SDU's rant re- Dantoni

[-SDU-]

man, i like to be friendly to all and dont like getting frustrated, but you dantoni haters are really starting to wear me down

the guy has some flaws, but i guarantee you, NO COACH could have done to this team what he did, look at the first year nash came over and we went for 62 wins, that was unbelievable, then we lost amare, and still made the conference finals, wow! what a great effort

last year was dissapointing, but our squad has improved since then losing james jones and kurt from our rotation and adding hill and skinner, and we learnt alot, something that can only improve our team in its hunger and resolve to win the title

the fact is that dantoni has gotten SOOO much out of these guys, he deserves far more respect, from the fans, and on top of that, more tolerance, leniency and TRUST when things arent going so well

he isnt freakin isaiah thomas, hes a great person, a great coach and he has the plan and the players to take us to the title, whether that happens or not remains to be seen, but the way some of you guys are so quick to call for someones head really disappoints me to no end.

you are trying to compare dantonis flaws to phil jackson and popovich? 2 of the greatest coaches in the history of this game. Thats not even fair, i know we all have high standards, but come on? dantoni can only be dantoni, and that still makes him an elite coach in the NBA.
Why dont you compare him to the other 27 coaches in this league? so dantoni isnt of the caliber of some of the best coaches in NBA history? heaven forbid, are we that unrealistic in our expetations, are we that blinded by the sky around our heads that we cant see how lucky, how fortunate, how entertained we are to have a team like the suns and a coach like dantoni?

i just wish you guys could step back from it all and instead of trying to whinge, and complain and fault every decision made by the man who cares more about suns wins and losses than all of us combined

Sure there are signs and things that need to be worked on, dantoni tried 2 new lineups during the hornets game, one with nash hill marion diaw and amare and one with nash barbs banks marion and diaw, big ball and small ball lineups, thats what we want, trialling things, working stuff out!!! maybe it cost us the game, especially that small ball lineup that didnt work and we got trounced during that time, but you know what, he tried it and we now know it doesnt work. it cost us a L? so? better to try and lose now than not know and use it in the playoffs and cost us more then.
check the hornets minutes distribution and then check ours, there is no way a playoff game would be like that, so rest assured im still confident we would have their number in the playoffs, so why complain?

between dantoni and kerr we have some great basketball minds whos job it is to know this team, know these players and to get the best out of them. As far as im concerned, we are equal top in the west, equal second best team in the league, we are doing great. Things need to improve in certain areas, adjustments need to be made, but to sack the coach? honestly? the suggestion is a joke. All we are showing is how high our expectations are, and how spoilt we are to be suns fans

a season is a journey, it has ups and downs and its how you end it that matters. Take the bad with optimism, the good with some focus, and enjoy the ride!

chill TF out

[WTFsunsFTW]

You admit most of his shotcomings are blatant, but dismiss them because of past accomplishments?

You have to admit, the criticisms against the coach are reoccurring, don't show any signs of changing, and do have a hint of truthiness to them.

I get bothered when people put blame on barbosa, because is he definitely my favorite player. But accusations of ball hogging, black hole, lower FG%s are all exaggerated but valid points.


Also, what is with wishing people would take a step back from all the criticisms? Are you trying to shape the way a global message board thinks? Its not like we all conspire to complain about the same things. These are blantant issues that are obviously observed by more than just a few people.

[-SDU-]

some of his criticisms ARE valid for sure, but they are no more glaring than any other coachs faults on the pecking list equal to dantoni, i think sometimes people expect perfection when it simply isnt possible, all we can ask for is 110% and thats whats happening

name one coach not named popovich and phil jackson you would replace dantoni with and ill point out the reasons the whingers would be "calling for his head" in 3 seasons time

Also, what is with wishing people would take a step back from all the criticisms? Are you trying to shape the way a global message board thinks? Its not like we all conspire to complain about the same things. These are blantant issues that are obviously observed by more than just a few people.

when your team is best in the west and people are acting like we are a lottery team, then yes, i feel like trying to put a little perspective on things

i dont know how long you guys have been suns fans, but realise one thing, we are currently in one of the best positions to win a title in the entire franchises history, we have had 40 years and only 4-5 seasons where we have been this good, so enjoy it

for the record, even dantoni admits his faults

As for Saturday, D'Antoni said Phoenix "probably should've tried" going to Stoudemire more in crunch time and that he would have played Brian Skinner more. Phoenix is 14-2 when Stoudemire takes at least 14 shots and 12-0 when he has 20 points and 10 rebounds.

[NapoleonII]

Come on, any half-ass competent coach could win 50+ games every year with Nash/Marion/STAT. Our offense wouldn't be as free-flowing and diverse, but it would be more secure, more consistant, and maybe even more creative.

I'm not even going to talk about defense, because D'Antoni is already NOT doing that for me.

Any other coach would have Diaw on the chopping block, and not in his pants.

Any other coach would play Banks, who is rotting on the bench.

Any other coach would realize we only lose when we get outrebounded, and play Skinner/STAT more, and emphasize crashing the boards.

Need i go on?

I'm not saying fire D'Antoni, because he's our coach and I don't want to shake up this group yet. But I wonder if you'll still be singing his praises after the playoffs if we fall short again.

[TASTIC]

I'm liking the debate, I just wanna make sure there's no name calling and immaturity, lets keep it civil because this topic is a great one to discuss

[nashill]

I'm not even going to talk about defense, because D'Antoni is already NOT doing that for me.

Somehow he's doing it actually but he is so committed to playing small basketball which leads to being out rebounded

Any other coach would play Banks, who is rotting on the bench.

Yeah, he definitely didnt experiment las night putting banks, barbosa and nash together. I doubt if Banks played if Bell was ok.

Any other coach would realize we only lose when we get out rebounded, and play Skinner/STAT more, and emphasize crashing the boards.

[nashill]

Guys, its really hard to debate or argue with you fellow Suns fans. If me, who doesnt even lives in Phoenix want to win the championship badly this year, how much more you guys who really live there and spend money to support the team.

Some of the pro Dantoni guys has some points and some of us who's tired of him I know you all will agree that we have our points also. Let us all guys re evaluate him and wait maybe for another 10 or 15 games if there are really changes or improvment he's addressing to our teams weaknesses. I'll take a closer look at the REBOUNDING while some of you guys know more what weaknesses this team has.

[GoDogGo]

Well I have been a fan of this team for a long time (27 years), and last year was the first time I gave up on a coach of this team. After not starting KT and only playing him 13 mins in game one, not using the bench in game five, to saying the reason we lost to the spurs was we tried to match up(playing KT too much.) Actually the last one really made me the most angry.
I would have really just rather he say,"I don't think KT fits this team, and so I am going to have him traded." Instead he blames the loss on a guy who clearly gave us a chance in that series.
SDU, I can totally see what you are saying, but there are a ton of coaches that have done better with less. Look at Boston right now, they have only three superstars(similar to us), and look at their record. Is Doc a great coach?
We had the coach to take this team to the next level, but we let him go to Memphis.
I care about this team, and if someone is bringing them down, I want them gone.
Unfortunately, I think they are Diaw and Mike. I have not started a thread about this, nor have I started a trade thread. But both of those guys have failed to do their jobs the last two years, so I think they should be fired.
However, it is tough to do anything now, but come on, who didn't see this coming?

[-SDU-]

Look at Boston right now, they have only three superstars(similar to us), and look at their record. Is Doc a great coach?:

im deliberately not responding to much in this thread till there are a number of responses and ill post again after getting the general feel of it all

but regarding doc rivers - dantoni >> rivers by a country mile

put the suns in the east and we win 65 games

[WTFsunsFTW]

He can "admit" his faults til he is blue in the face, but his stubborness overrides any saving grace he may receive for his admittance.

the last four games amare was a beat, the fans were cheering, and we were winning. he then goes back to "pass the ball shoot if youre open," amare gets not nearly as many touches as he should, and we lose. Dantoni admits he should have gone to amare more.

Why would he even put himself into a position to have to admit that? Why not just........ i dont know......... give amare the ball?

Vs the hornets, our pick and roll defense was absolutely atrocious. Through the whole game. Dantoni missed a handful of key situations where calling a timeout and smacking the team around would have been ideal.

We have the talent on this team to be an uncontested lock on making the finals. Yet the holes in our gameplay are so blatant that this simply cant be assumed. We have had our core together for long enough that the blatant shortcomings we DO have should have been fixed or improved right now. This falls squarely on the coach's shoulders.

He talks about defense, he talks about feeding amare, he talks about chemistry issues, but none of them have even had a HINT of actually being worked upon or fixed. If you dont get jaded by his rhetoric, than you are a better man than I.

[GoDogGo]

-= original quote snipped =-



im deliberately not responding to much in this thread till there are a number of responses and ill post again after getting the general feel of it all

but regarding doc rivers - dantoni >> rivers by a country mile

put the suns in the east and we win 65 games

Possibly, but we lose to the West finalist, because we are not a match-up sort of team.
Face it, Mike makes the wrong choices down the stretch. He still thinks that LB can guard Peja.
Why not milk Amare until Chandler fouls out?
If we needed another big to guard Chandler, bring in Skin, he couldn't have scored less than Marion.
He knew that Bell has been illen, why not start Banks? Banks sure earned those mins. At one point, he went with only Marion as our sole defender, with Nash, LB, Boris, and Hill. Now Hill has stepped up his D, and Boris can play it when he wants. Neither as good on D as Banks and Skin. But LB couldn't guard a glass of milk, and Nash left everyone wide open.
I understand supporting your coach, but I am a fan of the team, just not one of it's parts. And I think Mike is not doing a good job.
BTW I didn't say that Doc was a better coach, I am just saying, that with good talent, a monkey could coach them to at least 40 wins. Now add at least 20 more IQ points, and then you might have 50 wins.
Mike is obviously way smarter than a monkey, so he is vastly underachieving.

[@ndrew]

Somebody, who thinks it's easy to run a team with Nash/Marion/STAT - look at the UTAH

They have Williams/AK/Boozer - I don't wanna start a flame war about skills of this 3, but I think it's close.
Now look at the record! Utah is not making the play-off right now and there is possibility, that it won't.
So, do you wanna subsitute D'Antoni with Sloan? I would, just because I would like to see, how D'Antoni will use the offensive potential of Jazz.

[GoDogGo]

Somebody, who thinks it's easy to run a team with Nash/Marion/STAT - look at the UTAH

They have Williams/AK/Boozer - I don't wanna start a flame war about skills of this 3, but I think it's close.
Now look at the record! Utah is not making the play-off right now and there is possibility, that it won't.
So, do you wanna subsitute D'Antoni with Sloan? I would, just because I would like to see, how D'Antoni will use the offensive potential of Jazz.

Nevermind! Utah still good! Other players involved that change things a bit.

[dantian]

DA admitted that he could put his fingers what's wrong. He's lost the ability to reach the players now. For that fact alone, it's time for him to go, just like Skiles had to go when he was here.

Somebody needs to come in and make Nash emulate Stockton and refocus the team's game plan to utilizing Amare. But that's impossible to expect from DA as he put the team into Nash's hand in the first place and can't simply say "give it to Amare" to Nash.

[eastsidecrossover]

I would not say the big 3 in utah are close to our big three in any way. Maybe in the future, but not right now.

I think a lot of guys have the right to be pissed at DA. I have meet the guy in person a few times, and the guy is a quality person, very nice and approachable. The DA's are great people. DA's system works for this team, and it has for years now. Problem is, we seem to have plat toed as a team, and others have figured out our weaknesses. As coach, some of this is his fault, but I think I put most of the blame on the players. To a point, I do think DA is blind and stubborn to change. His ego may be the problem in proving the none believers that his system, small ball run n gun can win it all. The FO is also to blame to not take this team to the next level personal too. The bottom line seems to be more important than to win it all.

Fact is, the FO will get the pass, DA will not be fired if he does not win it all. The core will get the ax first if they can't work out the chemistry issues and selfish problems.

The thing is, we just got into January, and if things do not change, maybe the FO will grow some nuts and make a necessary move.

[pidi]

did anyone of you asked youreself why are we running??
Or why are we an offensive team??
i also would like to see some people who can shut down duncan, dwight or any other of the big guys....
we ain

[Stix]

DA did do some things that have helped this franchise, but he has also done some pretty stupid things... (Diaw) So until he wins this team a Championship, he will always be criticized.

[rsavaj]

I would not say the big 3 in utah are close to our big three in any way. Maybe in the future, but not right now.

I think a lot of guys have the right to be pissed at DA. I have meet the guy in person a few times, and the guy is a quality person, very nice and approachable. The DA's are great people. DA's system works for this team, and it has for years now. Problem is, we seem to have plat toed as a team, and others have figured out our weaknesses. As coach, some of this is his fault, but I think I put most of the blame on the players. To a point, I do think DA is blind and stubborn to change. His ego may be the problem in proving the none believers that his system, small ball run n gun can win it all. The FO is also to blame to not take this team to the next level personal too. The bottom line seems to be more important than to win it all.

Fact is, the FO will get the pass, DA will not be fired if he does not win it all. The core will get the ax first if they can't work out the chemistry issues and selfish problems.

The thing is, we just got into January, and if things do not change, maybe the FO will grow some nuts and make a necessary move.

Re: Utah's big 3....a lot of people would put Boozer near(or even ahead) of Amare offensively, Williams is a Top 5 PG in the league, and AK-47 is the one guy who could come close to doing what Shawn does for us, so saying that their big 3 isn't "close" is a little off, IMO.

[NapoleonII]

I wish the 06 season was a complete loss, we didn't make the playoffs etc.

Think about it.

We'd have gotten an awesome draft pick.

Diaw wouldn't have been given that bloated contract.

D'Antoni would realize we need to use Stat to win.

[rsavaj]

I wish the 06 season was a complete loss, we didn't make the playoffs etc.

Think about it.

We'd have gotten an awesome draft pick.

Diaw wouldn't have been given that bloated contract.

D'Antoni would realize we need to use Stat to win.