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2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes

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Would you trade Booker for Giannis if he'd re-sign, for a Rubio, Mikal, Cam, Giannis, Ayton lineup?

Yes
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No
29
59%
 
Total votes: 49

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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1801 » by Slim Charless » Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:28 am

bwgood77 wrote:
Saberestar wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Not that I know of. He did have knee tendinitis this past year but was ready to go and completely healthy a few months ago.

Bilateral knee tendinitis that needs around 6 months to make a full recovery is concerning to me.

Every player can get injured at any time, not a player's fault at all, but this injury can be more of a chronic problem that can appear multiple times during his career. In that case his value and potential decrease considerably.

I expect that the Suns medical staff will look closely at this injury if Kennard is available again in trade talks with the Suns. Woj said in February that the package for Kennard was Carter, Okobo and our first round pick (#10).


It can be a chronic issue but also may not be. However, the fact that it's in both knees is probably not a good sign. They decided to rest him to let them heal in late December and apparently he was cleared to go when the season got suspended...and as of 3 months ago he felt very healthy. This might be the longest break he's had in a long while...will probably be about a year.

Maybe not the best idea but if he was healthy I think he's a really good option. I just don't think we can probably get Gordon or Lauri for him, nor am I sure we would want Gordon and his salary. He does expire in 2 years though right when Ayton and Bridges are up so that's good. But Orlando would simply just want to get rid of him and have Oubre for a year and hope they can re-sign him. I don't know if with Isaac out it will make them want to keep Gordon or not...you'd think it might but they drafted a PF last year and also signed Al Farouq Aminu...and they could like Oubre at PF too...

This past year neither Gordon or Lauri were as good as Oubre though....but I do think both would be better in new places.

I don't really see us going after those guys though and it was rumored we were after Kennard and that was after he was injured.

One positive if he did get injured again, you can just let him go too if you think he's chronic, since his rookie deal ends after this year. Mentioning those lineups I did above, he'd probably be the primary initiator, and obviousl is a great shooter.


That's a tough call for Orlando. That unfortunate Issac injury really screwed them. I think they would've gotten rid of Gordon for sure, now idk. Too bad. I like their team if they had a good perimeter threat.

As to us a potential chronic double knee injury raises some major flags. Im fine with just letting our guys ride it out next year till the trade deadline. If we have to trade I disagree on the comp for Lauri- I feel thats even. Chicago still has to hire a coach to figure out what they wanna do with their whole team tho.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1802 » by Barkley6 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:10 am

Saberestar wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:I think if they want to control cost and also get value for Oubre while they likely still can get some value, they should consider the Oubre for Kennard swap if it's still available. Not because he is as good, but because Oubre's trade value will likely decrease the longer you hold him, they likely don't want to pay him what he commands, and letting him walk for cap space probably doesn't net you a player like Kennard, who vastly improved in his 3rd season with over 4 apg and shot 40% from 3. Booker was at 4.7 apg in year 3 and 38.3% from 3. From 2 pt range, Kennard's actually better in year 3, over 49% while Booker was at 46% (but of course Booker REALLY improved this part last year, despite the regression from 3). I'm not saying he's Booker or will become a player nearly as good as him, but in ways he is on the same trajectory and improving quickly.

Another reason to get Kennard is you likely control him for 4-5 years.

Would you trade #10 and Ty Jerome for Kennard?


Undoubtedly. Trade a player who won't get much burn and a pick in a very uncertain draft for a guy who can light it up off the bench and ensure that your superstar gets decent rest? NO BRAINER.

Even if Kennard's 16ppg production this season in limited action is a fluke, and he can get you 11ppg on 40% 3pt shooting you do that deal. It fills the biggest hole in our bench and gives us a pretty solid 10 man rotation (If we retain Baynes):

Rubio-Payne
Booker-Kennard
Bridges-Oubre
Johnson-Saric
Ayton-Baynes

That's a DEEP team.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1803 » by bwgood77 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:40 am

Saberestar wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:I think if they want to control cost and also get value for Oubre while they likely still can get some value, they should consider the Oubre for Kennard swap if it's still available. Not because he is as good, but because Oubre's trade value will likely decrease the longer you hold him, they likely don't want to pay him what he commands, and letting him walk for cap space probably doesn't net you a player like Kennard, who vastly improved in his 3rd season with over 4 apg and shot 40% from 3. Booker was at 4.7 apg in year 3 and 38.3% from 3. From 2 pt range, Kennard's actually better in year 3, over 49% while Booker was at 46% (but of course Booker REALLY improved this part last year, despite the regression from 3). I'm not saying he's Booker or will become a player nearly as good as him, but in ways he is on the same trajectory and improving quickly.

Another reason to get Kennard is you likely control him for 4-5 years.

Would you trade #10 and Ty Jerome for Kennard?


Probably not...I guess I'd have to wait and see who is there at 10, but rookie contracts are valuable, and I think there are a few players that would fit nicely. One mock just had us taking Haliburton with Vassell still on the board. If either of those are there, I take them.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1804 » by bwgood77 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:44 am

Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Saberestar wrote:Bilateral knee tendinitis that needs around 6 months to make a full recovery is concerning to me.

Every player can get injured at any time, not a player's fault at all, but this injury can be more of a chronic problem that can appear multiple times during his career. In that case his value and potential decrease considerably.

I expect that the Suns medical staff will look closely at this injury if Kennard is available again in trade talks with the Suns. Woj said in February that the package for Kennard was Carter, Okobo and our first round pick (#10).


It can be a chronic issue but also may not be. However, the fact that it's in both knees is probably not a good sign. They decided to rest him to let them heal in late December and apparently he was cleared to go when the season got suspended...and as of 3 months ago he felt very healthy. This might be the longest break he's had in a long while...will probably be about a year.

Maybe not the best idea but if he was healthy I think he's a really good option. I just don't think we can probably get Gordon or Lauri for him, nor am I sure we would want Gordon and his salary. He does expire in 2 years though right when Ayton and Bridges are up so that's good. But Orlando would simply just want to get rid of him and have Oubre for a year and hope they can re-sign him. I don't know if with Isaac out it will make them want to keep Gordon or not...you'd think it might but they drafted a PF last year and also signed Al Farouq Aminu...and they could like Oubre at PF too...

This past year neither Gordon or Lauri were as good as Oubre though....but I do think both would be better in new places.

I don't really see us going after those guys though and it was rumored we were after Kennard and that was after he was injured.

One positive if he did get injured again, you can just let him go too if you think he's chronic, since his rookie deal ends after this year. Mentioning those lineups I did above, he'd probably be the primary initiator, and obviousl is a great shooter.


That's a tough call for Orlando. That unfortunate Issac injury really screwed them. I think they would've gotten rid of Gordon for sure, now idk. Too bad. I like their team if they had a good perimeter threat.

As to us a potential chronic double knee injury raises some major flags. Im fine with just letting our guys ride it out next year till the trade deadline. If we have to trade I disagree on the comp for Lauri- I feel thats even. Chicago still has to hire a coach to figure out what they wanna do with their whole team tho.


I am not sure what you are saying regarding Lauri. I am not sure if Lauri is a good fit if we want guys with Ayton who can guard small ball lineups, but he has a lot of talent.

Oubre was the better player but Lauri likely has a lot more trade value because you control him for so long....with Oubre he could leave any team after a year. If a team is willing to really pay him, and start him, I think they'd have a good case, but I don't know what that team would be. That's partially why I mention Detroit. Chicago still has a lot of money in Otto Porter who was really good but he's been out for awhile.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1805 » by ImNotMcDiSwear » Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:06 am

bwgood77 wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
It can be a chronic issue but also may not be. However, the fact that it's in both knees is probably not a good sign. They decided to rest him to let them heal in late December and apparently he was cleared to go when the season got suspended...and as of 3 months ago he felt very healthy. This might be the longest break he's had in a long while...will probably be about a year.

Maybe not the best idea but if he was healthy I think he's a really good option. I just don't think we can probably get Gordon or Lauri for him, nor am I sure we would want Gordon and his salary. He does expire in 2 years though right when Ayton and Bridges are up so that's good. But Orlando would simply just want to get rid of him and have Oubre for a year and hope they can re-sign him. I don't know if with Isaac out it will make them want to keep Gordon or not...you'd think it might but they drafted a PF last year and also signed Al Farouq Aminu...and they could like Oubre at PF too...

This past year neither Gordon or Lauri were as good as Oubre though....but I do think both would be better in new places.

I don't really see us going after those guys though and it was rumored we were after Kennard and that was after he was injured.

One positive if he did get injured again, you can just let him go too if you think he's chronic, since his rookie deal ends after this year. Mentioning those lineups I did above, he'd probably be the primary initiator, and obviousl is a great shooter.


That's a tough call for Orlando. That unfortunate Issac injury really screwed them. I think they would've gotten rid of Gordon for sure, now idk. Too bad. I like their team if they had a good perimeter threat.

As to us a potential chronic double knee injury raises some major flags. Im fine with just letting our guys ride it out next year till the trade deadline. If we have to trade I disagree on the comp for Lauri- I feel thats even. Chicago still has to hire a coach to figure out what they wanna do with their whole team tho.


I am not sure what you are saying regarding Lauri. I am not sure if Lauri is a good fit if we want guys with Ayton who can guard small ball lineups, but he has a lot of talent.

Oubre was the better player but Lauri likely has a lot more trade value because you control him for so long....with Oubre he could leave any team after a year. If a team is willing to really pay him, and start him, I think they'd have a good case, but I don't know what that team would be. That's partially why I mention Detroit. Chicago still has a lot of money in Otto Porter who was really good but he's been out for awhile.


I don't see why a team would bring Oubre in if they're not doing so for the primary purpose of using him to contend next season, which is why I don't think the Pistons or the Bulls make much sense as landing spots.

I'm not really interested in Lauri ATM. Just not the type of player I'm looking to add.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1806 » by Slim Charless » Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:10 am

bwgood77 wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
It can be a chronic issue but also may not be. However, the fact that it's in both knees is probably not a good sign. They decided to rest him to let them heal in late December and apparently he was cleared to go when the season got suspended...and as of 3 months ago he felt very healthy. This might be the longest break he's had in a long while...will probably be about a year.

Maybe not the best idea but if he was healthy I think he's a really good option. I just don't think we can probably get Gordon or Lauri for him, nor am I sure we would want Gordon and his salary. He does expire in 2 years though right when Ayton and Bridges are up so that's good. But Orlando would simply just want to get rid of him and have Oubre for a year and hope they can re-sign him. I don't know if with Isaac out it will make them want to keep Gordon or not...you'd think it might but they drafted a PF last year and also signed Al Farouq Aminu...and they could like Oubre at PF too...

This past year neither Gordon or Lauri were as good as Oubre though....but I do think both would be better in new places.

I don't really see us going after those guys though and it was rumored we were after Kennard and that was after he was injured.

One positive if he did get injured again, you can just let him go too if you think he's chronic, since his rookie deal ends after this year. Mentioning those lineups I did above, he'd probably be the primary initiator, and obviousl is a great shooter.


That's a tough call for Orlando. That unfortunate Issac injury really screwed them. I think they would've gotten rid of Gordon for sure, now idk. Too bad. I like their team if they had a good perimeter threat.

As to us a potential chronic double knee injury raises some major flags. Im fine with just letting our guys ride it out next year till the trade deadline. If we have to trade I disagree on the comp for Lauri- I feel thats even. Chicago still has to hire a coach to figure out what they wanna do with their whole team tho.


I am not sure what you are saying regarding Lauri. I am not sure if Lauri is a good fit if we want guys with Ayton who can guard small ball lineups, but he has a lot of talent.

Oubre was the better player but Lauri likely has a lot more trade value because you control him for so long....with Oubre he could leave any team after a year. If a team is willing to really pay him, and start him, I think they'd have a good case, but I don't know what that team would be. That's partially why I mention Detroit. Chicago still has a lot of money in Otto Porter who was really good but he's been out for awhile.


My disagreement is the evaluation of Oubre<Lauri. I get that control of said player is important, but if another team is trading for him then why wouldn't they want to resign him? Oubre isn't in the position of turning down guaranteed money. If they were both on the same contract then Oubre is worth more due to him being proven to be the better player so far at least. So, if we agree with that point than we shouldn't have to add value to get what we both agree in the lesser of the 2. If anything I would say that a switch of our picks this year makes it even. The money is an issue but we can absorb OPJ or Saroksky if need be. I agree that Detroit on paper at least seems to be a great spot for him to be traded to.

As to Ayton I think he has been pretty good so far on defense and still has a lot more to improve on that side. His foot speed and ability to switch should(will) improve even more and give us hopefully more a quicker reacting defense. His rebounding needs improvement and someone of his athletic ability and size should be able to block more than 1.5 a game. Still, he's young and under Monty he should improve there.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1807 » by bwgood77 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:34 am

ImNotMcDiSwear wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
That's a tough call for Orlando. That unfortunate Issac injury really screwed them. I think they would've gotten rid of Gordon for sure, now idk. Too bad. I like their team if they had a good perimeter threat.

As to us a potential chronic double knee injury raises some major flags. Im fine with just letting our guys ride it out next year till the trade deadline. If we have to trade I disagree on the comp for Lauri- I feel thats even. Chicago still has to hire a coach to figure out what they wanna do with their whole team tho.


I am not sure what you are saying regarding Lauri. I am not sure if Lauri is a good fit if we want guys with Ayton who can guard small ball lineups, but he has a lot of talent.

Oubre was the better player but Lauri likely has a lot more trade value because you control him for so long....with Oubre he could leave any team after a year. If a team is willing to really pay him, and start him, I think they'd have a good case, but I don't know what that team would be. That's partially why I mention Detroit. Chicago still has a lot of money in Otto Porter who was really good but he's been out for awhile.


I don't see why a team would bring Oubre in if they're not doing so for the primary purpose of using him to contend next season, which is why I don't think the Pistons or the Bulls make much sense as landing spots.

I'm not really interested in Lauri ATM. Just not the type of player I'm looking to add.


I would say GS, because they have a trade exception. In the past I would have said he doesn't seem like a fit for their style, but they seem to try out different guys lately like Russell and Wiggins, so they might just give it a shot.

I don't know what other contender he would:

a) Help
b) The team has the trade assets that either we'd want or they want to trade

I can't see either LA team (Lakers would probably like to get him but they have no one I'd want who they'd trade...I guess maybe Caruso but they probably don't trade him.

Then the Clips likely wouldn't trade anyone we would want.

Denver - no

Utah, maybe but not sure who they'd trade for him

The thing is, a team HAS to be willing to pay him.

Miami, no

Toronto, no

Indy, no

Philly? They might want to unload a bad contract for an expiring and a guy that might fit better. Probably love to give us Horford for him.

Dallas? Probably not for anyone we'd want..they won't trade Kleber, Curry...maybe they'd trade Delon Wright but probably not.

Bucks...that might be the most likely but not sure for who..

Who do you have in mind?
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1808 » by King4Day » Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:41 am

Hindsight but did we really take Bender over Murray?! Ugg
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2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1809 » by Jdiddy701 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:48 am

King4Day wrote:Hindsight but did we really take Bender over Murray?! Ugg

Never understand how we can draft a player that averaged 5pts overseas. Blows my mind every time I think about it. Dude had bust written alllllllllll over him. So many people on this board made every excuse in the book for him, such a bad pick. Even to this day, people think he will pan out.

But yeah, Jamal Murray is a bad man. He’s fun to watch.


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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1810 » by Mjee » Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:21 am

King4Day wrote:Hindsight but did we really take Bender over Murray?! Ugg



Ryan Mcd you SUCK!!
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1811 » by AtheJ415 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:47 am

cberry78 wrote:
King4Day wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=09


These guys act like Oubre, Ayton, at least one of Cam/Bridges and picks isn't a deal that could net Giannis? Huh?
Name a team that can offer them something better...

Set aside the fact he's staying with the Bucks but I don't get why the hosts think a Suns offer surrounded by Ayton isn't competitive

Doesn't OKC have like 47 first-round picks over the next decade? I'm pretty sure that plus salary would trump the Suns' offer.


All of those picks they have are very late. I think there's an argument that SGA is more valuable than Ayton, but I think our role players we could offer would be better.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1812 » by Ghost of Kleine » Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:13 am

Read on Twitter
?s=09

Cam got snubbed bad! :nonono:
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1813 » by Revived » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:14 am

I mentioned it earlier when he was complete ass against the Mavs but I can see the Clippers wanting to move on from Paul George after his historically horrific game 7 performance against Denver. I think Kawhi and his uncle themselves may recommend it to Ballmer. Their the ones who demanded to trade for him anyway.

He's a great regular season player and would help us from a standpoint of getting into the playoffs. I hope this is something James Jones inquires and looks into.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1814 » by nevetsov » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:38 am

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=09

Cam got snubbed bad! :nonono:


Have literally never heard of Terrence Davis II.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1815 » by King4Day » Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:16 pm

Revived wrote:I mentioned it earlier when he was complete ass against the Mavs but I can see the Clippers wanting to move on from Paul George after his historically horrific game 7 performance against Denver. I think Kawhi and his uncle themselves may recommend it to Ballmer. Their the ones who demanded to trade for him anyway.

He's a great regular season player and would help us from a standpoint of getting into the playoffs. I hope this is something James Jones inquires and looks into.


I don't think LAC will give up on him yet. His value is at an all time low so even if they wanted to, it'd be hard to move him.
I expect them to make some minor moves to and run it back with a full camp and (hopefully) no interruption to the season.

Despite all of this, I don't expect Leonard to leave. He wants to be in LA. He knows he can build something special with the Clips AND he's got one of the best owners in the league.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1816 » by King4Day » Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:17 pm

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=09

Cam got snubbed bad! :nonono:


I think he just came on too late. He'd be on the 3rd team I'm sure. If he played the way he did in the bubble, from the start, he probably makes 2nd team.

I still hate that Zion is first team. Dude played 20 something games. How does that warrant any recognition at all?
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1817 » by King4Day » Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:35 pm

If Miami wins it all, that would cap off the Dragic trade nicely for them. They would have made good on trading their picks for him.
Fortunately we dealt it (for Bridges) before the value became garbage as it is now.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1818 » by Wilber85 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:40 pm

King4Day wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=09

Cam got snubbed bad! :nonono:


I think he just came on too late. He'd be on the 3rd team I'm sure. If he played the way he did in the bubble, from the start, he probably makes 2nd team.

I still hate that Zion is first team. Dude played 20 something games. How does that warrant any recognition at all?


Cam I don't think deserved it.. If he played like he did in the bubble yes, but he wasn't that great during the regular season.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1819 » by bwgood77 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:03 pm

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=09

Cam got snubbed bad! :nonono:


I don't pay too close attention to all other rookies so thought I'd check some all encompassing stats here just for a quick look without looking too much at stuff

FIC
Spoiler:
Floor Impact Counter): A formula to encompass all aspects of the box score into a single statistic. The intent of the statistic is similar to other efficiency stats, but assists, shot creation and offensive rebounding are given greater importance.
Formula: (Points + ORB. + 0.75 DRB + AST + STL + BLK –0.75 FGA – 0.375 FTA – TO – 0.5 PF)


Image

https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/stats/2020/Advanced_Stats/Qualified/fic/All/desc/1/Regular_Season?rookies=

PER (just ahead of Tyler Herro and PJ Washington here.

Image

https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/stats/2020/Advanced_Stats/Qualified/per/All/desc/1/Regular_Season?rookies=

ORTG he is 7th

DRTG he is 21st.

TS% he is 9th (but very close to 7th - .001 and .002 behind two guys ahead of him and the top 2 are Cs...so without the Cs very close to 5th..Zion being one ahead of him (mostly dunks)

https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/stats/2020/Advanced_Stats/Qualified/ts_pct/All/desc/1/Regular_Season?rookies=
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1820 » by bwgood77 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:18 pm

Revived wrote:I mentioned it earlier when he was complete ass against the Mavs but I can see the Clippers wanting to move on from Paul George after his historically horrific game 7 performance against Denver. I think Kawhi and his uncle themselves may recommend it to Ballmer. Their the ones who demanded to trade for him anyway.

He's a great regular season player and would help us from a standpoint of getting into the playoffs. I hope this is something James Jones inquires and looks into.


Kawhi was just about as bad....6-22 (27%)...George was 25%...a combined 10-38

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