Finals refs and possible bias

[bigfoot]

So there are 10 refs chosen for the finals

https://www.nba.com/news/nba-announces-officials-for-2021-nba-finals

The working refs earn $29000 per finals game

https://thestadiumreviews.com/blogs/info/how-much-do-nba-refs-make/

Seems like a major incentive for the refs to stretch the series to seven games considering they only get paid $3500 per game for the regular season.

Thoughts?

[DirtyDez]

Makes me feel better about my Suns in 7 bet.

[bwgood77]

So there are 10 refs chosen for the finals

https://www.nba.com/news/nba-announces-officials-for-2021-nba-finals

The working refs earn $29000 per finals game

https://thestadiumreviews.com/blogs/info/how-much-do-nba-refs-make/

Seems like a major incentive for the refs to stretch the series to seven games considering they only get paid $3500 per game for the regular season.

Thoughts?

I had heard 14, and following the link, even though it mentions 10 to start, it lists 14, so I think there are 14.

That definitely sounds like an incentive. But hopefully they really grade them harder in the finals and if they feel they get a lot of calls wrong they don't let them do finals in the future.

Doesn't seem like they should get paid more for the finals though.

As a matter of fact, they should probably make salaries or some predetermined amount before the season. Then maybe just rotate all refs in the entire playoffs that you plan on bringing back next year because they performed well enough to bring back.

But making that much money for an extra game? That seems a little ridiculous. Any extra money provides incentive.

[lilfishi22]

No matter what you do, the narrative could be skewed.

Refs get paid by the game, oh they want to extend to 7 games
Refs get paid one sum for the entire Finals, oh they want to keep it to a few games as possible.

[suns12345]

damn, $29000 for 2.5 hours work is some good coin though.

[RunDogGun]

No matter what you do, the narrative could be skewed.

Refs get paid by the game, oh they want to extend to 7 games
Refs get paid one sum for the entire Finals, oh they want to keep it to a few games as possible.

It depends on if they like reffing though. But it should be a salary or they get paid after a review. Many bad calls, and they get paid less. Gives incentives to make good calls throughout. But that is if the league isn't pushing more games as well. There is huge money an tv contracts for series to go seven games.

[lilfishi22]

lol I'm not in the business of trying to figure out the individual aspirations of each ref working the Finals. Am I suppose to think a slightly more junior officially would need the money more than a more senior ref so they games going to G7 would be more advantageous? Or should a more junior ref be more gung-ho about getting calls right and earning their stripes and respect even if it means the series ends earlier? Man there's enough variables in game, I'm just not spending time trying to give legs to conspiracy theories.

I want refs to make the right calls more often too but unless you take the human element out of the equation, there will always be highly questionable calls because humans make mistakes.

[MrMiyagi]

lol I'm not in the business of trying to figure out the individual aspirations of each ref working the Finals. Am I suppose to think a slightly more junior officially would need the money more than a more senior ref so they games going to G7 would be more advantageous? Or should a more junior ref be more gung-ho about getting calls right and earning their stripes and respect even if it means the series ends earlier? Man there's enough variables in game, I'm just not spending time trying to give legs to conspiracy theories.

I want refs to make the right calls more often too but unless you take the human element out of the equation, there will always be highly questionable calls because humans make mistakes.

Robo-refs for all sport. Give me sensor-filled vest/sleeves that ring a buzzer to indicate fouls.

[RunDogGun]

lol I'm not in the business of trying to figure out the individual aspirations of each ref working the Finals. Am I suppose to think a slightly more junior officially would need the money more than a more senior ref so they games going to G7 would be more advantageous? Or should a more junior ref be more gung-ho about getting calls right and earning their stripes and respect even if it means the series ends earlier? Man there's enough variables in game, I'm just not spending time trying to give legs to conspiracy theories.

I want refs to make the right calls more often too but unless you take the human element out of the equation, there will always be highly questionable calls because humans make mistakes.

Well it doesn't have to be a conspiracy theory really. The NBA is a business, and they are in the business of making money. Regardless if they maybe push for series to go seven games, or bigger markets or more marketable players going further in the playoffs, would pay out. If refs are getting paid by the game, it seems logical they would want to make as much extra money possible. I mean, if you are making $30k to basically work 2.5-3 hours, would you do it? I know I would.

I mean, they let Donaughy keep reffing in the playoffs even after they knew the FBI was investigating him for gambling on games he was officiating. Foster was someone that Donaughy was in contact with, and Tim made bets based on bias he was aware of. So maybe it isn't a conspiracy really, just crappy people doing crappy things at the same time. And a senior official can override jr officials, so there seems to be a lot possible to go south.

All I know was Giannis got many many calls go his way, and calls that appeared to be obvious fouls or violations didn't get called. Did the refs or lead ref do this on purpose? Did he say, hey lets not call ticky tack stuff, let them play, and then make some ticky tack calls? Who knows. All I know was Ayton got bad calls, and Giannis got great calls, and those calls affected the game more than they should.

[lilfishi22]

lol I'm not in the business of trying to figure out the individual aspirations of each ref working the Finals. Am I suppose to think a slightly more junior officially would need the money more than a more senior ref so they games going to G7 would be more advantageous? Or should a more junior ref be more gung-ho about getting calls right and earning their stripes and respect even if it means the series ends earlier? Man there's enough variables in game, I'm just not spending time trying to give legs to conspiracy theories.

I want refs to make the right calls more often too but unless you take the human element out of the equation, there will always be highly questionable calls because humans make mistakes.

Robo-refs for all sport. Give me sensor-filled vest/sleeves that ring a buzzer to indicate fouls.

I've thought about this from time to time and I think it's the way forward. There are those who argue that pace would be impacted because every touch would be called a foul but I think you can build in some variance or margin of error so incidental touches (ie touch fouls) won't be called. I think ultimately, in circumstances where there is a big enough doubt about a certain call and the robo-ref cannot call something with 80%+ confidence, then the human ref can make the judgement call.

[lilfishi22]

lol I'm not in the business of trying to figure out the individual aspirations of each ref working the Finals. Am I suppose to think a slightly more junior officially would need the money more than a more senior ref so they games going to G7 would be more advantageous? Or should a more junior ref be more gung-ho about getting calls right and earning their stripes and respect even if it means the series ends earlier? Man there's enough variables in game, I'm just not spending time trying to give legs to conspiracy theories.

I want refs to make the right calls more often too but unless you take the human element out of the equation, there will always be highly questionable calls because humans make mistakes.

Well it doesn't have to be a conspiracy theory really. The NBA is a business, and they are in the business of making money. Regardless if they maybe push for series to go seven games, or bigger markets or more marketable players going further in the playoffs, would pay out. If refs are getting paid by the game, it seems logical they would want to make as much extra money possible. I mean, if you are making $30k to basically work 2.5-3 hours, would you do it? I know I would.

I mean, they let Donaughy keep reffing in the playoffs even after they knew the FBI was investigating him for gambling on games he was officiating. Foster was someone that Donaughy was in contact with, and Tim made bets based on bias he was aware of. So maybe it isn't a conspiracy really, just crappy people doing crappy things at the same time. And a senior official can override jr officials, so there seems to be a lot possible to go south.

All I know was Giannis got many many calls go his way, and calls that appeared to be obvious fouls or violations didn't get called. Did the refs or lead ref do this on purpose? Did he say, hey lets not call ticky tack stuff, let them play, and then make some ticky tack calls? Who knows. All I know was Ayton got bad calls, and Giannis got great calls, and those calls affected the game more than they should.

It's pretty obvious there are heavy conspiratorial undertones to this thread. No one is making this topic on the Suns forum unless we were in the Finals (hadn't happened in RealGM existence until now) and we were hard done by some very iffy calls. I mean if we are to take the narrative that the NBA/referees (are they two diff entities?) want the Finals to go further then why did the Warriors sweep the Cavs in 2018? Those are the two most popular teams at the time, "they" could certainly stand to earn a pretty penny by pushing it out even by one or two games.

I just think this is going down a rabbit hole with no real answers

[Frank Lee]

RDog is barking up the right tree me thinks

[Keith_myath]

Ref's don't need to say anything to one another.

They're old enough to understand contexts and the inferences they bring.

The other 2 can put the Foster appointment together with the news about Paul's W/L record and infer the intended narrative without a word spoken.