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The 2020 NBA Draft

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Are you happy with the Jalen Smith pick?

Yes, without a doubt
20
30%
Yes, but I would have preferred Haliburton or Vassell or maybe Bey or Lewis
29
43%
No, I would have preferred one of the above guys
12
18%
No, there were at least 10 guys I would have taken over him.
6
9%
 
Total votes: 67

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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#861 » by bwgood77 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:19 pm

BobbieL wrote:
49erhokie wrote:
Bogyo wrote:
Let's agree to disagree on this one. Pick BPA, figure out the rest later, especially if the difference is pretty glaring as in this case.


But what if that's not his BPA. We all get caught up on mocks and what so called "experts" say should be the draft order but at the end of the day the FO's are the ones out there scouting and determining the fit for the team.


I agree. I mean, the Bulls pick at 4 was Patrick Williams. That seemed to be high. The Celtics picked that kid from Oregon, Pritchard, was he picked too high. Nobody knows what the Suns draft board represents or where they have them ranked. My guess, when Smith was picked, he was BPA on their draft board

I go back to this about James Jones (and crew): Cam Johnson in one year has shown to be a better NBA pro than Josh, Dragan or Jackson ever did. If Jalen Smith is a good NBA pro - it doesn't matter if Jay Bilas would have picked Vassell or Haliburton


Yeah, I liked Smith a lot better than Patrick Williams. And about taking BPA...I'm sure Jones and company DID take the BPA on their board. You think they said "Hey, lets take the guy we think is 5th best here."
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#862 » by bwgood77 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:21 pm

King4Day wrote:Anyone see Gambo's feedback on Haliburton on why we didn't take him?
Saw this on Reddit:

"Gambo says the Suns didn't think Halliburton was unique or dynamic enough to play the 1 and that he wasn't unique or dynamic enough to play the 2. They see him as a combo guard who isn't talented enough to take a solid role."


I think that's fair. I liked him, and thought he was a perfect pick, much for the same reason I liked Bane, but I viewed both as the third guard now and in the future. I didn't envision Haliburton as ever being our starting 1 or 2 in the future. Everyone saying we should have taken a starter...I don't think him or Vassell start over our guards or Bridges.
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#863 » by jcsunsfan » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:22 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
King4Day wrote:Anyone see Gambo's feedback on Haliburton on why we didn't take him?
Saw this on Reddit:

"Gambo says the Suns didn't think Halliburton was unique or dynamic enough to play the 1 and that he wasn't unique or dynamic enough to play the 2. They see him as a combo guard who isn't talented enough to take a solid role."


I think that's fair. I liked him, and thought he was a perfect pick, much for the same reason I liked Bane, but I viewed both as the third guard now and in the future. I didn't envision Haliburton as ever being our starting 1 or 2 in the future. Everyone saying we should have taken a starter...I don't think him or Vassell start over our guards or Bridges.

If all you are doing is drafting a backup then draft the backup player you need most.
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#864 » by BobbieL » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:23 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
BobbieL wrote:
49erhokie wrote:
But what if that's not his BPA. We all get caught up on mocks and what so called "experts" say should be the draft order but at the end of the day the FO's are the ones out there scouting and determining the fit for the team.


I agree. I mean, the Bulls pick at 4 was Patrick Williams. That seemed to be high. The Celtics picked that kid from Oregon, Pritchard, was he picked too high. Nobody knows what the Suns draft board represents or where they have them ranked. My guess, when Smith was picked, he was BPA on their draft board

I go back to this about James Jones (and crew): Cam Johnson in one year has shown to be a better NBA pro than Josh, Dragan or Jackson ever did. If Jalen Smith is a good NBA pro - it doesn't matter if Jay Bilas would have picked Vassell or Haliburton


Yeah, I liked Smith a lot better than Patrick Williams. And about taking BPA...I'm sure Jones and company DID take the BPA on their board. You think they said "Hey, lets take the guy we think is 5th best here."


Or worse, Chad Ford said we should be taking Player X because on consensus mock drafts Player X is ranked higher than Smith. Just nonsense.

I am not saying Smith will be a good NBA player or even a solid role player type. But, especially with this draft that didn't have that top heavy talent of other drafts - trust your scouting and your instincts. And if Givony gives you an F - who gives a damn. Pelton gave the Suns a B for the CP3 trade partly because he thought they should be an under the cap team. When in reality, in some ways, an over the cap team actually could get them more talent. Just maybe not one Gallinari. But a few players to help depth.
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#865 » by bwgood77 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:24 pm

Jesus_H_Macy wrote:
Wilber85 wrote:I am content with Smith. Hope he is that stretch player we need at the 4/5.

Also - people saying he's bigger stronger than Saric, ya'll are crazy to want to get rid of Saric. Keep both! Why one or the other? I saw Halliburton, Vassell, Kira available and was upset we didn't go with one of them, but I have a feeling we bring in another PG that can learn under CP3.

I am thinking we somehow get Lonzo Ball, call me crazy but New Orleans is stacked with PG's.

Who else do you think we can get for back up PG?

CP3, ???, Payne
Booker, Carter
Bridges, Nader
Johnson, Saric
Ayton, Smith

That roster has a lot of different lineup opportunities.

Hope we stay healthy, and no drug pops!



I'm hoping we use all or most of the MLE money on that backup 1/2 spot, assuming there are no more trades coming. These are the dudes I see showing as available on Spotrac that I thought were worth bothering to mention here:

Jeff Teague
Goran Dragic
Jordan Clarkson
Matthew Dellavedova
D.J. Agustin
Kris Dunn
J.J. Barea
Michael Carter-Williams
Shabazz Napier
Emmanuel Mudiay
Raul Neto
Pat Connaughton
Reggie Jackson
Trey Burke
Jerian Grant

Dragic is the clear standout and best-case scenario for me, but I'd be surprised if he was willing to come back here at all, let alone for MLE money. Other than that...I guess Agustin? Although I'd like us to get a guy who can play both 1 and 2 the 1 part of that is far more important so I don't know how much Clarkson would help. Can JJ Barea still play :lol: ? Napier, Mudiay, Neto, Connaughton, Burke, and Grant all have some level of name value for me but tbh I have no real idea what any of their games are like and if they would give us what we need.


As I mentioned earlier, best case scenario for me is Augustin and Justin Holiday as the guys we sign for backup 1 and 2/3. I'd feel real good about our team and depth then.

I also like Teague ok and Napier....and then as potential backup 2s, Bellinelli and Bryn Forbes.
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#866 » by bwgood77 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:26 pm

Slim Charless wrote:
bigfoot wrote:
AtheJ415 wrote:
His job and critically acclaimed balanced coverage of NBA events for decades makes him an expert. I don't know why you've chosen this bridge to die on, but there isn't a more well respected writer in the country. Like not a 1. Comparing him to Stephen A Smith (who isn't really a writer and is a TV personality), or Tucker Carlson (a TV personality), shows that. Zach Lowe appearing on the Jump on occasion doesn't make him a TV personality shock jock. He's a writer with sources in every FO in the entire league. He covers the entire NBA and is one of the very few writers who even does that.


The bridge I've chosen to die is pointing out your complaints about James Jones assets management are bogus. You decided you don't like the way Jones handled trades and dumping draft picks. You then chose to use a snippet of Lowe's writing as your justification to support your argument. Lowe is just a more well known and connected Gambo. He writes opinion articles. Sure he's well respected but it doesn't make him right nor does it make him more experienced in evaluating talent than Jones and the other Suns front office guys. He certainly does not have experience being around championship cultures nor can he put three championship rings on his fingers. Guaranteed that Lowe does not have the experience of being around players every waking minute of a season and understanding the type of mentality and dedication it takes to get to the promise land.

To me, Jones understands the behind-the-scenes culture of what it takes to win. If he sacrifices 2nd round picks to build/repair that culture I don't care. If he passes on players mocked higher that he doesn't believe fit the culture I'm okay with that. And being that Lowe got his start as an analytics guy, I'm sure you can find articles about the odds of 2nd round and late 1st round picks ever panning out. For every Dragic type gotten in the second round, there are 95 others who didn't make the cut. Those aren't great odds. That seems to be the bridge your willing to die on when you lament about giving up second-round picks.



This obsession that he has with bringing up Luka is hilarious too. With absolutely no proof he just goes and declares that Jones would take JJJ is funny. This is despite the fact the Jones loves to take kids with multiple years of experience and who are smart. That's EXACTLY what Luka's rep was coming out. Everything Jones has shown us leads to him taking Luka with no hesitation.

He's salty his guy didn't get taken and is spamming the board with complaints. There's a number of mocks that had Smith being taken in 13-16 range. We have no proof that he'd still be there if we traded down to 18 or wherever. Boston and other teams needed a big.

Plus, he played PF in college, the constant comments about how the kid's a C are funny when they're followed immediately by complaints about how weak his base and thin his legs are. He's a 4, besides with Ayton there we hopefully have an anchor for our defense and this kid can do things that he excells at like blindside blocks.


Yeah, I'm pretty sure Jones would have taken Luka. He likes guys that can shoot, pass and defend. Luka could do the first two VERY well, and has the size to eventually be a good defender. Ayton had a rep as a bad defender, wasn't much of a shooter and was a decent passer.

And JJJ certainly wouldn't have been the #1 pick.
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#867 » by Revived » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:26 pm

Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
TheLogician wrote:Gambo said the Suns fielded trade calls. He didn't say which teams inquired but I believe that happened because it took Woj/Shams/Gambo until the last second to report the pick. I would have been fine trading down for Smith, or better yet Achiuwa. We could have then added someone like Bane to help with our depth. We could definitely regret passing on Vassell and Haliburton, too. I just hope Smith is as versatile as Jones seems to believe. A backup 3&D center is really not that valuable. We are probably letting the best one we had go in Baynes.


A lot of people including me wanted to keep Baynes, and some wanted to trade for Zubac. Baynes won't be around too much longer and Zubac is a bad fit with Ayton.

Ultimately, Haliburton would have been great, but he is likely a career backup too. I don't really see him as our PG of the future or a guy that could replace Booker at the 2. Same with Vassell. I don't think he ever would have supplanted Booker or Bridges.

This was more of a depth type of draft, outside of a few guys...teams that needed a C taking Wiseman or Okongwu, someone wanting Ball, who isn't a great prospect in a good draft, and maybe a couple other guys...but I don't really see any of the PGs as definite future long term starters. Same with the SGs or wings. Vassell maybe on a different team but probably not for us with Booker and Bridges. I don't think anyone taken after us is a clear cut starter.

Of course 1 or 2 guys taken later will break out and become starters, but it may not be the guys people are thinking. Vassell will probably start in SA, given their roster.

What guy taken after us is a definite starter on another team other than Vassell? Haliburton is probably a 3rd guard behind Fox and Hield. Do you think either of those guys starts for us?

Who else?


Speaking of that. When is Fox due for his next deal? IF Haliburton is so good then he'll take Fox's spot as neither of them really shoot well enough to play SG. If that happens then what's to stop us from going after him? Who's to say that the Kings would be gung ho about resigning him to a big contract if they already have (in their mind) the PGOTF. If we could time signing him with when CP3 is off the books it'd be perfect.

Rumor has it that Miami is targeting Fox when he hits free agency next year.
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#868 » by King4Day » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:30 pm

Revived wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
A lot of people including me wanted to keep Baynes, and some wanted to trade for Zubac. Baynes won't be around too much longer and Zubac is a bad fit with Ayton.

Ultimately, Haliburton would have been great, but he is likely a career backup too. I don't really see him as our PG of the future or a guy that could replace Booker at the 2. Same with Vassell. I don't think he ever would have supplanted Booker or Bridges.

This was more of a depth type of draft, outside of a few guys...teams that needed a C taking Wiseman or Okongwu, someone wanting Ball, who isn't a great prospect in a good draft, and maybe a couple other guys...but I don't really see any of the PGs as definite future long term starters. Same with the SGs or wings. Vassell maybe on a different team but probably not for us with Booker and Bridges. I don't think anyone taken after us is a clear cut starter.

Of course 1 or 2 guys taken later will break out and become starters, but it may not be the guys people are thinking. Vassell will probably start in SA, given their roster.

What guy taken after us is a definite starter on another team other than Vassell? Haliburton is probably a 3rd guard behind Fox and Hield. Do you think either of those guys starts for us?

Who else?


Speaking of that. When is Fox due for his next deal? IF Haliburton is so good then he'll take Fox's spot as neither of them really shoot well enough to play SG. If that happens then what's to stop us from going after him? Who's to say that the Kings would be gung ho about resigning him to a big contract if they already have (in their mind) the PGOTF. If we could time signing him with when CP3 is off the books it'd be perfect.

Rumor has it that Miami is targeting Fox when he hits free agency next year.


Will he be an RFA or UFA? I forget
RFA, forget it. But UFA, he could be had
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#869 » by bwgood77 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:41 pm

Revived wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
A lot of people including me wanted to keep Baynes, and some wanted to trade for Zubac. Baynes won't be around too much longer and Zubac is a bad fit with Ayton.

Ultimately, Haliburton would have been great, but he is likely a career backup too. I don't really see him as our PG of the future or a guy that could replace Booker at the 2. Same with Vassell. I don't think he ever would have supplanted Booker or Bridges.

This was more of a depth type of draft, outside of a few guys...teams that needed a C taking Wiseman or Okongwu, someone wanting Ball, who isn't a great prospect in a good draft, and maybe a couple other guys...but I don't really see any of the PGs as definite future long term starters. Same with the SGs or wings. Vassell maybe on a different team but probably not for us with Booker and Bridges. I don't think anyone taken after us is a clear cut starter.

Of course 1 or 2 guys taken later will break out and become starters, but it may not be the guys people are thinking. Vassell will probably start in SA, given their roster.

What guy taken after us is a definite starter on another team other than Vassell? Haliburton is probably a 3rd guard behind Fox and Hield. Do you think either of those guys starts for us?

Who else?


Speaking of that. When is Fox due for his next deal? IF Haliburton is so good then he'll take Fox's spot as neither of them really shoot well enough to play SG. If that happens then what's to stop us from going after him? Who's to say that the Kings would be gung ho about resigning him to a big contract if they already have (in their mind) the PGOTF. If we could time signing him with when CP3 is off the books it'd be perfect.

Rumor has it that Miami is targeting Fox when he hits free agency next year.


Doesn't matter who targets him. Kings will match.
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#870 » by Slim Charless » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:43 pm

King4Day wrote:
Revived wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
Speaking of that. When is Fox due for his next deal? IF Haliburton is so good then he'll take Fox's spot as neither of them really shoot well enough to play SG. If that happens then what's to stop us from going after him? Who's to say that the Kings would be gung ho about resigning him to a big contract if they already have (in their mind) the PGOTF. If we could time signing him with when CP3 is off the books it'd be perfect.

Rumor has it that Miami is targeting Fox when he hits free agency next year.


Will he be an RFA or UFA? I forget
RFA, forget it. But UFA, he could be had


That, and how do they plan on getting him and Giannis? If Giannis doesn't resign w/ MIL then Miami has to wait till he makes his mind up. I've also seem them on for Dipo-who I think will recover and revert back to his all star form this season. They can't sign them all and keep Jimmy and Bam as well. Back to Fox though, so he's able to sign a new contract this up-coming summer or are we talking about the year after that?
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#871 » by bwgood77 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:45 pm

Golanator wrote:So this is fun from Jalen Smith

Read on Twitter


He shows his strengths big time there all the way to the end.
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#872 » by Slim Charless » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:52 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
Golanator wrote:So this is fun from Jalen Smith

Read on Twitter


He shows his strengths big time there all the way to the end.


He's a PF. Until proven otherwise. Once we accept that then he has a lot of potential and do a lot of good/great things when paired with Ayton.
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#873 » by BobbieL » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:05 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
Golanator wrote:So this is fun from Jalen Smith

Read on Twitter


He shows his strengths big time there all the way to the end.


Seeing those highlights - my Spider Salley comp might be a bit wrong. But if he brings what Spider brought early in his career with the defense, blocked shots, energy, some rebouding - will be totally pleased.
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#874 » by Slim Charless » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:23 pm

Someone compared him to Horace Grant but with range. God. That'd be perfect if we managed to grab that
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#875 » by suns12345 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:23 pm

BobbieL wrote:
bigfoot wrote:
AtheJ415 wrote:
His job and critically acclaimed balanced coverage of NBA events for decades makes him an expert. I don't know why you've chosen this bridge to die on, but there isn't a more well respected writer in the country. Like not a 1. Comparing him to Stephen A Smith (who isn't really a writer and is a TV personality), or Tucker Carlson (a TV personality), shows that. Zach Lowe appearing on the Jump on occasion doesn't make him a TV personality shock jock. He's a writer with sources in every FO in the entire league. He covers the entire NBA and is one of the very few writers who even does that.


The bridge I've chosen to die is pointing out your complaints about James Jones assets management are bogus. You decided you don't like the way Jones handled trades and dumping draft picks. You then chose to use a snippet of Lowe's writing as your justification to support your argument. Lowe is just a more well known and connected Gambo. He writes opinion articles. Sure he's well respected but it doesn't make him right nor does it make him more experienced in evaluating talent than Jones and the other Suns front office guys. He certainly does not have experience being around championship cultures nor can he put three championship rings on his fingers. Guaranteed that Lowe does not have the experience of being around players every waking minute of a season and understanding the type of mentality and dedication it takes to get to the promise land.

To me, Jones understands the behind-the-scenes culture of what it takes to win. If he sacrifices 2nd round picks to build/repair that culture I don't care. If he passes on players mocked higher that he doesn't believe fit the culture I'm okay with that. And being that Lowe got his start as an analytics guy, I'm sure you can find articles about the odds of 2nd round and late 1st round picks ever panning out. For every Dragic type gotten in the second round, there are 95 others who didn't make the cut. Those aren't great odds. That seems to be the bridge your willing to die on when you lament about giving up second-round picks.


I like Zach Lowe - I think he is one of the best out there. And yes, I think the Suns should have stretched Josh and not given up the player (Melton) and picks (two second rounders I believe) to save some 2.5m dollars (difference between Josh and Korvers buy out).

That being said, Zach gets to write his articles after the fact. So its easy to second guess

As for Jones - he does seem to know what kind of player he likes and will just have to see how Smith develops and the team develops.


Zach, who I love listening to, also said after the CP3 trade we need to look to sign a couple of defensive pieces to round out our roster... which we just did by drafting Smith
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#876 » by suns12345 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:34 pm



Kid looks like a stud GoK. defense and shooting!

Whats his chances of being a contributor next season do you think?
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#877 » by cberry78 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:35 pm

Slim Charless wrote:Someone compared him to Horace Grant but with range. God. That'd be perfect if we managed to grab that

LOL, that was me and I thought that comment got lost in the thread!

I totally see Horace Grant in the way he runs down the floor, especially in that clip above. He even LOOKS like him with those glasses!
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#878 » by suns12345 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:36 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
AtheJ415 wrote:
suns12345 wrote:90% of people on here are the same as the ridiculous media, criticising draft picks and saying teams had great drafts based on prospects who have never played a minute in the league.

Just relax and see how it plays out.

I get the asset management argument most years, and I think that is important, but Jalen Smith was not really a reach when (as BW's post said) he was projected only a few picks after us in plenty of mocks.

PS. Imagine if we drafted Desmond Bane (who plenty wanted), even though we could've traded back to 29 and got him. Hindsight makes this so easy.


Most I've seen here who wanted Bane wanted to trade down to take Bane. It's not really hindsight. It's very obvious that Jones has different opinions of guys than consensus. Given that, he should lean into it and get more from the draft via extra picks or players like he did last year to get Saric. Problem is that's the only time he's done it despite 2 obvious times he could have.


Cam was the bigger reach though, and it turns out he was a nice pick...and later it was confirmed a couple teams in the teens liked him. You never know if you have the option to move down either.

Jalen Smith, on the major big boards, ranked between 13 and 17, so it wasn't that far off...particularly if you felt you needed depth at the 4/5..positional need wasn't a big deal in this draft given the little difference between about 20 prospects. I would like to know why they didn't take Haliburton though.

I don't care that they didn't trade down at all because I have no idea if that was even an option, but I know taking Haliburton was an option. Or Vassell for that matter.

It will be interesting to see who pans out...and who busts of the top 20-30 players.

Last year only about 2-3 players drafted after Cam were better. Tyler Herro, Brandon Clarke, and possibly PJ Washington, but all those ended up being pretty close looking at the numbers and Cam was stuck behind Oubre, Bridges and Saric for the whole season until the bubble where he thrived. If he starts or gets major minutes, who knows where he ends up.


Looks like Zach Lowe is saying Dallas was trying to move up for Haliburton with 18 and 31.

So I assume we turned that down. 18 was likely too low to get the guy we wanted so I think that is fair enough... and 31 still would have missed on Bane.
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#879 » by AtheJ415 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:41 pm

Mr Puddles wrote:The success of this pick will depend on if Smith can play the 4 spot. I have no doubt he'll be a solid back-up 5, but that by itself is not enough with a #10 pick IMO, especially since I see guys like Vassell and Haliburton being solid rotation pieces for the Spurs and Kings.

Basically, I'd see our depth chart like this。

PG CP3 / Payne
SG Booker / Carter
SF Bridges / Johnson / Nader
PF Johnson / Saric / Smith
C. Ayton / Smith / Saric

We'll probably play a three guard line-up at times as well with CP3/Carter (or Payne when he's on fire)/ Booker/

This pick shows that our front office has a lot of faith in Payne and Carter building on their strong bubble performance. There's definitely something to be said for rewarding strong performances. I think Carter will be great as a backup SG (he's looked much better there than as a PG), but I'm a bit concerned about having only Payne on the roster if CP misses time. Of course we could still address this in free agency.

Overall, I hope this pick works out and I think we'll really like Smith as a back-up center. But I see both Vassell and Haliburton outproducing him.


That's the other part of this. With Cam as the 4 and if we bring Saric back, how many minutes is Smith even going to get at the 4? Unless they plan on benching Cam or not bringing back Saric, but I think both options would be a mistake.
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Re: The 2020 NBA Draft - New Poll 

Post#880 » by AtheJ415 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:42 pm

suns12345 wrote:
AtheJ415 wrote:
suns12345 wrote:90% of people on here are the same as the ridiculous media, criticising draft picks and saying teams had great drafts based on prospects who have never played a minute in the league.

Just relax and see how it plays out.

I get the asset management argument most years, and I think that is important, but Jalen Smith was not really a reach when (as BW's post said) he was projected only a few picks after us in plenty of mocks.

PS. Imagine if we drafted Desmond Bane (who plenty wanted), even though we could've traded back to 29 and got him. Hindsight makes this so easy.


Most I've seen here who wanted Bane wanted to trade down to take Bane. It's not really hindsight. It's very obvious that Jones has different opinions of guys than consensus. Given that, he should lean into it and get more from the draft via extra picks or players like he did last year to get Saric. Problem is that's the only time he's done it despite 2 obvious times he could have.



Wanted to trade down to 15, not 30...

its pretty obvious every GM has different views to the consensus based on today.

What are the 2 obvious times he could have got extra picks and players? are you aware of offers he had on the table for past assets?


I'll give you 3: Cam, Smith, Jackson. Hell, probably Jerome.

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