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Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever?

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Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#1 » by Saberestar » Thu Nov 25, 2021 10:53 am

Legitimate question...there have been a better Suns team than this 2021/22 Suns?

I can't see it watching our last season's success reaching the NBA Finals and this current 14 game winning streak (and counting).

This team have it all. Great GM, great HC, an amazing couple of perennial All Stars, two upcoming borderline All Stars in Ayton and Bridges and a nice bunch of very good role players.

I can't find a better fourth option in the league than Bridges, he could average way more points per game on any team in the league. The same can be said about Ayton who would have a lot of more touches offensively on almost every other team.

We are stacked even with three players out because of injuries. Saric, Kaminsky and Nader. That proves how deep and talented our roster is and how wonderful job James Jones has done as a GM.

Discuss.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#2 » by m1chal » Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:19 am

Certainly it's the most balanced Suns team I remember and I've been a fan since '93. Respect to Jones for building it. Is it the best? Too early to say IMO. If we win the trophy or at least have another Finals run then probably yes. If not, I'm not sure. I still feel those great Nash teams from 2004 to 2007 had so much potential and should have won at least one trophy.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#3 » by Mulhollanddrive » Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:55 am

Sports are determined by results
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#4 » by Kyler Murray » Thu Nov 25, 2021 5:45 pm

Those Nash teams changed the way the game is played so I'm leaning towards them. But it's close, with another finals run, case closed.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#5 » by sunsbg » Thu Nov 25, 2021 6:09 pm

No, until they prove me wrong and win a championship this season. '93 and Nash + Amare-led teams almost certainly win it all last season.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#6 » by Bogyo » Thu Nov 25, 2021 6:11 pm

No.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#7 » by Saberestar » Thu Nov 25, 2021 6:27 pm

sunsbg wrote:No, until they prove me wrong and win a championship this season. '93 and Nash + Amare-led teams almost certainly win it all last season.

I loved those Nash+Amare teams but they could not get to the NBA Finals for a reason.

Those teams were more fun to watch but they did not look as serious and balanced as this current Suns team.

I have heard multiple times that we could have win it all in 2006-07 but I doubt it. People give too much credit to suspensions, but we had our full roster available on the sixth game in San Antonio and lost to them...we couldn't even force Game 7.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#8 » by sunsbg » Thu Nov 25, 2021 6:44 pm

Saberestar wrote:
sunsbg wrote:No, until they prove me wrong and win a championship this season. '93 and Nash + Amare-led teams almost certainly win it all last season.

I loved those Nash+Amare teams but they could not get to the NBA Finals for a reason.

Those teams were more fun to watch but they did not look as serious and balanced as this current Suns team.

I have heard multiple times that we could have win it all in 2006-07 but I doubt it. People give too much relevance to suspensions, but we had our full roster available on the sixth game in San Antonio and lost to them...we didn't even force Game 7.


One game can change a series. If Suns won gm4 in last finals they gain confidence while Bucks lose it and probably Suns win it all. That said, they had luck with injuries in both the playoffs and current run, so lets wait and see.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#9 » by bwgood77 » Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:36 pm

Saberestar wrote:
sunsbg wrote:No, until they prove me wrong and win a championship this season. '93 and Nash + Amare-led teams almost certainly win it all last season.

I loved those Nash+Amare teams but they could not get to the NBA Finals for a reason.

Those teams were more fun to watch but they did not look as serious and balanced as this current Suns team.

I have heard multiple times that we could have win it all in 2006-07 but I doubt it. People give too much credit to suspensions, but we had our full roster available on the sixth game in San Antonio and lost to them...we couldn't even force Game 7.


Do you think the Clippers that we played are as good as the Spurs and Mavs in 2005-2008? With Kawhi they might be but it would be like us beating the Spurs back then without Duncan.

Do you think they are as good as the Rockets with Olajuwon?

The Lakers with Magic, Worthy, etc? We beat the 4-1 when Magic was MVP and they were the NBA Champs.

I mean it is even close. None of those playoff teams we beat are even close to that level with the health the way it was.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#10 » by bwgood77 » Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:40 pm

No, I don't think this team is the best Suns team, but the main thing is that it's WAY too early to tell. Some of those SSOL teams were routinely destroying teams.

How easy one forgets the past. I think this team would have a tough time beating any of the teams between 89-95 and 05-07 and 09-10.

Chris Paul is a stud and hard to compare to Nash and KJ, so you could make arguments for each, but you go down the rest of those rosters and this team doesn't have nearly the experience or all star players that those did.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#11 » by Saberestar » Thu Nov 25, 2021 9:37 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
Saberestar wrote:
sunsbg wrote:No, until they prove me wrong and win a championship this season. '93 and Nash + Amare-led teams almost certainly win it all last season.

I loved those Nash+Amare teams but they could not get to the NBA Finals for a reason.

Those teams were more fun to watch but they did not look as serious and balanced as this current Suns team.

I have heard multiple times that we could have win it all in 2006-07 but I doubt it. People give too much credit to suspensions, but we had our full roster available on the sixth game in San Antonio and lost to them...we couldn't even force Game 7.


Do you think the Clippers that we played are as good as the Spurs and Mavs in 2005-2008? With Kawhi they might be but it would be like us beating the Spurs back then without Duncan.

Do you think they are as good as the Rockets with Olajuwon?

The Lakers with Magic, Worthy, etc? We beat the 4-1 when Magic was MVP and they were the NBA Champs.

I mean it is even close. None of those playoff teams we beat are even close to that level with the health the way it was.

Different eras, but I think the Rockets with Olajuwon was not a great team. They had an amazing player in Olajuwon and solid role players around him and they got Drexler later, but before getting him look at their roster... it wasn't THAT good.

I agree about the Mavs and Spurs from 2005-2008. Those were tough teams.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#12 » by bwgood77 » Thu Nov 25, 2021 10:00 pm

Saberestar wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Saberestar wrote:I loved those Nash+Amare teams but they could not get to the NBA Finals for a reason.

Those teams were more fun to watch but they did not look as serious and balanced as this current Suns team.

I have heard multiple times that we could have win it all in 2006-07 but I doubt it. People give too much credit to suspensions, but we had our full roster available on the sixth game in San Antonio and lost to them...we couldn't even force Game 7.


Do you think the Clippers that we played are as good as the Spurs and Mavs in 2005-2008? With Kawhi they might be but it would be like us beating the Spurs back then without Duncan.

Do you think they are as good as the Rockets with Olajuwon?

The Lakers with Magic, Worthy, etc? We beat the 4-1 when Magic was MVP and they were the NBA Champs.

I mean it is even close. None of those playoff teams we beat are even close to that level with the health the way it was.

Different eras, but I think the Rockets with Olajuwon was not a great team. They had an amazing player in Olajuwon and solid role players around him and they got Drexler later, but before getting him look at their roster... it wasn't THAT good.

I agree about the Mavs and Spurs from 2005-2008. Those were tough teams.


Their defense was tough. Olajuwon obviously, but Vernon Maxwell, Robert Horry and Otis Thorpe were tough too. Then they had solid 3 pt shooters at the time to surround Hakeem with and Cassell, Brooks, Elie and some other solid bench players.

They took out Stockton and Malone in 5 in the WCF after we took them to the finals and then a Knicks team that had battled the Bulls tough the prior year in the finals. In 95 we should have won, but they just hung in there and beat us, and had Drexler then...then knocked out a tough Spurs team in 7 in the WCF and swept Shaq and Penny in the finals.

Teams were tougher back then, at least then the injury riddled teams of last year and this year. Just tough comparisons.

It doesn't feel like you were watching then or perhaps in early SSOL days.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#13 » by Saberestar » Thu Nov 25, 2021 10:15 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
Saberestar wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Do you think the Clippers that we played are as good as the Spurs and Mavs in 2005-2008? With Kawhi they might be but it would be like us beating the Spurs back then without Duncan.

Do you think they are as good as the Rockets with Olajuwon?

The Lakers with Magic, Worthy, etc? We beat the 4-1 when Magic was MVP and they were the NBA Champs.

I mean it is even close. None of those playoff teams we beat are even close to that level with the health the way it was.

Different eras, but I think the Rockets with Olajuwon was not a great team. They had an amazing player in Olajuwon and solid role players around him and they got Drexler later, but before getting him look at their roster... it wasn't THAT good.

I agree about the Mavs and Spurs from 2005-2008. Those were tough teams.


Their defense was tough. Olajuwon obviously, but Vernon Maxwell, Robert Horry and Otis Thorpe were tough too. Then they had solid 3 pt shooters at the time to surround Hakeem with and Cassell, Brooks, Elie and some other solid bench players.

They took out Stockton and Malone in 5 in the WCF after we took them to the finals and then a Knicks team that had battled the Bulls tough the prior year in the finals. In 95 we should have won, but they just hung in there and beat us, and had Drexler then...then knocked out a tough Spurs team in 7 in the WCF and swept Shaq and Penny in the finals.

Teams were tougher back then, at least then the injury riddled teams of last year and this year. Just tough comparisons.

It doesn't feel like you were watching then or perhaps in early SSOL days.

I know perfectly those teams, the Rockets-Knicks Finals were one of the worst Finals ever. Edit: I talk about their skills and overall talent, the games from the Finals were really interesting.

Yeah, tough defense with a lot of contact was allowed then and players were less skilled than now, a lot of big guys were on every team's bench.

That Rockets team had a lot of players playing minutes worse than Mikal Bridges or Crowder. Sam Cassell that early in his career was not better than Cam Payne. Come on...that roster didn't have any borderline All Star. Olajuwon was amazing but that roster was seriously one of the worst ever to win a Championship IMO.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#14 » by sunsbg » Thu Nov 25, 2021 10:59 pm

'95 roster was stacked, so unfortunate Manning got injured. There are a few similarities here and there with current roster.

Starters
Charles Barkley/Deandre Ayton
Danny Manning/Jae Crowder
Dan Majerle/Devin Booker
Kevin Johnson/Chris Paul
A.C. Green/Mikal Bridges

Reserves
Wesley Person/Cam Johnson
Wayman Tisdale/Javale McGee
Elliot Perry/Cam Payne
Danny Ainge/Landry Shamet

Honorable mention
Joe Kleine/Frank Kaminsky
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#15 » by garrick » Fri Nov 26, 2021 2:42 am

I think the Barkley era Suns will handily beat this team since Barkley was an all time great player and very hard to stop in the paint.

The Suns are incredibly balanced but don't have anyone that can consistently produce in the clutch the way Barkley often could, Booker does a good job but he is obviously not on Barkley's level.

92-95 Suns are still the all time team for me.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#16 » by bwgood77 » Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:16 am

Saberestar wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Saberestar wrote:Different eras, but I think the Rockets with Olajuwon was not a great team. They had an amazing player in Olajuwon and solid role players around him and they got Drexler later, but before getting him look at their roster... it wasn't THAT good.

I agree about the Mavs and Spurs from 2005-2008. Those were tough teams.


Their defense was tough. Olajuwon obviously, but Vernon Maxwell, Robert Horry and Otis Thorpe were tough too. Then they had solid 3 pt shooters at the time to surround Hakeem with and Cassell, Brooks, Elie and some other solid bench players.

They took out Stockton and Malone in 5 in the WCF after we took them to the finals and then a Knicks team that had battled the Bulls tough the prior year in the finals. In 95 we should have won, but they just hung in there and beat us, and had Drexler then...then knocked out a tough Spurs team in 7 in the WCF and swept Shaq and Penny in the finals.

Teams were tougher back then, at least then the injury riddled teams of last year and this year. Just tough comparisons.

It doesn't feel like you were watching then or perhaps in early SSOL days.

I know perfectly those teams, the Rockets-Knicks Finals were one of the worst Finals ever. Edit: I talk about their skills and overall talent, the games from the Finals were really interesting.

Yeah, tough defense with a lot of contact was allowed then and players were less skilled than now, a lot of big guys were on every team's bench.

That Rockets team had a lot of players playing minutes worse than Mikal Bridges or Crowder. Sam Cassell that early in his career was not better than Cam Payne. Come on...that roster didn't have any borderline All Star. Olajuwon was amazing but that roster was seriously one of the worst ever to win a Championship IMO.


There is not one team in the NBA right now that feels to me as tough as the Rockets felt then. I remember fearing them after we went to the finals. I did not feel like we could beat them in 94 and then we surprisingly went up 2-0 on the road. I did not think we could beat them in 93 either but thought we could beat Seattle so was happy Seattle knocked out Houston.

You are right that was a horrible finals..not because the teams were bad but because the Rockets were like the 05 Spurs..a tough physical defensive team with 3 pt shooting along with a legendary interior scorer, so they were not exactly exciting and the Knicks had built their teams to be physical and beat the Bulls and others by being tough and physical...with tough defense. So you had these two unexciting teams in the finals and it went 7..it was a lot like the 05 finals actually. Not an exciting one to watch.

This was a team I thought was very tough (the Suns) because in 90 we had taken out MVP Magic's Showtime Lakers but lost to a tough Portland team in the WCF as KJ got hobbled, after losing to the Lakers in the WCF the year before in 89. I felt that teams in 90 would have beaten the Pistons in the finals. I think we actually swept them that year.

Anyway, then we added Barkley. In 95 I did think we were better than Houston but blew it. Those Suns teams were deep. You had guys like Manning, Ceballos, Eddie Johnson, Perry, Chambers, off the bench.

You may not think much of those Rockets as a team to lose to in the western conference, but I think they'd kill the Clippers with George, Reggie Jackson and company. We would probably hang with them ok as we did there and we took them to 7 both years and should have beaten them in 95, but these were the NBA champs with Olajuwon in his prime with solid role players playing their roles to perfection...tough defense. They were similar to the 2005 Spurs...or maybe a later version considering they had Horry, but more in his prime years...and Otis Thorpe had been an all star. Vernon Maxwell was tough, Kenny Smith solid...a career 40% 3 pt shooter, a rarity those days.

Cassell was a rookie I think but he got hot in those playoffs and averaged like 13 and 7 against us while shooting 50% from 3.

It's hard to compare eras though. It would be easy to argue that most teams these days could beat most teams those days because teams have turned it into a #s game and advanced stats and mostly just take 3s or go to the rim, so a more efficient team will always win provided they don't turn it over a bunch or allow tons of offensive boards. But the rules have also made it easier too.

So I'm speaking in relative terms as well. Could this team beat the 93 Jordan Bulls? We were probably a bad defensive play on a Paxson 3 from beating that team...I know we had one more game but it was game 7 at home..pressure would have been on the Bulls after being up 2-0 and 3-1 (like we lost to the Rockets in 95)...our team was only more experienced and improved in 94 and especially 95...Houston was just a tough matchup.

This team now might be Houston but I think that team could have beaten Houston in 95 more often than not if they played 100x. But I think that Suns team had far more experience, depth and star power. Those guys had all played in the playoffs for years...deep into the playoffs.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#17 » by bwgood77 » Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:34 am

garrick wrote:I think the Barkley era Suns will handily beat this team since Barkley was an all time great player and very hard to stop in the paint.

The Suns are incredibly balanced but don't have anyone that can consistently produce in the clutch the way Barkley often could, Booker does a good job but he is obviously not on Barkley's level.

92-95 Suns are still the all time team for me.


89-90 Suns might be my favorite. They had something...they ran, were electric, exciting...they had a Suns song playing all over the city....that is the team that walked over MVP's Magic's defending champion Lakers...it was shocking that not only the we won the series, but dominated it and won it in 5.
,
KJ, Hornacek, Majerle, Chambers, West with EJ, Rambis, Perry, etc off the bench.

They had the 3rd rated offense and 6th rated defense.

The only thing that hurt the team from the previous year, even though they were better, was they lost Tyrone Corbin in the expansion draft because they protected some younger guys like Lang who they thought would be more appealing to the expansion teams...and the Timberwolves surprisingly picked Corbin, who was a solid starter.

Though I loved the 95 team, 04-05 team, 06-07 team and enjoyed the 09-10 team. I also do love this years Suns team. Bridges is one of my favorite Suns players ever as is Paul and the whole team is likeable and you can tell they all really like each other...heck, they talk about how much they all like each other...it's rare.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#18 » by Slim Charless » Fri Nov 26, 2021 6:35 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
Saberestar wrote:
sunsbg wrote:No, until they prove me wrong and win a championship this season. '93 and Nash + Amare-led teams almost certainly win it all last season.

I loved those Nash+Amare teams but they could not get to the NBA Finals for a reason.

Those teams were more fun to watch but they did not look as serious and balanced as this current Suns team.

I have heard multiple times that we could have win it all in 2006-07 but I doubt it. People give too much credit to suspensions, but we had our full roster available on the sixth game in San Antonio and lost to them...we couldn't even force Game 7.


Do you think the Clippers that we played are as good as the Spurs and Mavs in 2005-2008? With Kawhi they might be but it would be like us beating the Spurs back then without Duncan.

Do you think they are as good as the Rockets with Olajuwon?

The Lakers with Magic, Worthy, etc? We beat the 4-1 when Magic was MVP and they were the NBA Champs.

I mean it is even close. None of those playoff teams we beat are even close to that level with the health the way it was.


I still say that the best team we had was the Nash team that was screwed by the Spurs "fight"....we should've won the chip that year.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#19 » by Bogyo » Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:04 pm

Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Saberestar wrote:I loved those Nash+Amare teams but they could not get to the NBA Finals for a reason.

Those teams were more fun to watch but they did not look as serious and balanced as this current Suns team.

I have heard multiple times that we could have win it all in 2006-07 but I doubt it. People give too much credit to suspensions, but we had our full roster available on the sixth game in San Antonio and lost to them...we couldn't even force Game 7.


Do you think the Clippers that we played are as good as the Spurs and Mavs in 2005-2008? With Kawhi they might be but it would be like us beating the Spurs back then without Duncan.

Do you think they are as good as the Rockets with Olajuwon?

The Lakers with Magic, Worthy, etc? We beat the 4-1 when Magic was MVP and they were the NBA Champs.

I mean it is even close. None of those playoff teams we beat are even close to that level with the health the way it was.


I still say that the best team we had was the Nash team that was screwed by the Spurs "fight"....we should've won the chip that year.


I'm surprised it took so long for somebody to bring this up. I feel that was our best team - even though I loved the Barkley Suns a bit more, they were my first basketball love, and that just hits different... But that Nash team changed the game and should have won it all, and would have won it all fair and square had it not been the Stern NBA... letter of the law my AAAAAAASSSSSSSSS
But yeah, what Slim said.

Oh, and happy Thanksgiving to all of our US posters.
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Re: Is this 2021/22 Suns team the best Suns team ever? 

Post#20 » by bwgood77 » Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:17 pm

Bogyo wrote:
Slim Charless wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Do you think the Clippers that we played are as good as the Spurs and Mavs in 2005-2008? With Kawhi they might be but it would be like us beating the Spurs back then without Duncan.

Do you think they are as good as the Rockets with Olajuwon?

The Lakers with Magic, Worthy, etc? We beat the 4-1 when Magic was MVP and they were the NBA Champs.

I mean it is even close. None of those playoff teams we beat are even close to that level with the health the way it was.


I still say that the best team we had was the Nash team that was screwed by the Spurs "fight"....we should've won the chip that year.


I'm surprised it took so long for somebody to bring this up. I feel that was our best team - even though I loved the Barkley Suns a bit more, they were my first basketball love, and that just hits different... But that Nash team changed the game and should have won it all, and would have won it all fair and square had it not been the Stern NBA... letter of the law my AAAAAAASSSSSSSSS
But yeah, what Slim said.

Oh, and happy Thanksgiving to all of our US posters.


Yeah, I think that was a team that easily would have won it all if not for the suspensions. We had tied it up, had 2 games at home and nearly beat them in game 5 without those guys. And then we would have crushed Utah and Cleveland.

However, in 95 we had a very tough team that had already been in the finals and lost to the Rockets after having a 2 game lead the year before and had a 2-0 and 3-1 lead and nearly won game 5. I felt we were easily the best team in the league that year as well as 2007. Those were the only two years I thought we were the best team in the league. I think we should have won that series but blew it and then game 7 game down basically to the last shot. We would have likely beaten SA as we always had their # in the 90s and then crushed Orlando.

This year as I mentioned, it's hard to say. We don't ever look like a great team outside of bits and pieces of games and 4th quarters and most of this is against bad teams so far. I think we are definitely good, but not sure how we would have looked against completely healthy Mavs and Nuggets teams. But since we are relying a lot on lack of health for wins as well, we also luckily probably get the Warriors twice before Klay returns and he may still be very rusty on Christmas Day.

I'd rather us have faced full strength and tougher teams though to get a better feel for how good we are and make us more battle tested. We should be able to beat NY though and Brooklyn without Kyrie, especially with Harden playing like he is.

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