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2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes

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If Suns get Chris Paul, who will be the 2nd leading scorer on the team?

Ayton
44
94%
Paul
3
6%
 
Total votes: 47

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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3981 » by alamin330 » Sun Nov 15, 2020 4:10 am

DirtyDez wrote:
Sunsdeuce wrote:
DirtyDez wrote:
Yes that’s what I’m saying. He wasn’t the wink link on one side of the ball.


When did Chris Paul win MVP? I must have forgot.


The MVP is a media voted award. It’s not proof of one player being better or more valuable than another.

My point is Paul was putting up elite offensive numbers while expending a ton of energy on defense. He was the most complete PG of this generation.

Like I say a 6’1 Lebron
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3982 » by cberry78 » Sun Nov 15, 2020 4:25 am

alamin330 wrote:
DirtyDez wrote:
Sunsdeuce wrote:
When did Chris Paul win MVP? I must have forgot.


The MVP is a media voted award. It’s not proof of one player being better or more valuable than another.

My point is Paul was putting up elite offensive numbers while expending a ton of energy on defense. He was the most complete PG of this generation.

Like I say a 6’1 Lebron

MIni-Lebron is already taken, sorry.

https://clipperholics.com/2012/11/15/king-james-crowns-a-mini-lebron-in-one-eric-bledsoe/
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3983 » by El Hespiritu » Sun Nov 15, 2020 5:54 am

Physically, Bledsoe makes a more legit mini-LeBald, indeed.

But when it comes to skillset, talent, IQ and leadership, Carlton Banks is a better reference.
Bledsoe is just a minor player in comparison with James and CP3.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3984 » by Slim Charless » Sun Nov 15, 2020 7:14 am

El Hespiritu wrote:Physically, Bledsoe makes a more legit mini-LeBald, indeed.

But when it comes to skillset, talent, IQ and leadership, Carlton Banks is a better reference.
Bledsoe is just a minor player in comparison with James and CP3.


Speaking of LeBron, getting CP3 obviously puts us in the driver's seat for when he becomes a FA again.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3985 » by El Hespiritu » Sun Nov 15, 2020 7:38 am

Man... you're pushing the expression 'wishful thinking' to new levels never reached before.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3986 » by Slim Charless » Sun Nov 15, 2020 7:44 am

I know. On a serious note though, Paul probably would help us sign some other vets-not named LeBron.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3987 » by nevetsov » Sun Nov 15, 2020 7:56 am

I could handle this if:

- Paul stays healthy (72 game season helps)
- we keep Saric and Carter
- we can find a 30mpg wing with the MLE
- we find a backup C for the BAE

Paul, Payne/ Carter
Booker, MLE/ Carter
Bridges, MLE
Johnson, Saric
Ayton, Saric/ BAE
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3988 » by El Hespiritu » Sun Nov 15, 2020 8:03 am

Not commenting around that yet... I'm a man of my word and Cholismo is actually a thing.
It's hard to keep my mouth closed about the whole stuff, I admit that.

I have some comments, memes and edits yet ready...

You all can expect a humoungous brick when the waters calm down and we all know the end of this story.

If any... we're making a hell of a noise.

The League was quiet and boring 'til all this Unmentionable thing started and now it's havoc, with Suns in the eye of the storm, all media focused on us (I use the term 'us' knowing that probably has a close Date of Expiry) and lots of NBA agents hiring hotel rooms at Phoenix to be next where action happens.

On the negative side... we can't do nothing else with the rest of guys.
We don't know what to do yet with expirings and Team Options, we don't know who to keep and who to dismiss...

Half of our roster must be feeling they are kinda NPCs in a video game waiting for the gamer to choose a character.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3989 » by SSOL » Sun Nov 15, 2020 9:05 am

TheLogician wrote:
Sunsdeuce wrote:Some of you are taking what this Flex kid tweets and says as the word of God. It’s literally some kid on twitter with about 1500 followers telling everyone what the chances are for a Chris Paul trade. Going through his timeline it’s endless Captain Obvious info. But sure keep eating up.


He's not hiding behind an anonymous Twitter handle, he's a real guy. I don't know if he has credible sources. Maybe he's just talking to Dudley or something. But ray ray is saying the same thing. Gambo has not ruled it out like he did with DLo. Let's stop antagonizing the guy and see where this goes. Be nice, guys.


I don’t understand you guys. I work in the industry and to get any nugget outside of the silo of the front office is a gift. However, when someone pokes their head out and offers something up, they get trolled to the point that the ROI just isn’t there. Personally, I hope Flex never tweets again, not because he has done anything wrong (assuming his sources are good with him leaking information), but because people in this forum and online really don’t deserve it.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3990 » by sunsbg » Sun Nov 15, 2020 9:28 am

Thankful for a short offseason and the drama probably ends in a week rather than a month.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3991 » by sunskerr » Sun Nov 15, 2020 10:18 am

Why do we have to give up such a nice package for Paul?

I know there are other people out there who realize that the reason Chris Paul is on the market is because the Thunder WANT OUT of his $40m+ contract. It seems like the Thunder should be the ones prepared to have to taper their expectations. It really doesn't seem like there are many suitors other than us out there for Paul at this moment, so there's no need to bid against ourselves.

Thunder get ONE asset in addition to the cap relief they get for moving Paul's contract. Not more than that. The offer should only increase according to the offers of other teams.

I will acknowledge overall he is better than Rubio. But that being said, Rubio is 5 years younger, and Paul is at that age where things can go south quickly (as we saw with Nash who declined quite a bit at the same age even prior to his Laker trade/career ending injury). Rubio is also a much better defender right now, according to RAPTOR. There is a chance Rubio is better overall next year just because Paul gets a year older, and an even higher chance the year after that.

I can only support a deal for Paul if there is a guarantee another decent player will sign here with him. Maybe we can actually make the playoffs with him instead of Rubio and Oubre. I don't freaking know. But I do know that the Thunder have been trying to move Paul since the moment they acquired him and nobody has bit so far. And that it's a pretty big **** ask to want a starting level point guard 5 years younger who just had his best ever year, and a 25 year old two way wing, let alone a draft pick on top of that, when you've made it clear from day 1 you wanted to move Paul because of his contract.

tl;dr no problem with Paul the player, but for a team that seems desperate to get out of his contract the Thunder seem to be a bit greedy.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3992 » by SSOL » Sun Nov 15, 2020 10:25 am

sunskerr wrote:Why do we have to give up such a nice package for Paul?

I know there are other people out there who realize that the reason Chris Paul is on the market is because the Thunder WANT OUT of his $40m+ contract. It seems like the Thunder should be the ones prepared to have to taper their expectations. It really doesn't seem like there are many suitors other than us out there for Paul at this moment, so there's no need to bid against ourselves.

Thunder get ONE asset in addition to the cap relief they get for moving Paul's contract. Not more than that. The offer should only increase according to the offers of other teams.

I will acknowledge overall he is better than Rubio. But that being said, Rubio is 5 years younger, and Paul is at that age where things can go south quickly (as we saw with Nash who declined quite a bit at the same age even prior to his Laker trade/career ending injury). Rubio is also a much better defender right now, according to RAPTOR. There is a chance Rubio is better overall next year just because Paul gets a year older, and an even higher chance the year after that.

I can only support a deal for Paul if there is a guarantee another decent player will sign here with him. Maybe we can actually make the playoffs with him instead of Rubio and Oubre. I don't freaking know. But I do know that the Thunder have been trying to move Paul since the moment they acquired him and nobody has bit so far. And that it's a pretty big **** ask to want a starting level point guard 5 years younger who just had his best ever year, and a 25 year old two way wing, let alone a draft pick on top of that, when you've made it clear from day 1 you wanted to move Paul because of his contract.


Because this isn’t fantasy basketball. The Thunder are not trying to move Paul because they “want out.” They are moving him because they are going into a rebuild which is the same reason why Donovan chose not to return to the team. Because they are going into a rebuild, Presti, who is magnificent, is trying to do right by Paul in finding him a destination he likes while acquiring assets that set the team up nicely going forward.

Additionally, can we stop acting like Nash’s skills decreased with age? The guy broke his leg in such a way that it was nearly impossible for him to recover.

Maybe make the playoffs with Paul? Chris Paul, at his current age, is one of the absolutely elite guards in the game. I’m really tired of the same people complaining about this franchise being stuck in mediocrity also complaining that a package for an elite star player is too lucrative.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3993 » by Blonde » Sun Nov 15, 2020 10:26 am

I got around to listening to the Solar Panel podcast with Flex. They made a comparison which I thought was interesting and that was the Heat acquiring Shaq in 04/05 season. Now of course Shaq was of a higher status at that point then Paul is now, but that’s not the point of the comparison. The point is that Wade, who was just starting to turn heads around the league, really got put on the map with the star power that Shaq brought. By the time Shaq left he was a tier 1 superstar. Of course they won a championship during that span and Suns probably won’t make the finals with CP3. But thinking of what this trade could mean for Booker, and to some extent Ayton, it could have a much bigger impact than you think. The alternative is you roll the dice and maybe miss the playoffs again and things start looking really bad when your star has now missed the playoffs for 7 straight years and your former #1 draft pick is up for a max extension. That doesn’t sound very palatable.

The other thing mentioned on the pod is that trade discussions might have reached the point of no return where is could look really bad to bring Oubre and Rubio back in after openly shopping them.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3994 » by sunskerr » Sun Nov 15, 2020 10:33 am

SSOL wrote:Because this isn’t fantasy basketball. The Thunder are not trying to move Paul because they “want out.” They are moving him because they are going into a rebuild which is the same reason why Donovan chose not to return to the team. Because they are going into a rebuild, Presti, who is magnificent, is trying to do right by Paul in finding him a destination he likes while acquiring assets that set the team up nicely going forward.

Additionally, can we stop acting like Nash’s skills decreased with age? The guy broke his leg in such a way that it was nearly impossible for him to recover.

Maybe make the playoffs with Paul? Chris Paul, at his current age, is one of the absolutely elite guards in the game. I’m really tired of the same people complaining about this franchise being stuck in mediocrity also complaining about a package for an elite star player is too lucrative.


What does fantasy basketball have to do with what I said? Absolutely nothing. You really can't draw the connection between "wanting out of his contract" and "wanting to rebuild"? That's literally the same thing. They want out so they can actually rebuild. Therefore the pressure is on them to get a deal.

And yes, Nash DID slow down post 2010 season. By his last year here he was averaging 12/10 and had no quickness at all.

And no, I don't think Chris Paul at the moment counts as elite beyond his reputation. He was an all-star level player for sure, but if you want to define his value as a player by "elite" status as a top 30 player then ok, you need to balance his value with his age (35) and contract ($40m+!!).

Why are you drooling over Sam Presti? The guy is a great GM for sure but that doesn't mean we have to lose a trade on purpose because he is a good GM.

Again, if there's no competition, then we don't need to fork out for Paul.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3995 » by SSOL » Sun Nov 15, 2020 10:46 am

sunskerr wrote:
SSOL wrote:Because this isn’t fantasy basketball. The Thunder are not trying to move Paul because they “want out.” They are moving him because they are going into a rebuild which is the same reason why Donovan chose not to return to the team. Because they are going into a rebuild, Presti, who is magnificent, is trying to do right by Paul in finding him a destination he likes while acquiring assets that set the team up nicely going forward.

Additionally, can we stop acting like Nash’s skills decreased with age? The guy broke his leg in such a way that it was nearly impossible for him to recover.

Maybe make the playoffs with Paul? Chris Paul, at his current age, is one of the absolutely elite guards in the game. I’m really tired of the same people complaining about this franchise being stuck in mediocrity also complaining about a package for an elite star player is too lucrative.


What does fantasy basketball have to do with what I said? Absolutely nothing. You really can't draw the connection between "wanting out of his contract" and "wanting to rebuild"? That's literally the same thing. They want out so they can actually rebuild. Therefore the pressure is on them to get a deal.

And yes, Nash DID slow down post 2010 season. By his last year here he was averaging 12/10 and had no quickness at all.

And no, I don't think Chris Paul at the moment counts as elite beyond his reputation. He was an all-star level player for sure, but if you want to define his value as a player by "elite" status as a top 30 player then ok, you need to balance his value with his age (35) and contract ($40m+!!).

Why are you drooling over Sam Presti? The guy is a great GM for sure but that doesn't mean we have to lose a trade on purpose because he is a good GM.

Again, if there's no competition, then we don't need to fork out for Paul.


It has to do with fantasy basketball because you have absolutely no concept of how these types of transactions actually work. Nor do you have a grasp on the off court benefits of such a move (this is a business). You are a fan looking at a screen and nothing more.

Presti acquired Paul to eventually move him, true. He was never going to be a long term fixture in OKC. However, that does not decrease his value. The guy took them into a tie for the 4-seed last season which was miraculous. Do you think Rubio would have done the same? Before you reply, the answer is no.

There is competition here in that Presti can also just wait until the trade deadline. He really has no pressure. If Paul doesn’t want to report (he will), then Presti can better position the team for a higher pick in the next draft. The leverage is with OKC.

At 35, Nash shot over 50% from the field, nearly 43% from three, 94% from the line and oh, played 81 games. Bye.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3996 » by sunskerr » Sun Nov 15, 2020 10:48 am

:lol: almost none of what you said is relevant or true beyond Paul having a nice season
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3997 » by SSOL » Sun Nov 15, 2020 10:51 am

You are absolutely just a fan, staring at a screen. Bye bye.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3998 » by sunskerr » Sun Nov 15, 2020 10:58 am

Are you ok friend?

Anyway, I could just as easily make a case for why we should trade for Paul (ex he is literally a better player than Rubio overall, and he could attract a player or two who could theoretically replace Oubre). But it wouldn't involve any vague notions of people not in favour of trading for him being "just fans and not understanding business" or whatever that's supposed to mean in the context of discussing a trade. Nor would it involve wanting to bend over for Sam Presti because Presti is "majestic", lol.

Go in peace.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#3999 » by Saberestar » Sun Nov 15, 2020 11:19 am

SSOL wrote:
sunskerr wrote:
SSOL wrote:Because this isn’t fantasy basketball. The Thunder are not trying to move Paul because they “want out.” They are moving him because they are going into a rebuild which is the same reason why Donovan chose not to return to the team. Because they are going into a rebuild, Presti, who is magnificent, is trying to do right by Paul in finding him a destination he likes while acquiring assets that set the team up nicely going forward.

Additionally, can we stop acting like Nash’s skills decreased with age? The guy broke his leg in such a way that it was nearly impossible for him to recover.

Maybe make the playoffs with Paul? Chris Paul, at his current age, is one of the absolutely elite guards in the game. I’m really tired of the same people complaining about this franchise being stuck in mediocrity also complaining about a package for an elite star player is too lucrative.


What does fantasy basketball have to do with what I said? Absolutely nothing. You really can't draw the connection between "wanting out of his contract" and "wanting to rebuild"? That's literally the same thing. They want out so they can actually rebuild. Therefore the pressure is on them to get a deal.

And yes, Nash DID slow down post 2010 season. By his last year here he was averaging 12/10 and had no quickness at all.

And no, I don't think Chris Paul at the moment counts as elite beyond his reputation. He was an all-star level player for sure, but if you want to define his value as a player by "elite" status as a top 30 player then ok, you need to balance his value with his age (35) and contract ($40m+!!).

Why are you drooling over Sam Presti? The guy is a great GM for sure but that doesn't mean we have to lose a trade on purpose because he is a good GM.

Again, if there's no competition, then we don't need to fork out for Paul.


It has to do with fantasy basketball because you have absolutely no concept of how these types of transactions actually work. Nor do you have a grasp on the off court benefits of such a move (this is a business). You are a fan looking at a screen and nothing more.

Presti acquired Paul to eventually move him, true. He was never going to be a long term fixture in OKC. However, that does not decrease his value. The guy took them into a tie for the 4-seed last season which was miraculous. Do you think Rubio would have done the same? Before you reply, the answer is no.

There is competition here in that Presti can also just wait until the trade deadline. He really has no pressure. If Paul doesn’t want to report (he will), then Presti can better position the team for a higher pick in the next draft. The leverage is with OKC.

At 35, Nash shot over 50% from the field, nearly 43% from three, 94% from the line and oh, played 81 games. Bye.

I agree with you about Presti having more leverage than some people think.

There were a lot of rumors about CP3 being traded just before the start of last season, but they never did it. Some people could not believe it. Presti can do the same this year and wait until the trade deadline or even to next summer...you know that Paul is gonna play as hard as he can with them, he is not demanding the trade officially.

And I like a lot that comparison with the 2004/05 Heat, I can really see the similarities with us IF we finally get CP3.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#4000 » by El Hespiritu » Sun Nov 15, 2020 11:41 am

Mmmh...

People can be very excited about getting Carlton and the hypothetical vets he can help to bring here... that's legit.
People can be unwilling to entirely disband a roster that was looking fine and with an undeniable margin to grow and that's legit as well.

I don't see the need to belittle nobody for defending one position of another.

Not a big deal, 'course... a bit of heated arguing are fine but let's try to be civil, please.
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