Boxing Thread 4.0

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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1841 » by NoDopeOnSundays » Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:11 am

This is an instant classic, what a fight.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1842 » by Rich Rane » Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:15 am

FOTY. I probably have Spence winning 7 rounds or 6 with the KD being the tiebreaker. This has the makings of a trilogy though.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1843 » by Butch718 » Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:22 am

Fight went the way I expected. A close decision for Spence. A lot of people were writing off Porter. Porter has the best resume(competition wise) out of any welter not named Pacquiao. Dude fought Thurman, Brook and Garcia in their primes. His style may not be pretty but the man is a f*cking dog in that ring. He would have given a tough fight to any welter fighting today, that includes Crawford.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1844 » by Butch718 » Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:29 am

If Spence is fighting Danny Garcia that means Pacquiao is gonna fight Mikey.

Porter should Crawford, but we all know that PBC likes to pretend that Crawford doesn’t exist, which is getting old.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1845 » by Butch718 » Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:30 am

Rich Rane wrote:FOTY. I probably have Spence winning 7 rounds or 6 with the KD being the tiebreaker. This has the makings of a trilogy though.

Close. Still Not better than Hurd/Williams.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1846 » by Pinkyring » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:34 pm

Butch718 wrote:If Spence is fighting Danny Garcia that means Pacquiao is gonna fight Mikey.

Porter should Crawford, but we all know that PBC likes to pretend that Crawford doesn’t exist, which is getting old.

Soooo it's PBC fault? No it's crawfords fault for resigning with arum when he knows there's all scrubs over there at 147, nobody outside hardcore boxing fans even know who he is.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1847 » by Butch718 » Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:37 pm

Stop being a stable fan boy. Y’all dudes are so embarrassing with the typical talking points that you see casuals spewing all over the Internet. The fact that Spence can’t even bring his name up shows you he’s been instructed by Haymon to ice him out the game.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1848 » by Pinkyring » Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:05 pm

Butch718 wrote:Stop being a stable fan boy. Y’all dudes are so embarrassing with the typical talking points that you see casuals spewing all over the Internet. The fact that Spence can’t even bring his name up shows you he’s been instructed by Haymon to ice him out the game.

Dude did you watch the post fight conference? Clearly you didnt, he mentioned Crawford but why would he go after that fight when manny is a bigger draw, more money, and also has a belt? Crawford is an unknown to casual boxing fans and he's beat nobody.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1849 » by NoDopeOnSundays » Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:31 pm

Eh, Arum won't let that fight happen unless it's some ridiculous 70/30 split in Crawford's favor, I don't see it as PBC's fault as much, they have all the leverage in this situation and a group of top 10 welterweights that Spence can fight. If Arum had Thurman, Garcia, Porter etc to keep Crawford busy would this be any different? Right now Crawford is no man's land, who is he going to fight next? Why should they mention him when he's on the outside with a notoriously stubborn promoter. Before he had the belts Spence was calling out everyone, nobody stepped up, now he has belts and Crawford is the clear b-side now and it's a case of Spence ducking?
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1850 » by Butch718 » Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:38 pm

Lol he’s a real unknown? You do realize he has more name recognition than Porter right? I can’t discuss boxing with guys like you seriously. You would rather draw a line in the sand like a groupie, rather than seeing the best fight the best.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1851 » by Butch718 » Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:43 pm

NoDopeOnSundays wrote:Eh, Arum won't let that fight happen unless it's some ridiculous 70/30 split in Crawford's favor, I don't see it as PBC's fault as much, they have all the leverage in this situation and a group of top 10 welterweights that Spence can fight. If Arum had Thurman, Garcia, Porter etc to keep Crawford busy would this be any different? Right now Crawford is no man's land, who is he going to fight next? Why should they mention him when he's on the outside with a notoriously stubborn promoter. Before he had the belts Spence was calling out everyone, nobody stepped up, now he has belts and Crawford is the clear b-side now and it's a case of Spence ducking?

Again, buying into the PBC talking points. When was Haymon willing to work with Arum? That one time the Pac/Mayweather fight happened? Or should we just keep blaming the senile old man for not making fights happen? This is my problem with boxing fans these days. No one looks at anything from a nonbiased point of view. The job of the promoter is to work with other promotions. Not ice other fighters out because they aren’t signed with YOUR promotion. Boxing isn’t a monopoly. I don’t even like Arum. He’s a greedy old ****. But so is **** Haymon. The only difference is Haymon never speak out in public and runs a tighter ship.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1852 » by NoDopeOnSundays » Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:47 pm

Butch718 wrote:
NoDopeOnSundays wrote:Eh, Arum won't let that fight happen unless it's some ridiculous 70/30 split in Crawford's favor, I don't see it as PBC's fault as much, they have all the leverage in this situation and a group of top 10 welterweights that Spence can fight. If Arum had Thurman, Garcia, Porter etc to keep Crawford busy would this be any different? Right now Crawford is no man's land, who is he going to fight next? Why should they mention him when he's on the outside with a notoriously stubborn promoter. Before he had the belts Spence was calling out everyone, nobody stepped up, now he has belts and Crawford is the clear b-side now and it's a case of Spence ducking?

Again, buying into the PBC talking points. When was Haymon willing to work with Arum? That one time the Pac/Mayweather fight happened? Or should we just keep blaming the senile old man for not making fights happen? This is my problem with boxing fans these days. No one looks at anything from a nonbiased point of view. The job of the promoter is to work with other promotions. Not ice other fighters out because they aren’t signed with YOUR promotion. Boxing isn’t a monopoly. I don’t even like Arum. He’s a greedy old ****. But so is **** Haymon. The only difference is Haymon never speak out in public and runs a tighter ship.



This has nothing to do with PBC talking points, it's literally just looking at the situation from the outside. The two promoters hate each other, one of them has a stable of fighters to keep his guy busy and the other doesn't. Obviously everyone wants to see Spence vs Bud, but realistically we all know it's not going to happen anytime soon for the reasons above. You're talking about this from an idealistic point of view and not from the reality of modern boxing, and boxing has been on this road for at least 15 years now when HBO guys rarely fought Showtime guys. The death of HBO boxing, the rise of PBC and the rise of streaming services has made it worse, but it's been like this for a while now.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1853 » by Pinkyring » Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:51 pm

Butch718 wrote:
NoDopeOnSundays wrote:Eh, Arum won't let that fight happen unless it's some ridiculous 70/30 split in Crawford's favor, I don't see it as PBC's fault as much, they have all the leverage in this situation and a group of top 10 welterweights that Spence can fight. If Arum had Thurman, Garcia, Porter etc to keep Crawford busy would this be any different? Right now Crawford is no man's land, who is he going to fight next? Why should they mention him when he's on the outside with a notoriously stubborn promoter. Before he had the belts Spence was calling out everyone, nobody stepped up, now he has belts and Crawford is the clear b-side now and it's a case of Spence ducking?

Again, buying into the PBC talking points. When was Haymon willing to work with Arum? That one time the Pac/Mayweather fight happened? Or should we just keep blaming the senile old man for not making fights happen? This is my problem with boxing fans these days. No one looks at anything from a nonbiased point of view. The job of the promoter is to work with other promotions. Not ice other fighters out because they aren’t signed with YOUR promotion. Boxing isn’t a monopoly. I don’t even like Arum. He’s a greedy old ****. But so is **** Haymon. The only difference is Haymon never speak out in public and runs a tighter ship.

Why would you work with an outside promoter when it's easier working with yourself? Do you know anything about business? Haymon has 4 out the top 5 welterweights in the world so he needs a Crawford fight why? Factor in Crawford has beaten nobody in the ww division to even deserve respect as elite. He couldn't break 200k ppv buys on a cheap espn platform against a fighter with a big following. You seem to lack common sense regarding boxing as it's called prize fighting, if Crawford could build a big enough purse for a fight it'd happen, he has zero draw ability
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1854 » by Butch718 » Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:57 pm

NoDopeOnSundays wrote:
Butch718 wrote:
NoDopeOnSundays wrote:Eh, Arum won't let that fight happen unless it's some ridiculous 70/30 split in Crawford's favor, I don't see it as PBC's fault as much, they have all the leverage in this situation and a group of top 10 welterweights that Spence can fight. If Arum had Thurman, Garcia, Porter etc to keep Crawford busy would this be any different? Right now Crawford is no man's land, who is he going to fight next? Why should they mention him when he's on the outside with a notoriously stubborn promoter. Before he had the belts Spence was calling out everyone, nobody stepped up, now he has belts and Crawford is the clear b-side now and it's a case of Spence ducking?

Again, buying into the PBC talking points. When was Haymon willing to work with Arum? That one time the Pac/Mayweather fight happened? Or should we just keep blaming the senile old man for not making fights happen? This is my problem with boxing fans these days. No one looks at anything from a nonbiased point of view. The job of the promoter is to work with other promotions. Not ice other fighters out because they aren’t signed with YOUR promotion. Boxing isn’t a monopoly. I don’t even like Arum. He’s a greedy old ****. But so is **** Haymon. The only difference is Haymon never speak out in public and runs a tighter ship.



This has nothing to do with PBC talking points, it's literally just looking at the situation from the outside. The two promoters hate each other, one of them has a stable of fighters to keep his guy busy and the other doesn't. Obviously everyone wants to see Spence vs Bud, but realistically we all know it's not going to happen anytime soon for the reasons above. You're talking about this from an idealistic point of view and not from the reality of modern boxing, and boxing has been on this road for at least 15 years now when HBO guys rarely fought Showtime guys. The death of HBO boxing, the rise of PBC and the rise of streaming services has made it worse, but it's been like this for a while now.

I’m well aware of the reality of what boxing is like these days. But I’m calling it the way it is. I think it’s flat out ridiculous to strictly blame Arum for Crawford and Spence not being made. It’s not all his fault but it’s easy to target him. I will always take issue with fans that strictly put absolutely no blame on Haymon.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1855 » by Butch718 » Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:59 pm

Pinkyring wrote:
Butch718 wrote:
NoDopeOnSundays wrote:Eh, Arum won't let that fight happen unless it's some ridiculous 70/30 split in Crawford's favor, I don't see it as PBC's fault as much, they have all the leverage in this situation and a group of top 10 welterweights that Spence can fight. If Arum had Thurman, Garcia, Porter etc to keep Crawford busy would this be any different? Right now Crawford is no man's land, who is he going to fight next? Why should they mention him when he's on the outside with a notoriously stubborn promoter. Before he had the belts Spence was calling out everyone, nobody stepped up, now he has belts and Crawford is the clear b-side now and it's a case of Spence ducking?

Again, buying into the PBC talking points. When was Haymon willing to work with Arum? That one time the Pac/Mayweather fight happened? Or should we just keep blaming the senile old man for not making fights happen? This is my problem with boxing fans these days. No one looks at anything from a nonbiased point of view. The job of the promoter is to work with other promotions. Not ice other fighters out because they aren’t signed with YOUR promotion. Boxing isn’t a monopoly. I don’t even like Arum. He’s a greedy old ****. But so is **** Haymon. The only difference is Haymon never speak out in public and runs a tighter ship.

Why would you work with an outside promoter when it's easier working with yourself? Do you know anything about business? Haymon has 4 out the top 5 welterweights in the world so he needs a Crawford fight why? Factor in Crawford has beaten nobody in the ww division to even deserve respect as elite. He couldn't break 200k ppv buys on a cheap espn platform against a fighter with a big following. You seem to lack common sense regarding boxing as it's called prize fighting, if Crawford could build a big enough purse for a fight it'd happen, he has zero draw ability

I’m literally laughing as I read this post. You sound exactly like lame fan boy. But keep on man. Do you.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1856 » by Pinkyring » Sun Sep 29, 2019 7:09 pm

Butch718 wrote:
Pinkyring wrote:
Butch718 wrote:Again, buying into the PBC talking points. When was Haymon willing to work with Arum? That one time the Pac/Mayweather fight happened? Or should we just keep blaming the senile old man for not making fights happen? This is my problem with boxing fans these days. No one looks at anything from a nonbiased point of view. The job of the promoter is to work with other promotions. Not ice other fighters out because they aren’t signed with YOUR promotion. Boxing isn’t a monopoly. I don’t even like Arum. He’s a greedy old ****. But so is **** Haymon. The only difference is Haymon never speak out in public and runs a tighter ship.

Why would you work with an outside promoter when it's easier working with yourself? Do you know anything about business? Haymon has 4 out the top 5 welterweights in the world so he needs a Crawford fight why? Factor in Crawford has beaten nobody in the ww division to even deserve respect as elite. He couldn't break 200k ppv buys on a cheap espn platform against a fighter with a big following. You seem to lack common sense regarding boxing as it's called prize fighting, if Crawford could build a big enough purse for a fight it'd happen, he has zero draw ability

I’m literally laughing as I read this post. You sound exactly like lame fan boy. But keep on man. Do you.

Yeah heaven forbid im not ignorant enough to ignore business element in one on one sports, sxcuse me
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1857 » by Pinkyring » Sun Sep 29, 2019 7:19 pm

You have to be a fool to think finances don't matter in boxing, none of these ww fighters are a big draw right now outside manny and people wanting to watch broner get his ass kicked, it makes zero sense to do an outside promoter deal from a business standpoint if said huy outside isn't a draw and crawford definitely isn't
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1858 » by Butch718 » Sun Sep 29, 2019 7:23 pm

Apologies for the condescending tone and attacks. I literally just cringe when people do not hold PBC accountable for anything. That being said my opinion still stands. Nothing will change how I feel about Haymon. I also cringe when I see fans dismiss Crawford due to who he’s signed with. Any knowledgeable fan knows he’s right up there with Spence and is a legit pound for pound talent and in the discussion with Loma, Canelo and Spence. He passes the eye test and only a biased fan would say he isn’t worthy of a fight.

Because let’s face it, If Crawford/Spence were signed tomorrow, that fight would make a ton of money and draw an insane amount of interest. You included. The only fights more profitable at Welter is Pacquiao vs Spence or Pac/Crawford. That’s the truth.
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1859 » by Pinkyring » Sun Sep 29, 2019 7:56 pm

Butch718 wrote:Apologies for the condescending tone and attacks. I literally just cringe when people do not hold PBC accountable for anything. That being said my opinion still stands. Nothing will change how I feel about Haymon. I also cringe when I see fans dismiss Crawford due to who he’s signed with. Any knowledgeable fan knows he’s right up there with Spence and is a legit pound for pound talent and in the discussion with Loma, Canelo and Spence. He passes the eye test and only a biased fan would say he isn’t worthy of a fight.

Because let’s face it, If Crawford/Spence were signed tomorrow, that fight would make a ton of money and draw an insane amount of interest. You included. The only fights more profitable at Welter is Pacquiao vs Spence or Pac/Crawford. That’s the truth.

It isn't about holding pbc accountable or not, i hear you but i think from a business perspective, Crawford doesn't draw interest so what incentive is it for haymon to do business with arum, it won't do 1m buys, 750k is a stretch so as a businessman, why make that fight when you have to split it with another promoter when you can make quality fights within your stable and do 500k buys that you get a cut on both ends? To crawford. Yes he passes the eye test and I think he has a good shot at beating any of the pbc guys but surely he knows about the obstacles getting a fight with them so why re sign with arum? Business wise that was dumb on his behalf. Pbc wont just give Spence to him so arum should push for a broner fight to let crawford knock him out and get a real buzz
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Re: Boxing Thread 4.0 

Post#1860 » by Butch718 » Sun Sep 29, 2019 8:20 pm

No one is doing a million PPV buys or anything close to it anymore unless it’s some crazy ass circus(Connor/Mayweather)or legit once in a generation super fight like May/Pac 5 years ago. Not even Canelo/GGG had that many buys and that’s the biggest PPV fight with anyone not named Mayweather or Pacquiao on it.

I just wanna see the best fighting the best. I don’t think Spence is ducking Crawford either. Al Haymom’s contempt of Arum and vice verse is hurting the sport. It could be so much bigger and draw so many more fans besides the ones that are currently in place. Whenever they do the screen shots of the top welters in the game, Crawford’s name is omitted. Listen, I get it. They only want to mention PBC fighters. But to act like he doesn’t exist when they purposefully disregard his name on the broadcast when discussing the best at 147, it’s cringe worthy. Boxing politics suck.

As for Crawford resigning with Top Rank can you honestly blame him? they’re the reason why he was put on the boxing map. To knock a fighter for staying loyal to the promotion that took a chance on him... They helped make him a house hold name and draw in his hometown of Omaha. That type of stuff matters a lot to a fighter. He’s just the victim of no other legit welters being signed to the promotion. At least Pacquiao was able to keep busy with Cotto, Margarito, Marquez and Bradley when he was with TR. Crawford has no one to tango with. In hindsight he probably should have signed with PBC to get bigger fights, but that doesn’t change the fact that Haymon is still as stubborn as Arum when it comes to working outside their promotions. A fight between Spence and Crawford benefits everyone. Everyone makes money and the sport grows and builds beyond its base when you give the fans the fights they want. Just my take.

Also Wilder and Fury got made twice. Cross promotional stuff can work. I just have to strongly disagree with anyone that puts all the blame on Arum, when Haymon is just as responsible for the current boxing landscape being so partisan.

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