's first eight seasons then their numbers per 36 minutes or 100 possession are damn close. Even their per game numbers are similar. Not claiming Rubio is as good as Kidd but if Rubio improves his shot like Kidd did in the later part of his career we will have made a very good pickup. I don't see why Rubio can't be a better shooter especially with his excellent free throw shooting percentage. That was what I was trying to point out but somehow you jumped to the wrong conclusion that I was saying Rubio is as a good as Kidd.

http://bkref.com/tiny/LCrrA

OK. I would not get your hopes up.

Kidd played in an era where a three-point shot was not as critical. Kidd was more athletic and much more aggressive than Rubio. He could depend on that part of his game to be very effective. While people criticized Kidd's shooting it was not considered as much as a detriment as Rubio's because of the other parts of Kidds game and the era.

I have no doubt that Rubio would LOVE to have a three-point shot. That shot is the bread and butter of the Euro league. Shooting has been drilled into him since very young. It is much more likely that Rubio just is not good at shooting from distance--if he hasn't gotten it by now, he is not likely to get it. I do not think Kidd bothered to try until later.

After following his career for many seasons i believe Rubio's struggles are mental more than anything. Your theory that he just doesnt have a touch is not convincing - he has been >90% from the FT line a few times and is among the top FT shooters every season consistently. He can pass the ball for an alley oop precisely while running at full speed, over half court. Hand-Eye-coordination wise he does not have a precision problem with the 3pt line. Its all confidence or lack thereof.

Watch Rubio play and tell me he lacks confidence. He is a classic smooth operator that operates like cool even in the hottest situations. Maybe its mechanics, but his shot looks pretty clean. He does not have much lean for an NBA player, so maybe strength has something to do with it. Regardless, with his level of experience in Europe and here, the likelihood of him developing a competent three pointer now is very slim.

I won't be surprised if Rubio shoots ok from 3 this year. He shot over 35% two years ago, which was better than any returning players on our team. He obviously was probably left wide open, but that's probably not going to change much.

He dipped back down last year, but it seems like every other year he shoots around 33% or better....with a dip in the years between.

Now I don't expect the consistency, and won't be surprised if he shoots poorly either. The defense is unlikely to respect him which is a big part of it, to be able to stretch the floor, so hopefully he isn't off ball much.

I have always been encouraged by his FT shooting but if the 3pt consistency hasn't come after 8 years in the NBA, it might be tough to change, but again, he's shot between 33%-35% 4 of those years.

I don't completely understand the Kidd comparisons. Kidd was over 33% his second year and 37% his third. then 36.6% his 5th and still 33.7% in his 6th. He did have a couple of down years after that, but then was between 34-36% for a few years, before getting up to 38%-42.5% for a few years, before settling back down to 36%-37% his last few years.

So he did improve further 10 years in, but had been pretty consistent early in his career.

bwgood77 wrote:I won't be surprised if Rubio shoots ok from 3 this year. He shot over 35% two years ago, which was better than any returning players on our team. He obviously was probably left wide open, but that's probably not going to change much.

He dipped back down last year, but it seems like every other year he shoots around 33% or better....with a dip in the years between.

For Rubio's sake, it's too bad the Suns fired Coach Kokoskov, because Rubio arguably shot the ball the best in his career under the specific tutelage of Kokoskov. It's a too small sample, but post All Star break in the 2017/18 season, with Kokoskov in charge of coaching Rubio, Rubio averaged 15 ppg on 43.6% shooting overall and 40.9% from three on 3.8 attempts per game. Rubio and Coach Kokoskov meshed very well together. Kokoskov seemed to help Rubio shoot the ball with more confidence.