Boris Diaw

amitg · Post #1 » by **amitg** » Sun Mar 8, 2009 3:46 pm

His stats since the trade:
15.1 / 6.3 / 4.9 are pretty solid, even better than his MIP year with us (+2.5 MPG vs that year though), but even more surprising, is that he's shooting 44% (46-105) from the 3... (barbosa shoots 36% and j-rich shoots 40%)

I guess he probably takes more corner 3pts then those guys, but that's still much better than our shooters (except for Nash, of course).

I know he was underachieving badly for us, and when the trade went i thought we got the better part of it, but still, i'm quite sad to see him shine in another team (and happy for him, since when he wanted, he was a fantastic player).

right now, i don't think that J-Rich's contract is much better than Diaw's.
He does gives more consistent production (pts, but not much besides that) but his D isn't close to Diaw's (which was a pretty solid defender, and was able to guard point guards to power forwards)

Your thoughts?

Post #2 » by **rsavaj** » Sun Mar 8, 2009 4:00 pm

He wasn't even achieving that badly for us towards the end; his per 36 numbers were good, and his adjusted plus minus numbers were > than Amare's for a couple games.

Rich's contract isn't really better than Diaw's contract, you're right, and Boris is the better player.

Mr. Sun · Post #3 » by **Mr. Sun** » Sun Mar 8, 2009 5:04 pm

Boris went from a bench player in the west to a starter for an east team.

I rather have J-Rich and put effort into finding a proper center for this team.

rag-time4 · Post #4 » by **rag-time4** » Sun Mar 8, 2009 5:13 pm

How much was Diaw getting paid by the suns? I seem to remember from afar that he got a huge contract...??

pidi · Post #5 » by **pidi** » Sun Mar 8, 2009 5:15 pm

diaw would have never put up that numbers for us... so i´m fine having j-rich and dudley on this team. and now with stro and lou there would have been no place for doris..
btw did he find his second nut??

JohnVancouver · Post #6 » by **JohnVancouver** » Sun Mar 8, 2009 7:18 pm

I watched most of CHA/NY last night and Diaq looked good, but not spectacular. Still passes away out of layups and short shots he should take. I want to see him do well for old times' sake but he's the same guy he was here. he'd still be driving us nuts.
Though it would be nice to have him right now

Vernon Maxwell · Post #7 » by **Vernon Maxwell** » Sun Mar 8, 2009 7:46 pm

only his ppg + 3pt per 36minutes have improved from when he was a starter in 05-06.

BurningHeart · Post #8 » by **BurningHeart** » Sun Mar 8, 2009 8:37 pm

No place for Boris? Are you f'n kidding me? He was easily the most versatile player we had after Marion got dealt. You're telling me you don't think he would help against a team like the Spurs (or any team worth a damn) when given the shot? You don't think he could have helped with his low post offense or his pick-and-pop ability? You don't think he could have helped when Nash goes out as a BIG point-forward? You'd rather have Jason Richardson, who constantly blows his defensive assignments and does some STUPID ass stuff on the court?

Sometimes, I wonder if people are watching the same things I am.

hitachi7 · Post #9 » by **hitachi7** » Sun Mar 8, 2009 10:46 pm

BurningHeart wrote:No place for Boris? Are you f'n kidding me? He was easily the most versatile player we had after Marion got dealt. You're telling me you don't think he would help against a team like the Spurs (or any team worth a damn) when given the shot? You don't think he could have helped with his low post offense or his pick-and-pop ability? You don't think he could have helped when Nash goes out as a BIG point-forward? You'd rather have Jason Richardson, who constantly blows his defensive assignments and does some STUPID ass stuff on the court?

Sometimes, I wonder if people are watching the same things I am.

Jrich is a better complementary player than Boris. He's a good shooter and great slasher/finisher. Diaw's strengths come from being an impossible 1on1 matchup for most teams, but then you are running your offense through him which is not better than Nash/Amare pick-n-rolls. Boris has trouble complementing other players because he doesn't excel at rebounding or shooting or moving without the ball. He would have had some value from a depth standpoint for the reasons you mentioned, but in theory that shouldn't outweigh what Jrich can bring for this particular team.

BurningHeart · Post #10 » by **BurningHeart** » Sun Mar 8, 2009 11:01 pm

He CAN bring it, but IS he bringing it?

eastsidecrossover · Post #11 » by **eastsidecrossover** » Mon Mar 9, 2009 4:19 am

Look at the team he is on? They are worse then us and not as good of players. Yes we suck, but they area a much worse team. Diaw could not be the player he was due to the makeup of this team. He was too scared and made bad decisions. Yes, he was our most versitile player, but he was soft and did not always bring it. I think it was a good trade and I thought Diaw would do well for them.

albasuna · Post #12 » by **albasuna** » Mon Mar 9, 2009 4:51 am

Giving Diaw and Bell up was one of the worst things that could happen. You lose size and defense.

But I honestly think that they were dumped more than anything, I think the Bell/Diaw trade was the beginning of the rebuilding process of the Suns.

Sandra · Post #13 » by **Sandra** » Mon Mar 9, 2009 6:58 am

Here's what Cats fans think of Boris:
viewtopic.php?f=53&t=888224&st=0&sk=t&sd=a

And a couple of quotes from that thread:

In Phoenix, they failed to see what the guy could bring if you build the team around him, don't do the same mistake !!!!
The guy is a Genius and given the good opportunity and good surrending, you might get a championship in charlotte at the expense of the big teams !
You have a Diamond, just surrend it with the proper cast and you will get yourself a pretty nice ring !!!!!!!!!

Diaw is the ultimate team player.
I would say that is the ultimate Basketball player.
The Dude can pretty much do it all on the court.
And yet he prefers to make/allow his teamates to shine instead of himself.
Some of you bash him for his lack of rebound production, but you forget to see that he blocks his guy to let you have it.
People should send tapes of him in every basketball program all over the world, and the game would be much better to watch.
High Bb IQ, sweet technique, great vision, etc... You name it !
And still people try to make him fit some stupid archetypes, he's a 4, he should play the 3, etc...
Forget it, Boris is a Basketball Player, that's it !

And so on
They highly praise Raja, too
I've always thought we were robbed in that trade

Post #14 » by **lilfishi22** » Mon Mar 9, 2009 3:21 pm

The last quote was so full of homerism it was ridiculous.

Diaw is the ultimate team player. - To a certain degree
I would say that is the ultimate Basketball player. - C'mon!
The Dude can pretty much do it all on the court. - 3 times a season yeah.
And yet he prefers to make/allow his teamates to shine instead of himself. - Because he's soft
Some of you bash him for his lack of rebound production, but you forget to see that he blocks his guy to let you have it. - Yeah it's called boxing out, everybody should be doing it.
People should send tapes of him in every basketball program all over the world, and the game would be much better to watch. - We'd have a bunch of sissies doing passing drills till the 24s run out.
High Bb IQ, sweet technique, great vision, etc... You name it ! - Desire? Aggressiveness?
And still people try to make him fit some stupid archetypes, he's a 4, he should play the 3, etc...
Forget it, Boris is a Basketball Player, that's it !

As much as we need Diaw right now because of our situation with Amare, we can't have him coming off the bench for 9mill a season and being as inconsistent as he is. He would put up 14/8/6 one night and everyone would be all up his s**t and the next three games he would average 8/5/3. We needed consistency.

As for Raja, he was one of my favourite Suns, and I feel terrible that he had to leave because we couldn't find a way for him to work in Porter's so-called system. I'd take Raja back in a heart beat. Reasonable salary, decent defense, spreads the floor, heart and soul of the team, if anything I regret trading Raja.

chuckerz · Post #15 » by **chuckerz** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 3:50 am

Amare was the reason why Diaw numbers went down. Diaw was clutch especially during the playoffs when amare was out for the season. That's the season when he got the most improved player award and he probably could have improved off that as he is now where he is a centerpiece of the starting 5.

Vernon Maxwell · Post #16 » by **Vernon Maxwell** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 4:45 am

chuckerz wrote:Amare was the reason why Diaw numbers went down. Diaw was clutch especially during the playoffs when amare was out for the season. That's the season when he got the most improved player award and he probably could have improved off that as he is now where he is a centerpiece of the starting 5.

and then once he got an extension after winning MIP, he got lazy and showed up to camp all fat.

Ninjafish · Post #17 » by **Ninjafish** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 5:00 am

Vernon Maxwell wrote:
chuckerz wrote:Amare was the reason why Diaw numbers went down. Diaw was clutch especially during the playoffs when amare was out for the season. That's the season when he got the most improved player award and he probably could have improved off that as he is now where he is a centerpiece of the starting 5.

and then once he got an extension after winning MIP, he got lazy and showed up to camp all fat.

And some Suns fans still have never forgiven him for that even though it was 3 years ago. These are the only fans that will still defend this disaster of a trade for us.

If we still had Bell and Diaw and we ditched Porter, is there any doubt that we would be in the playoff picture now? There shouldn't be.

Sandra · Post #18 » by **Sandra** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 6:18 am

I still fail to understand why Boris and Amare couldn't play together. Can you guys explain it to me? In theory, they seem to complement each other perfectly, IMO. But for some mysterious reasons it never actually worked

BurningHeart · Post #19 » by **BurningHeart** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 6:21 am

Sandra wrote:I still fail to understand why Boris and Amare couldn't play together. Can you guys explain it to me? In theory, they seem to complement each other perfectly, IMO. But for some mysterious reasons it never actually worked

Because both players need the ball in order to do what they do most effectively. Amare to drive or come off the pick and roll, and Boris to post up and distribute.

Sandra · Post #20 » by **Sandra** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 6:56 am

Call me stupid if you wish, but I still don't get it. Nash needs the ball in order to do what he does most effectively too, doesn't he? Yet, it doesn't prevent Nash/Amare duo from being quite effective together, to say the least. So, why is it not the same about Boris/Amare combo?