UFC 199 (6/4): Weidman vs Rockhold, Cruz vs Faber

[Headliner]

I couldn't find a thread, so...

June 4, 2016

Middleweight Luke Rockhold (c) vs. Chris Weidman
Bantamweight Dominick Cruz (c) vs. Urijah Faber
Lightweight Dustin Poirier vs. Bobby Green
Lightweight Evan Dunham vs. Leonardo Santos
Middleweight Kevin Casey vs. Elvis Mutapcic
Light Heavyweight Jonathan Wilson vs. Luiz Henrique da Silva
Lightweight Polo Reyes vs. Dong Hyun Kim
Welterweight Sean Strickland vs. Tom Breese
Lightweight John Makdessi vs. Mehdi Baghdad

[CPT]

Not bad. I'll be happy if everyone makes it to fight time. Drops off hard after the main and co-main.

It's a different Dong Hyun Kim, by the way. No way Stun Gun could make 155.

I still think "Mehdi Baghdad" sounds like a fake name. Not a particularly imaginative one either.

[Headliner]

I'm excited for Cruz vs Faber, I know Faber is past his prime and is most likely going to lose, but I really want the guy to have a belt.
Faber is one of my top 5 all time favorite fighters, so I always fanboy for him when he is set for a match up.

I think we are going to see him go for a gameplan centered strictly around buzzcutting Cruz's knees out. That was the turning point in the TJ fight, and if Faber can chop that tree down, he's got an excellent shot to win. That's easier said then done though, because Cruz is so good at getting out of the way of damage.

I predict Cruise to win, but Im really hoping for a Faber miracle here.

[Jasen777]

I'm excited for Cruz vs Faber, I know Faber is past his prime and is most likely going to lose, but I really want the guy to have a belt.

[Headliner]

Haha, that's a phenomenal picture, but you know what I mean. I really don't want him to have to have an Astrix next to his name clarifying the stature of th WEC everytime he talks about a belt.
The next generation will have no idea the difference between Pride, strikeforce, the WEC, etc they will all be lumped into the same category and thought of as 'secondary feds', when we know that's not the case with the the WEC.

[REDDzone]

I think you may have to be at peace with the wwe champ thing, man (he seems to be). Faber imo hasn't looked the same since 2014ish.

[Headliner]

I think you may have to be at peace with the wwe champ thing, man (he seems to be). Faber imo hasn't looked the same since 2014ish.

For sure. His shot is slim, but if Matt Serra can be the champ, anyone can be on any given night haha.

[REDDzone]

Lol I said wwe, meant wec obvs.

[NZB2323]

Haha, that's a phenomenal picture, but you know what I mean. I really don't want him to have to have an Astrix next to his name clarifying the stature of th WEC everytime he talks about a belt.
The next generation will have no idea the difference between Pride, strikeforce, the WEC, etc they will all be lumped into the same category and thought of as 'secondary feds', when we know that's not the case with the the WEC.

That's not the case for any of those organizations. Rampage beat Liddell, then went to Pride and couldn't win a belt while Liddell was dominating in the UFC, then he came to the UFC and beat Liddell and won the belt. Then another pride fighter in Shogun won the belt.

I'll take Big Nog, Fedor, and Cro Cop over any 3 UFC heavyweights from 2002-2005.

Cormier is undefeated against UFC HWs. Werdum, Rockhold, Lawler, and Miesha Tate are all holding belts in the UFC. Ronda is another ex-strikeforce fighter.

Benson Henderson, Anthony Pettis, Jose Aldo, Demetrius Johnson and Dominick Cruz have won belts in the UFC.

I don't really see how any of those organizations are 'seconday feds.' The WSOF is a secondary fed. Bellator is a secondary fed. These organizations are more like the ABA or AAFC.

[SDM]

Good post. Strikeforce = WHL, UFC = NHL.

[CPT]

It's funny, because Pride was clearly better in the LHW and HW divisions, but when those guys came over to the UFC, on average, they didn't do so well.

On the other hand, Strikeforce and WEC (in the overlapping divisions) were clearly not as good, but their fighters have seen a lot of success in the UFC, both on average and at the top level, with several champs.

I think it's more of a generational thing than the fighters/organizations actually being better though. 2012 Rockhold vs. 2012 Anderson Silva? 2012 Robbie Lawler vs. 2012 GSP? It only gets worse (Hendo vs. Jones?). The depth wasn't there either (though looking at a random UFC card these days you might not think it is there either).

Strikeforce and WEC did a good job of signing and developing some top prospects who ended up being a huge part of the current generation of top UFC fighters, but when you're the UFC, sometimes you can let the smaller orgs do that work because you know you can poach them in the end.

Relating it to Faber, where this started, I see both points. Everyone who knows the sport knows the WEC was the pinnacle of 145 when it was around, and Faber was a long reigning champ there. However, historically, UFC belts are probably going to count for more, particularly to the masses, so in that sense it's unfortunate Faber will likely never get a UFC championship on his resume. At least he hung around better than Miguel Torres, MTB, Bowles, etc.

[NZB2323]

CPT, so you're also saying that 2010 BJ Penn, Frankie Edgar, and Gray Maynard were superior to 2010 Benson Henderson, Anthony Pettis, and Cowboy? Not sure I agree with that.

[CPT]

CPT, so you're also saying that 2010 BJ Penn, Frankie Edgar, and Gray Maynard were superior to 2010 Benson Henderson, Anthony Pettis, and Cowboy? Not sure I agree with that.

There's probably more overlap there, but yes, I would say that.

[Jasen777]

http://www.mmafighting.com/2016/5/11/11660968/bj-penn-vs-cole-miller-in-the-works-for-ufc-199

A day after news broke that Dennis Siver, Penn's original opponent at UFC 199, withdrew from the fight, the UFC is now targeting a featherweight bout between Penn and Cole Miller, MMA Fighting has learned.

[lilfishi22]

I don't even know why Penn's coming back. Dude's seemingly already retired like 3 times.

[REDDzone]

I posted this in another thread, but its already gotten up to delusion levels with the comeback too. He and Ariel were talking title shots when he was on the podcast a few weeks ago.

[lilfishi22]

It's one thing to come back and do big money fights, it's another to talk title shots. I certainly don't endorse him doing either but at least if he's coming back for big money fights, you know his mind is on the money. Talking about a title shot is delusional.

[REDDzone]

Its frustrating hearing the media and fans talk about it in general. I've literally heard guys I respect say "if Greg Jackson's in, I'm in, what does he have to lose?"

How about the quality of his life? Think of those beatings that guys like Rory and Frankie and Fitch and Nick Diaz gave him. Now think of the beatings that anyone in the top 15 at 145 would give him.

[Mehar]

Just read on twitter that Weidman is out of UFC 199. Hope Jacare is ready for a quick turnaround. Terrible news.

http://www.flocombat.com/article/41884-chris-weidman-out-of-ufc-199-bout-with-luke-rockhold

[phanman]

Hopefully Jacare can step in, that'd be a great fight to watch.. Otherwise I'd love to see Bisping get his shot, somehow needs to shut that loud mouth up.