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2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation

Moderators: bwgood77, Kerrsed, Qwigglez, lilfishi22

How many games do we win out of our next 15 through Christmas? See post #1029 for schedule

11
5
20%
10
6
24%
9
3
12%
8
1
4%
7
0
No votes
More than 11
10
40%
Fewer than 7
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 25

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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1001 » by Slim Charless » Sat Nov 20, 2021 11:43 pm

Jdiddy701 wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
bigfoot wrote:
He's been clutch rebounding. But ... his ability to take his man 1-on-1 on offense is non-existent. A perfect example was an offensive rebound he grabbed. He was down low on the left block and settled for a fade-away jumper because he couldn't back his man down or face him up and drive around. He also does a poor job getting a decent position in the post when he has a small man on him. This is not to say Ayton isn't good ... he's just not max good.


He does have moments where he settles for like that fadeaway jumper or even passes out when he could go for it, but you must not have watched nearly all the games because he has definitely backed his man down on possessions and scored and also had drives not only around, but at guys. He doesn't do it second nature or all the time, but he does it. But if a fadeaway goes in, no one complains? I mean Book often could drive in and does tons of fadeaways but it's fine. It's ok to try and have a repertoire. I wish he would be more aggressive offensively and sometimes it's frustrating but it's not like he can't or hasn't done those things. They are just not second nature and he takes a lot of baseline jumpers like Ewing and TD took.

I’ve watched every game and don’t remember many plays where he’s backed the defender down and scored. Once there is contact, he settles for a fadeaway or passes out. Just because a player does it once a blue moon, doesn’t mean they can consistently do it. It’s just not his game and that’s fine. Well, not fine if he wants a max contract. Offensively, he’s the same player he was coming into the league - hasn’t improved much on that end and that’s frustrating.


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I don't know about that. I've noticed a nice little hook shot being added into his game. Which I hope stays as that's 1 of the best weapons for a big man.

I just don't think we're getting enough reps for him in games. He needs more touches now, so that in the playoffs this stuff is developed. Imagine if we can go to him vs LAL and force AD to work every time down and draw fouls on him? Same with Joker.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1002 » by Slim Charless » Sun Nov 21, 2021 2:48 am

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:I saw a trade suggestion on the trade board of Ayton for OG which is interesting, since OG can play PF. Out of all the PFs people mention around here, I'd take him over anyone. Even though I really like Siakam too, people have also mentioned him but I'd prefer OG in a deal simply because he makes half as much money and has way more upside. He may already be better too or close to it.


That'd be an exciting ( duo) dynamic with Bridges at the 3 and OG at the 4. Our perimeter defense would be suffocating I'd believe. What would be the entirety of the deal that you'd be looking at in terms of overall value man? Any other pieces involved for equitable value? Or would you be amenable to a simple Ayton for OG swap?


You know what I would do to fix our PF issue? I bet with things working well in Orlando for the Franz/WCJ/Bamba frontcourt, I wonder if we can steal Isaac? They have a lot good players in that area of their team. I'm not 100% sure he'd start for them now.

I'd offere them Cam, Stix, Saric and a 1st and see what they'd say. A healthy Isaac would be amazing on this team with his length and size. He's locked up on a good deal too.

I'm not sure what Orlando would want for him but I bet he could be had.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1003 » by bwgood77 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 2:58 am

Slim Charless wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:I saw a trade suggestion on the trade board of Ayton for OG which is interesting, since OG can play PF. Out of all the PFs people mention around here, I'd take him over anyone. Even though I really like Siakam too, people have also mentioned him but I'd prefer OG in a deal simply because he makes half as much money and has way more upside. He may already be better too or close to it.


That'd be an exciting ( duo) dynamic with Bridges at the 3 and OG at the 4. Our perimeter defense would be suffocating I'd believe. What would be the entirety of the deal that you'd be looking at in terms of overall value man? Any other pieces involved for equitable value? Or would you be amenable to a simple Ayton for OG swap?


You know what I would do to fix our PF issue? I bet with things working well in Orlando for the Franz/WCJ/Bamba frontcourt, I wonder if we can steal Isaac? They have a lot good players in that area of their team. I'm not 100% sure he'd start for them now.

I'd offere them Cam, Stix, Saric and a 1st and see what they'd say. A healthy Isaac would be amazing on this team with his length and size. He's locked up on a good deal too.

I'm not sure what Orlando would want for him but I bet he could be had.


I would easily do that (If I thought he would probably be healthy), but I think they are VERY high on Isaac. I don't think they'd trade him for even a better offer. I think they view him as their starting PF of the future.

He can't stay healthy though, which if is an issue for them would be an issue for us too.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1004 » by Slim Charless » Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:32 am

bwgood77 wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
That'd be an exciting ( duo) dynamic with Bridges at the 3 and OG at the 4. Our perimeter defense would be suffocating I'd believe. What would be the entirety of the deal that you'd be looking at in terms of overall value man? Any other pieces involved for equitable value? Or would you be amenable to a simple Ayton for OG swap?


You know what I would do to fix our PF issue? I bet with things working well in Orlando for the Franz/WCJ/Bamba frontcourt, I wonder if we can steal Isaac? They have a lot good players in that area of their team. I'm not 100% sure he'd start for them now.

I'd offere them Cam, Stix, Saric and a 1st and see what they'd say. A healthy Isaac would be amazing on this team with his length and size. He's locked up on a good deal too.

I'm not sure what Orlando would want for him but I bet he could be had.


I would easily do that (If I thought he would probably be healthy), but I think they are VERY high on Isaac. I don't think they'd trade him for even a better offer. I think they view him as their starting PF of the future.

He can't stay healthy though, which if is an issue for them would be an issue for us too.


Yeah. I'm not 100% sure they'd do it either but here's another thing......a healthy Isaac is basically a 6'11 version of Mikal...on a cheaper contract.

I know alot of ppl here would probably say no but IF he's healthy and is the same player, I'd strongly consider that trade. We have Cam to replace Mikal in the starting line-up and can finally put Crowder to the bench where he should be playing at this point.

Imagine having that kinda size with Isaac and Ayton? Even Giannis would have no shot at that kinda size. Plus AZ's MAGA crowd would love Issac anyway.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1005 » by Ghost of Kleine » Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:54 am

Slim Charless wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:I saw a trade suggestion on the trade board of Ayton for OG which is interesting, since OG can play PF. Out of all the PFs people mention around here, I'd take him over anyone. Even though I really like Siakam too, people have also mentioned him but I'd prefer OG in a deal simply because he makes half as much money and has way more upside. He may already be better too or close to it.


That'd be an exciting ( duo) dynamic with Bridges at the 3 and OG at the 4. Our perimeter defense would be suffocating I'd believe. What would be the entirety of the deal that you'd be looking at in terms of overall value man? Any other pieces involved for equitable value? Or would you be amenable to a simple Ayton for OG swap?


You know what I would do to fix our PF issue? I bet with things working well in Orlando for the Franz/WCJ/Bamba frontcourt, I wonder if we can steal Isaac? They have a lot good players in that area of their team. I'm not 100% sure he'd start for them now.

I'd offere them Cam, Stix, Saric and a 1st and see what they'd say. A healthy Isaac would be amazing on this team with his length and size. He's locked up on a good deal too.

I'm not sure what Orlando would want for him but I bet he could be had.


That'd be amazing! You should propose it on the trade board man, To gauge interest and get insight as to where they're at on him currently in terms of trade value. :nod:
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1006 » by Slim Charless » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:11 am

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
That'd be an exciting ( duo) dynamic with Bridges at the 3 and OG at the 4. Our perimeter defense would be suffocating I'd believe. What would be the entirety of the deal that you'd be looking at in terms of overall value man? Any other pieces involved for equitable value? Or would you be amenable to a simple Ayton for OG swap?


You know what I would do to fix our PF issue? I bet with things working well in Orlando for the Franz/WCJ/Bamba frontcourt, I wonder if we can steal Isaac? They have a lot good players in that area of their team. I'm not 100% sure he'd start for them now.

I'd offere them Cam, Stix, Saric and a 1st and see what they'd say. A healthy Isaac would be amazing on this team with his length and size. He's locked up on a good deal too.

I'm not sure what Orlando would want for him but I bet he could be had.


That'd be amazing! You should propose it on the trade board man, To gauge interest and get insight as to where they're at on him currently in terms of trade value. :nod:


I just asked the Magic board but I think he'd be a perfect fit for us. Allows us not to be crushed when there's no Ayton (I don't believe we can rely on Frank and McGee for the playoffs).

Would give us a MASSIVE and young frontcourt:

Ayton
Issac
Cam J

Which is great since Chris is so short. Also, we'd have him locked up on a fantastic contract-provided he's the old Issac.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1007 » by bwgood77 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:25 am

Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
You know what I would do to fix our PF issue? I bet with things working well in Orlando for the Franz/WCJ/Bamba frontcourt, I wonder if we can steal Isaac? They have a lot good players in that area of their team. I'm not 100% sure he'd start for them now.

I'd offere them Cam, Stix, Saric and a 1st and see what they'd say. A healthy Isaac would be amazing on this team with his length and size. He's locked up on a good deal too.

I'm not sure what Orlando would want for him but I bet he could be had.


I would easily do that (If I thought he would probably be healthy), but I think they are VERY high on Isaac. I don't think they'd trade him for even a better offer. I think they view him as their starting PF of the future.

He can't stay healthy though, which if is an issue for them would be an issue for us too.


Yeah. I'm not 100% sure they'd do it either but here's another thing......a healthy Isaac is basically a 6'11 version of Mikal...on a cheaper contract.

I know alot of ppl here would probably say no but IF he's healthy and is the same player, I'd strongly consider that trade. We have Cam to replace Mikal in the starting line-up and can finally put Crowder to the bench where he should be playing at this point.

Imagine having that kinda size with Isaac and Ayton? Even Giannis would have no shot at that kinda size. Plus AZ's MAGA crowd would love Issac anyway.


I love Isaac the player..he is awesome..yes, in a Bridges sort of way with blocks....but again, I think they would place him near untouchable. Especially after that contract. They have mostly rookie deals now anyway...and won't have to pay their Cs much. Bamba and Carter are starting to look a lot better now too. Wagner is good but Isaac is better than any of those guys.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1008 » by Slim Charless » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:37 am

bwgood77 wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
I would easily do that (If I thought he would probably be healthy), but I think they are VERY high on Isaac. I don't think they'd trade him for even a better offer. I think they view him as their starting PF of the future.

He can't stay healthy though, which if is an issue for them would be an issue for us too.


Yeah. I'm not 100% sure they'd do it either but here's another thing......a healthy Isaac is basically a 6'11 version of Mikal...on a cheaper contract.

I know alot of ppl here would probably say no but IF he's healthy and is the same player, I'd strongly consider that trade. We have Cam to replace Mikal in the starting line-up and can finally put Crowder to the bench where he should be playing at this point.

Imagine having that kinda size with Isaac and Ayton? Even Giannis would have no shot at that kinda size. Plus AZ's MAGA crowd would love Issac anyway.


I love Isaac the player..he is awesome..yes, in a Bridges sort of way with blocks....but again, I think they would place him near untouchable. Especially after that contract. They have mostly rookie deals now anyway...and won't have to pay their Cs much. Bamba and Carter are starting to look a lot better now too. Wagner is good but Isaac is better than any of those guys.


They already paid WCJ and Bamba is due up this year...as he's from the same class as Ayton. The only spot they have available is C...if they let Bamba walk. I don't really think that Issac can play the pivot as he's too light. He's a PF and they are already paying WCJ.

Issac is displaced over there, while Mikal would fit that team like a glove. Admittedly Mikal also fits our team like a glove but like I said a healthy Issac is Mikal 5 inches taller. He's also younger than Mikal too which helps obviously. This way we can keep Cam while making better use of him to boot.

This would have to wait till the trade deadline if not the off-season as you'd need to see Issac play for a few months and how he looks. But if he's the same guy we saw pre bubble, think I'd have to pull the trigger on that one.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1009 » by bwgood77 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:50 am

Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
Yeah. I'm not 100% sure they'd do it either but here's another thing......a healthy Isaac is basically a 6'11 version of Mikal...on a cheaper contract.

I know alot of ppl here would probably say no but IF he's healthy and is the same player, I'd strongly consider that trade. We have Cam to replace Mikal in the starting line-up and can finally put Crowder to the bench where he should be playing at this point.

Imagine having that kinda size with Isaac and Ayton? Even Giannis would have no shot at that kinda size. Plus AZ's MAGA crowd would love Issac anyway.


I love Isaac the player..he is awesome..yes, in a Bridges sort of way with blocks....but again, I think they would place him near untouchable. Especially after that contract. They have mostly rookie deals now anyway...and won't have to pay their Cs much. Bamba and Carter are starting to look a lot better now too. Wagner is good but Isaac is better than any of those guys.


They already paid WCJ and Bamba is due up this year...as he's from the same class as Ayton. The only spot they have available is C...if they let Bamba walk. I don't really think that Issac can play the pivot as he's too light. He's a PF and they are already paying WCJ.

Issac is displaced over there, while Mikal would fit that team like a glove. Admittedly Mikal also fits our team like a glove but like I said a healthy Issac is Mikal 5 inches taller. He's also younger than Mikal too which helps obviously. This way we can keep Cam while making better use of him to boot.

This would have to wait till the trade deadline if not the off-season as you'd need to see Issac play for a few months and how he looks. But if he's the same guy we saw pre bubble, think I'd have to pull the trigger on that one.


I wouldn't trade Mikal for him if only because Mikal never misses games and Isaac never plays in them. I think the Magic would get rid of almost anyone else before they got rid of Isaac personally.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1010 » by Slim Charless » Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:27 am

bwgood77 wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
I love Isaac the player..he is awesome..yes, in a Bridges sort of way with blocks....but again, I think they would place him near untouchable. Especially after that contract. They have mostly rookie deals now anyway...and won't have to pay their Cs much. Bamba and Carter are starting to look a lot better now too. Wagner is good but Isaac is better than any of those guys.


They already paid WCJ and Bamba is due up this year...as he's from the same class as Ayton. The only spot they have available is C...if they let Bamba walk. I don't really think that Issac can play the pivot as he's too light. He's a PF and they are already paying WCJ.

Issac is displaced over there, while Mikal would fit that team like a glove. Admittedly Mikal also fits our team like a glove but like I said a healthy Issac is Mikal 5 inches taller. He's also younger than Mikal too which helps obviously. This way we can keep Cam while making better use of him to boot.

This would have to wait till the trade deadline if not the off-season as you'd need to see Issac play for a few months and how he looks. But if he's the same guy we saw pre bubble, think I'd have to pull the trigger on that one.


I wouldn't trade Mikal for him if only because Mikal never misses games and Isaac never plays in them. I think the Magic would get rid of almost anyone else before they got rid of Isaac personally.


Well, this is all based off of him being and staying healthy. If so, he'd be the best PF we could probably get at his level.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1011 » by Mulhollanddrive » Sun Nov 21, 2021 9:57 am

Nader and Kaminsky out.

5 games in 7 days coming up.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1012 » by Bogyo » Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:28 am

Mulhollanddrive wrote:Nader and Kaminsky out.

5 games in 7 days coming up.


Time for Cam to bring it.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1013 » by Saberestar » Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:59 am

bwgood77 wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
That'd be an exciting ( duo) dynamic with Bridges at the 3 and OG at the 4. Our perimeter defense would be suffocating I'd believe. What would be the entirety of the deal that you'd be looking at in terms of overall value man? Any other pieces involved for equitable value? Or would you be amenable to a simple Ayton for OG swap?


You know what I would do to fix our PF issue? I bet with things working well in Orlando for the Franz/WCJ/Bamba frontcourt, I wonder if we can steal Isaac? They have a lot good players in that area of their team. I'm not 100% sure he'd start for them now.

I'd offere them Cam, Stix, Saric and a 1st and see what they'd say. A healthy Isaac would be amazing on this team with his length and size. He's locked up on a good deal too.

I'm not sure what Orlando would want for him but I bet he could be had.


I would easily do that (If I thought he would probably be healthy), but I think they are VERY high on Isaac. I don't think they'd trade him for even a better offer. I think they view him as their starting PF of the future.

He can't stay healthy though, which if is an issue for them would be an issue for us too.

He probably will never be the same player that he was pre injury.

I mean, he had a terrible injury. He tore his ACL and meniscus in his left knee more than a year ago. Actually close to a year and a half ago.

I am not sure about trading that package for him. He needs to show that he can play again at a high level.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1014 » by bigfoot » Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:55 pm

The twelve trades of Xmas incoming ... even though the Suns are on an eleven game win streak.


I expect to see this used as a headline of ValleyoftheSuns or Brightside
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1015 » by MrMiyagi » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:03 pm

bigfoot wrote:The twelve trades of Xmas incoming ... even though the Suns are on an eleven game win streak.


I expect to see this used as a headline of ValleyoftheSuns or Brightside

We are literally the worst team in the NBA.

Our record is meaningless.

Last season was a fluke.
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Let us sing when we can, and forget the rest. - H.P. Lovecraft
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1016 » by Ghost of Kleine » Sun Nov 21, 2021 8:20 pm

Matt Petersen (@TheMattPetersen) Tweeted:
Mikal Bridges' first 15 games are why stats can be laughably misleading. His numbers are DOWN or similar compared to last year, but EVERYONE is gushing about how improved he is.

PPG +0.6
RPG -0.8
APG -0.5
SPG -0.2
BPG -0.7
TS% -2.3
WS/48 -0.015
BPM -3.1
VORP -2.8
PER -1.6
Read on Twitter
?s=20

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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1017 » by Ghost of Kleine » Sun Nov 21, 2021 8:44 pm

Timberwolves Clips (@WolvesClips) Tweeted:
NBA leaders in points allowed per halfcourt play:

1. Golden State - 0.861
2. Phoenix - 0.861
3. Utah - 0.862
4. Minnesota - 0.864
https://t.co/Z1zU1zYjZt
Read on Twitter
?s=20

Phoenix at #2 pretty solid though :D
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1018 » by Ghost of Kleine » Sun Nov 21, 2021 8:55 pm

Xin Varlock (@XinNBA) Tweeted:
The Suns have the 11th adjusted net rating in the NBA per https://t.co/jjqx0M5Yaa due to the easiest schedule in the league so far.

This team definitely has room to improve and we’ll get to see how they fare against better teams. https://t.co/0iUniOG2d6
Read on Twitter
?s=20

We'll see how they do on this road trip as a good barometer of their true potential.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1019 » by Saberestar » Sun Nov 21, 2021 9:19 pm

Kaminsky out indefinitely. ****.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#1020 » by bwgood77 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:47 pm

Saberestar wrote:Kaminsky out indefinitely. ****.


Not something I thought I'd ever read on this forum.

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