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Cam Payne news and highlights

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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#21 » by Frank Lee » Thu Dec 24, 2020 7:53 pm

Haliburton will be the barometer for Smith, and to a certain degree , Payne. Thought we had the perfect set up to get Hali then sign woods and fill in the gap with Len or even Boogie. I’d love the slim Boog on this squad. Blah blah blah

Oh well. ChamPayne anyone? At times, he’s sparkly
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#22 » by WeekapaugGroove » Thu Dec 24, 2020 8:59 pm

I didn't watch enough pre suns Payne to know if this is new but his effort level is great. Dude is playing hard and because of that he's been a pretty good defender.

Who knows of the shooting will sustain but as long as he keeps playing hard on D and using quickness as an advantage on O he's probably keeping his rotation spot.

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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#23 » by Saberestar » Thu Dec 24, 2020 9:45 pm

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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#24 » by Qwigglez » Fri Dec 25, 2020 11:39 am

I'm really loving the energy so far as others have mentioned. He's got that Jevon Carter hustle, but has a lot more creativity offensively than Jevon does. I'm not sure it's possible for him to average over 10 a game throughout the entire season, but if he did... man that would be huge.
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#25 » by bwgood77 » Fri Dec 25, 2020 6:17 pm

So far so good with the 1 game sample outside of the bubble play which I only put so much relevance too given most team's motivations since we played 7 of 8 playoff teams....but I have stated that.

But solid here outside of that weird turnover where he threw it WAY over the guys head. Reminded me of Okobo's first game last year with 20 minutes where he scored 11 with 7 assists going 4-8 from the field, getting to the rim and hitting 2/3 from 3.

Hopefully Payne keeps composure going forward unlike Okobo who lost his minutes down the stretch with more mistakes and a declining ast/to ratio and 3pt % after earlier getting to the rim, an insane ast/to ratio and a solid 3pt % with nice D.

It would be really nice to have a young guy solidifying his hold on the backup PG spot for years going forward. I don't see him necessarily as a future starter but I never really count guys out for anything...

Though funny thing is if he was our rookie everyone would have given up on his 3 years ago, as he was worse than Jackson and Chriss and at leat as bad as Bender and Okobo in his first two years....but glad it appears he may be on his way to making a comeback.
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#26 » by Saberestar » Fri Dec 25, 2020 11:05 pm

bwgood77 wrote:So far so good with the 1 game sample outside of the bubble play which I only put so much relevance too given most team's motivations since we played 7 of 8 playoff teams....but I have stated that.

But solid here outside of that weird turnover where he threw it WAY over the guys head. Reminded me of Okobo's first game last year with 20 minutes where he scored 11 with 7 assists going 4-8 from the field, getting to the rim and hitting 2/3 from 3.

Hopefully Payne keeps composure going forward unlike Okobo who lost his minutes down the stretch with more mistakes and a declining ast/to ratio and 3pt % after earlier getting to the rim, an insane ast/to ratio and a solid 3pt % with nice D.

It would be really nice to have a young guy solidifying his hold on the backup PG spot for years going forward. I don't see him necessarily as a future starter but I never really count guys out for anything...

Though funny thing is if he was our rookie everyone would have given up on his 3 years ago, as he was worse than Jackson and Chriss and at leat as bad as Bender and Okobo in his first two years....but glad it appears he may be on his way to making a comeback.

Okobo was terrible in his first two seasons on the Suns. Payne was terrible in his first two seasons on the Thunder. Similar play, same result...out of the league (well, Payton played another season on the Bulls but you get the idea).

Now, IF Okobo improves a lot his game and he is good at 25/26 years old then he can make a comeback and play in the NBA again. That's what Cam Payne has done and that's why he is playing as a full time backup now and he probably will get a solid contract after this season. Kudos to him.

But it would be a bad idea to pay during two or three more years to a guy playing terrible basketball just waiting to see if he learns how to play the game.
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#27 » by bwgood77 » Sat Dec 26, 2020 1:02 am

Saberestar wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:So far so good with the 1 game sample outside of the bubble play which I only put so much relevance too given most team's motivations since we played 7 of 8 playoff teams....but I have stated that.

But solid here outside of that weird turnover where he threw it WAY over the guys head. Reminded me of Okobo's first game last year with 20 minutes where he scored 11 with 7 assists going 4-8 from the field, getting to the rim and hitting 2/3 from 3.

Hopefully Payne keeps composure going forward unlike Okobo who lost his minutes down the stretch with more mistakes and a declining ast/to ratio and 3pt % after earlier getting to the rim, an insane ast/to ratio and a solid 3pt % with nice D.

It would be really nice to have a young guy solidifying his hold on the backup PG spot for years going forward. I don't see him necessarily as a future starter but I never really count guys out for anything...

Though funny thing is if he was our rookie everyone would have given up on his 3 years ago, as he was worse than Jackson and Chriss and at leat as bad as Bender and Okobo in his first two years....but glad it appears he may be on his way to making a comeback.

Okobo was terrible in his first two seasons on the Suns. Payne was terrible in his first two seasons on the Thunder. Similar play, same result...out of the league (well, Payton played another season on the Bulls but you get the idea).

Now, IF Okobo improves a lot his game and he is good at 25/26 years old then he can make a comeback and play in the NBA again. That's what Cam Payne has done and that's why he is playing as a full time backup now and he probably will get a solid contract after this season. Kudos to him.

But it would be a bad idea to pay during two or three more years to a guy playing terrible basketball just waiting to see if he learns how to play the game.


I don't mind paying guys the minimum when they show some potential future skills. Okobo was probably better than Payne to start, but Payne was cut because he made a lot of money as a lotto pick. Okobo started well last year, but faded mid season on. He had a solid start with a high ast/to ratio, solid shooting, slashing and defense. He just started making mistakes and it kind of snowballed as it went on.

Payne seems to be playing with a lot of confidence though, so that's good, and we pay him peanuts and it's unguaranteed, but I think if he continues he may earn a minimum contract.
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#28 » by Saberestar » Sat Dec 26, 2020 7:23 am

bwgood77 wrote:
Saberestar wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:So far so good with the 1 game sample outside of the bubble play which I only put so much relevance too given most team's motivations since we played 7 of 8 playoff teams....but I have stated that.

But solid here outside of that weird turnover where he threw it WAY over the guys head. Reminded me of Okobo's first game last year with 20 minutes where he scored 11 with 7 assists going 4-8 from the field, getting to the rim and hitting 2/3 from 3.

Hopefully Payne keeps composure going forward unlike Okobo who lost his minutes down the stretch with more mistakes and a declining ast/to ratio and 3pt % after earlier getting to the rim, an insane ast/to ratio and a solid 3pt % with nice D.

It would be really nice to have a young guy solidifying his hold on the backup PG spot for years going forward. I don't see him necessarily as a future starter but I never really count guys out for anything...

Though funny thing is if he was our rookie everyone would have given up on his 3 years ago, as he was worse than Jackson and Chriss and at leat as bad as Bender and Okobo in his first two years....but glad it appears he may be on his way to making a comeback.

Okobo was terrible in his first two seasons on the Suns. Payne was terrible in his first two seasons on the Thunder. Similar play, same result...out of the league (well, Payton played another season on the Bulls but you get the idea).

Now, IF Okobo improves a lot his game and he is good at 25/26 years old then he can make a comeback and play in the NBA again. That's what Cam Payne has done and that's why he is playing as a full time backup now and he probably will get a solid contract after this season. Kudos to him.

But it would be a bad idea to pay during two or three more years to a guy playing terrible basketball just waiting to see if he learns how to play the game.


I don't mind paying guys the minimum when they show some potential future skills. Okobo was probably better than Payne to start, but Payne was cut because he made a lot of money as a lotto pick. Okobo started well last year, but faded mid season on. He had a solid start with a high ast/to ratio, solid shooting, slashing and defense. He just started making mistakes and it kind of snowballed as it went on.

Payne seems to be playing with a lot of confidence though, so that's good, and we pay him peanuts and it's unguaranteed, but I think if he continues he may earn a minimum contract.

Payne has already earned a minimum contract, he is making $2M this season. We are not waiving him by any means, we need him as a shot creator and ball handler.

If he continues playing well he probably will get a $12M/3 years contract, like Jevon Carter.
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#29 » by WeekapaugGroove » Sat Dec 26, 2020 2:35 pm

Shoot if Payne keeps playing exactly like he has so far as a Sun he'll get more than Carter and probably a deal more like Saric. Now I kind of doubt that would be with Phoenix but we have a long time to discuss that.

It's extremely likely his shooting regresses at some point, he's been like a 50% 3pt shooter with phoenix lol. But say that regresses to the mid to high 30% if he keeps playing hard and doing all the other stuff that's sustainable that's still a very rotation worthy guy.

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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#30 » by bwgood77 » Sat Dec 26, 2020 6:51 pm

Saberestar wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Saberestar wrote:Okobo was terrible in his first two seasons on the Suns. Payne was terrible in his first two seasons on the Thunder. Similar play, same result...out of the league (well, Payton played another season on the Bulls but you get the idea).

Now, IF Okobo improves a lot his game and he is good at 25/26 years old then he can make a comeback and play in the NBA again. That's what Cam Payne has done and that's why he is playing as a full time backup now and he probably will get a solid contract after this season. Kudos to him.

But it would be a bad idea to pay during two or three more years to a guy playing terrible basketball just waiting to see if he learns how to play the game.


I don't mind paying guys the minimum when they show some potential future skills. Okobo was probably better than Payne to start, but Payne was cut because he made a lot of money as a lotto pick. Okobo started well last year, but faded mid season on. He had a solid start with a high ast/to ratio, solid shooting, slashing and defense. He just started making mistakes and it kind of snowballed as it went on.

Payne seems to be playing with a lot of confidence though, so that's good, and we pay him peanuts and it's unguaranteed, but I think if he continues he may earn a minimum contract.

Payne has already earned a minimum contract, he is making $2M this season. We are not waiving him by any means, we need him as a shot creator and ball handler.

If he continues playing well he probably will get a $12M/3 years contract, like Jevon Carter.


I don't see anyone else paying him, but we can't pay him more than the minimum next offseason I don't think since our cap # is $127 million.

I don't think we will have bird rights to sign him over the cap...I think we would have to give him the minimum.

Though I don't see him turning that down barring a lot bigger offer given the opportunity he has been given and being cut 3 times, and he also probably earned quite a bit in his first 2-3 years being on a decent rookie contract.

Not sure why we'd offer him more if we could with no teams needing backup PGs..many have 3+ and we will have another rookie class coming in. This year's class was big too with not only the 3 lottery guys but Maxey, Maledon and others.

I think he looks good this one game and did in the bubble but I will only put so much stock in such a small sample size. But he will get a lot more opportunity to play a lot since we don't have other PGs unlike last year where people like Jerome and Okobo and sometimes Carter would get yanked quickly so couldn't get that rythmn while he can.
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#31 » by bwgood77 » Sat Dec 26, 2020 6:54 pm

WeekapaugGroove wrote:Shoot if Payne keeps playing exactly like he has so far as a Sun he'll get more than Carter and probably a deal more like Saric. Now I kind of doubt that would be with Phoenix but we have a long time to discuss that.

It's extremely likely his shooting regresses at some point, he's been like a 50% 3pt shooter with phoenix lol. But say that regresses to the mid to high 30% if he keeps playing hard and doing all the other stuff that's sustainable that's still a very rotation worthy guy.

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Can we pay him more than the minimum given we will be at like $127 million and well over the cap? We don't have bird rights to give him a bigger contract to go over do we? Or does that only come in play if you want to sign ANOTHER free agent (being under the cap prior to signing him) and THEN going over the cap to sign him?

I'm surprised many backup PGs get too much more than the minimum. Like Melton, Tyus Jones, etc...though I think those were with the same team who has a rookie starting PG, so not as bad. And the Kings gave Joseph a lot I think.
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#32 » by phx#7 » Sat Dec 26, 2020 7:27 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:Shoot if Payne keeps playing exactly like he has so far as a Sun he'll get more than Carter and probably a deal more like Saric. Now I kind of doubt that would be with Phoenix but we have a long time to discuss that.

It's extremely likely his shooting regresses at some point, he's been like a 50% 3pt shooter with phoenix lol. But say that regresses to the mid to high 30% if he keeps playing hard and doing all the other stuff that's sustainable that's still a very rotation worthy guy.

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Can we pay him more than the minimum given we will be at like $127 million and well over the cap? We don't have bird rights to give him a bigger contract to go over do we? Or does that only come in play if you want to sign ANOTHER free agent (being under the cap prior to signing him) and THEN going over the cap to sign him?

I'm surprised many backup PGs get too much more than the minimum. Like Melton, Tyus Jones, etc...though I think those were with the same team who has a rookie starting PG, so not as bad. And the Kings gave Joseph a lot I think.


Suns haven't used their BAE yet and they'll still be able to use the MLE. If he outplays that we should at least be in for a good year.
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#33 » by lilfishi22 » Sat Dec 26, 2020 7:30 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:Shoot if Payne keeps playing exactly like he has so far as a Sun he'll get more than Carter and probably a deal more like Saric. Now I kind of doubt that would be with Phoenix but we have a long time to discuss that.

It's extremely likely his shooting regresses at some point, he's been like a 50% 3pt shooter with phoenix lol. But say that regresses to the mid to high 30% if he keeps playing hard and doing all the other stuff that's sustainable that's still a very rotation worthy guy.

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Can we pay him more than the minimum given we will be at like $127 million and well over the cap? We don't have bird rights to give him a bigger contract to go over do we? Or does that only come in play if you want to sign ANOTHER free agent (being under the cap prior to signing him) and THEN going over the cap to sign him?

I'm surprised many backup PGs get too much more than the minimum. Like Melton, Tyus Jones, etc...though I think those were with the same team who has a rookie starting PG, so not as bad. And the Kings gave Joseph a lot I think.

Depends how well he plays. We have his early Bird rights to give him a max of 175% of his current salary while being over the cap. At his current salary of just under $2m, that makes it around $3.5m which is a little under what Carter got.

I suppose we do have the MLE
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#34 » by bwgood77 » Sat Dec 26, 2020 7:55 pm

phx#7 wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:Shoot if Payne keeps playing exactly like he has so far as a Sun he'll get more than Carter and probably a deal more like Saric. Now I kind of doubt that would be with Phoenix but we have a long time to discuss that.

It's extremely likely his shooting regresses at some point, he's been like a 50% 3pt shooter with phoenix lol. But say that regresses to the mid to high 30% if he keeps playing hard and doing all the other stuff that's sustainable that's still a very rotation worthy guy.

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Can we pay him more than the minimum given we will be at like $127 million and well over the cap? We don't have bird rights to give him a bigger contract to go over do we? Or does that only come in play if you want to sign ANOTHER free agent (being under the cap prior to signing him) and THEN going over the cap to sign him?

I'm surprised many backup PGs get too much more than the minimum. Like Melton, Tyus Jones, etc...though I think those were with the same team who has a rookie starting PG, so not as bad. And the Kings gave Joseph a lot I think.


Suns haven't used their BAE yet and they'll still be able to use the MLE. If he outplays that we should at least be in for a good year.


Oh yeah. I guess he could get some of that. But we also have no idea how he will play the next 71 games...1 down though and pretty good. I don't imagine much of a market though, but I guess you never know.

Josh Jackson had a nice first game as well...but he makes a lot more.
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#35 » by Saberestar » Sat Dec 26, 2020 8:41 pm

lilfishi22 wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:Shoot if Payne keeps playing exactly like he has so far as a Sun he'll get more than Carter and probably a deal more like Saric. Now I kind of doubt that would be with Phoenix but we have a long time to discuss that.

It's extremely likely his shooting regresses at some point, he's been like a 50% 3pt shooter with phoenix lol. But say that regresses to the mid to high 30% if he keeps playing hard and doing all the other stuff that's sustainable that's still a very rotation worthy guy.

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Can we pay him more than the minimum given we will be at like $127 million and well over the cap? We don't have bird rights to give him a bigger contract to go over do we? Or does that only come in play if you want to sign ANOTHER free agent (being under the cap prior to signing him) and THEN going over the cap to sign him?

I'm surprised many backup PGs get too much more than the minimum. Like Melton, Tyus Jones, etc...though I think those were with the same team who has a rookie starting PG, so not as bad. And the Kings gave Joseph a lot I think.

Depends how well he plays. We have his early Bird rights to give him a max of 175% of his current salary while being over the cap. At his current salary of just under $2m, that makes it around $3.5m which is a little under what Carter got.

I suppose we do have the MLE

Yeah, we will have different options to pay him much more than the minimun, that will not be a problem.
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#36 » by Saberestar » Sat Dec 26, 2020 8:44 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
phx#7 wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Can we pay him more than the minimum given we will be at like $127 million and well over the cap? We don't have bird rights to give him a bigger contract to go over do we? Or does that only come in play if you want to sign ANOTHER free agent (being under the cap prior to signing him) and THEN going over the cap to sign him?

I'm surprised many backup PGs get too much more than the minimum. Like Melton, Tyus Jones, etc...though I think those were with the same team who has a rookie starting PG, so not as bad. And the Kings gave Joseph a lot I think.


Suns haven't used their BAE yet and they'll still be able to use the MLE. If he outplays that we should at least be in for a good year.


Oh yeah. I guess he could get some of that. But we also have no idea how he will play the next 71 games...1 down though and pretty good. I don't imagine much of a market though, but I guess you never know.

Josh Jackson had a nice first game as well...but he makes a lot more.

Good backup PGs always have a place in the league.

A lot of teams are paying their backup PGs over $3.5M per year. I can not imagine Payne playing well and not getting at least that money.
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#37 » by bwgood77 » Sat Dec 26, 2020 9:00 pm

Saberestar wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
phx#7 wrote:
Suns haven't used their BAE yet and they'll still be able to use the MLE. If he outplays that we should at least be in for a good year.


Oh yeah. I guess he could get some of that. But we also have no idea how he will play the next 71 games...1 down though and pretty good. I don't imagine much of a market though, but I guess you never know.

Josh Jackson had a nice first game as well...but he makes a lot more.

Good backup PGs always have a place in the league.

A lot of teams are paying their backup PGs over $3.5M per year. I can not imagine Payne playing well and not getting at least that money.


Yeah, if he plays well I guess that makes sense. That's about what Derrick White and TJ McConnell make. Carter got more than I expected too.
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#38 » by WeekapaugGroove » Sat Dec 26, 2020 10:23 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
Saberestar wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Oh yeah. I guess he could get some of that. But we also have no idea how he will play the next 71 games...1 down though and pretty good. I don't imagine much of a market though, but I guess you never know.

Josh Jackson had a nice first game as well...but he makes a lot more.

Good backup PGs always have a place in the league.

A lot of teams are paying their backup PGs over $3.5M per year. I can not imagine Payne playing well and not getting at least that money.


Yeah, if he plays well I guess that makes sense. That's about what Derrick White and TJ McConnell make. Carter got more than I expected too.
Derrick White just signed a 4yr 73m extension.



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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#39 » by bwgood77 » Sat Dec 26, 2020 10:48 pm

WeekapaugGroove wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Saberestar wrote:Good backup PGs always have a place in the league.

A lot of teams are paying their backup PGs over $3.5M per year. I can not imagine Payne playing well and not getting at least that money.


Yeah, if he plays well I guess that makes sense. That's about what Derrick White and TJ McConnell make. Carter got more than I expected too.
Derrick White just signed a 4yr 73m extension.



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Yeah, I guess I was looking at current salaries. That seems like a bit much for him.
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Re: Cam Payne news and highlights 

Post#40 » by WeekapaugGroove » Sun Dec 27, 2020 1:57 am

bwgood77 wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Yeah, if he plays well I guess that makes sense. That's about what Derrick White and TJ McConnell make. Carter got more than I expected too.
Derrick White just signed a 4yr 73m extension.



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Yeah, I guess I was looking at current salaries. That seems like a bit much for him.
I thought so too and I generally like White as a player.

You have to set rookie scale contracts aside when doing price comps for a pending FA because they are always going to look bargains for rotation guys. If you remove those and the ring chasers that gives a much cleaner look at the market and the market for a solid backup is right around or just below the MLE.

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