15 games now, re-evaluate...

[mkot]

Many people were quick on calling Mike to get fired and I was one of those. Although, I did say that it was too late to make coaching changes and I also want to give him at least 15 games...now 15 games into the Nash-Amare-Shaq era, let's re-evaluate. What are your thoughts?

I'll start...

I want to give Mike alot of credit and I admit I was a bit too harsh on him early on because I was impatient and depressed with the struggles of the team and he gets the chop. And just like I gave him hell when he wasn't doing well, I have to give him props for adjusting well on the fly. Looking at how we used Shaq early on in the process compared to now is like night and day. Before Shaq we usually play the pick and roll and sometimes more of a circle motion offense using picks and reacting to what the defense gives them. Now with Shaq we're still running motion, but it is more like a triangle with the focus going into the post instead of out on the wing or top of the key and creating a strong side and weak side instead of being so spread out. I think that one "triangle" play we use is feeding Shaq in the post and then having the guy in the corner and the wing cut through the lane...the baseline cut is the flex cut, and either guy can step out if his man overplays or goes to double. Its a nice read-and-react play, that can help ISO Shaq and everyone moves to the other side of the floor.

Defensively, I think we're also getting better. I think early on guys were not knowing how to play D without Shawn, now instead of relying Shawn to bail them out, they're playing harder and it showed. I kinda like the zone with Shaq. He's big enough to take up a lot of space inside and if we force the other team to take longer jumpers which can lead to long rebounds and easier fast breaks. The downside is of course offensive rebounds. I think we're definitely getting there tho.

And what more can I say about our rebounding? No longer I have to throw stuff at my TV because our guys couldn't grab a rebound to save their lives. We usually shoot a higher percentage than the opponents, but the opponents usually got a lot more attempts at the basket (b4 the trade). Now we shoot a higher percentage AND we get more attempts at the basket, which makes it very difficult to score less than the opponents... difficult to lose.

I want to point out that I'm not overly excited about beating up bottom feeders like the Grizzlies and Kings, and squeezed out a lucky win against the lowly Sonics (POR is a good win, the SA game too), but it's hard not to get excited about the potential of this team. You can see the team is starting to gel and all of the players are starting to learn their roles and what they need to do to be successful, and guys are playing with confidence within those roles. And Mike has won back a significant chunk of my trust by being willing to change (playing the reserves more, and making necessary adjustments offensively and defensively). Like I said before, Mike is stubborn but eventually, after some growing pain (and he needs it), does what he should. He almost always admit his obvious mistakes and will eventually make adjustments. Just like the case with Boris, KT and Hill. He will adjust to his players.

[NaplesSunsFan]

Mike will forgive you

The San Antonio game showed me all I needed to see. it's going to be VERY hard to beat PHX in a 7 game series.

[BurningHeart]

We just need to be consistent. Stop turning the ball over, hit our shots, and rebound the rock.

Everything else will fall into place.

Although these last few games have given me hope that was gone a couple weeks ago.

[scootfu602]

Great post mkot. You really said it all.

+1 for me.

[trick83]

nice post mkot...totally agree

[dm17415]

This trade has drastically changed us and we are a much complete team. Heres a look at our stats and our rank in the NBA in each category.

W/O Shaq
Record - 37-16
FGM/FGA - 41.5 (1st) / 84.1 (5th) = 49.3% (1st in the league)
3ptM/3ptA - 8.9 (3rd) / 23.3 (4th) = 38.3% (3rd)
FTM/FTA - 17.9 (21st)/ 22.5 (25th) = 79.5% (4th)
PPG - 109.8 (2nd)
ORB/DEF - 8.5 (30th) / 32.3 (6th) = 40.7 (23rd)
AST/TO - 27.3 (1st) / 13.3 (7th fewest)
STL/BLK/PF - 7.3 (17th) / 7.0 (2nd) / 19.3 (4th fewest)

Opponent Stats

FGM/FGA - 40.9 / 90.6 = 45.1%
3ptM/3ptA - 5.7 / 16.8 = 33.9%
FTM/FTA - 16.5 / 22.2 = 74.3%
PPG - 104.0
ORB/DEF - 14.5 / 31.8 = 46.3
AST/TO - 19.6 / 13.7
STL/BLK/PF - 7 / 3.7 / 20.1

With Shaq
Record - 9-6
FGM/FGA - 41.6 (3rd) / 80.8 (19th) = 51.5% (1st in the league)
3ptM/3ptA - 8.0 (8th) / 18.8 (12th) = 42.6% (2nd)
FTM/FTA - 19.7 (11th)/ 26.9 (8th) = 73.5% (12th)
PPG - 110.9 (3rd)
ORB/DEF - 9.5 (27th) / 33.4 (3rd) = 42.9 (10th)
AST/TO - 25.1 (3rd) / 15.9 (2nd most)
STL/BLK/PF - 4.8 (30th) / 5.5 (4th) / 20.9 (15th most)

Opponent Stats

FGM/FGA - 41.5 / 88.3 = 46.9%
3ptM/3ptA - 6.2 / 15.7 = 39.4%
FTM/FTA - 19.2 / 24.3 = 79%
PPG - 108.5
ORB/DEF - 10.7 / 28.2 = 38.9
AST/TO - 19.7 / 12.2
STL/BLK/PF - 8.1 / 3.5 / 22.7

[nba_addict]

Laughing out loud on the decline in free throw %s.

[nanoclarkology]

Phoenix stats the last 6 games.

PPG-116.16 /FG-273-491=55.6%/FT-96-140=68.6%/3pt-55-117=47.0%
ORPG-9.83/DRPG-36.5/TRPG-46.33
APG-27.83
SPG-5.83
BPG-6.0

The difference between us and our opponents in averages is as follows:

PPG +14.82
RPG +6.49
APG +11.66
SPG -1.50
BPG +3.67

The TO have really killed us during all of this. I know we are working out kinks in our chainmail. Or ironing out our mistakes but.

TO Per game
PHX-15.50<--Interesting note is that it includes today's 26 TO's
In the 5 previous games we avg 13.4TO/G
OPP-12.16

DIFF -3.34

I like the way the team is moving. Trying some different plays with a more bottom feeding team. Then we can perfect moves against the more stellar teams. I would like to note that I wasn't judging to harshly until about now.

[nashill]

i hate to admit it but dantoni did a great job...and i know there is a lot more to come..he is still experimenting lately...

good post mkot

[addicted2noise]

Great thread mkot. I have to admit I was definitely all gloom and doom about our championship hopes after about 8 games with Shaq, but this current streak has me more confident than ever that we can win it all. We finally have the low-post presence that this franchise has always lacked, someone who we can just throw the ball into when the offense gets stagnant, and who will intimidate opponents who get past our wing defenders. Looks like Steve Kerr may be a genius after all!

[impulsenine]

The comforting thing about this situation has been that turnovers are a correctable problem. Team chemistry, shooting %, and rotation issues are difficult.

I just hope - a lot - that they don't have any more 26-turnover games in their system. After all, a 10-turnover game would have (figuring they shot the same %), given something more like 80 points... for a 30-point win.

[b-ball forever]

Great post mkot

Our team's turning point in the Shaq era was made when we switched from using him in the high-post runnin pick n rolls with Nash, to keeping him in the low-post and mixing up a little triangle in our offense, kudos to D'Antoni for makin that adjustment.

We still needa improve our defense and cut down on the TO's tho.
Recently our defense has looked much better then it did in the early post-Marion days (with Amare/Diaw playin solid D, and Raja/Hill/Shaq actually even playin very good defense at times!), but if we wanna go all the way in the playoffs they've gotta do it consistantly, and comunicate more as well (specially with the zone D)

[loflin3hree5ive]

After the Shaq trade, I picked Phoenix to win the West. After the first few games with Shaq, I was getting a little nervous. I'm more confident now than ever that Phoenix is winning the West this year. You guys are looking sharp.

[nashill]

the play with shaq with the ball in the post, then amare, hill and bell moving and nash anticipate a pass in the 3 point line looks awesome...we should do more of that.

[mkot]

bump.

No one wants to praise the team when they're doing well, so let's hear some gloom and doom now that we just lost 2 in a row

All I want to see from this team, is to play with more control. It's disturbing to me to see that how little discipline this team has tonight against Boston - no dedication to defense, and too many turnovers. I know it's the players who play the game (and I do blame the players, there's simply no excuse for so many turnovers and many of them are unforced, and no heart in rebounding), but this things start with the coaching staff. And if we don't improve going into the playoffs and then fall short once again, this needs to be changed. If Ivaroni is fired (as rumored from Memphis paper), I'd welcome him back with open arms.

I read someone posted on other thread (that just got locked) complaining about Mike not using Shaq the right way...those people need to watching the freaking game. First of all the Suns can't ask more of Shaq than what he's already giving. He's been great for this team. Secondly, he's getting his touches in the low block. And we're running a triangle like motion offense in the half-court. We still use him to set screen beyond the line but its almost a last resort to get Nash open, which is fine.

However, we still use him on the pick and roll sometimes which is a little silly IMO. There's really no use in using Shaq in the pick and roll because teams know to collapse and play the paint, leaving Shaq 18ft from the hoop where he's literally useless. He can't shoot, can't put the ball on the floor and drive and if he rolls he's not nimble or agile enough to avoid defenders in the lane. Unless there's a real design to get Nash open (which is usually the case) and use Shaq as a decoy where Nash ends up hitting a back door cutter or something, it should only be Amare or Boris on the pick and roll.

[albasuna]

Raja and barbosa just need to kill 3 pointers. Barbosa also needs to stop handling the ball in the half court, he just passes some of the dumbest and weakest passes ever its pretty embarrasing. Also CoachD has to mix up the rotations, this isn't the old suns where you can just put all 5 starts and see points and defense grow on trees.

Raja doesn't look healthy yet aswell.

LETS SEE SOME SKINNER MINUTES!!

[Deepness5134]

Raja and barbosa just need to kill 3 pointers. Barbosa also needs to stop handling the ball in the half court, he just passes some of the dumbest and weakest passes ever its pretty embarrasing. Also CoachD has to mix up the rotations, this isn't the old suns where you can just put all 5 starts and see points and defense grow on trees.

Raja doesn't look healthy yet aswell.

LETS SEE SOME SKINNER MINUTES!!

Agreed. I was just going to the same thing. Im just visiting from the Bulls board. I've been a fan of the Suns for a couple years now. LOVE that high powered offense. Anyway...I always felt that getting Shaq would be a great deal for you guys. I think Nash/Amare/Shaq will be your consistant guys for sure. When you get guys like Bell/Barbosa shooting on target...I can't see any team beating you in a 7 game series. Good Luck to you all..I wanna see you guys getting to the Finals this year!!

[walkingart]

Barbosa also needs to stop handling the ball in the half court, he just passes some of the dumbest and weakest passes ever its pretty embarrasing.

Thank you. It drives me insane to watch him try and make even the simplest passes, he is horrible.

We definately need to add a legit backup point in the offseason, Barbs is just pathetic running the point.

But, as a team we look great. Can't wait for the playoffs.

[Frank Lee]

We are like the 'Little girl with the curl on her forehead....when good, we can be very good, but when bad....horrid'


Too much of our success depends upon Barbososo, Doris, and Bell. 2 of the 3 need to atleast play to their potential on a nightly basis.

And please, D Ant needs to change his....ahhhh ... forget it...
Mikey D'Mule aint changing nuttin. The boys just need to NUT UP and play 48 minutes each night.