UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cain...

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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#41 » by lilfishi22 » Thu Oct 23, 2014 11:06 pm

Bernman wrote:
REDDzone wrote:That was like 5.5 years ago and only 3 years into Cain's career.


It may have been w/ a torn acl, but that didn't excuse his chin when he was 1-punch ko'ed effectively by JDS the first time. And he got hurt by him multiple times the last fight. But JDS couldn't get the separation to follow up and finish him off because I think he sucks dong in the clinch. Are there other fights with him doing good clinch work? I don't think there are, but Werdum has been painting some masterpieces in that dept as you displayed by the beautiful gif against Browne you provided or in the Big Country fight. I think some of those knees on Big Country take Cain out. He doesn't have Country's chin. And he may have been able to finish Browne if he needed to, but he was in mission control after the first few minutes. Sure, Cain may be able to land 150 if it goes the distance. But Werdum lands half as many, but harder ones, if it does too. And his are much more apt to ensure it doesn't.

I say Werdum WHEREVER IT GOES. I'm calling my shot. Hopefully the fight doesn't fall apart and we can find out who's right.

Big Country is not a good clinch fighter. He's got a lot of power but in terms of controlling his man on the cage and deliver offense, he's no where near Cain's level. THe amount of space Big Country gave to Werdum when he was pushing him up against the cage is ridiculous. There should be no reason why Werdum is able to get the plum and create space between their hips to deliver knees. A fighter on Cain's level knows this. Cain was chest on chest the entire two fights against JDS.

Likewise with Browne, outside of the first round when he had Werdum hurt surviving, Werdum was doing most of his clinch work with Browne up against the fence not the other way around. Cain is not giving Werdum any space to do damage, that's a guarantee.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#42 » by NZB2323 » Sun Nov 9, 2014 6:52 pm

Are we really supposed to pretend that this is a title fight?
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#43 » by lilfishi22 » Sun Nov 9, 2014 10:20 pm

It's an interim title fight...if that means anything to anyone.

I'm just excited to see Hunt fight for the title
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#44 » by NZB2323 » Sun Nov 9, 2014 11:00 pm

lilfishi22 wrote:It's an interim title fight...if that means anything to anyone.

I'm just excited to see Hunt fight for the title


This is certainly not on the same level as the last intern title fight- Condit vs. Diaz.

Mark Hunt is on a 1 fight win streak against the #9 ranked HW. JDS finished both of these guys, and has only lost to Cain. This card doesn't have a whole lot of fights outside of the main event to get me excited. Gastelum won TUF because Hall was timid against him, and he's a boring fighter who hasn't shown much improvement going up against a guy who lost his last 2. Lamas and Bermudez are good, but I don't see them winning against Aldo, Edgar, ect.

Basically I see all the winners of UFC 180 losing their next fight.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#45 » by REDDzone » Sun Nov 9, 2014 11:55 pm

NZB2323 wrote:This is certainly not on the same level as the last intern title fight- Condit vs. Diaz.

Mark Hunt is on a 1 fight win streak against the #9 ranked HW. JDS finished both of these guys, and has only lost to Cain. This card doesn't have a whole lot of fights outside of the main event to get me excited. Gastelum won TUF because Hall was timid against him, and he's a boring fighter who hasn't shown much improvement going up against a guy who lost his last 2. Lamas and Bermudez are good, but I don't see them winning against Aldo, Edgar, ect.

Basically I see all the winners of UFC 180 losing their next fight.


To be fair this is far from the original version, as this card has been decimated with injuries. The "title fight" is a last ditch effort for marketing purposes.

I don't see why you criticize the Lamas/Bermudez fight though. Lamas already beat Cub and was beating up Aldo in round 5 in their fight. If your logic is to not care about that fight because neither would beat Aldo then you shouldn't care about the Edgar/Cub fight either.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#46 » by CPT » Mon Nov 10, 2014 1:53 am

To be unfair, this fight could have had a main card of

Hunt vs. Werdum
Bisping vs. Rockhold
Shogun vs. OSP
Ellenberger vs. Gastelum
Lamas vs. Bermudez

with Pearson vs. Iaquinta and maybe some other half decent stuff on the prelims.

Even then, I wouldn't be like "WOW this card is stacked!"

Instead we get it spread over 3 **** events.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#47 » by Jasen777 » Mon Nov 10, 2014 2:11 am

And it could have had Uncle Creepy pull out.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#48 » by NZB2323 » Mon Nov 10, 2014 2:27 am

REDDzone wrote:
NZB2323 wrote:This is certainly not on the same level as the last intern title fight- Condit vs. Diaz.

Mark Hunt is on a 1 fight win streak against the #9 ranked HW. JDS finished both of these guys, and has only lost to Cain. This card doesn't have a whole lot of fights outside of the main event to get me excited. Gastelum won TUF because Hall was timid against him, and he's a boring fighter who hasn't shown much improvement going up against a guy who lost his last 2. Lamas and Bermudez are good, but I don't see them winning against Aldo, Edgar, ect.

Basically I see all the winners of UFC 180 losing their next fight.


To be fair this is far from the original version, as this card has been decimated with injuries. The "title fight" is a last ditch effort for marketing purposes.

I don't see why you criticize the Lamas/Bermudez fight though. Lamas already beat Cub and was beating up Aldo in round 5 in their fight. If your logic is to not care about that fight because neither would beat Aldo then you shouldn't care about the Edgar/Cub fight either.


Edgar is the king of rematches.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#49 » by REDDzone » Mon Nov 10, 2014 3:25 am

NZB2323 wrote:
Edgar is the king of rematches.


Technically 1-1-1 in rematches iirc. 8-)
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#50 » by NZB2323 » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:09 am

REDDzone wrote:
NZB2323 wrote:
Edgar is the king of rematches.


Technically 1-1-1 in rematches iirc. 8-)


Technically 2-1-1. Did you forget about BJ?
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#51 » by REDDzone » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:18 am

NZB2323 wrote:
REDDzone wrote:
NZB2323 wrote:
Edgar is the king of rematches.


Technically 1-1-1 in rematches iirc. 8-)


Technically 2-1-1. Did you forget about BJ?


Won against BJ, Lost against Benson, Drew Maynard in the rematch. What am I missing?

edit: Ahh I see, you are counting the third fight with Maynard.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#52 » by lilfishi22 » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:43 am

NZB2323 wrote:
lilfishi22 wrote:It's an interim title fight...if that means anything to anyone.

I'm just excited to see Hunt fight for the title


This is certainly not on the same level as the last intern title fight- Condit vs. Diaz.

Mark Hunt is on a 1 fight win streak against the #9 ranked HW. JDS finished both of these guys, and has only lost to Cain. This card doesn't have a whole lot of fights outside of the main event to get me excited. Gastelum won TUF because Hall was timid against him, and he's a boring fighter who hasn't shown much improvement going up against a guy who lost his last 2. Lamas and Bermudez are good, but I don't see them winning against Aldo, Edgar, ect.

Basically I see all the winners of UFC 180 losing their next fight.

Things at HW is always murky because the talent is so concentrated at the top. JDS has already had 3 cracks at Cain and lost 1-2. He'll get another shot soon enough based on being clearly the 2nd best HW in the world. The next logical guy down the ranking is Browne, Hunt or Miocic. Miocic is booked against JDS and Browne just lost to Werdum. There isn't really any other fights available unless you go further down the ranking:
Barnett(lost to Browne)
Pitbull (ugly decision against Shaub and decent KO against #10)
Not many options and they can always sell Mark to the hardcore fans

Gastelum is boring? Really? I love watching him fight. The guy has good boxing and great power. He's young and he comes in to fight. Dude comes in improved every time. Unlike Rory who likes to pick people apart and make them apprehensive, Gastelum is probably going to go in there to put Ellenberger out.

Lamas v Bermudez is interesting from a rankings standpoint and I hope Bermudez wins just so there's a new contender even though I don't see him beating Aldo either.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#53 » by Jasen777 » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:56 am

lilfishi22 wrote:There isn't really any other fights available unless you go further down the ranking:


On the bright side Cain can't fight very often so he's not clearing the division out.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#54 » by REDDzone » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:59 am

NZB doesn't make any sense. He was just giving me grief like a week ago because I said I didn't care about Phil vs Glover, he said as an mma fan I should be excited to watch top 10 guys fight.

Now he have two top 7 featherweights fighting and the #8 and #11 welterweight fighting and he is talking about how he isn't excited.

Its funny because he says its because Lamas/Bermudez won't beat Aldo, I think I said the same thing about Glover/Phil in regards to Bones.

Where you at NZB?!
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#55 » by lilfishi22 » Mon Nov 10, 2014 5:05 am

Jasen777 wrote:
lilfishi22 wrote:There isn't really any other fights available unless you go further down the ranking:


On the bright side Cain can't fight very often so he's not clearing the division out.

It's bad because the "contenders" are kind of knocking themselves off by fighting each other and with how shallow the division is, it makes HW title fights harder and harder to sell. Basically, the only legit contender out there is Miocic.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#56 » by CPT » Mon Nov 10, 2014 7:30 am

lilfishi22 wrote:
Jasen777 wrote:
lilfishi22 wrote:There isn't really any other fights available unless you go further down the ranking:


On the bright side Cain can't fight very often so he's not clearing the division out.

It's bad because the "contenders" are kind of knocking themselves off by fighting each other and with how shallow the division is, it makes HW title fights harder and harder to sell. Basically, the only legit contender out there is Miocic.


I don't know if I've ever seen stronger evidence that the division should just be folded.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#57 » by NZB2323 » Mon Nov 10, 2014 1:32 pm

REDDzone wrote:NZB doesn't make any sense. He was just giving me grief like a week ago because I said I didn't care about Phil vs Glover, he said as an mma fan I should be excited to watch top 10 guys fight.

Now he have two top 7 featherweights fighting and the #8 and #11 welterweight fighting and he is talking about how he isn't excited.

Its funny because he says its because Lamas/Bermudez won't beat Aldo, I think I said the same thing about Glover/Phil in regards to Bones.

Where you at NZB?!
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:lol: fair enough.

I think it's just because this is a PPV that has a "title fight" that makes me so critical. If this were on Fox Sports 1 I wouldn't complain and I would watch it. But I'm supposed to shell out money for this? Mark Hunt has 1 win in his last 3 fights and it's against a guy who is obese, if not morbidly obese.

And I wasn't criticizing you for not caring about Davis/Glover, I was just curious because I was interested in it and you're a bigger MMA fan than me.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#58 » by REDDzone » Mon Nov 10, 2014 1:48 pm

Haha, I'm just busting your balls.

I will probably watch but I am a Werdum fan, and if anyone actually reads my posts they know I like Kelvin a lot (future champ imo if he gets his weight under control) and I think Bermudez is a cool dude as well.

I think the main event result will be good regardless and if Kelvin/Bermudez win then we have a few guys who will be near the top of their respective divisions making things interesting.

edit: Btw, not arguing that this is a good card for a ppv. Its not.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#59 » by cowboyronnie » Mon Nov 10, 2014 6:01 pm

Love Bastelum. That loose, crackin boxing. I don't see what's boring.

Lamas might have displayed more determination in a loss than anyone in a while. Tight, technical combos... Movement on point for the full five against Aldo. He made me a huge fan. Meanwhile, Bermudez is streaking hard. Those are two juggernauts... Hard to imagine either guy losing. Can't wait for that.
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Re: UFC 180(Nov 15)Cain/Werdum,Hunt steps in for injured Cai 

Post#60 » by REDDzone » Mon Nov 10, 2014 6:06 pm

War Bastelum! ;)
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