2023 Draft Discussion

[KdoubleDees23]

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Gosh! I really hope that the suns are in on this guy in the 2nd round as that elusive elite microwave scorer we've been missing for so long!

This guy is Josh Jackson but worse. He is not going to be a good NBA player, even for a 2nd round pick! The MAC is a horrible division and he cant even lead his team!

[Ghost of Kleine]

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Gosh! I really hope that the suns are in on this guy in the 2nd round as that elusive elite microwave scorer we've been missing for so long!

This guy is Josh Jackson but worse. He is not going to be a good NBA player, even for a 2nd round pick! The MAC is a horrible division and he cant even lead his team!

While I do get your concerns that he's got a lot of maturity issues and growth to work on sure! His athleticism and wingspan is not elite either. And he needs to work on being more team oriented in order to advance his value beyond a mid to late 2nd round prospect. But his scoring package is absolutely elite with significant offensive versatility and big shot making potential. also, he already possesses that supreme irrational confidence that separates star potential from the average nba options.

So considering that he could be acquired with nothing more than a mid to late 2nd, he'd still represent a significant value pickup. And seeing as how ( with Durant) we'll not be rebuilding right away anyways, we could pick him up pretty cheap and stash him in the G league for a couple of years and let him mature and adjust into a more experienced and seasoned level headed player with time and maturity! But it's important to remember that Bates was a legitimate top 5 lottery player and a 5 star prospect coming into college. Jackson's misplaced percieved value was mostly do to his upside athleticism and defensive versatility. But I'm not sure he's ever shown the capacity/ capability to actually score or put up games like Bates has.

Bottomline is Bates has already shown elite outlier star traits/ abilities. Jackson was mostly a big upside swing with not showing much. And his cost was a lottery pick. Bates cost would be at best no more than a mid to late 2nd. Getting him for pennies on the dollar as an elite upside development swing would be a fairly different scenario obviously.

[bwgood77]

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Gosh! I really hope that the suns are in on this guy in the 2nd round as that elusive elite microwave scorer we've been missing for so long!

This guy is Josh Jackson but worse. He is not going to be a good NBA player, even for a 2nd round pick! The MAC is a horrible division and he cant even lead his team!

While I do get your concerns that he's got a lot of maturity issues and growth to work on sure! His athleticism and wingspan is not elite either. And he needs to work on being more team oriented in order to advance his value beyond a mid to late 2nd round prospect. But his scoring package is absolutely elite with significant offensive versatility and big shot making potential. also, he already possesses that supreme irrational confidence that separates star potential from the average nba options.

So considering that he could be acquired with nothing more than a mid to late 2nd, he'd still represent a significant value pickup. And seeing as how ( with Durant) we'll not be rebuilding right away anyways, we could pick him up pretty cheap and stash him in the G league for a couple of years and let him mature and adjust into a more experienced and seasoned level headed player with time and maturity! But it's important to remember that Bates was a legitimate top 5 lottery player and a 5 star prospect coming into college. Jackson's misplaced percieved value was mostly do to his upside athleticism and defensive versatility. But I'm not sure he's ever shown the capacity/ capability to actually score or put up games like Bates has.

Bottomline is Bates has already shown elite outlier star traits/ abilities. Jackson was mostly a big upside swing with not showing much. And his cost was a lottery pick. Bates cost would be at best no more than a mid to late 2nd. Getting him for pennies on the dollar as an elite upside development swing would be a fairly different scenario obviously.

Perhaps Jackson should have similarly fallen to 2nd round value.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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He's no Mikal Bridges, But IF we anticipate losing Okogie to a bigger offer than we could give in free agency, then this kid is a really good defensive wing consideration as a potential replacement.
https://www.noceilingsnba.com/p/a-sleeper-in-slawson-jalen-slawsons?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=536361&post_id=101533906&isFreemail=true&utm_medium=email

[Ghost of Kleine]

This guy is Josh Jackson but worse. He is not going to be a good NBA player, even for a 2nd round pick! The MAC is a horrible division and he cant even lead his team!

While I do get your concerns that he's got a lot of maturity issues and growth to work on sure! His athleticism and wingspan is not elite either. And he needs to work on being more team oriented in order to advance his value beyond a mid to late 2nd round prospect. But his scoring package is absolutely elite with significant offensive versatility and big shot making potential. also, he already possesses that supreme irrational confidence that separates star potential from the average nba options.

So considering that he could be acquired with nothing more than a mid to late 2nd, he'd still represent a significant value pickup. And seeing as how ( with Durant) we'll not be rebuilding right away anyways, we could pick him up pretty cheap and stash him in the G league for a couple of years and let him mature and adjust into a more experienced and seasoned level headed player with time and maturity! But it's important to remember that Bates was a legitimate top 5 lottery player and a 5 star prospect coming into college. Jackson's misplaced perceived value was mostly do to his upside athleticism and defensive versatility. But I'm not sure he's ever shown the capacity/ capability to actually score or put up games like Bates has.

Bottomline is Bates has already shown elite outlier star traits/ abilities. Jackson was mostly a big upside swing with not showing much. And his cost was a lottery pick. Bates cost would be at best no more than a mid to late 2nd. Getting him for pennies on the dollar as an elite upside development swing would be a fairly different scenario obviously.

Perhaps Jackson should have similarly fallen to 2nd round value.

Maybe?? But I don't think Jackson has ever had the scoring package or the big games that Bates has. Watch a few of his games, and you'll see that even though he still needs development, maturity/mentoring/ etc. He's still got elite star level outlier traits. Seeing as we'd be highly competitive over the next couple of years with Durant/ Booker/Ayton. We'd lose nothing really in getting a player like him on the cheap to stash in the G league for some seasoning and occasionally bring him in to work with Durant and Book to instill championship mentality/ perspective. He is still a young very fluid 6'10 wing with elite scoring package (shot making and confidence) too. We could do far worse in our current restrictive situation.

Spoiler:

Watch on YouTube

6'10 wings shouldn't be hitting shots like that, or be hitting big shots right in the defenders faces, or be able to dribble or move that well. It'd really be something to see Durant mentor him and potentially steal a high end talent in the mid to late 2nd round. Especially considering our lack of assets/ cap flexibility.

[KdoubleDees23]

While I do get your concerns that he's got a lot of maturity issues and growth to work on sure! His athleticism and wingspan is not elite either. And he needs to work on being more team oriented in order to advance his value beyond a mid to late 2nd round prospect. But his scoring package is absolutely elite with significant offensive versatility and big shot making potential. also, he already possesses that supreme irrational confidence that separates star potential from the average nba options.

So considering that he could be acquired with nothing more than a mid to late 2nd, he'd still represent a significant value pickup. And seeing as how ( with Durant) we'll not be rebuilding right away anyways, we could pick him up pretty cheap and stash him in the G league for a couple of years and let him mature and adjust into a more experienced and seasoned level headed player with time and maturity! But it's important to remember that Bates was a legitimate top 5 lottery player and a 5 star prospect coming into college. Jackson's misplaced perceived value was mostly do to his upside athleticism and defensive versatility. But I'm not sure he's ever shown the capacity/ capability to actually score or put up games like Bates has.

Bottomline is Bates has already shown elite outlier star traits/ abilities. Jackson was mostly a big upside swing with not showing much. And his cost was a lottery pick. Bates cost would be at best no more than a mid to late 2nd. Getting him for pennies on the dollar as an elite upside development swing would be a fairly different scenario obviously.

Perhaps Jackson should have similarly fallen to 2nd round value.

Maybe?? But I don't think Jackson has ever had the scoring package or the big games that Bates has. Watch a few of his games, and you'll see that even though he still needs development, maturity/mentoring/ etc. He's still got elite star level outlier traits. Seeing as we'd be highly competitive over the next couple of years with Durant/ Booker/Ayton. We'd lose nothing really in getting a player like him on the cheap to stash in the G league for some seasoning and occasionally bring him in to work with Durant and Book to instill championship mentality/ perspective. He is still a young very fluid 6'10 wing with elite scoring package (shot making and confidence) too. We could do far worse in our current restrictive situation.

Spoiler:

Watch on YouTube

6'10 wings shouldn't be hitting shots like that, or be hitting big shots right in the defenders faces, or be able to dribble or move that well. It'd really be something to see Durant mentor him and potentially steal a high end talent in the mid to late 2nd round. Especially considering our lack of assets/ cap flexibility.

Dude plays for EMU !!!!!!!!!!! Jackson in the MAC would avg 30 ppg and have over .500 for his team. You want to compare, compare Bates at Memphis to Jackson. Jackson > Bates

[Ghost of Kleine]

Perhaps Jackson should have similarly fallen to 2nd round value.

Maybe?? But I don't think Jackson has ever had the scoring package or the big games that Bates has. Watch a few of his games, and you'll see that even though he still needs development, maturity/mentoring/ etc. He's still got elite star level outlier traits. Seeing as we'd be highly competitive over the next couple of years with Durant/ Booker/Ayton. We'd lose nothing really in getting a player like him on the cheap to stash in the G league for some seasoning and occasionally bring him in to work with Durant and Book to instill championship mentality/ perspective. He is still a young very fluid 6'10 wing with elite scoring package (shot making and confidence) too. We could do far worse in our current restrictive situation.

Spoiler:

Watch on YouTube

6'10 wings shouldn't be hitting shots like that, or be hitting big shots right in the defenders faces, or be able to dribble or move that well. It'd really be something to see Durant mentor him and potentially steal a high end talent in the mid to late 2nd round. Especially considering our lack of assets/ cap flexibility.

Dude plays for EMU !!!!!!!!!!! Jackson in the MAC would avg 30 ppg and have over .500 for his team. You want to compare, compare Bates at Memphis to Jackson. Jackson > Bates

I get your argument about weaker conferences, But honestly man, They're completely different players. Completely different skillsets! Bates, has elite offensive tools, and a very deep offensive versatile bag. Jackson was a versatile defensive wing prospect with elite athleticism that was overhyped into a top 5 pick. Currently though, Bates isn't at all overhyped at his current range ( mid to late 2nd round). If we're being honest, about the only similarities between the two that are wholly accurate are the maturity and development issues keeping them from being elite in the NBA. The value difference given their draft ranges increases the polarity between the two.

And as intriguing as Jackson was in college, he still wasn't an elite offensive talent, and unless I missed it somewhere, he's never put up big games comparable to what Bates has. Again, because the selling point on Jackson in college was as a POTENTIALLY elite versatile defender/ playmaker with some scoring ability and elite upside. If Bates somehow makes it into the top 5 discussion of the lottery based on POTENTIAL upside, then the argument might be more legitimate in terms of scalable value comparisons.

But even then, we'd need to see how Bates would adapt and contribute in a similar competitive nba level role to what Jackson played in the nba to determine proper value comparisons beyond mere hypothetical projections. For now given his elite skillset at a much lower cost, and still having elite upside value, I'd give the edge to Bates.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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This kid is solid and very versatile at 250 lbs. He's also putting up very impressive stats and efficiency. He'd be another potential steal at the backup 3/4 position off the bench.

[sunsbg]

GoK's scouting even more important now as it's certain Suns won't trade the picks they own. They may even buy additional second round picks if they like some prospect. Hopefully scouting department puts more work to maximize on the lower number of picks in the coming years.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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A potential JO replacement option IF we're likely to lose him in unrestricted free agency due to value escalation putting him outside of our available range? Caleb McConnell of Rutgers is also a very nice rugged, aggressive wing defender too. Both should fall into 2nd round range for our consideration.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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An ultimate intangible type of glue wing bench player with high end role player potential. Definitely a Jones/ Williams type option. Probably won't still be on the board in the 2nd round by the time we're picking, but then again, you never know? And this new hire of Gerald Madkins apparently has UCLA connections. So could he possibly be a target?

[Ghost of Kleine]

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[Frank Lee]

Lock this thread else name it ‘who’s left’

I put the over/under for rooks on next yrs
roster at .5

Junkyard will spend much more effort sifting through the cast off scrap pile.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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Spoiler:

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I mentioned Jake Stephens a couple months back as a late 2nd round to undrafted value option for us as a backup 5. It's rare that you find a 7'1 275 lb center with a high IQ that also happens to shoot around 39% from three, block almost two shots a game, average close to 20 points per game and also happens to average close to 4 assists per game with advanced passing skills.

When you're cash strapped ( restricted) as a championship team, you need to extract maximum value whenever possible at the lowest possible cost! This guy is like a 7 ft version of Saric, only better at threes and shotblocking. He also happens to have an 8 ft wingspan too. He plays a lot like a budget version of Nikola Jokic with his easygoing effortless crafty scoring/ advanced passing/ 3 pt shooting, crafty post scoring, and borderline triple double production potential.

Value is value, even if pulled from the late 2nd round or undrafted pool.

[bwgood77]

Lock this thread else name it ‘who’s left’

I put the over/under for rooks on next yrs
roster at .5

Junkyard will spend much more effort sifting through the cast off scrap pile.

Maybe need to change it to 2024 draft.

[Frank Lee]

Well we do have a second for now. So I guess there is a needle somewhere in that field of haystacks, but thinking we’ll get some measurable contribution this upcoming year is an odds defier. Given the neutering cap restrictions we face, we’d better pursue all avenues to improve, even if it’s a delayed return.

[bwgood77]

Well we do have a second for now. So I guess there is a needle somewhere in that field of haystacks, but thinking we’ll get some measurable contribution this upcoming year is an odds defier. Given the neutering cap restrictions we face, we’d better pursue all avenues to improve, even if it’s a delayed return.

Oh, well in that case, that is GoK's specialty.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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This kid and/or Jalen Graham are the two Jared Vanderbilt prototype/ skillset prospects that we need to keep a close eye on (target) heading into the 24' draft next summer towards cost effective continuity and stronger supportive rebounding and defensive versatility off the bench.

[Ghost of Kleine]

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3rd string backup center prospect for 24' consideration??

[Ghost of Kleine]

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https://playeroftheyear.gatorade.com/winner/omaha-biliew/39616#:~:text=Athletic%20Excellence,and%201.4%20steals%20per%20game.

This kid is really intriguing at 6'9 220 lbs with an unbelievable 7'5 wingspan and a 39 inch vertical, also with an incredible motor, athleticism, versatility and PHYSICALITY/AGGRESSIVE PLAY for an late 2nd to undrafted wing/forward consideration for us. With 3 two way contracts now available, we should look at a jumbo wing forward, point guard and a power forward/center option to bolster long term talent/depth. He seems somewhat like a more versatile Vanderbilt.