Duane Washington Jr. signs a two-way contract with the Suns

[Saberestar]

Interesting player who had a solid rookie season for the Pacers. 22 years old. Undrafted.

He is an small SG. He is 6'2.25" without shoes but has a nice 6'7.75" wingspan.

I haven't seen enough from him to know if he can play some PG, but initially I think he will be used strictly as a microwave scorer coming from the bench.

He was born in Germany and his father played professional basketball. Derek Fisher is his uncle.

I am interested in watching his value on defense and if he can cover decently all type of PGs and SGs.

[Saberestar]

Watch on YouTube

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Gotta love the shooting, and the hair. But here's what I see:

Paul/Payne
Booker/Shamet/Lee/Okogie/Washington
Bridges/Craig
Crowder/Johnson
Ayton/Saric/Landale/Biyombo

I think there's a decent chance we expect to move Landry Shamet.

[sunskerr]

WE CALLED IT BOYS. PACERS WAVED HIM FOR AYTON AND JONES GOT HIM LOL.

[bwgood77]

Gotta love the shooting, and the hair. But here's what I see:

Paul/Payne
Booker/Shamet/Lee/Okogie/Washington
Bridges/Craig
Crowder/Johnson
Ayton/Saric/Landale/Biyombo

I think there's a decent chance we expect to move Landry Shamet.

He's the guy I'm most like to move because he has 2 years left guaranteed and is overpaid, but I think he would be the hardest to move. I think it would definitely require a pick unless we take back a contract that is equally bad.

I really don't think you want us to rely on any of the guys behind him though to really play serious minutes. I mean those guys really are not that good at all. The would not be playoff rotation guys...or certainly shouldn't be. If we lose Payne in a KD trade, even as bad as people think he is, our guard depth really really sucks and Paul and Book only played in 65 and 68 games last year and also were injured in playoffs.

If we still have Crowder and Paul or Book get injured we will need to just slide Bridges to 2 and start Cam at 3 with Paul or Book at PG, unless Payne really bounces back. I do expect him to bounce back somewhere in between last year and the year before and Shamet can't be much worse.

But no one really seemed to want Shamet on his rookie deal (though he was moved in deals for big name or first round picks) but at nearly $10 million a year for 2 years that's a lot for what he provides (or doesn't).

[bwgood77]

If a non playoff team now rebuilding waived a guy after his rookie season I don't think I'd expect much from him. I know they did to clear space for Ayton, but if they had that many more guys ahead of him being a young rebuilding team, he's probably not great. Looks like he must be a terrible defender. At least it's just a 2 way.

[RedIndian]

As a 2-way player, he's a fairly intriguing prospect.

41% on catch and shoot threes.
47% on corner threes.
42% on midrange pullups (not great, but okayish)
44% on shots at the rim (not good, but on decent volume there)

He has shown definite evidence of self-creation. Really nice dribble package, and likes to attack the rim even though he's not a great finisher. That said, he could always improve there.

Definitely buy into his shooting though. Very good form and quick release and doesn't lack confidence at all. We do need a player like that who's willing to shoot confidently and can create for himself.

On the negative side, whatever clips I've seen of him, he looks a pretty bad defender. Having said that, the physical tools are there (6'3 with a near 6'8 wingspan) to at least be a decent defender.

[nevetsov]

Sounds like Aaron Holiday without the defense?

[sunskerr]

If a non playoff team now rebuilding waived a guy after his rookie season I don't think I'd expect much from him. I know they did to clear space for Ayton, but if they had that many more guys ahead of him being a young rebuilding team, he's probably not great. Looks like he must be a terrible defender. At least it's just a 2 way.

He averaged 10 ppg off the bench with 40% 3P%, but the Pacers have Haliburton and McConnell who are both way better and command 100% of the PG minutes. These are the types of guys you have to find and take chances on in the NBA. Some of them work out, some don't. But if you're not even trying to find diamonds in the rough on bargain bin contracts you're miles behind many front offices.

You can poke and prod at any prospect's deficiencies, but every prospect has deficiencies. Another cheap player we've been trying to bring along right now but hasn't done anything is Ish Wainwright, but we all have hope for him, too.

Just have to hope it works out.

[bwgood77]

If a non playoff team now rebuilding waived a guy after his rookie season I don't think I'd expect much from him. I know they did to clear space for Ayton, but if they had that many more guys ahead of him being a young rebuilding team, he's probably not great. Looks like he must be a terrible defender. At least it's just a 2 way.

He averaged 10 ppg off the bench with 40% 3P%, but the Pacers have Haliburton and McConnell who are both way better and command 100% of the PG minutes. These are the types of guys you have to find and take chances on in the NBA. Some of them work out, some don't. But if you're not even trying to find diamonds in the rough on bargain bin contracts you're miles behind many front offices.

You can poke and prod at any prospect's deficiencies, but every prospect has deficiencies. Another cheap player we've been trying to bring along right now but hasn't done anything is Ish Wainwright, but we all have hope for him, too.

Just have to hope it works out.

I definitely think it's good to roll the dice on these guys, especially with a 2 way, but I wouldn't expect him to be a key rotation piece in the playoffs. Yes, his offense was ok, but only 37% from 3, not 40%, and 43% from 2, and defense bad. Didn't see him play but his RAPTOR ratings and other not good. But of course with a first year player and a guy on a 2 way contract, worth giving a shot.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

If a non playoff team now rebuilding waived a guy after his rookie season I don't think I'd expect much from him. I know they did to clear space for Ayton, but if they had that many more guys ahead of him being a young rebuilding team, he's probably not great. Looks like he must be a terrible defender. At least it's just a 2 way.

He averaged 10 ppg off the bench with 40% 3P%, but the Pacers have Haliburton and McConnell who are both way better and command 100% of the PG minutes. These are the types of guys you have to find and take chances on in the NBA. Some of them work out, some don't. But if you're not even trying to find diamonds in the rough on bargain bin contracts you're miles behind many front offices.

You can poke and prod at any prospect's deficiencies, but every prospect has deficiencies. Another cheap player we've been trying to bring along right now but hasn't done anything is Ish Wainwright, but we all have hope for him, too.

Just have to hope it works out.

I definitely think it's good to roll the dice on these guys, especially with a 2 way, but I wouldn't expect him to be a key rotation piece in the playoffs. Yes, his offense was ok, but only 37% from 3, not 40%, and 43% from 2, and defense bad. Didn't see him play but his RAPTOR ratings and other not good. But of course with a first year player and a guy on a 2 way contract, worth giving a shot.

What I like to look for with shooters is volume. 40% is better than 37%, but he shot a 3 every 4.5 minutes. The volume supports the idea that he'll be a good shooter. Doesn't do much else, really, though at least his A/TO ratio is over 1 (1.5). I doubt he'll be of much value except as a stop gap unless he improves as a defender, shooter and/or playmaker. Still, it's nice to have a little more youth.

[bwgood77]

He averaged 10 ppg off the bench with 40% 3P%, but the Pacers have Haliburton and McConnell who are both way better and command 100% of the PG minutes. These are the types of guys you have to find and take chances on in the NBA. Some of them work out, some don't. But if you're not even trying to find diamonds in the rough on bargain bin contracts you're miles behind many front offices.

You can poke and prod at any prospect's deficiencies, but every prospect has deficiencies. Another cheap player we've been trying to bring along right now but hasn't done anything is Ish Wainwright, but we all have hope for him, too.

Just have to hope it works out.

I definitely think it's good to roll the dice on these guys, especially with a 2 way, but I wouldn't expect him to be a key rotation piece in the playoffs. Yes, his offense was ok, but only 37% from 3, not 40%, and 43% from 2, and defense bad. Didn't see him play but his RAPTOR ratings and other not good. But of course with a first year player and a guy on a 2 way contract, worth giving a shot.

What I like to look for with shooters is volume. 40% is better than 37%, but he shot a 3 every 4.5 minutes. The volume supports the idea that he'll be a good shooter. Doesn't do much else, really, though at least his A/TO ratio is over 1 (1.5). I doubt he'll be of much value except as a stop gap unless he improves as a defender, shooter and/or playmaker. Still, it's nice to have a little more youth.

Yeah, volume is important but 1 year is hard to take a lot from. Crowder shot 39% from 2 on 6.3 attempts per game his first year with us but dropped last year. Payne shot 44% his first year with us and 33.6% this past year.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

I definitely think it's good to roll the dice on these guys, especially with a 2 way, but I wouldn't expect him to be a key rotation piece in the playoffs. Yes, his offense was ok, but only 37% from 3, not 40%, and 43% from 2, and defense bad. Didn't see him play but his RAPTOR ratings and other not good. But of course with a first year player and a guy on a 2 way contract, worth giving a shot.

What I like to look for with shooters is volume. 40% is better than 37%, but he shot a 3 every 4.5 minutes. The volume supports the idea that he'll be a good shooter. Doesn't do much else, really, though at least his A/TO ratio is over 1 (1.5). I doubt he'll be of much value except as a stop gap unless he improves as a defender, shooter and/or playmaker. Still, it's nice to have a little more youth.

Yeah, volume is important but 1 year is hard to take a lot from. Crowder shot 39% from 2 on 6.3 attempts per game his first year with us but dropped last year. Payne shot 44% his first year with us and 33.6% this past year.

It's true. Shooting is hard to project. Remember that one year where every Celtic shot the best 3FG% of their careers? Systems matter. Scouting matters. Too many things matter. Hell, you can have a great shooter just ice out for no reason (Majerle, Frye). Nothing is certain in this life, my friend.

[bwgood77]

What I like to look for with shooters is volume. 40% is better than 37%, but he shot a 3 every 4.5 minutes. The volume supports the idea that he'll be a good shooter. Doesn't do much else, really, though at least his A/TO ratio is over 1 (1.5). I doubt he'll be of much value except as a stop gap unless he improves as a defender, shooter and/or playmaker. Still, it's nice to have a little more youth.

Yeah, volume is important but 1 year is hard to take a lot from. Crowder shot 39% from 2 on 6.3 attempts per game his first year with us but dropped last year. Payne shot 44% his first year with us and 33.6% this past year.

It's true. Shooting is hard to project. Remember that one year where every Celtic shot the best 3FG% of their careers? Systems matter. Scouting matters. Too many things matter. Hell, you can have a great shooter just ice out for no reason (Majerle, Frye). Nothing is certain in this life, my friend.

Yeah, Bridges was 42.5% from 3 in 20-21 while CamJ was 34.9% and this past year Cam was 42.5% while Bridges was 36.9%.

[WeekapaugGroove]

Yeah, volume is important but 1 year is hard to take a lot from. Crowder shot 39% from 2 on 6.3 attempts per game his first year with us but dropped last year. Payne shot 44% his first year with us and 33.6% this past year.

It's true. Shooting is hard to project. Remember that one year where every Celtic shot the best 3FG% of their careers? Systems matter. Scouting matters. Too many things matter. Hell, you can have a great shooter just ice out for no reason (Majerle, Frye). Nothing is certain in this life, my friend.

Yeah, Bridges was 42.5% from 3 in 20-21 while CamJ was 34.9% and this past year Cam was 42.5% while Bridges was 36.9%.

Even over a 82 game season it's still a fairly small sample size with 3pt %. Take a guy like Shamet who shot 123 for 334 on 3s last year for a 36% clip. If he makes just 10 more 3s over the course of the season that would have been a 40% 3pt season and we view his year a little different. Like one hot or cold shoot week can swing these numbers. Hell just a few lucky bounces and he might have got there.

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[Frank Lee]

But when you jack twice as many 3s as 2s, you better be at the 40% clip and better. That’s pretty much his alleged forte

Reverse engineering makes good stats seem so attainable. The difference between a career .280 hitter and a .300 one is like a dozen hits a yr. That’s 2 or so a month. Seems easy eh?

[WeekapaugGroove]

But when you jack twice as many 3s as 2s, you better be at the 40% clip and better. That’s pretty much his alleged forte

Reverse engineering makes good stats seem so attainable. The difference between a career .280 hitter and a .300 one is like a dozen hits a yr. That’s 2 or so a month. Seems easy eh?

It's why you see pretty wild swings in baseball player averages year to year. Not uncommon for a dude to hit 290 one year and like 210 the next.

I was just using Shamet as an example of how fine of a line there can be with this stuff. I think we get a little too caught up in basing conclusions purely from numbers. We'll see a guy shoot 35% from 3 one year and then 40% the next, well jump to a conclusion that he's suddenly a better shooter when it might just be he had a hot week or two.

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[Saberestar]

He is by far the best two-way contract that we have ever had, no doubt about it.

His handles are great. I didn't expect that level of ball handling, he can go wherever he wants on the court. He can really play PG.

He has a quick release and his scoring mentality makes him a threat everytime on the court.

I wouldn't be surprised if James Jones offers him an official spot with a multi-year contract.

[Saberestar]

Watch on YouTube

[bwgood77]

He is by far the best two-way player that we have ever had, no doubt about it.

His handles are great. I didn't expect that level of ball handling, he can go wherever he wants on the court. He can really play PG.

He has a quick release and his scoring mentality makes him a threat everytime on the court.

I wouldn't be surprised if James Jones offers him an official spot with a multi-year contract.

I read this a few times thinking you meant "two way player" as offense/defense and I'm thinking..."what"?