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create a realistcally bad off-season for us

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create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#1 » by SlovenianDragon » Thu Aug 1, 2019 9:54 pm

Basically a what would McDonough do?

Who do we draft, trade for, or sign in FA, and what our roster would look like?
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#2 » by matt131 » Thu Aug 1, 2019 10:50 pm

McD:
Draft Whichever Kentucky guard was ranked highest (so I guess Tyler Herro).
Sign Terry Rozier to a 4yr/80million contract.
Don't resign Kelly because he wouldn't have traded for him last year anyway plus we would value Terry more.
Don't do anything else.
Win 20 games. Claim success for improving by one game.
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#3 » by Scutt » Thu Aug 1, 2019 11:03 pm

You mean like giving up on young talented players and attaching assets with them to ship them out? Or trading back in the draft to take a small forward who could have been had in the 20's, when Oubre and Bridges are on the roster?

They claimed they needed to get rid of Warren to free up the logjam at SF, only to continue it by drafting Cam. They over paid to bring in mediocre starters in Rubio and Saric, though I will admit those two should fit the roster well. The real off-season was realistically bad for the Suns. The only real bright spots for me are knowing Ayton finally gets to play with a starting caliber point guard and Oubre only got a 2 year deal.
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#4 » by Desertfox » Thu Aug 1, 2019 11:06 pm

Draft Culver, draft Cam Johnson (trade up using Bucks pick), keep everyone, sign veteran FA SF with MLE, sign Euro/G-League All-star PG with other exception.

Roll out all-SF lineup: Warren, Kelly, Jackson, Bridges, Culver, Johnson, FA SF....
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#5 » by WeekapaugGroove » Thu Aug 1, 2019 11:10 pm

I think mcd would have drafted Sekou Doumbouya.

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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#6 » by Scutt » Thu Aug 1, 2019 11:29 pm

I get that McD had his flaws as a GM, but the only young talent with any real upside this team has, were all drafted by him. I certainly hope his eye for talent is not as bad as some of you seem to think. Just because McD was a bad GM doesn't mean that bottoming out and building a team through the draft isn't the right way to go. He just did a crappy job of it.

Meanwhile the Champ is counting his chickens before they hatch, surrounding Booker and Ayton with low ceiling role players, and some of you are praising those moves. I can't wait till next year when TJ Warren goes beast mode and one of Melton or Jackson breaks out, and Suns fans start realizing the Champs roster is only good for making the Suns a mediocre team for a few years.
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#7 » by lilfishi22 » Thu Aug 1, 2019 11:39 pm

WeekapaugGroove wrote:I think mcd would have drafted Sekou Doumbouya.

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lol exactly what I was about to type up
alamin330 wrote:This draft reminds me of the 2003 draft.
Lebron - Zion, Barrett like Melo, wade like Culver, garland like tj ford, hunter like bosh, white like Barbosa, Clarke like David West. I think this draft is actually going to be deeper though
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#8 » by darealjuice » Thu Aug 1, 2019 11:54 pm

The obvious one to me is that we could have ended up with a half-assed starting point guard like Cory Joseph if Milwaukee kept Brogdon and Indiana continued their pursuit of Rubio. He's a bit overpaid, but that's the cost of doing business for starting-caliber free agents when you have our recent history. From Rubio's perspective, he's committing his prime to a team that won 19 games last year.

Hiring another first time head coach instead of Monty after firing Igor would have been looked at very unfavorably. Getting one of the big names of the season saved us a lot of face after we fired Igor his first year with a terribly constructed roster. I don't blame James for wanting to get his own guy and cleanse the McDonough from the franchise.

Matching a big offer sheet for Oubre would have really hamstrung us. Taking the qualifying offer because he didn't like his offers probably wouldn't have been good for us either. A 2-year deal works well for both of us: he can earn more money in 2021 if he plays like when he started here, and we get the opportunity to see if he'll develop into being worth big money while maintaining big cap space for a stacked 2021 free agency.

Drafting another raw project player wouldn't have been received well either, even if it's a completely different front office and coaching staff doing the drafting and developing. I would have preferred Clarke (and probably NAW after seeing him play more), but Cam has a very translatable skill set for the NBA and we can't afford to keep busting.

Trading TJ like we did was a very controversial move, but going into the season with him starting at power forward again would have been very bad too.
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#9 » by lilfishi22 » Thu Aug 1, 2019 11:57 pm

Scutt wrote:I get that McD had his flaws as a GM, but the only young talent with any real upside this team has, were all drafted by him. I certainly hope his eye for talent is not as bad as some of you seem to think. Just because McD was a bad GM doesn't mean that bottoming out and building a team through the draft isn't the right way to go. He just did a crappy job of it.

Meanwhile the Champ is counting his chickens before they hatch, surrounding Booker and Ayton with low ceiling role players, and some of you are praising those moves. I can't wait till next year when TJ Warren goes beast mode and one of Melton or Jackson breaks out, and Suns fans start realizing the Champs roster is only good for making the Suns a mediocre team for a few years.

He's taken enough shots in the dark to pick *some* young talent with any real upside. I mean, if you gave a cat a choice of eating from 5 bowls where each of those 5 bowls represented the top 5 players in each of the last few drafts, that cat would probably make one right pick. But he also drafted a bunch of young talent with upside that aren't even with the team any more (JJ, Len, Chriss, Bender and the rest of the late 1st, early 2nd's) and some of those are barely hanging on to an NBA contract.

I'll give him credit for taking TJ and Booker but that's about it. Those were genuinely good picks because they were at the end of the lottery and he had to develop them into NBA players. I'll also give him credit for some very savvy moves to bring in younger untapped players in exchange for those older guys that didn't fit the timeline early on in his tenure. But the drafts was always one of his worst performances of the offseason.

Yes Jones has lowered the high end ceiling this team had on paper but it was this adherence to only high upside moves while actual team building was put side which doomed McD's tenure. I'm happy that we finally get a look at what a Booker/Ayton combo looks like with a cast of capable supporting players. Yes this team, on paper, arguably doesn't' have the upside you'd expect from a 20 win team the last few season but this team also just needed to put it's foot down and say, OK the draft and hope phase of this team is over and it's time to build a team around those young players. That's what we did and if we're not much better then there's plenty of moves we can make. Oubre, Baynes, Saric, Kaminsky, Johnson, Diallo and the young guys are all moveable or expiring.

This season is about seeing what we have in Booker and Ayton and I'm glad we're finally focusing on the cornerstone who McD had committed us to. If it doesn't work, then I'd rather know sooner rather than later.
alamin330 wrote:This draft reminds me of the 2003 draft.
Lebron - Zion, Barrett like Melo, wade like Culver, garland like tj ford, hunter like bosh, white like Barbosa, Clarke like David West. I think this draft is actually going to be deeper though
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#10 » by Damkac » Fri Aug 2, 2019 12:00 am

Give a good player for free. Or even add some small asset like 2nd rounder.
Make a big reach in the draft.
Add a lot of players unwanted by their former teams.
Don't adress the defense at all.

Oh, wait....
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#11 » by lilfishi22 » Fri Aug 2, 2019 12:16 am

Damkac wrote:Give a good player for free. Or even add some small asset like 2nd rounder.
Make a big reach in the draft.
Add a lot of players unwanted by their former teams.
Don't adress the defense at all.

Oh, wait....


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alamin330 wrote:This draft reminds me of the 2003 draft.
Lebron - Zion, Barrett like Melo, wade like Culver, garland like tj ford, hunter like bosh, white like Barbosa, Clarke like David West. I think this draft is actually going to be deeper though
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#12 » by Crives » Fri Aug 2, 2019 6:34 am

lilfishi22 wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:I think mcd would have drafted Sekou Doumbouya.

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lol exactly what I was about to type up


2nd place answer = Cam Reddish
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#13 » by ryanball » Fri Aug 2, 2019 8:13 am

Jalen Leque would end up with significant minutes or maybe even starting. He'd be touted for his "potential" instead of recognized as the G-League scrub he is.

We would still have TJ Warren on his "good contract" and he would play his usual 40-50 games. But its fine because Eddie Johnson would call him Rush Hour.

Possibly we would have found a way to acquire Chris Paul. He would be a "mentor" to Leque and our other half-dozen YMCA-tier point guards, plus he's friends with Lebron James and could recruit him to play here.
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#14 » by sunsbg » Fri Aug 2, 2019 8:59 am

Scutt wrote:I get that McD had his flaws as a GM, but the only young talent with any real upside this team has, were all drafted by him. I certainly hope his eye for talent is not as bad as some of you seem to think. Just because McD was a bad GM doesn't mean that bottoming out and building a team through the draft isn't the right way to go. He just did a crappy job of it.

Meanwhile the Champ is counting his chickens before they hatch, surrounding Booker and Ayton with low ceiling role players, and some of you are praising those moves. I can't wait till next year when TJ Warren goes beast mode and one of Melton or Jackson breaks out, and Suns fans start realizing the Champs roster is only good for making the Suns a mediocre team for a few years.


Yeah, they should have offered 17M contract to Melton, not Rubio.

Let's keep all the scrubs because of fear someone breaks out in 5 years.
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#15 » by sunsbg » Fri Aug 2, 2019 9:48 am

Damkac wrote:Give a good player for free. Or even add some small asset like 2nd rounder.
Make a big reach in the draft.
Add a lot of players unwanted by their former teams.
Don't adress the defense at all.

Oh, wait....


You will be the most positively surprised on this board next season. Wrong on all your points.

Warren -> Rubio
Already discussed Pistons may have drafted CJ 15th. Clarke was drafted 21, still you would be fine with him at 11 probably.
Nash was also not wanted by the Mavs I guess.
Rubio, Baynes, Diallo, Oubre - all good or potentially good defenders.
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#16 » by Scutt » Fri Aug 2, 2019 4:03 pm

sunsbg wrote:
Scutt wrote:I get that McD had his flaws as a GM, but the only young talent with any real upside this team has, were all drafted by him. I certainly hope his eye for talent is not as bad as some of you seem to think. Just because McD was a bad GM doesn't mean that bottoming out and building a team through the draft isn't the right way to go. He just did a crappy job of it.

Meanwhile the Champ is counting his chickens before they hatch, surrounding Booker and Ayton with low ceiling role players, and some of you are praising those moves. I can't wait till next year when TJ Warren goes beast mode and one of Melton or Jackson breaks out, and Suns fans start realizing the Champs roster is only good for making the Suns a mediocre team for a few years.


Yeah, they should have offered 17M contract to Melton, not Rubio.

Let's keep all the scrubs because of fear someone breaks out in 5 years.


Did I say anything about signing Melton to a 17M contract? Melton was one of the leaders in steals on our team for a bit and he was a rookie on a dirt cheap contract. There was no reason to ship him off, other than being a McD guy. You really should focus on your reading comprehension skills, it might even help you make rational arguments, instead of just blindly drinking the front offices Kool aid.
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#17 » by ImNotMcDiSwear » Fri Aug 2, 2019 4:33 pm

1. Draft Coby White @ #6.
2. Draft Bol Bol @ #32.
3. Sign Terry Rozier @ 4 years, $85 million.
4. Stretch Tyler Johnson to open up space for Rozier.
5. Sign Mike Muscala @ remaining cap space/full MLE.
6. Re-Sign Dragan Bender @ 2 years/$6 million.
7. Pick up the option on Ray Spalding.
8. Re-sign Jamal Crawford in August.
9. After protracted contract negotiation with Oubre, he takes the QO.
10. @ End of Summer, pick up the option on Josh Jackson.

Rozier/White/Okobo
Booker/Crawford/Melton
Warren/Bridges/Jackson
Oubre/Bender/Spalding
Ayton/Muscala/Bol

11. Rumblings about Booker wanting out begin in earnest one month into the season.
12. TJ goes down with a mystery ailment in November.
13. Crawford starts seeing consistent minutes by December.
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#18 » by WeekapaugGroove » Fri Aug 2, 2019 4:44 pm

One point that people seem to like to make is 'why ship out Warren to clear the SF log jam then add Cam?" The big difference is Cam being on the 1st season of his rookie deal it's perfectly fine for him to be a fringe rotation guy this year if everyone else is healthy. If he's eased in by getting 10 mins a night or even DNP's that's fine as he gets his feet under him. That would certainly not be fine to do with Warren. Both because he wouldn't have been happy in that type of role but more importantly his trade value would have plummeted even more than it was at this summer if he's getting light minutes and not putting up numbers. At that point that contract is going to cost more than a 2nd rounder to clear. As I have been stating for a while the decision was Warren or Oubre and they chose Oubre, debate that all you want but Cam is a totally different equation.

Jackson is a little different because technically he could have played spot minutes but he actively hurts your team any minutes he plays and it seems they decided they weren't picking up his 4th year option so simply didn't want him around anymore.
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#19 » by sunsbg » Fri Aug 2, 2019 5:19 pm

Scutt wrote:
sunsbg wrote:
Scutt wrote:I get that McD had his flaws as a GM, but the only young talent with any real upside this team has, were all drafted by him. I certainly hope his eye for talent is not as bad as some of you seem to think. Just because McD was a bad GM doesn't mean that bottoming out and building a team through the draft isn't the right way to go. He just did a crappy job of it.

Meanwhile the Champ is counting his chickens before they hatch, surrounding Booker and Ayton with low ceiling role players, and some of you are praising those moves. I can't wait till next year when TJ Warren goes beast mode and one of Melton or Jackson breaks out, and Suns fans start realizing the Champs roster is only good for making the Suns a mediocre team for a few years.


Yeah, they should have offered 17M contract to Melton, not Rubio.

Let's keep all the scrubs because of fear someone breaks out in 5 years.


Did I say anything about signing Melton to a 17M contract? Melton was one of the leaders in steals on our team for a bit and he was a rookie on a dirt cheap contract. There was no reason to ship him off, other than being a McD guy. You really should focus on your reading comprehension skills, it might even help you make rational arguments, instead of just blindly drinking the front offices Kool aid.


You haters are just funny, complain when they ship a scrub, but also complain when the team loses by playing the same scrub. And that's what a player who's only skill is to chase players around - a scrub. There is a reason he was on a cheap contract.

You said Rubio is overpaid. What are your rational arguments ? Here's an article proving the opposite.

https://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2019/7/27/8931810/ricky-rubio-was-not-overpaid-by-the-phoenix-suns-nba-free-agency
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Re: create a realistcally bad off-season for us 

Post#20 » by Frank Lee » Fri Aug 2, 2019 6:33 pm

Whats this... 'softball' thread served up to the disgruntlers ? Scutt getting his cuts in.
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