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GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD

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GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#1 » by Ghost of Kleine » Mon Sep 28, 2020 2:39 am

This is my big board for the 2020 nba draft (per request). In this big board, I'll list below the prospects which I believe will make the Rookie Team/ which are long term players/ which prospects in time have potential to become top 10 players from this draft.
( core player= potential franchise cornerstone prospect).
( fringe rotation = potential starter, But occasionally 2nd unit, Or general rotation as needed).
- high end Ultimate outcome
.
- Low end outcome.

1- James Wiseman
( Long term core starter).
Anthony Davis/ Hassan Whiteside

2- La Melo Ball
( Long term core starter).
Bigger Jason Williams/ Shaun Livingston

3- Oneyka Okungwu
(Long term core starter).
Bam Adebayo
/ Bismack biyombo


4- Devin Vassell
( Long term rotation player).
Robert Covington/ Danny Green


5- Obi Toppin
( Long term core starter).
Amare Stoudemire
/ more athletic Carlos Boozer with a 3 point shot.

6- Killian Hayes
( Long term core starter).
De Angelo Russell
/ Taller Jay Williams/ Tony Parker

7- Anthony Edwards
( Long term rotation player/ starter).
Victor Oladipo/ Cory Maggette

8- Isaac Okoro
( long term rotation player/ core player).
Jimmy Butler/ Justice Winslow

9- Tyreese Haliburton
( Long term rotation player/ starter).
Lonzo Ball/ Dejounte Murray

10- Grant Riller
( Long term/ fringe starter/ core player).
Fred Van Vleet/ Mike Bibby/ Marcus Thornton

11- Aleksev Pokusevski
( Long term starter/ fringe core player).
Andrei Kirilenko/ Anorexic Keith Van Horn


12- Deni Avdija
( Long term/ Starter/ Rotation player).
Could become a core player, But it's highly dependent upon his shooting progression.
worse shooting Gordon Hayward/ Hedo Turkgolu.


13- Kira Lewis
( Long term/ rotation/ fringe starter).
Dennis Schroder/ Darren Collison.


14- Tyrell Terry
( Long term/ starter/ rotation player).
Trae Young/ Seth Curry


15- Jalen Smith
( Long term/ fringe rotation/ Journeyman).
Young Serge Ibaka/ Larry Sanders/ PJ Brown

16- Aaron Nesmith
( Long term/ fringe rotation/ core player).
Allan Houston/ Alec Burks

17- Tyler Bey
( long term/ Fringe starter/ Journeyman).
Bigger Matisse Thybulle/ Andre Roberson

18- Precious Achiuwa
( Long term/ fringe starter/ rotation player).
Bigger Jerami Grant/ More agile Montrezl Harrell

19- Saddiq Bey
( Long term/ fringe starter/ Journeyman). He'll have to improve upon his footwork and mobility to become a solid starter/ core player.
Bigger Buddy Hield/ Much better 3 point shooting Thaddeus Young.

20- Cole Anthony
( Long term/ rotation player/ starter). Dependant upon his shooting percentages/ decision making improving.
Jamal Murray/ Jeryyd Bayless

21- Patrick Williams
( Long term/ fringe starter/ rotation/ Journeyman).
Paul Milsap/ Patrick Patterson

22- Tyreese Maxey
( Long/ short term- Dependant upon his shooting progression/ Journeyman).
Pat Beverly- Lou Williams combo
/ Ish Smith or Rodney Stuckey.

23- Daniel Oturu
( Long / short term bench rotation Big/ possible Journeyman).
Jamal Magloire/ Al Jefferson or better offensive Clint Capela.

24- RJ Hampton
( Fringe rotation player/ possible rotation player depending upon his shooting improvements)?
Better OJ Mayo/ Frank Ntilikina

25- Reggie Perry
( Fringe starter/ rotation energy big/ Journeyman- Depending upon his defensive improvement/ in game awareness).
Less explosive Bam Adebayo
/ More powerful Jamychal Green


26- Malachi Flynn
( Long term/short term potential journeyman backup guard with possible fringe starter potential).
Steve Nash IQ, playmaking, Van Vleet- defense and metrics
/ Austin Rivers- Luke Ridenour

27- Paul Reed
(Long/ short term potential depending upon his offensive progression and ballhandling improvement / Backup Journeyman defensive big).
Jerami Grant/ Pascal Siakim ultimate ceiling
/ Brice Johnson/ Torrey Craig

28- Xavier Tillman
( Long term/ Backup big / rotation potential due to his advanced defensive playmaking skillset and high IQ). He makes all the right plays defensively, and is an advanced passer.
A mix of Al Horford and PJ Tucker
/ Better defensive, smarter Richaun Holmes.

29- Tre Jones
( Long term backup guard/ Journeyman value glue player, Mainly due to his elite defensive skillset). He's just super solid as they come for backup guards.
Mike Conley/ Tyus Jones.

30- Jaden McDaniels
( 50/50High potential/ high risk potential starter/ core player, Or could easily bust depending upon motor and work ethic! But potential is sky high).
Jonathan Isaac-Brandon Ingram Rashard Lewis/ Chris Singleton/ Marvin Williams- Thon Makur.

31- Vernon Carey
( Long term/short term Bench big/ possible rotation player). Dependant upon his conditioning/ weight management/ mobility)?
Bigger more mobile Zach Randolph/ Kennedy Meeks- less athletic Derrick Coleman

All Rookie 1st Team
- Tyreese Haliburton.
- Anthony Edwards.
- Isaac Okoro.
- Obi Toppin.
- James Wiseman.

All Rookie 2nd Team
- Lamelo Ball.
- Killian Hayes.
- Devin Vassell.
- Deni Avdija.
- Oneyka Okungwu.

NBA All Rookie 3rd team
- Cole Anthony.
- RJ Hampton.
- Tyler Bey.
- Reggie Perry.
- Daniel Oturu.

Top 10 prospects ( in 5 years)
1- James Wiseman.
2- Tyreese Haliburton.
3- Isaac Okoro.
4- Cole Anthony.
5- Devin Vassell.
6- Killian Hayes.
7- Grant Riller.
8- Precious Achiuwa.
9- Tyrell Terry.
10- Deni Avdija.
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Re: GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#2 » by Blonde » Mon Sep 28, 2020 3:43 am

I appreciate the effort put into this. I’ll probably be updating my own board in a few weeks. I’m guessing you just forgot to put Deni in there? I’m surprised that you are so high on the centers, but Wiseman and Okongwu do seem like some of the safer bets in the class to at least be rotation players.

The actual big board seems pretty conservative, but the players comps are a little outrageous. Grant Riller’s floor being Mike Bibby seems.... ambitious to say the least. Haliburton having the ceiling of Lonzo does not interest me at all, but a floor of Dejounte? I view them as pretty much equal players right now. I guess you just view Hali as a safe bet to be lower end starting PG which is fair.
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Re: GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#3 » by Ghost of Kleine » Mon Sep 28, 2020 4:31 am

Blonde wrote:I appreciate the effort put into this. I’ll probably be updating my own board in a few weeks. I’m guessing you just forgot to put Deni in there? I’m surprised that you are so high on the centers, but Wiseman and Okongwu do seem like some of the safer bets in the class to at least be rotation players.

The actual big board seems pretty conservative, but the players comps are a little outrageous. Grant Riller’s floor being Mike Bibby seems.... ambitious to say the least. Haliburton having the ceiling of Lonzo does not interest me at all, but a floor of Dejounte? I view them as pretty much equal players right now. I guess you just view Hali as a safe bet to be lower end starting PG which is fair.


Did I forget Deni??? My bad man!That's crazy! :nonono: I'll correct that right away. As for Rillers' floor being Bibby, You're right, That's his other comp'd ceiling! I need to proofread my post better as I missed a few key errors. His floor was supposed to read Marcus Thornton. But my phone has been having a few issues wherein it's been randomly reloading the page and deleting my content, So I rushed submitting it, In fear of potentially having to restart again for the 3rd time! :banghead:As for being high on centers, I have him #1 only due to the fact that this draft is so very shallow on high end talent, And Wisemans' upside due to his incredible size, athleticism, Monster wingspan ( 7'6) :o And his mobility have him as having the highest available upside in the draft. I did this board primarily based upon where i'd rank the prospects in terms of value/upside. Bu thank you for pointing the errors out to me man! :thumbsup: I appreciate it.
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Re: GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#4 » by DirtyDez » Mon Sep 28, 2020 5:19 am

Is Riller the oldest? That’s our guy...
fromthetop321 wrote:I got Lebron number 1, he is also leading defensive player of the year. Curry's game still reminds me of Jeremy Lin to much.
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Re: GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#5 » by Banana Milk » Mon Sep 28, 2020 2:47 pm

Gok, do you not rate Josh Green highly or was it an oversight?
Looks like a great athlete, strong, good size with great wingspan and huge hands making him a plus defender and potential to be a solid 3&D.
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Re: GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#6 » by bwgood77 » Mon Sep 28, 2020 6:07 pm

Spoiler:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:This is my big board for the 2020 nba draft (per request). In this big board, I'll list below the prospects which I believe will make the Rookie Team/ which are long term players/ which prospects in time have potential to become top 10 players from this draft.
( core player= potential franchise cornerstone prospect).
( fringe rotation = potential starter, But occasionally 2nd unit, Or general rotation as needed).
- high end Ultimate outcome
.
- Low end outcome.

1- James Wiseman
( Long term core starter).
Anthony Davis/ Hassan Whiteside

2- La Melo Ball
( Long term core starter).
Bigger Jason Williams/ Shaun Livingston

3- Oneyka Okungwu
(Long term core starter).
Bam Adebayo
/ Bismack biyombo


4- Devin Vassell
( Long term rotation player).
Robert Covington/ Danny Green


5- Obi Toppin
( Long term core starter).
Amare Stoudemire
/ more athletic Carlos Boozer with a 3 point shot.

6- Killian Hayes
( Long term core starter).
De Angelo Russell
/ Taller Jay Williams/ Tony Parker

7- Anthony Edwards
( Long term rotation player/ starter).
Victor Oladipo/ Cory Maggette

8- Isaac Okoro
( long term rotation player/ core player).
Jimmy Butler/ Justice Winslow

9- Tyreese Haliburton
( Long term rotation player/ starter).
Lonzo Ball/ Dejounte Murray

10- Grant Riller
( Long term/ fringe starter/ core player).
Fred Van Vleet/ Mike Bibby/ Marcus Thornton

11- Aleksev Pokusevski
( Long term starter/ fringe core player).
Andrei Kirilenko/ Anorexic Keith Van Horn


12- Deni Avdija
( Long term/ Starter/ Rotation player).
Could become a core player, But it's highly dependent upon his shooting progression.
worse shooting Gordon Hayward/ Hedo Turkgolu.


13- Kira Lewis
( Long term/ rotation/ fringe starter).
Dennis Schroder/ Darren Collison.


14- Tyrell Terry
( Long term/ starter/ rotation player).
Trae Young/ Seth Curry


15- Jalen Smith
( Long term/ fringe rotation/ Journeyman).
Young Serge Ibaka/ Larry Sanders/ PJ Brown

16- Aaron Nesmith
( Long term/ fringe rotation/ core player).
Allan Houston/ Alec Burks

17- Tyler Bey
( long term/ Fringe starter/ Journeyman).
Bigger Matisse Thybulle/ Andre Roberson

18- Precious Achiuwa
( Long term/ fringe starter/ rotation player).
Bigger Jerami Grant/ More agile Montrezl Harrell

19- Saddiq Bey
( Long term/ fringe starter/ Journeyman). He'll have to improve upon his footwork and mobility to become a solid starter/ core player.
Bigger Buddy Hield/ Much better 3 point shooting Thaddeus Young.

20- Cole Anthony
( Long term/ rotation player/ starter). Dependant upon his shooting percentages/ decision making improving.
Jamal Murray/ Jeryyd Bayless

21- Patrick Williams
( Long term/ fringe starter/ rotation/ Journeyman).
Paul Milsap/ Patrick Patterson

22- Tyreese Maxey
( Long/ short term- Dependant upon his shooting progression/ Journeyman).
Pat Beverly- Lou Williams combo
/ Ish Smith or Rodney Stuckey.

23- Daniel Oturu
( Long / short term bench rotation Big/ possible Journeyman).
Jamal Magloire/ Al Jefferson or better offensive Clint Capela.

24- RJ Hampton
( Fringe rotation player/ possible rotation player depending upon his shooting improvements)?
Better OJ Mayo/ Frank Ntilikina

25- Reggie Perry
( Fringe starter/ rotation energy big/ Journeyman- Depending upon his defensive improvement/ in game awareness).
Less explosive Bam Adebayo
/ More powerful Jamychal Green


26- Malachi Flynn
( Long term/short term potential journeyman backup guard with possible fringe starter potential).
Steve Nash IQ, playmaking, Van Vleet- defense and metrics
/ Austin Rivers- Luke Ridenour

27- Paul Reed
(Long/ short term potential depending upon his offensive progression and ballhandling improvement / Backup Journeyman defensive big).
Jerami Grant/ Pascal Siakim ultimate ceiling
/ Brice Johnson/ Torrey Craig

28- Xavier Tillman
( Long term/ Backup big / rotation potential due to his advanced defensive playmaking skillset and high IQ). He makes all the right plays defensively, and is an advanced passer.
A mix of Al Horford and PJ Tucker
/ Better defensive, smarter Richaun Holmes.

29- Tre Jones
( Long term backup guard/ Journeyman value glue player, Mainly due to his elite defensive skillset). He's just super solid as they come for backup guards.
Mike Conley/ Tyus Jones.

30- Jaden McDaniels
( 50/50High potential/ high risk potential starter/ core player, Or could easily bust depending upon motor and work ethic! But potential is sky high).
Jonathan Isaac-Brandon Ingram Rashard Lewis/ Chris Singleton/ Marvin Williams- Thon Makur.

31- Vernon Carey
( Long term/short term Bench big/ possible rotation player). Dependant upon his conditioning/ weight management/ mobility)?
Bigger more mobile Zach Randolph/ Kennedy Meeks- less athletic Derrick Coleman

All Rookie 1st Team
- Tyreese Haliburton.
- Anthony Edwards.
- Isaac Okoro.
- Obi Toppin.
- James Wiseman.

All Rookie 2nd Team
- Lamelo Ball.
- Killian Hayes.
- Devin Vassell.
- Deni Avdija.
- Oneyka Okungwu.

NBA All Rookie 3rd team
- Cole Anthony.
- RJ Hampton.
- Tyler Bey.
- Reggie Perry.
- Daniel Oturu.

Top 10 prospects ( in 5 years)
1- James Wiseman.
2- Tyreese Haliburton.
3- Isaac Okoro.
4- Cole Anthony.
5- Devin Vassell.
6- Killian Hayes.
7- Grant Riller.
8- Precious Achiuwa.
9- Tyrell Terry.
10- Deni Avdija.


Thanks! Will be interested to see how the big board changes when you do it from a Suns perspective.
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Re: GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#7 » by Ghost of Kleine » Mon Sep 28, 2020 6:17 pm

Banana Milk wrote:Gok, do you not rate Josh Green highly or was it an oversight?
Looks like a great athlete, strong, good size with great wingspan and huge hands making him a plus defender and potential to be a solid 3&D.



I actually love his defensive potential, His athleticism, his nba pedigree, his high IQ. And And His shooting metrics seem to be getting better somewhat too. But the reasons that I don't have him higher are primarily due to:
- His peculiar low efficiency for scoring around the rim ( mainly due to poor touch, And poor ball control as he's loading up around the rim).

https://hashtagbasketball.com/nba-draft/content/everything-you-need-to-know-about-josh-green
This simple playmaking from Green is an unfortunate necessity in his game right now due to his ineffectiveness at the rim. Despite being an excellent straight-line driver, Green only scored .786 PPP (8th percentile) around the rim. His touch is inconsistent, and he actively avoids finishing with his left hand.

Green’s driving ability and body control are impressive, but if he continues to try to finish similarly to the below clips, he will continue to struggle. In both clips, Green does a great job of initially beating his man off the dribble. He proceeds to alter his body to use his right hand instead of his left. The result is two off-balance shots that have no chance of going in.


https://vimeo.com/455105094
( bad layup attempt blocked)again due to lack of control, Touch for finishing around the rim.

https://vimeo.com/455104954
( bad shot selection) mainly due to lack of ISO scoring ability from poor ball handling abilities.

- Also I have been hearing from alot of people that they have concerns over his general lack of confidence in his perimeter/ interior scoring. And that he seems to put up too many floaters, rather than utilizing his high end athleticism better on drives to the rim, Out of fear of being blocked, or missing in general.

- He also needs to refine his ballhandling skills a bit more, As currently he's very right hand dominant, And hasn't yet shown the consistent ability or propensity to score with his left.

- Also, Again with respect to his ballhandling deficiencies, Currently he's more of a straight line driver so he needs to really improve/ refine his ballhandling skills.

By improving his ability to finish at the rim, Green will be able to diversify his off-ball offense game tremendously. With Green’s athleticism and perimeter off-ball movement, he should be a much more effective cutter. While he only cut 6.8% of the time this season, he scored an embarrassing .808 PPP (9th percentile).


Again, To be fair, The majority of these developmental issues may be the root cause of his apparent lack of confidence that may affect his percieved projection/ outcome. Otherwise I would probably of placed him somewhere in the late teens to early 20s' in terms of value/ potential. As I think he still projects somewhere along the lines of a Josh Richardson/ more athletic Raja Bell. But again, The primary detractors being that he has such poor efficiency in scoring/ finishing at/ around the rim for a prospect with his athletic package, His poor perimeter shooting (inconsistencies) and his apparent confidence issues in general, Along with also needing to improve/ refine his isolation scoring/ playmaking abilities and defensive awareness a bit have dropped him a bit in my personal rankings in terms of value predraft/ pre combine? But I could fully understand others placing him higher due to his top shelf athleticism, potential. :nod:
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Re: GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#8 » by Banana Milk » Tue Sep 29, 2020 4:16 am

Spoiler:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Banana Milk wrote:Gok, do you not rate Josh Green highly or was it an oversight?
Looks like a great athlete, strong, good size with great wingspan and huge hands making him a plus defender and potential to be a solid 3&D.



I actually love his defensive potential, His athleticism, his nba pedigree, his high IQ. And And His shooting metrics seem to be getting better somewhat too. But the reasons that I don't have him higher are primarily due to:
- His peculiar low efficiency for scoring around the rim ( mainly due to poor touch, And poor ball control as he's loading up around the rim).

https://hashtagbasketball.com/nba-draft/content/everything-you-need-to-know-about-josh-green
This simple playmaking from Green is an unfortunate necessity in his game right now due to his ineffectiveness at the rim. Despite being an excellent straight-line driver, Green only scored .786 PPP (8th percentile) around the rim. His touch is inconsistent, and he actively avoids finishing with his left hand.

Green’s driving ability and body control are impressive, but if he continues to try to finish similarly to the below clips, he will continue to struggle. In both clips, Green does a great job of initially beating his man off the dribble. He proceeds to alter his body to use his right hand instead of his left. The result is two off-balance shots that have no chance of going in.


https://vimeo.com/455105094
( bad layup attempt blocked)again due to lack of control, Touch for finishing around the rim.

https://vimeo.com/455104954
( bad shot selection) mainly due to lack of ISO scoring ability from poor ball handling abilities.

- Also I have been hearing from alot of people that they have concerns over his general lack of confidence in his perimeter/ interior scoring. And that he seems to put up too many floaters, rather than utilizing his high end athleticism better on drives to the rim, Out of fear of being blocked, or missing in general.

- He also needs to refine his ballhandling skills a bit more, As currently he's very right hand dominant, And hasn't yet shown the consistent ability or propensity to score with his left.

- Also, Again with respect to his ballhandling deficiencies, Currently he's more of a straight line driver so he needs to really improve/ refine his ballhandling skills.

By improving his ability to finish at the rim, Green will be able to diversify his off-ball offense game tremendously. With Green’s athleticism and perimeter off-ball movement, he should be a much more effective cutter. While he only cut 6.8% of the time this season, he scored an embarrassing .808 PPP (9th percentile).


Again, To be fair, The majority of these developmental issues may be the root cause of his apparent lack of confidence that may affect his percieved projection/ outcome. Otherwise I would probably of placed him somewhere in the late teens to early 20s' in terms of value/ potential. As I think he still projects somewhere along the lines of a Josh Richardson/ more athletic Raja Bell. But again, The primary detractors being that he has such poor efficiency in scoring/ finishing at/ around the rim for a prospect with his athletic package, His poor perimeter shooting (inconsistencies) and his apparent confidence issues in general, Along with also needing to improve/ refine his isolation scoring/ playmaking abilities and defensive awareness a bit have dropped him a bit in my personal rankings in terms of value predraft/ pre combine? But I could fully understand others placing him higher due to his top shelf athleticism, potential. :nod:


Thanks for all the insight! Sounds like shades of Stanley Johnson. Really similar college stats too. Hope he tightens up that jump shot and learns to use his strength and athleticism to finish. Could potentially end up a Pat Connaughton + strong D.

Nothing more frustrating than watching players that can’t finish. Josh Jackson and his propensity for blown layups, dunks and getting blocked used to drive me crazy.
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Re: GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#9 » by cberry78 » Tue Sep 29, 2020 6:10 am

What are your top 5-ish for the Suns at #10?
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Re: GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#10 » by Ghost of Kleine » Tue Sep 29, 2020 6:55 pm

cberry78 wrote:What are your top 5-ish for the Suns at #10?


Do you mean mine or B Milks'? :dontknow:

Mine are:
1- Toppin.
- I would love to land Toppin to play an (Amare) role for us! He creates immense gravity with his potent scoring, and elite vertical Burst! But he can also space the floor really well. The Amare days were great for us, I want to bring those days back!

** In this scenario, I would look to move Oubre to Detroit for Kennard, And then flip Kennard to Philly for Josh Richardson / Ryan Broekhoff ( Budget version of Kennard/ Joe Harris)/ 21st pick. At 21, I'd draft Tyler Bey. Lastly, I'd buy a mid to late 2nd for Tyshon Alexander. We have Elite switchable/ versatile lockdown defenders all throughout the roster, And all of Bey/ Richardson/ Broekhoff/ Alexander are shooting nearly 40% or over from three.

2- Riller.
- Riller could give us a high impact ISO player who can contribute right away, in a Fred Van Vleet type of capacity. And he can improve his real only weakness, That being (his playmaking) by being mentored by Rubio. And his gravity upon penetration would be immense. And would pull the defenses into the paint. Freeing up our shooters big time! Plus really opening up the lanes for both Booker and Oubre too.

** In this scenario, I would then look to add a late first for Isiah Joe. Lastly I'd buy an early 2nd for either Paul Reed or Killian Tillie. Adding Joe would give us an elite ( Duncan Robinson) type spot up shooter. And Paul Reed could develop into a better rebounding version of Jerami Grant ( on the cheap) for us! Or if Tillie, A better version of Saric/ Kleber.


3- Smith.
Smith checks every box for us as our 3 and D big man option, And he can also space the floor really well too. I also believe that once he adds more weight/ strength, He'll be a big time 2 way impact player. I think he projects along the lines of a Serge Ibaka/ Larry Sanders for us!

** In this scenario, I'd trade back for a mid to late first ( if possible) to draft Desmond Bane or Isiah Joe, To give us a very potent inside/ out game. Lastly, I'd look to add a 2nd for either Tyshon Alexander or Ashton Hagans to provide strong defensive compliment to the elite shooters in either Bane or Joe? So we'd have elite perimeter shooting all around the wing, and a strong 3 and D rim protector next to Ayton in Smith in a twin towers scheme with elite perimeter shooters bombing away on the perimeter.

4- Vassell.
- Vassell would be great on the perimeter or in the post due to his elite defensive versatility, high IQ and defensive Awareness , And switchability. He'd give us two potentially elite lockdown perimeter defenders alongside of Bridges. We would then likely have one of the top perimeter defenses in the NBA.

In this scenario, I Would look to acquire a mid to late first to draft Paul Reed or Killian Tillie.
Lastly, I'd then look to buy a 2nd to draft Tyshon Alexander as our elite " point of attack" defender. And could become a top defensive team in the nba similar to what Toronto utilizes through versatile defensive depth. We utilize this elite disruptive defensive scheme to create suffocating lockdown defense, Whilst also creating more breakout fast break opportunities for our scorers, drawing more fouls, and exhausting the opposition. The additional benefits of this again being higher free throw rates, and getting into a better rythym offensively.

5- Lewis.
- Lewis would give us a high octane offensive option with his elite speed and penetration ability. His gravity upon his penetration would also be immense, Causing the opposing defenses to collapse into the paint, Thusly creating wide open looks for our perimeter shooters.

** In this scenario, I would add a late first to draft Tyler Bey or Paul Reed ( defense). Or for maximum value savings (low contractual cost) I'd look to add a 2nd for either Sam Merrill or Isiah Joe ( elite deadeye shooters)! The premise being Lewis's elite penetration/ speed creating wide open looks for our shooters and then Tyler Bey or Paul Reed giving us ELITE switchability and versatile perimeter and post defense. In a pick your poison scheme giving us a very potent balance of both offense and defense.
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Re: GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#11 » by cberry78 » Tue Sep 29, 2020 9:36 pm

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
cberry78 wrote:What are your top 5-ish for the Suns at #10?


Do you mean mine or B Milks'? :dontknow:

Mine are:
1- Toppin.
- I would love to land Toppin to play an (Amare) role for us! He creates immense gravity with his potent scoring, and elite vertical Burst! But he can also space the floor really well. The Amare days were great for us, I want to bring those days back!

** In this scenario, I would look to move Oubre to Detroit for Kennard, And then flip Kennard to Philly for Josh Richardson / Ryan Broekhoff ( Budget version of Kennard/ Joe Harris)/ 21st pick. At 21, I'd draft Tyler Bey. Lastly, I'd buy a mid to late 2nd for Tyshon Alexander. We have Elite switchable/ versatile lockdown defenders all throughout the roster, And all of Bey/ Richardson/ Broekhoff/ Alexander are shooting nearly 40% or over from three.

2- Riller.
- Riller could give us a high impact ISO player who can contribute right away, in a Fred Van Vleet type of capacity. And he can improve his real only weakness, That being (his playmaking) by being mentored by Rubio. And his gravity upon penetration would be immense. And would pull the defenses into the paint. Freeing up our shooters big time! Plus really opening up the lanes for both Booker and Oubre too.

** In this scenario, I would then look to add a late first for Isiah Joe. Lastly I'd buy an early 2nd for either Paul Reed or Killian Tillie. Adding Joe would give us an elite ( Duncan Robinson) type spot up shooter. And Paul Reed could develop into a better rebounding version of Jerami Grant ( on the cheap) for us! Or if Tillie, A better version of Saric/ Kleber.


3- Smith.
Smith checks every box for us as our 3 and D big man option, And he can also space the floor really well too. I also believe that once he adds more weight/ strength, He'll be a big time 2 way impact player. I think he projects along the lines of a Serge Ibaka/ Larry Sanders for us!

** In this scenario, I'd trade back for a mid to late first ( if possible) to draft Desmond Bane or Isiah Joe, To give us a very potent inside/ out game. Lastly, I'd look to add a 2nd for either Tyshon Alexander or Ashton Hagans to provide strong defensive compliment to the elite shooters in either Bane or Joe? So we'd have elite perimeter shooting all around the wing, and a strong 3 and D rim protector next to Ayton in Smith in a twin towers scheme with elite perimeter shooters bombing away on the perimeter.

4- Vassell.
- Vassell would be great on the perimeter or in the post due to his elite defensive versatility, high IQ and defensive Awareness , And switchability. He'd give us two potentially elite lockdown perimeter defenders alongside of Bridges. We would then likely have one of the top perimeter defenses in the NBA.

In this scenario, I Would look to acquire a mid to late first to draft Paul Reed or Killian Tillie.
Lastly, I'd then look to buy a 2nd to draft Tyshon Alexander as our elite " point of attack" defender. And could become a top defensive team in the nba similar to what Toronto utilizes through versatile defensive depth. We utilize this elite disruptive defensive scheme to create suffocating lockdown defense, Whilst also creating more breakout fast break opportunities for our scorers, drawing more fouls, and exhausting the opposition. The additional benefits of this again being higher free throw rates, and getting into a better rythym offensively.

5- Lewis.
- Lewis would give us a high octane offensive option with his elite speed and penetration ability. His gravity upon his penetration would also be immense, Causing the opposing defenses to collapse into the paint, Thusly creating wide open looks for our perimeter shooters.

** In this scenario, I would add a late first to draft Tyler Bey or Paul Reed ( defense). Or for maximum value savings (low contractual cost) I'd look to add a 2nd for either Sam Merrill or Isiah Joe ( elite deadeye shooters)! The premise being Lewis's elite penetration/ speed creating wide open looks for our shooters and then Tyler Bey or Paul Reed giving us ELITE switchability and versatile perimeter and post defense. In a pick your poison scheme giving us a very potent balance of both offense and defense.

Yours obviously, it's your thread :lol: :D

And I agree with you 100% about Toppin, he's the only player in the draft I would consider trading up from 10 for - he just fits the Suns needs perfectly....but that need is also why I'm so high on Smith (3rd choice after Toppin and Haliburton) and would happily take at #10 if the other 2 were gone.

The more I think about it, Smith might actually be my #2 choice...I just don't think a future starting PG is as much of a need right now since RR is only 30.

But why don't you have Haliburton in your top 5? I know you really think highly of Riller, but even in your big board you have Haliburton ranked higher than Riller (9 vs 10)?
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Re: GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#12 » by Ghost of Kleine » Tue Sep 29, 2020 10:07 pm

cberry78 wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
cberry78 wrote:What are your top 5-ish for the Suns at #10?


Do you mean mine or B Milks'? :dontknow:

Mine are:
1- Toppin.
- I would love to land Toppin to play an (Amare) role for us! He creates immense gravity with his potent scoring, and elite vertical Burst! But he can also space the floor really well. The Amare days were great for us, I want to bring those days back!

** In this scenario, I would look to move Oubre to Detroit for Kennard, And then flip Kennard to Philly for Josh Richardson / Ryan Broekhoff ( Budget version of Kennard/ Joe Harris)/ 21st pick. At 21, I'd draft Tyler Bey. Lastly, I'd buy a mid to late 2nd for Tyshon Alexander. We have Elite switchable/ versatile lockdown defenders all throughout the roster, And all of Bey/ Richardson/ Broekhoff/ Alexander are shooting nearly 40% or over from three.

2- Riller.
- Riller could give us a high impact ISO player who can contribute right away, in a Fred Van Vleet type of capacity. And he can improve his real only weakness, That being (his playmaking) by being mentored by Rubio. And his gravity upon penetration would be immense. And would pull the defenses into the paint. Freeing up our shooters big time! Plus really opening up the lanes for both Booker and Oubre too.

** In this scenario, I would then look to add a late first for Isiah Joe. Lastly I'd buy an early 2nd for either Paul Reed or Killian Tillie. Adding Joe would give us an elite ( Duncan Robinson) type spot up shooter. And Paul Reed could develop into a better rebounding version of Jerami Grant ( on the cheap) for us! Or if Tillie, A better version of Saric/ Kleber.


3- Smith.
Smith checks every box for us as our 3 and D big man option, And he can also space the floor really well too. I also believe that once he adds more weight/ strength, He'll be a big time 2 way impact player. I think he projects along the lines of a Serge Ibaka/ Larry Sanders for us!

** In this scenario, I'd trade back for a mid to late first ( if possible) to draft Desmond Bane or Isiah Joe, To give us a very potent inside/ out game. Lastly, I'd look to add a 2nd for either Tyshon Alexander or Ashton Hagans to provide strong defensive compliment to the elite shooters in either Bane or Joe? So we'd have elite perimeter shooting all around the wing, and a strong 3 and D rim protector next to Ayton in Smith in a twin towers scheme with elite perimeter shooters bombing away on the perimeter.

4- Vassell.
- Vassell would be great on the perimeter or in the post due to his elite defensive versatility, high IQ and defensive Awareness , And switchability. He'd give us two potentially elite lockdown perimeter defenders alongside of Bridges. We would then likely have one of the top perimeter defenses in the NBA.

In this scenario, I Would look to acquire a mid to late first to draft Paul Reed or Killian Tillie.
Lastly, I'd then look to buy a 2nd to draft Tyshon Alexander as our elite " point of attack" defender. And could become a top defensive team in the nba similar to what Toronto utilizes through versatile defensive depth. We utilize this elite disruptive defensive scheme to create suffocating lockdown defense, Whilst also creating more breakout fast break opportunities for our scorers, drawing more fouls, and exhausting the opposition. The additional benefits of this again being higher free throw rates, and getting into a better rythym offensively.

5- Lewis.
- Lewis would give us a high octane offensive option with his elite speed and penetration ability. His gravity upon his penetration would also be immense, Causing the opposing defenses to collapse into the paint, Thusly creating wide open looks for our perimeter shooters.

** In this scenario, I would add a late first to draft Tyler Bey or Paul Reed ( defense). Or for maximum value savings (low contractual cost) I'd look to add a 2nd for either Sam Merrill or Isiah Joe ( elite deadeye shooters)! The premise being Lewis's elite penetration/ speed creating wide open looks for our shooters and then Tyler Bey or Paul Reed giving us ELITE switchability and versatile perimeter and post defense. In a pick your poison scheme giving us a very potent balance of both offense and defense.

Yours obviously, it's your thread :lol: :D

And I agree with you 100% about Toppin, he's the only player in the draft I would consider trading up from 10 for - he just fits the Suns needs perfectly....but that need is also why I'm so high on Smith (3rd choice after Toppin and Haliburton) and would happily take at #10 if the other 2 were gone.

The more I think about it, Smith might actually be my #2 choice...I just don't think a future starting PG is as much of a need right now since RR is only 30.

But why don't you have Haliburton in your top 5? I know you really think highly of Riller, but even in your big board you have Haliburton ranked higher than Riller (9 vs 10)?


I don't have Haliburton on my board because I just don't see any way he falls to us at 10. The majority of scouts have all been saying that he's definitely going to be the 2nd guard off the board right after Melo. I mean sure, Hayes is vastly more talented with a much higher ceiling. But the consensus is that given this drafts shallow overall talent levels, GMs' are putting premium value on high IQ players with good intangibles. and Haliburton epitomizes that, Plus he's got far less glaring red flags (.concerns) to his game. I just don't see any way he realistically makes it past all of Charlotte, Chicago, Atlanta, Detroit and New York. So I didn't bother putting him on my board. He's simply hot too much value for him to fall all the way to 10 by comparison to his fellow prospects in that range.
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Re: GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#13 » by cberry78 » Tue Sep 29, 2020 10:13 pm

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
cberry78 wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Do you mean mine or B Milks'? :dontknow:

Mine are:
1- Toppin.
- I would love to land Toppin to play an (Amare) role for us! He creates immense gravity with his potent scoring, and elite vertical Burst! But he can also space the floor really well. The Amare days were great for us, I want to bring those days back!

** In this scenario, I would look to move Oubre to Detroit for Kennard, And then flip Kennard to Philly for Josh Richardson / Ryan Broekhoff ( Budget version of Kennard/ Joe Harris)/ 21st pick. At 21, I'd draft Tyler Bey. Lastly, I'd buy a mid to late 2nd for Tyshon Alexander. We have Elite switchable/ versatile lockdown defenders all throughout the roster, And all of Bey/ Richardson/ Broekhoff/ Alexander are shooting nearly 40% or over from three.

2- Riller.
- Riller could give us a high impact ISO player who can contribute right away, in a Fred Van Vleet type of capacity. And he can improve his real only weakness, That being (his playmaking) by being mentored by Rubio. And his gravity upon penetration would be immense. And would pull the defenses into the paint. Freeing up our shooters big time! Plus really opening up the lanes for both Booker and Oubre too.

** In this scenario, I would then look to add a late first for Isiah Joe. Lastly I'd buy an early 2nd for either Paul Reed or Killian Tillie. Adding Joe would give us an elite ( Duncan Robinson) type spot up shooter. And Paul Reed could develop into a better rebounding version of Jerami Grant ( on the cheap) for us! Or if Tillie, A better version of Saric/ Kleber.


3- Smith.
Smith checks every box for us as our 3 and D big man option, And he can also space the floor really well too. I also believe that once he adds more weight/ strength, He'll be a big time 2 way impact player. I think he projects along the lines of a Serge Ibaka/ Larry Sanders for us!

** In this scenario, I'd trade back for a mid to late first ( if possible) to draft Desmond Bane or Isiah Joe, To give us a very potent inside/ out game. Lastly, I'd look to add a 2nd for either Tyshon Alexander or Ashton Hagans to provide strong defensive compliment to the elite shooters in either Bane or Joe? So we'd have elite perimeter shooting all around the wing, and a strong 3 and D rim protector next to Ayton in Smith in a twin towers scheme with elite perimeter shooters bombing away on the perimeter.

4- Vassell.
- Vassell would be great on the perimeter or in the post due to his elite defensive versatility, high IQ and defensive Awareness , And switchability. He'd give us two potentially elite lockdown perimeter defenders alongside of Bridges. We would then likely have one of the top perimeter defenses in the NBA.

In this scenario, I Would look to acquire a mid to late first to draft Paul Reed or Killian Tillie.
Lastly, I'd then look to buy a 2nd to draft Tyshon Alexander as our elite " point of attack" defender. And could become a top defensive team in the nba similar to what Toronto utilizes through versatile defensive depth. We utilize this elite disruptive defensive scheme to create suffocating lockdown defense, Whilst also creating more breakout fast break opportunities for our scorers, drawing more fouls, and exhausting the opposition. The additional benefits of this again being higher free throw rates, and getting into a better rythym offensively.

5- Lewis.
- Lewis would give us a high octane offensive option with his elite speed and penetration ability. His gravity upon his penetration would also be immense, Causing the opposing defenses to collapse into the paint, Thusly creating wide open looks for our perimeter shooters.

** In this scenario, I would add a late first to draft Tyler Bey or Paul Reed ( defense). Or for maximum value savings (low contractual cost) I'd look to add a 2nd for either Sam Merrill or Isiah Joe ( elite deadeye shooters)! The premise being Lewis's elite penetration/ speed creating wide open looks for our shooters and then Tyler Bey or Paul Reed giving us ELITE switchability and versatile perimeter and post defense. In a pick your poison scheme giving us a very potent balance of both offense and defense.

Yours obviously, it's your thread :lol: :D

And I agree with you 100% about Toppin, he's the only player in the draft I would consider trading up from 10 for - he just fits the Suns needs perfectly....but that need is also why I'm so high on Smith (3rd choice after Toppin and Haliburton) and would happily take at #10 if the other 2 were gone.

The more I think about it, Smith might actually be my #2 choice...I just don't think a future starting PG is as much of a need right now since RR is only 30.

But why don't you have Haliburton in your top 5? I know you really think highly of Riller, but even in your big board you have Haliburton ranked higher than Riller (9 vs 10)?


I don't have Haliburton on my board because I just don't see any way he falls to us at 10. The majority of scouts have all been saying that he's definitely going to be the 2nd guard off the board right after Melo. I mean sure, Hayes is vastly more talented with a much higher ceiling. But the consensus is that given this drafts shallow overall talent levels, GMs' are putting premium value on high IQ players with good intangibles. and Haliburton epitomizes that, Plus he's got far less glaring red flags (.concerns) to his game. I just don't see any way he realistically makes it past all of Charlotte, Chicago, Atlanta, Detroit and New York. So I didn't bother putting him on my board. He's simply hot too much value for him to fall all the way to 10 by comparison to his fellow prospects in that range.

So you honestly think there's a chance that Toppin falls all the way 10? I would freaking love that, but I can't see that happening.
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Re: GOK 2020 NBA DRAFT BIG BOARD 

Post#14 » by Ghost of Kleine » Wed Sep 30, 2020 1:17 am

cberry78 wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
cberry78 wrote:Yours obviously, it's your thread :lol: :D

And I agree with you 100% about Toppin, he's the only player in the draft I would consider trading up from 10 for - he just fits the Suns needs perfectly....but that need is also why I'm so high on Smith (3rd choice after Toppin and Haliburton) and would happily take at #10 if the other 2 were gone.

The more I think about it, Smith might actually be my #2 choice...I just don't think a future starting PG is as much of a need right now since RR is only 30.

But why don't you have Haliburton in your top 5? I know you really think highly of Riller, but even in your big board you have Haliburton ranked higher than Riller (9 vs 10)?


I don't have Haliburton on my board because I just don't see any way he falls to us at 10. The majority of scouts have all been saying that he's definitely going to be the 2nd guard off the board right after Melo. I mean sure, Hayes is vastly more talented with a much higher ceiling. But the consensus is that given this drafts shallow overall talent levels, GMs' are putting premium value on high IQ players with good intangibles. and Haliburton epitomizes that, Plus he's got far less glaring red flags (.concerns) to his game. I just don't see any way he realistically makes it past all of Charlotte, Chicago, Atlanta, Detroit and New York. So I didn't bother putting him on my board. He's simply hot too much value for him to fall all the way to 10 by comparison to his fellow prospects in that range.

So you honestly think there's a chance that Toppin falls all the way 10? I would freaking love that, but I can't see that happening.


There's a slightly better chance of Toppin falling than Haliburton because unfortunately everyone is dramatically overeating his defensive issues. And after 3, There are just more lottery teams with the 4 spot already occupied.

4- Chicago. Already has Markannen/ Young/ Porter. They need guard depth or small forward depth more. They'll likely pick one of Avdija or Okoro first.

5- *Cleveland*. Already has Love/ Nance Jr/ Osman. They're a bit of a risk, But if he can sneak past 5, then the odds are better for us honestly from there. I see them drafting whichever of Avdija or Okoro is left after Chicago. But Chicago could also draft Haliburton as a defensive compliment to Lavine. Have him at backup guard and White at off guard as a scorer. That would give Cleveland their choice of either Avdija or Okoro.

6- Atlanta. Already has Collins and Reddish. They really covet both of Vassell and Okoro from what I've been hearing honestly. Also, they've been talking about being super high on Grant to be there 3, backup 4 to Collins. So they'll not be looking at Toppin much at all.

7- Detroit. They already have Griffin on a 34 million contract, And also will look to bring back Woods as well at the backup 4/5 after his emergence. I see them taking either Hayes or Haliburton if either are still there, Otherwise they'll likely opt for the best 2/3 out of Okoro or Vassell left on the board.

8- New York. Still has Randle at 18 million/ Portis/ and Gibson who both play the 4/5. And they really need a guard badly. And they'll be looking to add Van Vleet and Gallinari or Bertans in free agency, So I see them targeting a guard or a shooting guard personally. But also, Thibs covets defense, And Toppin is percieved to be a really bad defender, So he'll really prefer one of Okoro due to ( Jimmy Butler memories/ crush) :lol: , or Haliburton ( defensive compromises), or Vassell ( covington crush). But if all are off the board, Look for them to take Anthony, Why??? Because it's New York, And Cole's a hometown prodigy that would help them sell tickets! As a hometown kid!

9- Washington. This one's tough as they're kind of thin on talent all over. But they still do have Hachimura and Bertans at the 4 (* If they bring him back). And they're actually thinnest at Shooting guard and small forward. So it may be a toss up really. But IF any of Okoro/ Vassell/ Okungwu or Wiseman fall, Then they'll most likely choose any of them first. Also, The most recent rumors/ gossip may actually have Washington taking Smith at 9, As he's a hometown kid for them, And could provide them with solid defense and floor spacing at the 4/5.

So our odds are actually pretty decent for having Toppin fall to us, Barring Cleveland or Washington getting a " Wild hair" and doing something bizarre. But even in a worst case scenario IF they do, Then Jalen would be a pretty nice consolation prize at 10 no? :nod:
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