Bellator General Discussion and Info

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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1701 » by Bernman » Thu Dec 13, 2018 5:15 pm

REDDzone wrote:Is Primus actually going to show up for this fight? I am not a fan of Chandler, but feel like Primus/Chandler is a less overt version of Nicco/Valentina. What are the odds of a last minute injury or bad weight cut?


You're thinking of Page/Daley. That's the one that's destined to have a late pullout after all their false starts and blatant ducking. I think Chandler/Primus 2 is just a standard case of an injury delay. I mean Primus did win the previous fight, albeit under odd circumstances. He's very much a live dog here unlike Montano.

Don't know why Bellator keeps doing this back-to-back night events, and even in the same city, strategy. They could make a combined card that was pretty stout. That would receive a lot of attention from mma fans and be worth its own thread.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1702 » by BorkLazer » Thu Dec 13, 2018 6:03 pm

Bernman wrote:Coker was always excusing the delay in scheduling of Page-Daley on waiting for the next English card. Now apparently they're having another English card in early February and it's not even taking place there. It's rumored for the States. I could understand if it would expedite the process. But at best it's ticketed for two weeks earlier on Fedor-Bader. I bet it's not even held there.

Why can't Scott manage a tournament properly? They always take forever. Put a couple on each card back-to-back. Fans are always excited but then it loses luster the longer it drags on. People can't remember context. The decision to include Rory even though he was fighting for the MW title on the same night as an opening round fight was probably the wackiest decision.

Edit: Apparently they're announcing Daley-MVP tonight. For some reason they're holding it in Connecticut the week after the UK card. Bizarre decision-making again by Bellator to say the least.


Very odd having this fight not in the UK I agree. On the other hand, Mohegan Sun is only about a 20 minute drive from me. Definitely going to grab tickets.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1703 » by REDDzone » Thu Dec 13, 2018 6:09 pm

Bernman wrote:You're thinking of Page/Daley. That's the one that's destined to have a late pullout after all their false starts and blatant ducking. I think Chandler/Primus 2 is just a standard case of an injury delay. I mean Primus did win the previous fight, albeit under odd circumstances. He's very much a live dog here unlike Montano.


I'm just skeptical of him in general I guess. Why hasn't he fought in a year and a half? Why does he only have 8 total fights despite starting his pro career in 2010? If we include amateur career, he started in 2006 and has 11 total fights. That's less than one fight per year. And he's supposed to beat Michael Chandler somehow?
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1704 » by Bernman » Thu Dec 13, 2018 6:43 pm

BorkLazer wrote:Very odd having this fight not in the UK I agree. On the other hand, Mohegan Sun is only about a 20 minute drive from me. Definitely going to grab tickets.


So you're not going to complain. Maybe about the back-to-back night cards. They're doing that at Mohegan Sun too. Could make it a weekend trip if they have a 2-event deal.

I've heard Coker's explanation since, and he talked out of both sides of his mouth. Claimed the fight staff still wanted it in England but the TV execs rebuffed. Then went on to say if they were going to do it in England it would have to be in London. I don't buy that at all. It's the first reason. Tell those dinosaurs to stop tape delaying, put it on Saturday, and it won't be a problem.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1705 » by Bernman » Thu Dec 13, 2018 6:47 pm

REDDzone wrote:I'm just skeptical of him in general I guess. Why hasn't he fought in a year and a half? Why does he only have 8 total fights despite starting his pro career in 2010? If we include amateur career, he started in 2006 and has 11 total fights. That's less than one fight per year. And he's supposed to beat Michael Chandler somehow?


Combo of injuries and Bellator's negligence would be Occam's Razor. Bandejas finally got a fight, Nallo fights once a year, Lima is inactive for a combo of injuries and Bellator's mismanagement. But bad asses when they get in the cage. Primus is more of a grinder, but still. Doesn't strike me as afraid of anybody between aggression and being an above average talent. Dude has to make money too. I wouldn't be surprised if he wasn't full-time still, even as champ. Early in career still and inactive.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1706 » by BorkLazer » Thu Dec 13, 2018 6:48 pm

Bernman wrote:
BorkLazer wrote:Very odd having this fight not in the UK I agree. On the other hand, Mohegan Sun is only about a 20 minute drive from me. Definitely going to grab tickets.


So you're not going to complain. Maybe about the back-to-back night cards. They're doing that at Mohegan Sun too. Could make it a weekend trip if they have a 2-event deal.

I've heard Coker's explanation since, and he talked out of both sides of his mouth. Claimed the fight staff still wanted it in England but the TV execs rebuffed. Then went on to say if they were going to do it in England it would have to be in London. I don't buy that at all. It's the first reason. Tell those dinosaurs to stop tape delaying, put it on Saturday, and it won't be a problem.


Nope not going to complain at all haha. I didn't know they were doing the fights back to back at the same location, that's awesome. I know some people that work at MS and they've given me free tickets to events before, maybe I'll get lucky :lol:
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1707 » by Bernman » Thu Dec 13, 2018 6:54 pm

BorkLazer wrote:Nope not going to complain at all haha. I didn't know they were doing the fights back to back at the same location, that's awesome. I know some people that work at MS and they've given me free tickets to events before, maybe I'll get lucky :lol:


Free tickets, free room, 2 quality MMA events to attend - nice little Saturday/Friday

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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1708 » by REDDzone » Thu Dec 13, 2018 6:54 pm

Bernman wrote:
REDDzone wrote:I'm just skeptical of him in general I guess. Why hasn't he fought in a year and a half? Why does he only have 8 total fights despite starting his pro career in 2010? If we include amateur career, he started in 2006 and has 11 total fights. That's less than one fight per year. And he's supposed to beat Michael Chandler somehow?


Combo of injuries and Bellator's negligence would be Occam's Razor. Bandejas finally got a fight, Nallo fights once a year, Lima is inactive for a combo of injuries and Bellator's mismanagement. But bad asses when they get in the cage. Primus is more of a grinder, but still. Doesn't strike me as afraid of anybody between aggression and being an above average talent. Dude has to make money too. I wouldn't be surprised if he wasn't full-time still, even as champ. Early in career still and inactive.



Not trying to imply he's afraid of Chandler, just to clarify. If anything maybe realizes that he got away with one in the first fight and doesn't want to give that belt back. IDK, maybe I'm completely wrong. But fighting less than once a year since 2006 is cray.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1709 » by REDDzone » Sat Dec 15, 2018 5:50 am

Whoa, MC talking about how he wants to hurt Primus bad, make sure he never fights again. Isn't he supposedly a big Christian? Lol.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1710 » by REDDzone » Sat Dec 15, 2018 6:27 am

Turned off bellator when MC got the TD in the 4th, clear how this fight is gonna finish. MC won't try to pass and won't land any significant GnP, BP will continue with half a$$ Williams guard attempts that lead to nothing and never try to get to his feet once. Maybe try butterfly at least once next time.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1711 » by Bernman » Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:09 pm

That was one of the most offputting events in MMA history. They dragged it out relentlessly with thinly veiled war propaganda masked as saluting the troops, and when they finally got to the main event, after a round and a half of compelling action that nearly resulted in a finish, Chandler just rode it out on top once he learned Primus didn't have the flexibility or explosiveness in his legs to get up, nor craft to threaten with his guard.

And yes, Chandler's narcissism whilst falsely presenting himself as moral thru religion, ala the king himself JBJ, made it even more unsettling that he was having his way. Primus needs to rehab his knees more, ditch that "Williams" guard for an open one, and work on his boxing to set up his kicking game. The leg kicks especially are fantastic. Really disappointing in his grappling though. Wrestling and jj are supposed to be his strengths. Must need to be able to get on top, which he couldn't against Chandler.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1712 » by REDDzone » Sat Dec 15, 2018 8:44 pm

You just don't really sub a guy like Chandler from the bottom. Maybe if you're Lovato or something, idk. To accept that position all night and not try to kick off the hips and get back to your feet is mind-blowing. Not to say it would work, but clearly his guard wasn't working either. That's the lack of fight experience I was referencing earlier, IMO.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1713 » by Bernman » Sat Dec 15, 2018 9:33 pm

REDDzone wrote:You just don't really sub a guy like Chandler from the bottom. Maybe if you're Lovato or something, idk. To accept that position all night and not try to kick off the hips and get back to your feet is mind-blowing. Not to say it would work, but clearly his guard wasn't working either. That's the lack of fight experience I was referencing earlier, IMO.


We can't all have the leg pressing strength of beasts like you though to push off opponents. I'd at least liked to have seen him work side to side for an armbar, then maybe could pop up in the scramble. Or even give up his back to try and stand up after while. 4th rd on there was no point in him hanging out in a guard with low % sub attempts like omaplatas from there, and doesn't even control both his opponent's arms to stop the gnp. He couldn't even slap on a classic rubber guard for those purposes? He must have just learned that and wanted to show it off. But before there wasn't a guy trying to bash him in the face.

You had to be impressed with McKee's anaconda choke though. And then trapped him down in the well on the roll so there was no way out. That guy is slick AF. But he couldn't do it without his Snickers. That was even worse than Rampage's "I'm a Monster" product placement. Bellator brings the unintentional comedy.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1714 » by REDDzone » Sat Dec 15, 2018 9:43 pm

Bernman wrote:
REDDzone wrote:You just don't really sub a guy like Chandler from the bottom. Maybe if you're Lovato or something, idk. To accept that position all night and not try to kick off the hips and get back to your feet is mind-blowing. Not to say it would work, but clearly his guard wasn't working either. That's the lack of fight experience I was referencing earlier, IMO.


We can't all have the leg pressing strength of beasts like you though to push off opponents. I'd at least liked to have seen him work side to side for an armbar, then maybe could pop up in the scramble. Or even give up his back to try and stand up after while. 4th rd on there was no point in him hanging out in a guard with low % sub attempts like omaplatas from there, and doesn't even control both his opponent's arms to stop the gnp. He couldn't even slap on a classic rubber guard for those purposes? He must have just learned that and wanted to show it off. But before there wasn't a guy trying to bash him in the face.

You had to be impressed with McKee's anaconda choke though. And then trapped him down in the well on the roll so there was no way out. That guy is slick AF. But he couldn't do it without his Snickers. That was even worse than Rampage's "I'm a Monster" product placement. Bellator brings the unintentional comedy.
He was going for armbars though, that whole 3 minute stretch when Herb warned him 20 times about his toes in the cage was him trying to cut an angle for an armbar. So it's not that he didn't try, it's that there was nothing doing.

I didn't watch any other fights on the card.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1715 » by Bernman » Sun Dec 16, 2018 10:04 pm

Neiman is bringing Gracies and jitsy back. Controlled a high-level wrestler from back b4 subbing from a dominant position. Just a step ahead w/ technique. Also displayed underrated striking. Now makes a very interesting challenger for presumably Rory.

McGeary also made a comeback to relevance last night. Didn't expect him to beat King Mo. Thought Mo would ground him too. But he showed improved tdd, working the unders hard. Popped the jab to straight right to head kick combos. And took out his friend.

Machida did his normal matador and burst attack thing to another split decision. Judges really don't like his style. Frankly thought he won all 3 rds, and a minimum 2. The rematch vs. Moose next is logical. They'd both want it. It's what the people want.

They're selling this Hawaiian Honey as their next star. I don't see it between her not being an athletic anomaly and her personality is likable but she's not brash. Maybe will draw better than most of their champs.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1716 » by Bernman » Tue Jan 1, 2019 4:43 pm

Caldwell lost to Horiguchi in Rizin. Guess it's not a catastrophe for Bellator because part of the deal was Horiguchi would have to come back and defend in their org. Actually, they should have mixed feelings about their guy losing, because it spices up their bantamweight division. It was much needed.

I guess Caldwell is prone to guillotines the way he burrows in for td's and re-shots. And he's tapping to it rather easily. We found a bugaboo. He's under-achieving his talent to have 2 losses now. Wonder if they leverage the rematch because they think Caldwell is their most marketable champ, or give Horiguchi the winner of Bandejas-Archuleta. I'd prefer the latter. Caldwell can build himself back up, maybe even fight at 145 now and not be drawn out.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1717 » by REDDzone » Wed Jan 2, 2019 4:19 pm

Sucks that Caldwell lost. I don't care if guys juice when they are allowed to do so because it's not cheating. But Horiguchi was crazy ripped in some angles I saw him in that fight. Makes for an interesting dynamic if these trades/copromotions become a thing...guys regularly tested fighting guys who are encouraged by the org to juice.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1718 » by Bernman » Thu Feb 14, 2019 6:26 pm

MVP-Daley finally going down this weekend. Some thought we'd never see the day. I never could tell who was ducking who, if anyone, in that saga. but we'll get a gauge on who had a reason to. I think MVP compels Daley to come forward and knocks his block off on an accurate counter. Could be a really boring fight where both are scared to lose however. (BTW this event will also mark the triumphant return of Vitaly Minakov).

Another fight that appears to also finally be on the horizon is Chandler-Pat Pitbull. They scheduled it for May 21st. Champ-Champ, Bellator legends, among the best in their divisions worldwide, and a grudge match because of the history of Chandler ko'ing Patricio's brother. Both met at the cage lip after the last time, with Patricio shouting in broken English "I want to fight you, I want to fight you". And Chandler responding, "you want to fight me?!?!" Then making the cutthroat sign. I think this is a close fight because of Pitbull's timing, well-roundedness, strength, and Chandler won't have the ability to use reach.

That card will reportedly be loaded. Also scheduled to be on there are the MVP-Daley winner vs. Douglas Lima, Curran-McKee retry, and Jack Swagger's return.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1719 » by cowboyronnie » Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:10 pm

Bernman wrote:MVP-Daley finally going down this weekend. Some thought we'd never see the day. I never could tell who was ducking who, if anyone, in that saga. but we'll get a gauge on who had a reason to. I think MVP compels Daley to come forward and knocks his block off on an accurate counter. Could be a really boring fight where both are scared to lose however. (BTW this event will also mark the triumphant return of Vitaly Minakov).
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Definitely could see that. Both have so much pride to lose. Last time MVP was truly challenged, an all-time worst (non-HW) fight happened.
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Re: Bellator General Discussion and Info 

Post#1720 » by REDDzone » Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:05 pm

Maybe the fight was hard to make for other reasons, but I really have a hard time seeing Daley ducking MVP, considering he has fought superior fighters in his career. Why would you willingly fight Rory and Lima and then duck MVP? It doesn't make sense.
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