Suns offseason

Jimmy76 · Post #1 » by **Jimmy76** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 4:36 am

I know this is a bit premature but I need to vent and I feel I have a decent idea of what we should do this offseason already.

Ive been saying this for awhile so this isnt a reactionary post but losing Amare is addition by subtraction. Anything we can get for him is gravy but he hurts the team.

The advanced stats confirm what my eyes see and that thats Amare is a negative. Howerver he is not to blame for our recent losses. The Suns just havent been any good at all out of the gate and we need to come out with some fire and passion.

onto the point:

In the offseason
1. We better hope Amare opts out and if he does dont re-sign him at any kind of money but im hoping he is traded before then anyways

2. Try to make Amare a sign a trade and get some value back if we dont trade Amare before the deadline.

3. Re-sign Frye to a long term deal at MLE type money level or less (5 years 25 million with a team option sounds good though its hard to gauge exact value right now)

4. Go after Brad Miller in free agency. Short team deal, full MLE over 3 years with the last year un-guaranteed. That will likely be his biggest offer plus we will probably be able to lure him in with the starting position assuming we dont get a starting big back with an Amare trade/sign and trade. He's a smart player, good rebounder, good passer, decent defender, and can keep the floor spread even more. He is a player who contributes to winning. Raw boxscore stats tell you a lot less about that than youd think.

5. Hope a couple decent players drop to the second round. I think we have 3 2nd round picks and we'll likely sell one or two (if its the highest ones ill be pissed) but with the ones we do keep.

Heres the ones I hope drop:

Damion James, currently 46th on draftexpress: but hes got a mindblowing wingspan, good stroke, and is a good rebounder as well. Plays for a winning team with Texas too. Kinda stuck between SF and PF but I think he can successfully play the wing in the NBA with some practice and given time to transition.

Gani Lawal, currently projected 29th on draftexpress: It'd be a miracle if he fell to us but despite being undersized hes great wingspan, is a great athlete and a fierce competitor. I think of him as a rich mans Lou Amudson.

Jerome Dyson, currently 57th on draftexpress: He's an undersized combo guard type player. He can slash and shoot and is a good passer. He is off to a terrible start this year and his handles need some real improvement but we're drafting in the second round so you can't have everything. Only see him play a few times and for a limited time but he looked like a player who could be a decent combo guard off the bench in the future.

DirtyDez · Post #2 » by **DirtyDez** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 4:51 am

If we can get a 1st for Amare i'm all for it, although we won't know a whole lot about the players till' after the college season. Not sure if EC can be our PF of the future but that position has a huge scoring gap if Amare leaves which is fine if we rebuild.

MaryvalesFinest · Post #3 » by **MaryvalesFinest** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 4:57 am

They should definately trade Amare for draft picks, the 2010 draft is probably the most loaded since the 2003 class I see a ton of future stars...

Jimmy76 · Post #4 » by **Jimmy76** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 4:59 am

DirtyDez wrote:If we can get a 1st for Amare i'm all for it, although we won't know a whole lot about the players till' after the college season. Not sure if EC can be our PF of the future but that position has a huge scoring gap if Amare leaves which is fine if we rebuild.

Im thinking we try to at least be a good team by doing essentially what we've done this offseason. Pick up underated players that fit in our system and pick up some hardworking roleplayers.

I don't think we should tank yet playoffs should remain a goal this year and next.

And yeah im all for trading Amare for 1st's id love a shot at the meat of this draft class.

DBrimstone · Post #5 » by **DBrimstone** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 5:04 am

If we trade Amare, we have to get a good 1st rounder for him. There's plenty of bigs in this draft that have to play for more than money and ego. We're paying Amare 16.3 mil to put up 19 and 6.8 (which is pathetic). Carlos Boozer's getting 12.3 mil to put up 20 and 10.9 and Boozer plays just as much D as Amare does (why not just sign him to do Amare's role, just better? His ego's not as huge and I think he'll take less money than Amare will to do more)... We need a big with a good solid work ethic who can do a pretty good job in the post. We've got plenty of scorers. Everyone knows we need post defense and rebounds more than anything right now.

I agree with keeping Frye. He needs to keep his 3 point shot and work on his rebounds, which have been up a little bit lately (3 games of 5 or fewer rebounds in the last 9 games with a low of 4 as opposed to 8 games of 5 of fewer with a low of...1 in the 1st 9 games) For what we'll be paying him, he'll be worth the money.

Still impressed with EC's basketball IQ. He makes good passes when he needs too as opposed to Amare and LB, and once he improves his jump shot and defends like he's supposed to, he'll be a solid player. Still wish he'd get more minutes. Especially in blow outs where the bench can honestly say they won the second half, hands down

The players I'd keep around for long term (Nash and Hill not on here because within 2-3 years they'll be gone)

Dragic
Dudley
Clark
Lou
Frye
Maybe Barbosa and maybe Lopez. I don't trust LB to handle the ball as he's a black hole but he's a great shot and a great slasher. Lopez hasn't quite played enough to prove he's an idiot but he's working his way there.

YouTube · Post #6 » by **Kerrsed** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 5:07 am

I believe this thread belongs in here. http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=963681&start=90

DBrimstone · Post #7 » by **DBrimstone** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 5:08 am

MaryvalesFinest wrote:They should definately trade Amare for draft picks, the 2010 draft is probably the most loaded since the 2003 class I see a ton of future stars...

I've been tempted to say "if I wanted your opinion I'd give it to you" a couple times lately but this opinion of yours is worth something. I doubt we'll get a D-wade, Carmelo, Bosh, or James out of it but they're freaks of nature. Plenty of great players to be had.

I agree with Clark not being the power forward of the future but I can see him as our "small" forward of the future. He might never be more than a good player, but I'm ok with good. Dudley's just good and he still has plenty of an impact

Christine-In-AZ · Post #8 » by **Christine-In-AZ** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 5:18 am

I think we only have Cleveland's 2nd round pick

I seriously doubt Amare is going to opt out. And with extension dollar figures/years that he and his agent are likely asking for right now, a sign and trade would be a very hard find.

Unfortunately, I think Kerr is going to have to ride out the contract until '11. If there is a team out there that doesn't mind "renting" Amare for a year and a half...test driving his worth, Kerr might be able to swing a deal before the deadline. But even so...we're not going to get back any sure-fire star.
We'd have to settle for low dollar, potential type talent.

Highly unlikely, but Cleveland might not balk at the idea of renting Amare. Acquiring Amare might help them retain LeBron.

Not an exciting trade for Suns fans, but this might fit into Kerr's "rebuild on the fly"..."keep the Suns competitive" but don't blow it up strategy.

Trade Amare for Hickson, Illgauskas, a late pick and necessary filler (D.Green)

Hickson has potential and can at least come close to Amare's numbers. STAT is only giving us default numbers right now. By that I mean, I have a feeling almost any decent PF can get 19 and 8 in a Suns starting line-up lead by Nash. Yes! I know Hickson is a question mark.

This would open up an opportunity for Clark to battle for serious time...but he is a bit undersized for the role of PF.

Illgauskas would just be a half year player, but his 11.5 million expiring would be very valuable for a free agent signing this summer. So in essence, your trading Amare for Hickson, a 10 million a year FA and a pick.

This never-going-to-happen trade would also take 3 million off the current payroll (effectively 6 with the luxury tax).

There is sizzle in it for the Cavs, but after watching tonight’s game…seems Illgauskas is a real fan favorite.

It’s an ugly trade, but it fits the mold towards what Kerr is trying to do. Bring down the payroll, open up FA signing money and get younger.

We’re not winning a championship this year. That was clear before the last two funk games. Just stay in the mix (read:in the playoffs) and improve the situation (read:open the flexability).

Jimmy76 · Post #9 » by **Jimmy76** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 5:22 am

Kerrsed wrote:I believe this thread belongs in here. http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=963681&start=90

Nah I dont think the sky is falling im just looking forward

We are a playoff team

Also we have the Cavs 2nd rounder, the Bobcats 2nd rounder, and im pretty sure our own second round pick

edit:confirmed we currently have 3 second round picks

Christine-In-AZ · Post #10 » by **Christine-In-AZ** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 5:42 am

Jimmy76 wrote:
edit:confirmed we currently have 3 second round picks

Cool! Three chances to maybe get lucky (no sarchasm)

Jimmy76 · Post #11 » by **Jimmy76** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 5:48 am

ChrisInAZ wrote:
Jimmy76 wrote:
edit:confirmed we currently have 3 second round picks

Cool! Three chances to maybe get lucky (no sarchasm)

or combine em and trade up for a late first

DBrimstone · Post #12 » by **DBrimstone** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 5:51 am

ChrisInAZ wrote:
Jimmy76 wrote:
edit:confirmed we currently have 3 second round picks

Cool! Three chances to maybe get lucky (no sarchasm)

See also Jeff Hornacek, Manu Ginobli, Tony Parker...

Or combine them and trade up for a late first (like was already stated), then trade the pick and (sign and) trade Amare or LB (who I don't care for right now) for somebody decent and a high first rounder.

RaisingArizona · Post #13 » by **RaisingArizona** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 5:51 am

ChrisInAZ wrote:
Jimmy76 wrote:
edit:confirmed we currently have 3 second round picks

Cool! Three chances to maybe get lucky (no sarchasm)

Or 3 million dollars to $arver's wallet.

MaryvalesFinest · Post #14 » by **MaryvalesFinest** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 5:58 am

DBrimstone wrote:
MaryvalesFinest wrote:They should definately trade Amare for draft picks, the 2010 draft is probably the most loaded since the 2003 class I see a ton of future stars...

I've been tempted to say "if I wanted your opinion I'd give it to you" a couple times lately but this opinion of yours is worth something. I doubt we'll get a D-wade, Carmelo, Bosh, or James out of it but they're freaks of nature. Plenty of great players to be had.

I agree with Clark not being the power forward of the future but I can see him as our "small" forward of the future. He might never be more than a good player, but I'm ok with good. Dudley's just good and he still has plenty of an impact

Yeah I was just mentioning it in general not necessarily on what the Suns would get if they traded Amare. For instance, guys like Evan Turner and Xavier Henry are projected to go between 5-10. Each of those guys could have been the #1 pick in both the 08 and 09 drafts, that's how insanely good this draft is.

DBrimstone · Post #15 » by **DBrimstone** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 6:13 am

There's like 4 or five PF's or C's that are projected to go late in the 1st round that just look lovely. If only we had a pick to grab one of them........

With the way LB's playing would anyone be opposed to trading him for scum and a later 1st rounder and letting Dudley and Dragic pick up his extra minutes? They've both been playing better than him in my opinion.

Minnesota has more picks than they know what to do with and no shooting guards who know how to shoot... New Jersey's got a later pick too...

sunfire0112 · Post #16 » by **sunfire0112** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 7:39 am

DBrimstone wrote:
ChrisInAZ wrote:
Jimmy76 wrote:
edit:confirmed we currently have 3 second round picks

Cool! Three chances to maybe get lucky (no sarchasm)

See also Jeff Hornacek, Manu Ginobli, Tony Parker...

Or combine them and trade up for a late first (like was already stated), then trade the pick and (sign and) trade Amare or LB (who I don't care for right now) for somebody decent and a high first rounder.

Technically Tony Parker was drafted in the 1st round. I hate the fact that I know this... :evil:

Anyway, I'm all for trying to trade for some picks but we don't have any real valuable trading chips. With all the 2010 draft hype, it's also gonna be real hard to get our hands on a 1st rounder. There's always hope we strike gold in the 2nd round!

Post #17 » by **lilfishi22** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 7:49 am

Can Amare's deal be extended during the season? If so, any chance we could pry away NY's (Utah) 1st in a deal including Boozer or whatever expirings/bad contracts etc etc?

sunsfever68 · Post #18 » by **sunsfever68** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 7:56 am

Evan Turner. Somehow we need to get this guy. Ohio State swingman. If you don't know how good this kid is look him up. EVAN TURNER!!!

sunsfever68 · Post #19 » by **sunsfever68** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 8:00 am

The reason we need evan turner is because he actually knows HOW TO DRIBBLE THE BASKETBALL. the only person who knows what to do putting the ball on the floor is nash, grant hill, and dragic to an extent but not really.

Ball handling is the most underrated part of basketball these days. Ask Amare, ask Jason richardson ask leandro barbosa. All terrible terrible ball handlers. Especially amare. what a joke. he fumbles more than Beanie Wells lol.

Evan Turner is the kind of 2 guard we need for the future. Trade Amare get a high first round pick and take Evan Turner. He's the next Brandon Roy. You need a 2 guard who can take his man off the dribble and create his own shot. It's so basic yet the Suns have never had one really

sunfire0112 · Post #20 » by **sunfire0112** » Thu Dec 3, 2009 8:15 am

Damn. Don't get my hopes up!

A big SG w/ great handles in the mold of Roy or JJ. If we got that kid our backcourt for the future would be set.
The problem is that he's projected to go pretty high in the lotto. If only we could somehow swindle someone else's pick. :lol: