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I was looking around at the rosters….
It may be us.

I’m not sure we will have the best athlete on the floor vrs anyone… may be not even the #2

Who is our most athletic guy? Okogee? Bridges?

This is going to be a problem especially if Jones proceeds with his evisceration plan

FWIW our starters have never been that athletic during the Monty era. The last truly athletic rotation guy was Kelly Oubre, maybe McGee but he's mostly just quick hops and length. Going further back, you have Chriss, Josh Jackson, DJJr...

It is known.

Frank Lee wrote::o I was looking around at the rosters….
It may be us.

I’m not sure we will have the best athlete on the floor vrs anyone… may be not even the #2

Who is our most athletic guy? Okogee? Bridges?

This is going to be a problem especially if Jones proceeds with his evisceration plan

Yeah, we don't have athletes. It is amazing we had the #4 offense and #3 defense this past year. I don't imagine it getting any better.

Anyone know anything about Turner's athleticism. In discussing his rebounding on the GB, a Pacers fan mentioned he doesn't have the skill set to be a good rebounder but he's pretty good at boxing out. Also said he didn't have a second jump. I'm thinking that's kind of weird if he's such a great shot blocker but maybe he does it a lot without jumping much or getting off the ground much.

lilfishi22 wrote:FWIW our starters have never been that athletic during the Monty era. The last truly athletic rotation guy was Kelly Oubre, maybe McGee but he's mostly just quick hops and length. Going further back, you have Chriss, Josh Jackson, DJJr...

No need to look further back

Short and slow going to kill us now.

In an Ayton free world, our bigs are Saric, Crowder, Smack, and some Aussie kid?

I’d wager we will lead the west in rebounding disparity and offensive boards given up, and it’s almost a certainty vs playoff contenders

It doesn’t seem to concern Jones

Frank Lee wrote:

lilfishi22 wrote:FWIW our starters have never been that athletic during the Monty era. The last truly athletic rotation guy was Kelly Oubre, maybe McGee but he's mostly just quick hops and length. Going further back, you have Chriss, Josh Jackson, DJJr...

No need to look further back

Short and slow going to kill us now.

In an Ayton free world, our bigs are Saric, Crowder, Smack, and some Aussie kid?

I’d wager we will lead the west in rebounding disparity and offensive boards given up, and it’s almost a certainty vs playoff contenders

It doesn’t seem to concern Jones

I think that's a bit of a stretch to say it doesn't concern him. I just think he looks at our needs differentially, in the sense that athleticism is not the end all and be all. You could be the most athletic big in the game, grab 15 rebounds and not be able to do much else (DeAndre Jordan comes to mind) for example. I do think we should add more athletic guys because it just makes us that much harder to defend when good defenders puts their clamps on average athletes but you have to find that right balance and combination of athleticism, skill set and being productive and impactful. Booker isn't a jump of the gym kinda athlete but that kid is very productive and impactful. Marquese Chriss, ultra athlete, probably has a lower BBIQ than his vertical.

My point being, it's not that easy. There are a ton of NBA athletes that would blow 3/4 of our roster out of the water in a combine but they wouldn't see a minute of playing time because they don't have the requisite skill set.

We have had rosters with too many young athletes but not truly basketball players before and didn't look good at all.

I value much more players with high basketball IQ, intangibles, shooting and handles rather than pure athletes who are learning the game forever. I prefer players that know how to play the game and love it and then improve physically.

Skill is the important prerequisite for being good and its all thats really needed in the regular season but when you start getting into title contention, the best teams are highly skilled AND athletic, so being only one of those things becomes a problem at that point if you're able to get that far.

Come on Frank, strictly depending on athleticism is probably the worst thing that any team can do in today's league. Phi Slama Jama just wouldn't fly in today's game.

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Ok then… Don’t just focus on athleticism… Size, length and speed matter too

How does our front line match up against Denver, NOLA, Clips, Minny, Griz, etc … will we have an edge against anyone? DA gave us an edge… the Smack ? Not so much

The plod squad will be challenged. We really haven’t improved to date

To be fair, we never had real athletes. Josh Jackson and Marquese Chriss were imposters. Real athletes don't set records for missed dunks. We had DJJr for about 20 games. Oubre was a legit athlete, as were Holmes and Melton. That's about it.

On our current roster, Okogie's an athlete. Biyombo's not bad. Booker's a solid athlete, too. But that's... that's it.

The thing I really hate about losing Ayton is: historically, this franchise has lacked high-quality centers. We played small ball for years and years, and for years and years we got beat by dominant bigs: KAJ, Hakeem, Shaq, Duncan. Now we finally have an All-Star caliber center and what do we do? We decide to go small, after losing in the finals due to a lack of size, and then a 64-win season where we prioritized big man depth.

We won't match that win total. And we'll miss Ayton right away no matter what we do - and for years to come.

What a bummer.

Yeah this has been a complaint for a while now. As one other user here put it, James Jones has a "type" and it's not like how Toronto or Boston builds their teams.

Jones likes "nice guys" who are slow drop coverage bigs or shooting guard (6'4"-6'5") sized wings.

He's never made an attempt to acquire a switch big or large wing. A big wing was an obvious thing to try and get seeing as we're looking at giving up our big wing depth for KD, but we went and got a Shamet clone in Lee. And as for centers we've always just had redundant players who can't switch backing up Ayton, with McGee, Biyombo, Jock, and Saric all slow footed players.

Championship Spurs and Warriors were not all that athletic. More high iq/methodical.

bwgood77 wrote:Championship Spurs and Warriors were not all that athletic. More high iq/methodical.

They weren't obscenely athletic but were further along there than the Suns, to go along with generational skill/IQ. Parker could get into the lane whenever he wanted with his quickness. Duncan next to a center towered over most front lines. Kawhi was/is a physical monstrosity. For Dubs, Steph was/is impossible to guard, Iguodala is literally a perfect basketball body w/ size, strength, quickness, leaping, etc. along with elite IQ. Draymond is super strong/quick. Both squads just so much more physically gifted than this team. The only guy who isn't physically overmatched most nights is Ayton, who doesn't really use those gifts very well lol.

To Frank's point, this team gets outclassed with strength, speed, size, etc. when they get to the highest levels where the team's high level of skill is matched by their high-level opponent. It's a "16 game" problem as opposed to an "82 game" problem, but when you start competing for titles, it's smaller things that separate the champions from the rest. This kind of thing can be one of them if you don't have other anomalous strengths to overcome it.

dremill24 wrote:

bwgood77 wrote:Championship Spurs and Warriors were not all that athletic. More high iq/methodical.

They weren't obscenely athletic but were further along there than the Suns, to go along with generational skill/IQ. Parker could get into the lane whenever he wanted with his quickness. Duncan next to a center towered over most front lines. Kawhi was/is a physical monstrosity. For Dubs, Steph was/is impossible to guard, Iguodala is literally a perfect basketball body w/ size, strength, quickness, leaping, etc. along with elite IQ. Draymond is super strong/quick. Both squads just so much more physically gifted than this team. The only guy who isn't physically overmatched most nights is Ayton, who doesn't really use those gifts very well lol.

To Frank's point, this team gets outclassed with strength, speed, size, etc. when they get to the highest levels where the team's high level of skill is matched by their high-level opponent. It's a "16 game" problem as opposed to an "82 game" problem, but when you start competing for titles, it's smaller things that separate the champions from the rest. This kind of thing can be one of them if you don't have other anomalous strengths to overcome it.

Yeah, I thought of Iggy...he's very athletic and was thinking that Steph is athletic in a different kind of way than you normall think. Wiggins is now athletic. Spurs don't seem super athletic. Kawhi is but I was more thinking earlier. Robinson was...but those teams we battled. I guess you could say Parker was. Manu in his own way.

But yes, a lot more than the Shamet's, Sarics and Landales.

I wonder how our most athletic player is. Bridges seems pretty athletic....those fast breaks seem effortless. Payne seems pretty athletic.

And of course Book had a good time in his shuttle run at the combine.

ImNotMcDiSwear wrote:To be fair, we never had real athletes. Josh Jackson and Marquese Chriss were imposters. Real athletes don't set records for missed dunks. We had DJJr for about 20 games. Oubre was a legit athlete, as were Holmes and Melton. That's about it.

On our current roster, Okogie's an athlete. Biyombo's not bad. Booker's a solid athlete, too. But that's... that's it.

The thing I really hate about losing Ayton is: historically, this franchise has lacked high-quality centers. We played small ball for years and years, and for years and years we got beat by dominant bigs: KAJ, Hakeem, Shaq, Duncan. Now we finally have an All-Star caliber center and what do we do? We decide to go small, after losing in the finals due to a lack of size, and then a 64-win season where we prioritized big man depth.

We won't match that win total. And we'll miss Ayton right away no matter what we do - and for years to come.

What a bummer.

ever had real athletes? I think Amare and Marion were great athletes. Joe Johnson was pretty athletic. McDyess was athletic as was Kidd, Penny (though not as much after injury), Finley was pretty athletic especially when we had him. Dumas was super athletic. KJ was super athletic.

Seems like we've had a lot of athletic guys.

lilfishi22 wrote:FWIW our starters have never been that athletic during the Monty era. The last truly athletic rotation guy was Kelly Oubre, maybe McGee but he's mostly just quick hops and length. Going further back, you have Chriss, Josh Jackson, DJJr...

Yeah .. I remember the overabundance of fast twitch muscles with just a light sprinkling of gray matter.

bwgood77 wrote:Seems like we've had a lot of athletic guys.

For whatever reason I thought we were talking post-SSOL.

lilfishi22 wrote:FWIW our starters have never been that athletic during the Monty era. The last truly athletic rotation guy was Kelly Oubre, maybe McGee but he's mostly just quick hops and length. Going further back, you have Chriss, Josh Jackson, DJJr...

In McD's era Suns had a lot of very athletic players who wasn't good at basketball. Well I guess having unathletic guys who can play is a bit better.

It was a problem last yr come play off time. 64 wins is not a defense for the poutstanding finish we witnessed.

At least we retained DA for now, but this flaw will resurface.