Game 48: Oklahoma City Thunder (28-20) @ Phoenix Suns (20-27)

[Saberestar]

Looks like a spot up shooter to me. He shouldn't be spotting up from 3 really at all, so he shoots between 3 and a half to 4 and a half shots a game (1 dribble is typically the avoid the defender and move over to shoot a 3, or step forward to shoot to avoid defender). Of course he takes it to the rim a lot thus the 2+ dribbles. He's not great at the rim, but still good enough to take it there. That's really what he should be doing more of instead of ever really spotting up.

Dude, you and that other idiot were arguing that Booker started dominating that ball, which forced Rubio to change his playing style and play more off the ball. This is clearly a lie. There's nothing more to discuss. Bye.

You gotta quit personally attacking people. I guess you didn't read the post about him touching it in the frontcourt a lot and holding onto it for 4 seconds or more. Heck, you posted it as evidence. We are supposed to be quickly moving the ball with a .5 offense and when we did, we were playing much better, starting 7-4 even without Ayton, and Rubio was playing better as well because the ball was moving quickly and the defense kept having to reset instead of focusing 3-4 guys on Booker and ignoring shooters because they know the majority of the time he will shoot anyway. It takes others out of the game as they watch. Other's games were impacted too, whether it be Baynes, Saric, etc. I know you are a Booker super fan and he can do no wrong, even if it sometimes costs the team. He's our biggest weapon, but when others get freezed out, most all of them play worse.

What has been ignored all the time in this discussion is that Rubio is not playing with the same energy and effectiveness lately as he was playing at the start of the season.

It is pretty obvious to me and that's why he is not breaking down defenders or shooting as well as he was doing it a month ago.

And what about his defense? How many charges he has drawn in the last ten games? He was really good taking chargers and staying in front of his man at the start of the season , but lately he hasn't been able to do any of that. Is Booker guilty of that too?

Ricky Rubio is responsible for his good or bad actions on the court. All in all he has been a positive player and a nice addition for the team, but he is playing worse basketball now than at the beginning of the season. That's all, no need to make excuses for him.

[SuperSunsFan]

Dude, you and that other idiot were arguing that Booker started dominating that ball, which forced Rubio to change his playing style and play more off the ball. This is clearly a lie. There's nothing more to discuss. Bye.

You gotta quit personally attacking people. I guess you didn't read the post about him touching it in the frontcourt a lot and holding onto it for 4 seconds or more. Heck, you posted it as evidence. We are supposed to be quickly moving the ball with a .5 offense and when we did, we were playing much better, starting 7-4 even without Ayton, and Rubio was playing better as well because the ball was moving quickly and the defense kept having to reset instead of focusing 3-4 guys on Booker and ignoring shooters because they know the majority of the time he will shoot anyway. It takes others out of the game as they watch. Other's games were impacted too, whether it be Baynes, Saric, etc. I know you are a Booker super fan and he can do no wrong, even if it sometimes costs the team. He's our biggest weapon, but when others get freezed out, most all of them play worse.

What has been ignored all the time in this discussion is that Rubio is not playing with the same energy and effectiveness lately as he was playing at the start of the season.

It is pretty obvious to me and that's why he is not breaking down defenders or shooting as well as he was doing it a month ago.

And what about his defense? How many charges he has drawn in the last ten games? He was really good taking chargers and staying in front of his man at the start of the season , but lately he hasn't been able to do any of that. Is Booker guilty of that too?

Ricky Rubio is responsible for his good or bad actions on the court. All in all he has been a positive player and a nice addition for the team, but he is playing worse basketball now than at the beginning of the season. That's all, no need to make excuses for him.

could have something to do with being a first time father.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Its crazy to look at numbers over your own eyes that should see the actual game. In the beginning of the year, Rubio brought the ball up, handoff to a big, screened for a wing, returned and got the ball back in triple threat situation from his big most of the time. Then there was a lot of pick and roll and penetration, followed by kick out from Rubio to Baynes or Saric or dish to a cutting Bridges or Booker. Its not so long ago, you know? You dont have to hide behind stats to undesrtand what has changed. Nowadays, Rubio brings the ball up (if its not one of the Oubre kamikaze posessions where noone else touches the ball), hands off to the big, screens for the wing and goes straight into the corner. He never gets the ball back most of the time unless book gets struck without plan and with several defenders on him, who then plays a poor desperation pass that ends up in Rickys hands with 0.8 on the clock. All of this happens by design, its not accidental over several games. It is designed to let Booker run the complete offense. I dont know the purpose but it doesnt seem to work, but thats besides the point. The point is that you seem to watch the games but dont actually see what happens. Rubio didnt come in to end up as a corner 3pt shooter. Its just plain stupid to blame him to be bad at it. Its also not the case that he has regressed, its more that the system and offense has obviously been altered by the coaching staff. Mabye to cater to book, maybe to help his ASG cause (not so far fetched theory - it brings $), maybe because someone thought it'd just be a good idea.

Finally, just assuming that what i observe is true, how would you feel in his situation? How motivated would you be to continue in this system that not only doesnt help you but very obviously hurts the team's success?

It's my impression that we went away from a Rubio-centered offense pretty shortly after Ayton replaced Baynes in the lineup. The Rubio/Ayton P&R isn't effective because neither can shoot. The defense collapses and dares Rubio to shoot the mid-range. If he passes it up, the offense tends to re-set around a Booker or Oubre shot/drive. The coaching staff has just cut to the chase, essentially calling players' numbers on offense, since any P&R with Ayton is really just a setup for the ballhandler to score and Ayton to follow.

If Ayton could pop as effectively as Amare (let alone Frye), that would open things up for Ricky. But Rubio as creator was already pretty anemic before Ayton, since Baynes and Saric were themselves pretty ineffective from outside, and Kaminsky shied away so often. It was certainly better for Ricky since he had an open lane to work with (at least whenever the defense could be fooled into respecting our stretch bigs).

Bottom line: If a Rubio/Ayton P&R is going to work, one of them has to be able to shoot.

[LesGrossman]

Its crazy to look at numbers over your own eyes that should see the actual game. In the beginning of the year, Rubio brought the ball up, handoff to a big, screened for a wing, returned and got the ball back in triple threat situation from his big most of the time. Then there was a lot of pick and roll and penetration, followed by kick out from Rubio to Baynes or Saric or dish to a cutting Bridges or Booker. Its not so long ago, you know? You dont have to hide behind stats to undesrtand what has changed. Nowadays, Rubio brings the ball up (if its not one of the Oubre kamikaze posessions where noone else touches the ball), hands off to the big, screens for the wing and goes straight into the corner. He never gets the ball back most of the time unless book gets struck without plan and with several defenders on him, who then plays a poor desperation pass that ends up in Rickys hands with 0.8 on the clock. All of this happens by design, its not accidental over several games. It is designed to let Booker run the complete offense. I dont know the purpose but it doesnt seem to work, but thats besides the point. The point is that you seem to watch the games but dont actually see what happens. Rubio didnt come in to end up as a corner 3pt shooter. Its just plain stupid to blame him to be bad at it. Its also not the case that he has regressed, its more that the system and offense has obviously been altered by the coaching staff. Mabye to cater to book, maybe to help his ASG cause (not so far fetched theory - it brings $), maybe because someone thought it'd just be a good idea.

Finally, just assuming that what i observe is true, how would you feel in his situation? How motivated would you be to continue in this system that not only doesnt help you but very obviously hurts the team's success?

It's my impression that we went away from a Rubio-centered offense pretty shortly after Ayton replaced Baynes in the lineup. The Rubio/Ayton P&R isn't effective because neither can shoot. The defense collapses and dares Rubio to shoot the mid-range. If he passes it up, the offense tends to re-set around a Booker or Oubre shot/drive. The coaching staff has just cut to the chase, essentially calling players' numbers on offense, since any P&R with Ayton is really just a setup for the ballhandler to score and Ayton to follow.

If Ayton could pop as effectively as Amare (let alone Frye), that would open things up for Ricky. But Rubio as creator was already pretty anemic before Ayton, since Baynes and Saric were themselves pretty ineffective from outside, and Kaminsky shied away so often. It was certainly better for Ricky since he had an open lane to work with (at least whenever the defense could be fooled into respecting our stretch bigs).

Bottom line: If a Rubio/Ayton P&R is going to work, one of them has to be able to shoot.

Good observations. I think that Rubio isnt reluctant to shoot the open midrange but at the same time Ayton is so far very hesitant at rolling hard to the hoop. His angles and timings need to be improved which will certainly come with more games. Right now i often feel like the shot isnt really open for Rubio...its somewhere in between, which results in poor percentages. Also Ayton needs to take some lessons from Baynes on how to set proper screens, because if you check, often he doesnt help with getting rid of the ballhandlers defender - rarely ever happened with Baynes who literally levelled the defender.

[Keith_myath]

Rubio is playing injured.

Look at how Baynes played injured. It makes a huge fkn difference.

Rubio should be resting, but there isn't another starting caliber PG on the team and they're still with a chance of the playoffs.

[bwgood77]

Its crazy to look at numbers over your own eyes that should see the actual game. In the beginning of the year, Rubio brought the ball up, handoff to a big, screened for a wing, returned and got the ball back in triple threat situation from his big most of the time. Then there was a lot of pick and roll and penetration, followed by kick out from Rubio to Baynes or Saric or dish to a cutting Bridges or Booker. Its not so long ago, you know? You dont have to hide behind stats to undesrtand what has changed. Nowadays, Rubio brings the ball up (if its not one of the Oubre kamikaze posessions where noone else touches the ball), hands off to the big, screens for the wing and goes straight into the corner. He never gets the ball back most of the time unless book gets struck without plan and with several defenders on him, who then plays a poor desperation pass that ends up in Rickys hands with 0.8 on the clock. All of this happens by design, its not accidental over several games. It is designed to let Booker run the complete offense. I dont know the purpose but it doesnt seem to work, but thats besides the point. The point is that you seem to watch the games but dont actually see what happens. Rubio didnt come in to end up as a corner 3pt shooter. Its just plain stupid to blame him to be bad at it. Its also not the case that he has regressed, its more that the system and offense has obviously been altered by the coaching staff. Mabye to cater to book, maybe to help his ASG cause (not so far fetched theory - it brings $), maybe because someone thought it'd just be a good idea.

Finally, just assuming that what i observe is true, how would you feel in his situation? How motivated would you be to continue in this system that not only doesnt help you but very obviously hurts the team's success?

It's my impression that we went away from a Rubio-centered offense pretty shortly after Ayton replaced Baynes in the lineup. The Rubio/Ayton P&R isn't effective because neither can shoot. The defense collapses and dares Rubio to shoot the mid-range. If he passes it up, the offense tends to re-set around a Booker or Oubre shot/drive. The coaching staff has just cut to the chase, essentially calling players' numbers on offense, since any P&R with Ayton is really just a setup for the ballhandler to score and Ayton to follow.

If Ayton could pop as effectively as Amare (let alone Frye), that would open things up for Ricky. But Rubio as creator was already pretty anemic before Ayton, since Baynes and Saric were themselves pretty ineffective from outside, and Kaminsky shied away so often. It was certainly better for Ricky since he had an open lane to work with (at least whenever the defense could be fooled into respecting our stretch bigs).

Bottom line: If a Rubio/Ayton P&R is going to work, one of them has to be able to shoot.

Well, unless Ayton can dunk it. But it is weird. He was a good midrange shooter in college and good from 3-10ft last year at 55.6%, but this year he is 44.2%. My guess is it has declined over time this year. I don't think he started off shooting poorly. He seemed to be making those earlier. But yeah, Baynes is over 60% from 3-10 ft, which is a bit odd, considering last year he was 44.4% from there. Baynes was also around 45% from 3 in October and November.

[bwgood77]

Rubio is playing injured.

Look at how Baynes played injured. It makes a huge fkn difference.

Rubio should be resting, but there isn't another starting caliber PG on the team and they're still with a chance of the playoffs.

He may be resting tomorrow.

Read on Twitter

[bwgood77]

Phx gets a nice extra rest day before this one. It feels like okc has been playing a game every other day for the last month. Adams and Noel are both playing but not 100%. Noel has a broken face and bum ankle but looked good last game. Adams has been pretty limited since Capela hocked checked how a while back. Ayton could have a big game of muscala gets minutes.

No injury for either side charm-

Spoiler:

You know, I used Dolly Castro a lot last year, and I think we had a good run with her. I remember posting this one...

Spoiler:

I guess you posting it gave you the win....you even got 8 And1s for the good luck charm you posted in our thread. Good work!

[ThunderBolt]

Phx gets a nice extra rest day before this one. It feels like okc has been playing a game every other day for the last month. Adams and Noel are both playing but not 100%. Noel has a broken face and bum ankle but looked good last game. Adams has been pretty limited since Capela hocked checked how a while back. Ayton could have a big game of muscala gets minutes.

No injury for either side charm-

Spoiler:

You know, I used Dolly Castro a lot last year, and I think we had a good run with her. I remember posting this one...

Spoiler:

I guess you posting it gave you the win....you even got 8 And1s for the good luck charm you posted in our thread. Good work!

It was a good health charm. I wouldn’t post a good luck charm for the thunder in another teams thread unless I want to get beat up. And, she’s uh, something else. Whew!

[LesGrossman]

Phx gets a nice extra rest day before this one. It feels like okc has been playing a game every other day for the last month. Adams and Noel are both playing but not 100%. Noel has a broken face and bum ankle but looked good last game. Adams has been pretty limited since Capela hocked checked how a while back. Ayton could have a big game of muscala gets minutes.

No injury for either side charm-

Spoiler:

You know, I used Dolly Castro a lot last year, and I think we had a good run with her. I remember posting this one...

Spoiler:

I guess you posting it gave you the win....you even got 8 And1s for the good luck charm you posted in our thread. Good work!

It was a good health charm. I wouldn’t post a good luck charm for the thunder in another teams thread unless I want to get beat up. And, she’s uh, something else. Whew!

Totally un PC and off topic observation: The beauty ideal in the USA seems to have become something completely different than in the corner of the world where i live.

[bwgood77]

You know, I used Dolly Castro a lot last year, and I think we had a good run with her. I remember posting this one...

Spoiler:

I guess you posting it gave you the win....you even got 8 And1s for the good luck charm you posted in our thread. Good work!

It was a good health charm. I wouldn’t post a good luck charm for the thunder in another teams thread unless I want to get beat up. And, she’s uh, something else. Whew!

Totally un PC and off topic observation: The beauty ideal in the USA seems to have become something completely different than in the corner of the world where i live.

She's a little thick and was in better shape a year ago which is why I didn't use her this year. I do typically prefer brunettes and maybe dark skin, but have come across a lot of nice looking blondes lately.

[KLEON]

Rubio is playing injured.

Look at how Baynes played injured. It makes a huge fkn difference.

Rubio should be resting, but there isn't another starting caliber PG on the team and they're still with a chance of the playoffs.

He may be resting tomorrow.

Read on Twitter

Everybody is getting injured. Who's next Monty?