Aldo All-time

Jasen777 · Post #1 » by **Jasen777** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 12:23 am

So where is Aldo on the all time list? Fight Matrix has him up to number 5. 25-1 (only loss at LW), 7 straight UFC title defenses, 3 WEC title fight wins, etc...

You could knock the FW division, but all the great champs have gotten some east fights. True, some more than others...

SDM · Post #2 » by **SDM** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 12:14 pm

I'm cool with 4 or 5. I have a hard time putting him over GSP, Silva, and Bones. For years, GSP didn't lose a round and Silva only lost rounds against Maia because he was screwing around, practically laughing at a guy who could murder 99% of the planet in under 5 minutes. That's too badass for words. Bones is Bones and might be #1 by the end, unfortunately.

It's interesting, because he cleaned out the division just like those guys, but his win over Cub was soooo early into his run and both guys are better and different fighters now. He didn't beat the Cub Swanson that's straight up murdering people now. Also, Edgar deserves a rematch.

REDDzone · Post #3 » by **REDDzone** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 3:12 pm

I'm still not 100% sure that he isn't the best fighter on the planet.

Or at least he will be starting in January.

NZB2323 · Post #4 » by **NZB2323** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 3:22 pm

I remember that in Cammo's rankings I complained about Chuck Liddell being ranked higher than him.

I can't put him above GSP, Silva, or Fedor.

Dan Henderson has more losses, but he also fought the best fighters across 3 divisions. BJ Penn had a better prime, being a champ in 2 weight classes, but he hasn't had the longevity.

Jon Jones, Cain, and DJ could all pass him but he's been a champion longer.

So he's definitely top 10, probably top 5.

SDM · Post #5 » by **SDM** » Thu Oct 30, 2014 3:44 pm

BJ hung around too long, I think, to crack the top 5. Greatest peak? He's up there. Overall? He's had some fights where he looked awful. Appreciate his fearlessness and influence, no question.

Hendo definitely has a solid case for top five... and Werdum too, if he's able to win his next couple.

REDDzone · Post #6 » by **REDDzone** » Fri Oct 31, 2014 12:22 am

See I don't see guys like Henderson as on the same level. Aldo has been the clear cut number one guy in his weight class for YEARS, Hendo never achieved that. Also, regardless of who he fought, he has twelve losses. And if we are JUST talking peak then I'd consider someone like BJ to be above him.

The true top 3-5 guys mostly have just a few losses to their names and were all the clear cut number one guy in their class for significant amounts of time: GSP, Fedor, Silva, Bones, Aldo.

NZB2323 · Post #7 » by **NZB2323** » Fri Oct 31, 2014 4:01 pm

Aldo never fought a guy who was 2 weight classes above him. Henderson was a natural MW who beat 2 of the best HWs of all time. P4P that has to count for something.

I'm fine if you rank guys like GSP, Fedor, Silva, Bones, Aldo, and BJ above Henderson, but I'm also fine with people ranking Henderson as #4 all time P4P. P4P is so subjective, and both rankings are acceptable to me.

REDDzone · Post #8 » by **REDDzone** » Fri Oct 31, 2014 4:33 pm

NZB2323 wrote:Aldo never fought a guy who was 2 weight classes above him. Henderson was a natural MW who beat 2 of the best HWs of all time. P4P that has to count for something.

I'm fine if you rank guys like GSP, Fedor, Silva, Bones, Aldo, and BJ above Henderson, but I'm also fine with people ranking Henderson as #4 all time P4P. P4P is so subjective, and both rankings are acceptable to me.

I'm fine with your ranking too, it is subjective. If we are talking guys with the best resume of wins ever, Hendo is definitely up there. Unfortunately for him, we have to count losses as well. Shields beat the **** out of him as a smaller guy (if we laud his wins against bigger opponents, shouldn't we also consider his losses against smaller ones?). And also, nobody on my top 5 was ever treated the same way that Cormier treated Henderson, just an embarrassing ragdolling. Finally, again this is subjective, but I would be lying if the PEDs thing didn't play a role for me. Do we know when Hendo got on the juice? I'm just wondering if it coincided with his strikeforce run.

Cammo101 · Post #9 » by **Cammo101** » Fri Oct 31, 2014 8:11 pm

NZB2323 wrote:I remember that in Cammo's rankings I complained about Chuck Liddell being ranked higher than

I've actually been kicking around the idea of updating those rankings.

REDDzone · Post #10 » by **REDDzone** » Fri Oct 31, 2014 9:34 pm

Cammo101 wrote:
NZB2323 wrote:I remember that in Cammo's rankings I complained about Chuck Liddell being ranked higher than

I've actually been kicking around the idea of updating those rankings.

Do you even make lists, bro? I feel like I don't even know you anymore.

Cammo101 · Post #11 » by **Cammo101** » Mon Nov 3, 2014 1:14 pm

REDDzone wrote:
Cammo101 wrote:
NZB2323 wrote:I remember that in Cammo's rankings I complained about Chuck Liddell being ranked higher than

I've actually been kicking around the idea of updating those rankings.

Do you even make lists, bro? I feel like I don't even know you anymore.

My list game hasn't been on point lately.

K1NG · Post #12 » by **K1NG** » Thu Nov 6, 2014 6:53 am

If Aldo's streak continues and he isn't fighting at 155 by 2016, I'll be disappointed.

Cammo101 · Post #13 » by **Cammo101** » Thu Nov 6, 2014 2:57 pm

K1NG wrote:If Aldo's streak continues and he isn't fighting at 155 by 2016, I'll be disappointed.

If he beats the Edgar/Swanson winner and then McGregor...it will be time to move up.

cowboyronnie · Post #14 » by **cowboyronnie** » Thu Nov 6, 2014 3:13 pm

REDDzone wrote:See I don't see guys like Henderson as on the same level. Aldo has been the clear cut number one guy in his weight class for YEARS, Hendo never achieved that. Also, regardless of who he fought, he has twelve losses. And if we are JUST talking peak then I'd consider someone like BJ to be above him.

The true top 3-5 guys mostly have just a few losses to their names and were all the clear cut number one guy in their class for significant amounts of time: GSP, Fedor, Silva, Bones, Aldo.

re: Hendo's losses...As that Parsons podcast made clear, it was a different time. Fighters would be left to prepare for Pride fights pretty slapdash and Hendo had more courage than career-management. I mean, he was put in there with Big Nog and Yvel and took his first fights without any striking training at all. There were only like 3-4 MMA gyms in the country anyways. You took what you could get, and had to be prepared to face losses...cos you just didn't know what you were getting into. It's a crazy mentality, no room for perfectionism or trying to manage all outcomes. Chips fall.

Whereas, you're defending a title in 2010, you and your top-to-bottom MMA camp are given 6-8 months notice and there's an enforced weight class and no one's showing up with a coke can of stimulants freshly injected into their thigh.

Cammo101 · Post #15 » by **Cammo101** » Thu Nov 6, 2014 3:18 pm

Aldo and Hendo could not be more different. Hendo went to the BJ Penn school of anytime/anywhere/anybody where as Aldo pulls out o fights with hangnails. Hendo has fought the best of the best in two of MMAs most stacked division for over a decade, Aldo has beaten up on a lot of guys (even in the UFC) who really had no business in there with him, because for a long time his division was pretty thin. It is a complete apples and oranges debate, but both are top 10 all time level fighters. They just went about it in two different ways.

cowboyronnie · Post #16 » by **cowboyronnie** » Thu Nov 6, 2014 3:31 pm

Cammo101 wrote:Aldo and Hendo could not be more different. Hendo went to the BJ Penn school of anytime/anywhere/anybody where as Aldo pulls out o fights with hangnails. Hendo has fought the best of the best in two of MMAs most stacked division for over a decade, Aldo has beaten up on a lot of guys (even in the UFC) who really had no business in there with him, because for a long time his division was pretty thin. It is a complete apples and oranges debate, but both are top 10 all time level fighters. They just went about it in two different ways.

agree

REDDzone · Post #17 » by **REDDzone** » Thu Nov 6, 2014 3:33 pm

cowboyronnie wrote:re: Hendo's losses...As that Parsons podcast made clear, it was a different time. Fighters would be left to prepare for Pride fights pretty slapdash and Hendo had more courage than career-management. I mean, he was put in there with Big Nog and Yvel and took his first fights without any striking training at all. There were only like 3-4 MMA gyms in the country anyways. You took what you could get, and had to be prepared to face losses...cos you just didn't know what you were getting into. It's a crazy mentality, no room for perfectionism or trying to manage all outcomes. Chips fall.

Whereas, you're defending a title in 2010, you and your top-to-bottom MMA camp are given 6-8 months notice and there's an enforced weight class and no one's showing up with a coke can of stimulants freshly injected into their thigh.

The majority of his losses came after Pride ended.

cowboyronnie · Post #18 » by **cowboyronnie** » Thu Nov 6, 2014 3:42 pm

he still shows up with that attitude, though. listening to him on Helwani before the Vitor fight in Brazil a year or two back, Helwani was trying to have him acknowledge how difficult a task it is to fly into some jungle city in Goiás and fight a native Brasilian who will be coming in with superhuman training abilities...Hendo couldn't have cared less. It's still IVC to him. he goes in, faces whomever, bangs it out, chips fall.

that's not Aldo.

REDDzone · Post #19 » by **REDDzone** » Thu Nov 6, 2014 4:08 pm

I'm not arguing it is at all. In any way, shape, or form.

And nobody is more a sucker for those anytime anyplace type of guys than I am btw. I personally just think a guy like Aldo who has been the man in his division for years and years is higher on the all time list than a guy who was probably never the best in either of his divisions.

cowboyronnie · Post #20 » by **cowboyronnie** » Thu Nov 6, 2014 4:16 pm

Aldo>Hendo, IMO

But hard to compare