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Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm

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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#281 » by bwgood77 » Fri Feb 25, 2022 3:09 pm

Revived wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
RunDogGun wrote:It happens, he also threw one at Ayton's feet. Crowder got a steal that Ayton made happen with a deflection. I was hoping for a few less minutes for Book, but overall the scoring was pretty balanced. And after Booker's solid assists, three of the other starters had 5, 4, and 4 assists.


It's funny Revived said that though because I thought they had credited some of the bad passes to Ayton turnovers....

Perhaps they did, I’m not sure I didn’t see that Ayton had turnovers credited to him as well.

I saw Olson tweet that they credited Booker for it though

Read on Twitter


Yeah, Ayton may have gotten a hand on some but generally people need to learn to pass it high to Ayton. How often do you see him miss passes that are high, either just over everyone, alley oops, etc? Or straight passes to his chest? It has happened once or twice where Paul bullets a pass very hard and Ayton misses it which, you can blame Ayton but it's also a bit abnormal for the passes to be that fast so somewhat understandable.

Most all the ones that either don't get to him or are mishandled are in either heavy traffic or too low. So they get deflected or the defender or several defenders have just has much chance as grabbing it as Ayton. Then the low ones below his waist are obviously tougher being a 7 footer having to bend down like that.

EJ constantly says they need to pass it up high.

Anyway, Ayton surely is to blame for some and can do better but Booker can continue to clean up on his passes. Most passses to other guys outside of his one that are way off, are not in traffic at all.

You also rarely see a Bridges, CamJ, etc, pass be mishandled by Ayton. But Ayton (and Booker and even Paul) all have bad games.

Ayton was always talked about as having great hands, but that was more or less catching balls up high...not all these low passes. But then again, being such an elite scoring threat these days, he attracts way more gravity than anyone else, making it much harder to get the ball to him, requiring people to pass over the defense, but these can be tough too as they need to have the right touch and arc to get over people and either come down a bit near Ayton or just be in a place it is easier for him to grab than anyone else.

But generally if you can't get the ball cleanly to someone, you should get the turnover. If a ball is mishandled after having control, then it's on the guy.

One thing that Book also struggles with (ego or whatever) is when he makes a bad pass or mistake he doesn't indicate my bad..hit his chest, as if to indicate that, etc..but often blames the other guy which likely isn't good for morale or confidence...he doesn this to multiple people...Bridges I've seen it and others and Bridges is usually great at catching the ball unless it's just way off or Booker doesn't see a defender in place.

All in all Booker has improved in this regard. He just needs to pass more high passes over the D to Ayton and he had been doing some of those.

He tens to sometimes go back to trying to sometimes (especially with Ayton) only pass when he runs into trouble/traffic inside instead of planning the play or pass to Ayton earlier when he has more of a clear path to throw a high pass.
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Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#282 » by Jdiddy701 » Fri Feb 25, 2022 3:17 pm

Ayton is an elite scoring threat? Averaging 16pts per game? Man, you really will say anything to make him look great and Book look bad. You can have any of the Suns bigs run to the rim and that gravity everyone talks about, is the same.

I’ve always said when passing to Ayton, if it’s not the perfect pass, it usually will not end well. No excuse for Ayton to not dominate OKC’s bigs last night. Hopefully he plays better tonight against Jonas.


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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#283 » by Barkley6 » Fri Feb 25, 2022 3:21 pm

Jdiddy701 wrote:Ayton is an elite scoring threat? Averaging 16pts per game? Man, you really will say anything to make him look great and Book look bad. You can have any of the Suns bigs run to the rim and that gravity everyone talks about, is the same.

I’ve always said when passing to Ayton, if it’s not the perfect pass, it usually will not end well. Not excuse for Ayton to not dominate OKC’s bigs last night. Hopefully he plays better tonight against Jonas.


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OKC packed the paint and dared us to beat them from the outside, which would have worked pretty well had we not gotten so many points off turnovers early on. Ayton was constantly double and triple teamed. They made it their focal point to take Ayton away and were successful.

Certainly wasn't Ayton's best game, but he doesn't have chemistry with Book as the primary ball handler. If he's still doing this after 3-4 games then we can talk, but the first game after the ASB with a new PG and new offensive principles, I'm willing to chalk it up to one bad night.
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#284 » by Jdiddy701 » Fri Feb 25, 2022 3:24 pm

Barkley6 wrote:
Jdiddy701 wrote:Ayton is an elite scoring threat? Averaging 16pts per game? Man, you really will say anything to make him look great and Book look bad. You can have any of the Suns bigs run to the rim and that gravity everyone talks about, is the same.

I’ve always said when passing to Ayton, if it’s not the perfect pass, it usually will not end well. Not excuse for Ayton to not dominate OKC’s bigs last night. Hopefully he plays better tonight against Jonas.


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OKC packed the paint and dared us to beat them from the outside, which would have worked pretty well had we not gotten so many points off turnovers early on. Ayton was constantly double and triple teamed. They made it their focal point to take Ayton away and were successful.

Certainly wasn't Ayton's best game, but he doesn't have chemistry with Book as the primary ball handler. If he's still doing this after 3-4 games then we can talk, but the first game after the ASB with a new PG and new offensive principles, I'm willing to chalk it up to one bad night.

Fair enough! Let’s hope he plays well the rest of the way without CP3 spoon feeding him. It’s his time to step it up. Really looking forward to it.


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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#285 » by bwgood77 » Fri Feb 25, 2022 3:25 pm

Saberestar wrote:This team is so great that is not even funny.

We were toying with the Thunder all game long and we destroyed them in the fourth quarter.

Book is not only an All Star, he is already an MVP candidate. 25 with 12 assists and 6 steals...oh brother!

Our wings are amazing. Mikal, Crowder and Cam Johnson gave us in this game a nice proof of their value and that we can rely on them a bit more for efficient scoring. Craig is a nice insurance for them, he can have a bigger role if needed.

Aaron Holiday is showing that James Jones is EOTY for a reason. What a nice find that cheap.

Ayton didn't score a lot but was much needed to space the floor for the rest of the team. Just his presence allows us to operate more comfortable on the perimeter.
He will score many more points on other games, not a problem at all to have nights with less than 10 points with low usage.

Happy to see Shamet back with the rest of the guys.


Yeah, most everyone looked good. No real complaints about most guys. Ayton didn't put up the best #s and the turnovers were not good but as I've mentioned, more defensive attention.

He may face more every night with Paul out too. He worked very well with Payne in the playoffs, putting up HUGE numbers in the games Paul missed at very high efficiency.

Payne is good at throwing the ball high which is why he works well with McGee. Of course McGee turns it over a lot and has really bad ball handling skills.

And McGee doesn't face nearly the defensive attention Ayton does and still turns it over 50% more per 36.
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#286 » by bwgood77 » Fri Feb 25, 2022 3:28 pm

Barkley6 wrote:Just want to make an Aaron Holiday appreciation post.

Dude has just balled out since he got here. Knows his role, doesn't do too much, tons of energy, scores, creates and plays D. Amazing that Washington gave him to us for cash.

The thing I love the most about Holiday is that he absolutely feels like a playoff player. He won't get 25 minutes a night in the playoffs, but he surely will make an impact on some games and gives us yet another look to throw at teams.

I don't want to put the cart before the horse after only 4 games, but if the Suns could get him signed to a Cam Payne-esque type contract (>$6m/Season, with some option years)...I kind of think he could be an MIP candidate next season. He's shown to be nothing but absolutely solid, and with his family pedigree you know that comes with a great work ethic.


I don't even know if he'd get as much as Payne if they let the market dictate the value as opposed to just giving him a contract otherwise.

He may even supplant Payne as the backup next year though.
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#287 » by bwgood77 » Fri Feb 25, 2022 3:35 pm

Jdiddy701 wrote:
Barkley6 wrote:
Jdiddy701 wrote:Ayton is an elite scoring threat? Averaging 16pts per game? Man, you really will say anything to make him look great and Book look bad. You can have any of the Suns bigs run to the rim and that gravity everyone talks about, is the same.

I’ve always said when passing to Ayton, if it’s not the perfect pass, it usually will not end well. Not excuse for Ayton to not dominate OKC’s bigs last night. Hopefully he plays better tonight against Jonas.


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OKC packed the paint and dared us to beat them from the outside, which would have worked pretty well had we not gotten so many points off turnovers early on. Ayton was constantly double and triple teamed. They made it their focal point to take Ayton away and were successful.

Certainly wasn't Ayton's best game, but he doesn't have chemistry with Book as the primary ball handler. If he's still doing this after 3-4 games then we can talk, but the first game after the ASB with a new PG and new offensive principles, I'm willing to chalk it up to one bad night.

Fair enough! Let’s hope he plays well the rest of the way without CP3 spoon feeding him. It’s his time to step it up. Really looking forward to it.

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There will be some up and down games and this comes with everyone. Seems to be more focus on Ayton when he doesn't put up big #s. There will be an adjustment period though.

I think you mentioned his contract too. I do hope we can work out kind of a lower contract for him. One that gets up to $30 in year 3 wouldn't be so bad when the cap jumps quite a bit in years 3 and particularly years 4 and 5.

I think 5/$125 or around Vucevic/Collins deals would be great. The real value deals like Allen or Sabonis got even better. But other teams realize his value on both sides and upside and may give him the max without the assets for a good S&T so then you almost have to match unless you just let him walk and it doesn't create enough cap space to replace him.

If they need to avoid paying more later they can sign him and trade him after next year if they have options to swap for solid Cs. Then again, a guy like Sabonis only has a couple of years left and may requre big money in his next contract and I'm not sure he's worth it either.

Ultimately $30 million later with a cap jump is not that bad. Now if he starts at $30 and gets up to near $40 at the end of a contract, that is way too much barring being utilized much more offensively.
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#288 » by bwgood77 » Fri Feb 25, 2022 3:38 pm

Jdiddy701 wrote:Ayton is an elite scoring threat? Averaging 16pts per game? Man, you really will say anything to make him look great and Book look bad. You can have any of the Suns bigs run to the rim and that gravity everyone talks about, is the same.

I’ve always said when passing to Ayton, if it’s not the perfect pass, it usually will not end well. No excuse for Ayton to not dominate OKC’s bigs last night. Hopefully he plays better tonight against Jonas.


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You're just looking at it too simply. He didnt get many shots (5) and was heavily guarded so people just couldn't get the ball to him or make clean passes. It wasn't THAT hard to see if paying attention.

It's not just going against Roby.

The elite scoring threat isn't about the PPG but how he is among the most efficient Cs and of those above him he has the most range. His hook shot is the best in the entire NBA and he has other moves too.

Being an elite scoring threat isn't defined by PPG but how big of a threat you are when you get the ball and what you do with it.
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#289 » by Jdiddy701 » Fri Feb 25, 2022 4:02 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
Jdiddy701 wrote:Ayton is an elite scoring threat? Averaging 16pts per game? Man, you really will say anything to make him look great and Book look bad. You can have any of the Suns bigs run to the rim and that gravity everyone talks about, is the same.

I’ve always said when passing to Ayton, if it’s not the perfect pass, it usually will not end well. No excuse for Ayton to not dominate OKC’s bigs last night. Hopefully he plays better tonight against Jonas.


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You're just looking at it too simply. He didnt get many shots (5) and was heavily guarded so people just couldn't get the ball to him or make clean passes. It wasn't THAT hard to see if paying attention.

It's not just going against Roby.

The elite scoring threat isn't about the PPG but how he is among the most efficienct Cs and of those above him he has the most range. His hook shot is the best in the entire NBA and he has other moves too.

Being an elite scoring threat isn't defined by PPG but how big of a threat you are when you get the ball and what you do with it.

All I’m saying, players on max contracts find a way to impact the game. Ayton didn’t do that - was terrible on both ends. I would have no issue with Ayton if he wasn’t up for a max contract. My frustration is that the Suns will be forced to match a max offer and we’ll be stuck with a player that doesn’t play to his potential. Games like last night should worry us all. Hopefully he starts to turn it on, because he’s been pretty disappointing this season.


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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#290 » by Puff » Fri Feb 25, 2022 4:20 pm

darealjuice wrote:Not sure what's worse tonight, the open 3s we're bricking or Ayton's brick hands


The final games of the season are important to Ayton. He has a chance to prove to everyone that he is worth a max contract.

He was good on the defensive but drives me nuts on his rebounding and the offensive end. He had one of those nights when if the ball does not come directly to him he just runs to the other end. I know he has good rebounding number but if he wants the max he needs to go after rebounds. While he was double and triple teamed on the offensive end he needs to or Monty needs to figure out ways to get him open. He seemed really detached last night due to his play on the offensive end. He needs to be part of our offense but last night he was a bystander.
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#291 » by Puff » Fri Feb 25, 2022 4:27 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
Jdiddy701 wrote:Ayton is an elite scoring threat? Averaging 16pts per game? Man, you really will say anything to make him look great and Book look bad. You can have any of the Suns bigs run to the rim and that gravity everyone talks about, is the same.

I’ve always said when passing to Ayton, if it’s not the perfect pass, it usually will not end well. No excuse for Ayton to not dominate OKC’s bigs last night. Hopefully he plays better tonight against Jonas.


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You're just looking at it too simply. He didnt get many shots (5) and was heavily guarded so people just couldn't get the ball to him or make clean passes. It wasn't THAT hard to see if paying attention.

It's not just going against Roby.

The elite scoring threat isn't about the PPG but how he is among the most efficienct Cs and of those above him he has the most range. His hook shot is the best in the entire NBA and he has other moves too.

Being an elite scoring threat isn't defined by PPG but how big of a threat you are when you get the ball and what you do with it.


Are you Ayton's agent?

Simply put he did not play like a max player last night. You need to open your eyes.
      "Has Beal taken over leadership of this team? Book and KD are great players but appear to not have leadership qualities"
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#292 » by bwgood77 » Fri Feb 25, 2022 4:44 pm

Puff wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Jdiddy701 wrote:Ayton is an elite scoring threat? Averaging 16pts per game? Man, you really will say anything to make him look great and Book look bad. You can have any of the Suns bigs run to the rim and that gravity everyone talks about, is the same.

I’ve always said when passing to Ayton, if it’s not the perfect pass, it usually will not end well. No excuse for Ayton to not dominate OKC’s bigs last night. Hopefully he plays better tonight against Jonas.


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You're just looking at it too simply. He didnt get many shots (5) and was heavily guarded so people just couldn't get the ball to him or make clean passes. It wasn't THAT hard to see if paying attention.

It's not just going against Roby.

The elite scoring threat isn't about the PPG but how he is among the most efficienct Cs and of those above him he has the most range. His hook shot is the best in the entire NBA and he has other moves too.

Being an elite scoring threat isn't defined by PPG but how big of a threat you are when you get the ball and what you do with it.


Are you Ayton's agent?

Simply put he did not play like a max player last night. You need to open your eyes.


I don't know why you keep going on about the max. I have constantly said he's not max worthy and I hope they can sign him for 5/$125. 5/$100 would be great but not going to happen but even 5/$150 would probably be ok given his rapid ascension in defensive versatility and effectiveness as well as offensive efficiency.

He's not worth the max right now. Few players are. Would I match rather than let him walk? Yes. If he proved not to be worth it after a year I might seek a trade.

Even if you are talking about max players, none play like max players every night. I agree last night he didn't play like a max player, or even a $20 million player.

Even though I don't think he's worth a max right now, he did often play like a max player in the playoffs when it really counted, while 22 years old.

Anyway, you're right, he didn't play max level last night I agree. And I never once said he did so the straw man argument really doesn't work.
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#293 » by ImNotMcDiSwear » Fri Feb 25, 2022 5:04 pm

A few thoughts:

Holiday looked great. I think he's worth his QO. I hope and expect we'll re-sign him. He's a better candidate to succeed CP3 than Payne due to his strength and versatility on defense.

When Payne returns, Shamet's now on our third string. His contract looks downright gruesome at this point. Biggest disappointment of the season.

SGA>Mitchell, if he can stay on the court.

I've been on the Max Ayton train since, like, the beginning of last season, long before it was cool. But doubts have sunk in over the last few weeks. $30 million is a lot, and I've come around to the view that Bridges is the more valuable player. Cam may be more valuable as well. Maxing Ayton puts a huge strain on our ability to pay for this squad not only over the course of CP3's contract, but indefinitely - especially if Book makes an All-NBA Team and qualifies for the Supermax. I have no idea what will happen this summer, but I'm almost certain that Ayton will get a max offer from someone. I'm sure we would rather S&T him for a TPE than let him walk for nothing, but I'd like to think we would receive draft compensation as well. We could still match, but he has to have another monster postseason to make it worth our while. At this point, he just doesn't look like a critical piece for this team.

Best "Point Book" performance ever. 3:1 A/TO ratio, six steals. I don't expect this experiment to be so successful every night, but if it is... maybe Book really is the successor to CP3? Way way way way too early to make that call. It's one good performance. I would need to see much more to have any confidence in going that direction.

... Are Book, Bridges and Cam Jo our "real" core? Even with great role players around them, that's not enough to contend post-CP3. If Ayton's not our second superstar, we need to think about who that might be post-CP3. If Point Book is real, our second star could play almost any position, given the versatility of that trio. Doesn't have to be a young player, either.
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#294 » by Slim Charless » Fri Feb 25, 2022 5:16 pm

Puff wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Jdiddy701 wrote:Ayton is an elite scoring threat? Averaging 16pts per game? Man, you really will say anything to make him look great and Book look bad. You can have any of the Suns bigs run to the rim and that gravity everyone talks about, is the same.

I’ve always said when passing to Ayton, if it’s not the perfect pass, it usually will not end well. No excuse for Ayton to not dominate OKC’s bigs last night. Hopefully he plays better tonight against Jonas.


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You're just looking at it too simply. He didnt get many shots (5) and was heavily guarded so people just couldn't get the ball to him or make clean passes. It wasn't THAT hard to see if paying attention.

It's not just going against Roby.

The elite scoring threat isn't about the PPG but how he is among the most efficienct Cs and of those above him he has the most range. His hook shot is the best in the entire NBA and he has other moves too.

Being an elite scoring threat isn't defined by PPG but how big of a threat you are when you get the ball and what you do with it.


Are you Ayton's agent?

Simply put he did not play like a max player last night. You need to open your eyes.
RaisingArizona wrote:
Blonde wrote:Ayton looks pedestrian far too often. He played like a max contract guy in the playoffs last year, hopefully he can do it again. If not it’s going to get pretty ugly when he’s making 30 million and has games like he did tonight.
Maybe JJ was right to wait to extend him. Let's see how it all plays out


Tell me you're not watching the games without telling me you're not watching the games. Ayton has 1 semi bad night and he sucks again.

News flash boys. Ayton is averaging career highs in:

FG%
TS%
OBPM
DBPM
VROP
PER

....all while averaging a career low in mins. In other words, he's having the best, most efficient year he's ever had. Monty is playing him less since we have McGee and DA is doing wayyyy more and being a better player despite that.

I swear where ru bashers (not you BW) on the nights he's awesome? I'm bumping this post each time he blows it up lol.
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#295 » by Slim Charless » Fri Feb 25, 2022 5:20 pm

If you guys wanna get mad at a Suns player, save the anger for Tiny Dancer.
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#296 » by WeekapaugGroove » Fri Feb 25, 2022 5:21 pm

Couple thoughts on the Ayton situation.

I think it's a good example of what's wrong with the max contract in general. Because the max contract exists it sets a number that guys expect and create a group of guys who get it that simply aren't on the same tier as true max franchise guys.

He's also squarely in the debate of how valuable are guys who can't really create for themselves so their success depends on others.

Lastly the toughest debate for me is this. I believe if you replaced Ayton with a competent replacement level starting C there wouldn't be any change in team success against like 90% of the league... BUT I do think he matters against certain opponents who have an elite big like Jokic. If the goal is to win a championship that 10% could matter.

Now in a perfect world the suns owner would be crazy rich and I'd say pay everyone but it's not a perfect world.

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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#297 » by Slim Charless » Fri Feb 25, 2022 5:25 pm

He's a max guy. Our team looks entirely different without him. Pay the man. Unless we're getting a certain "Z" named player return via trade than pay the man and move on.
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#298 » by Puff » Fri Feb 25, 2022 5:29 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
Puff wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
You're just looking at it too simply. He didnt get many shots (5) and was heavily guarded so people just couldn't get the ball to him or make clean passes. It wasn't THAT hard to see if paying attention.

It's not just going against Roby.

The elite scoring threat isn't about the PPG but how he is among the most efficienct Cs and of those above him he has the most range. His hook shot is the best in the entire NBA and he has other moves too.

Being an elite scoring threat isn't defined by PPG but how big of a threat you are when you get the ball and what you do with it.


Are you Ayton's agent?

Simply put he did not play like a max player last night. You need to open your eyes.


I don't know why you keep going on about the max. I have constantly said he's not max worthy and I hope they can sign him for 5/$125. 5/$100 would be great but not going to happen but even 5/$150 would probably be ok given his rapid ascension in defensive versatility and effectiveness as well as offensive efficiency.

He's not worth the max right now. Few players are. Would I match rather than let him walk? Yes. If he proved not to be worth it after a year I might seek a trade.

Even if you are talking about max players, none play like max players every night. I agree last night he didn't play like a max player, or even a $20 million player.

Even though I don't think he's worth a max right now, he did often play like a max player in the playoffs when it really counted, while 22 years old.

Anyway, you're right, he didn't play max level last night I agree. And I never once said he did so the straw man argument really doesn't work.


I know you have repeatedly said he is not worth the max. That is all I am saying. We probably will have to pay him the max. It will be interesting to see what offers he gets on the open market once he hits free agency. I just hope he earns prior to this summer. If he does, our team will be a monster to beat. It already is pretty damn good, it will be even better,

My issue is that I do not see the ferocity that I expect from a Max player. He appears to have the skills to be a max player but far too often is just too passive to be considered to be one. We have so many scoring options we do not need him on most nights. However, I expect we will need him come the playoffs.

This is a great time for him to show us and James Jones that he is worth the max. I am rooting for him to do just that.
      "Has Beal taken over leadership of this team? Book and KD are great players but appear to not have leadership qualities"
Barkley6
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#299 » by Barkley6 » Fri Feb 25, 2022 5:47 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
Barkley6 wrote:Just want to make an Aaron Holiday appreciation post.

Dude has just balled out since he got here. Knows his role, doesn't do too much, tons of energy, scores, creates and plays D. Amazing that Washington gave him to us for cash.

The thing I love the most about Holiday is that he absolutely feels like a playoff player. He won't get 25 minutes a night in the playoffs, but he surely will make an impact on some games and gives us yet another look to throw at teams.

I don't want to put the cart before the horse after only 4 games, but if the Suns could get him signed to a Cam Payne-esque type contract (>$6m/Season, with some option years)...I kind of think he could be an MIP candidate next season. He's shown to be nothing but absolutely solid, and with his family pedigree you know that comes with a great work ethic.


I don't even know if he'd get as much as Payne if they let the market dictate the value as opposed to just giving him a contract otherwise.

He may even supplant Payne as the backup next year though.


Not saying he would, but if he's signed for around $4-5m per season, with a couple of option years I think that's fair value for Holiday. Somewhere in the realm of 4/$20m, 3rd year team option, 4th year non-guaranteed or something seems pretty reasonable for someone with Holiday's resume thus far.
dremill24
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Re: Game 59: Phoenix Suns (48-10) @ OKC Thunder (18-41) l Thursday l 6:00pm 

Post#300 » by dremill24 » Fri Feb 25, 2022 6:02 pm

Puff wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Jdiddy701 wrote:Ayton is an elite scoring threat? Averaging 16pts per game? Man, you really will say anything to make him look great and Book look bad. You can have any of the Suns bigs run to the rim and that gravity everyone talks about, is the same.

I’ve always said when passing to Ayton, if it’s not the perfect pass, it usually will not end well. No excuse for Ayton to not dominate OKC’s bigs last night. Hopefully he plays better tonight against Jonas.


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You're just looking at it too simply. He didnt get many shots (5) and was heavily guarded so people just couldn't get the ball to him or make clean passes. It wasn't THAT hard to see if paying attention.

It's not just going against Roby.

The elite scoring threat isn't about the PPG but how he is among the most efficienct Cs and of those above him he has the most range. His hook shot is the best in the entire NBA and he has other moves too.

Being an elite scoring threat isn't defined by PPG but how big of a threat you are when you get the ball and what you do with it.


Are you Ayton's agent?

Simply put he did not play like a max player last night. You need to open your eyes.


Think he might be Ayton's concubine actually. Doesnt it get tiring trying to defend him against every single post? You're allowed to see one and just let it go y'know.

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