RealGM

So i didn't watch much of the Suns this year. But I was just going over Amare's stats at 82games.com and it looks like his opponents PER when he's playing PF or C is among the lowest of the big time players . So according to that whoever Amare is guarding, is having VERY little production. That would usually mean Amare is an awesome defender. In fact he holds his opponent to a lower PER rating than Okafor, Howard, Yao, Duncan, etc. He's tied with Chandler and is just a hair behind Garnett. What gives? If his defense really was that good he'd be in the conversation among the NBA's best defenders.

http://www.82games.com/0809/08PHO15.HTM

If you scroll down that link you'll see a section for opponent counterpart 48 minute production sorted by PER.

Just

I thought Suns fans would get a laugh out of that. I just can't figure out WHY the numbers come up that way.

ama´re is a beast on defense, i always knew it... he just has to show it... damn

I love Amare, but please!!!!

This just goes to show, if he ACTUALLY learned the basics of defense and put even a bit of effort in, he could be what he want him to on defense. If only Patrick Ewing or Charles Oakley wanted to come coach him.. Maybe Hakeem!

sd1306 you know what is funny about those comments. Is that I mentioned Dennis Rodman then all of a sudden he comes up on the front page admitting himself into rehab. How odd is that?

Not hearing anything from someone mention them and all of a sudden, speak of the devil.

This is exactly why 82games.com is ridiculous. There are no stats to demonstrate a player's positional defensive ability.

Amare is not as bad a defender as some would like to believe. Between the Suns terrible perimeter defense and the way he is officiated (ticky tack fouls leading to foul trouble) it's easy to see that it's not just his fundamentals or approach to defense that is the problem ALL the time. Amare is balancing trying to stay in the game, be the only real frontcourt man 2 man/help defender on his entire team and rebound the basketball. He can't be everywhere at once. Even if he locked his man down and grabbed 15 rebounds a game, that's not gonna stop the Kobe's, Wade's and every point guard in the league from having a field day.

Amare is the product of a lackluster team defense that makes all of the Suns players appear worst then they truly are as individual defenders. Put Joe Johnson, Marion, Raja Bell or Diaw back into the mix with Shaq and Amare and they would all look alot better defensively because in the NBA, team defense is the only "D" that matters. Individual D does not exist because guys are just to talented offensively to be guarded for a whole game by one player. Especially the superstars like Lebron, Amare, Wade, Kobe etc...

chriscringle95 wrote:Amare is not as good a defender as some would like to believe.

Amare is a contributor to a lackluster team defense that makes all of the Suns players appear worst then they truly are as individual defenders.

Fixed

His opponents PER score is low, but his opponents scoring and EFG% are about average.

I believe the stas came about because Amare defended the lesser scorer most of the time. We might conclude however that he is a bit easier to "hide" on defense then Nash is.

chriscringle95 wrote:Amare is not as bad a defender as some would like to believe. Between the Suns terrible perimeter defense and the way he is officiated (ticky tack fouls leading to foul trouble) it's easy to see that it's not just his fundamentals or approach to defense that is the problem ALL the time. Amare is balancing trying to stay in the game, be the only real frontcourt man 2 man/help defender on his entire team and rebound the basketball. He can't be everywhere at once. Even if he locked his man down and grabbed 15 rebounds a game, that's not gonna stop the Kobe's, Wade's and every point guard in the league from having a field day.

Amare is the product of a lackluster team defense that makes all of the Suns players appear worst then they truly are as individual defenders. Put Joe Johnson, Marion, Raja Bell or Diaw back into the mix with Shaq and Amare and they would all look alot better defensively because in the NBA, team defense is the only "D" that matters. Individual D does not exist because guys are just to talented offensively to be guarded for a whole game by one player. Especially the superstars like Lebron, Amare, Wade, Kobe etc...

It sucks that you wrote so much because no one took you seriously after your first sentence.

WTFsunsFTW wrote:

chriscringle95 wrote:Amare is not as bad a defender as some would like to believe. Between the Suns terrible perimeter defense and the way he is officiated (ticky tack fouls leading to foul trouble) it's easy to see that it's not just his fundamentals or approach to defense that is the problem ALL the time. Amare is balancing trying to stay in the game, be the only real frontcourt man 2 man/help defender on his entire team and rebound the basketball. He can't be everywhere at once. Even if he locked his man down and grabbed 15 rebounds a game, that's not gonna stop the Kobe's, Wade's and every point guard in the league from having a field day.

Amare is the product of a lackluster team defense that makes all of the Suns players appear worst then they truly are as individual defenders. Put Joe Johnson, Marion, Raja Bell or Diaw back into the mix with Shaq and Amare and they would all look alot better defensively because in the NBA, team defense is the only "D" that matters. Individual D does not exist because guys are just to talented offensively to be guarded for a whole game by one player. Especially the superstars like Lebron, Amare, Wade, Kobe etc...

It sucks that you wrote so much because no one took you seriously after your first sentence.

lol exactly I stopped reading right after his first sentence

Against the top bigmen in the league, it's always been Diaw/Shaq/Marion guarding them. Amare always guards the weaker front court player.

Arguably Amare is a subpar defender because he's lived the easy life here. From playing in a no defense system under D'Antoni, to having the opposing star big man being guarded by Diaw/Shaq/Marion to having every summer to work on his offense, he's definitely had it easy

lilfishi22 wrote:Against the top bigmen in the league, it's always been Diaw/Shaq/Marion guarding them. Amare always guards the weaker front court player.

Arguably Amare is a subpar defender because he's lived the easy life here. From playing in a no defense system under D'Antoni, to having the opposing star big man being guarded by Diaw/Shaq/Marion to having every summer to work on his offense, he's definitely had it easy

--- How many times did we see guys have career games against Stat? Kwame Brown looked like Wilt ....

Dude... Fabricio Oberto had his way with Amare on more than one occasion.

JohnVancouver wrote:
--- How many times did we see guys have career games against Stat? Kwame Brown looked like Wilt ....

Were you subconsciously thinking of Nash in this regard, maybe?

The only reason he hasn't taken more slack from the casual fan is because he's so dominant on offense, people just forget that he gets abused on D on a nightly basis.

dantian wrote:

JohnVancouver wrote:
--- How many times did we see guys have career games against Stat? Kwame Brown looked like Wilt ....

Were you subconsciously thinking of Nash in this regard, maybe?

--- Actually, no. But since you bring it up - Nash is a decent team defender but
once he gets beat, there is no-one inside who helps. As noted on the Amar'e trade thread, two years ago we were a solid defensive team bust as we traded away our defensive players, Nash and Amar'e weaknesses were exposed terribly.
But Amar'e has given up career numbers to every big man he goes head to head with - and none of them anywhere near his level. What;'s the point of Stat getting 35 if Brown or Oberto get 30? Kind of diminishes his impact.

I'll stick up for Nash on the grounds that with him it's not a lack of effort or desire, he's just physically not made to defend a lot of the guards in this league. Can't do much about that except have guys like Raja and Marion who take up the slack. Nash's defense was never the hot button topic in the prime SSOL years that it is now. The only that's changed is the supporting cast.

Amar'e though - damn, if he'd just learn a couple of the things we all learned around the eight grade, he'd be a solid defender. He just has never needed to, no-one has ever pushed him to play defense and frankly, it's hard, unglamorous work.