Brock Lesnar

[mr.ankle]

How come the WWE act like this guy is some unstoppable force ? His time in the UFC he got really exposed by losing to small fighters Like Frank Mir and Cain Velasquez .

[Stanford]

Have you missed the company winking at you for 20+ years? Vince knows that we know it's not real. Anyone with proven fighting experience should be portrayed as he is.

Besides, have you seen him? He's **** terrifying.

[Waylon Mercy]

I always thought Brock threw the fight against Velasquez because he already had that sickness
and decided he was gonna retire from it and wanted one last pay day. As for WWE he's already lost
to Cena and HHH in his 2nd run. You have to keep his character strong and a beast like force or
people would lose interest and Brock has been a box office success for them so far with the PPVs
he's been on doing strong buyrates.

[WRau1]

I don't care what anyone says, Brock Lesnar is the scariest dude I have ever seen. It's hard to appreciate what he is if you haven't seem him IRL.

[kblo247]

He tossed Hunter and Cena around, two of the biggest bad asses in company history. They made him look like a million bucks and the need of weapons and interference to beat him worked well.

The only one to do Brock a disservice was Cm punk. Brock won that match but Punk worked a horrible storytelling session, the anti michaels with that bs of going toe to two and Heyman needing to save him. You want to see how that match should've been worked, watch Michaels vs Batista, that's a small vs big story. Punk match was bs unless if you're into tna or roh no selling and illogical ****. Punk couldn't even fight the likes of Kofi clean months before toe to tow and then he's trading shots and rocking Brock after Hunter and Cena couldn't because they knew not to

[kblo247]

I don't care what anyone says, Brock Lesnar is the scariest dude I have ever seen. It's hard to appreciate what he is if you haven't seem him IRL.

Big Show is a sight too in real life lol if you ever meet him up close but I agree about Brock. I've seen him up close. I met the bod up close back in 01 too before a show, were nice but it catches you off guard, the big tatted up biker and the masked giant

[studcrackers]

He tossed Hunter and Cena around, two of the biggest bad asses in company history. They made him look like a million bucks and the need of weapons and interference to beat him worked well.

The only one to do Brock a disservice was Cm punk. Brock won that match but Punk worked a horrible storytelling session, the anti michaels with that bs of going toe to two and Heyman needing to save him. You want to see how that match should've been worked, watch Michaels vs Batista, that's a small vs big story. Punk match was bs unless if you're into tna or roh no selling and illogical ****. Punk couldn't even fight the likes of Kofi clean months before toe to tow and then he's trading shots and rocking Brock after Hunter and Cena couldn't because they knew not to

[kblo247]

You mad about the truth? Punk worked a **** horrible story. It was a solid TNA match, but its a 1/10 on a wwe story telling level in the ring which guys like Michaels perfected. Shane even worked a better lil vs big angle with Show before. Punk did him a disservice, he should have never been going toe to toe. He should have gotten his ass beat, capitalized on a screw up, and then cheated at best to have a shot at winning. Cena and Hunter told the better stroies, worked the better matches, and made brock look more like an ass kicker. You know this thing called in ring psychology at play. Hogan vs Andre would never had went how it did if hogan didn't sell the match and size difference being overwhelming to the very end. Punk just shows why he isn't an in ring general, he's a follower, which is why Cena always leads him to his best ****

Punk wasn't rocking Kofi Kingston with strikes before but was hurting Brock ... Come the **** on with that ****. Brock needed to be saved by Heyman from that scrawny lil mf but was rag dolling Triple H and John Cena who have spent over a decade built up as power house ass kickers ... Come the **** on.

That was some stupid ass ROH and TNA AJ Styles type ****, no place in a wwe ring and on that stage vs that guy, and this the attraction was bought out of Vince's own mouth when comparing main events between the previous two SummerSlams to stockholders

[WRau1]

Well, except that in pretty much every network of wrestling fans, the Brock v Punk match was widely considered a top5 match of 2013...

[kblo247]

It goes so against Hogan/Andre, Bret/Yoko, Michaels/Dave, and Brock's other matches with known power houses since returning from UFC that it was illogical to me. It was a TNA match, Punk just did him a disservice of making him look like a bad ass kicker by getting too much O. It was like the opposite of how small overpowered angled stories are told in wwe, reminded me of how an AJ styles takes on Abyss. I'm more old school so to me that's **** seeing punk who couldn't rock a Kofi on raw with a strike budge Brock, when guys like Cena and Hunter get their ass kicked and out muscled

[Stanford]

It was a TNA match

You're using the work of Christopher Daniels, AJ Styles, Kurt Angle and Samoa Joe as a slur? That's not being too old school, that's being completely trapped in a previous time.

[kblo247]

The work of Styles, Daniels, and Joe is **** stupid. They don't sell moves. The use no psychology. Their moves don't lead up to one another, they just are mad over because they work in front of a cult in the impact zone most the decade. Neville vs Graves shows more in ring psychology and storytelling from start to finish than most their x division stuff which is spot, spot, spot, flip, hit, flip, no sell. Kurt wrestles terribly took compared to wwe where they made him work a damn leg to lead into the ankle lock or work the back and body with suplex Es to lead to the angle slamm, in TNA he just does **** because he can for no reason. TNA matches don't tell stories by in large,they are meant to be what the name says, total nonstop action, which means you throw out selling moves and stringing together an actual match psychology and story because you know those 900 cats who don't pay but come most weeks like regulars are going to chant this is awesome anyway. NXT rookies can tell a better story, hell look at Paige vs Emma, Zayn vs Cesaro, Graves vs Neville, and so on like I've said if you want to se matches with an actual story being told, moves being targeted to wear you down and set something up, and playing to a crowd right ... That's wrestling, AJ/Joe/Daniels and what Punk did with Brock was dumb Indy **** that most all time greats like Michaels or Hunter no better than to do on the grand stage .

I grew up watching Benoit, Michaels, Flair, Eddie, Bret, Hunter, Taker ... Technicians who told stories in a ring and who put together logical matches and move sets, not just do **** out of order because they can. No one here can say the way Punk wrestled made sense compared to how Cena and HHH sold for Brock.

The reason guys like Danielson and Punk get sent to developmental is to get deprogrammed from just doing things because they can, so they get used to selling. There's a reason you don't see Vince wasting money on AJ Styles, he needs to be taught how to actually wrestle in the big leagues and he has such a short shelf life right now, same reason they never brought over Daniels when he was free. The only guy they would bring in is Joe and teach him how to be a real dominant big, control a match, play off the crowd, play off a larger TV crowd and actual paying live audience, let that sink in, peripheral pay to watch NXT be taped but not impact after 12 years. There are so many holes in what they do in the ring that people don't pay to see that. People don't buy the TNA ppvs, hell they don't and haven't paid most of all for impact tapings throughout history, and the audience is of Indy true wrasslin fans which is why they get less viewers in average than Main event or Total Divas and their WM only moved 3,000 tix large portion papered. TNAs in ring product has as many holes as their production and storylines to be fixed to ever be a true successful mainstream alternative because they are no WCW or ecw and never will be largely because of management relying on guys like Styles who can't work a match that grips a casual paying customer into watching and giving up money, as a bunch of guys no selling, doing dropkicks, flips, and all gets old as it can't be taken seriously

[Coach Smiley]

I love old school rasslin as much as the next guy but MMA exposed a lot of so called "good wrestling pychology" as nonsense, in reality any decent 205 pounder would probably destroy Brock in the UFC, contrary to what Vince tells us a great little man could quite easily beat a good big man. There's no reason why someone like Punk couldn't get as much offense as he did in his match with Brock, you act like he was hitting him with power bombs or something

[skbucks1985]

Yes Brock lost to smaller fighters like Cain Velazquez and Frank Mir. But last time I checked neither of those guys are currently employed by the WWE. They can book him like some unstoppable force because, big or small, he would kick the ass of every single guy on the WWE roster

[Stanford]

I grew up watching Benoit, Michaels, Flair, Eddie, Bret, Hunter, Taker ...

And that's where you'll stay.

By the way, Daniel Bryan spent one day in developmental, because he wanted to. He was not sent there. And I'm not sure exactly how much he learned about selling by wrestling Low Ki.

[Coach Smiley]

Yes Brock lost to smaller fighters like Cain Velazquez and Frank Mir. But last time I checked neither of those guys are currently employed by the WWE. They can book him like some unstoppable force because, big or small, he would kick the ass of every single guy on the WWE roster

I agree completely. Even though Santino could probably put up a fight with Brock, maybe even beat him depending on how good his jiu-jitsu is, it wouldn't make any sense because Santino is booked to look weak. All I'm saying is it's not so infathomable that a strongly booked CM Punk can go toe to toe with Brock, it may seem impossible by 1980s WWF standards but with what MMA has shown us a little guy doesn't have to go into a fight with a big guy scared or as the underdog, the HBK giant killer story is not the only story that can be told

[Dunthreevy]

You guys are still letting the Batista fanboy push your buttons?

[kblo247]

I love old school rasslin as much as the next guy but MMA exposed a lot of so called "good wrestling pychology" as nonsense, in reality any decent 205 pounder would probably destroy Brock in the UFC, contrary to what Vince tells us a great little man could quite easily beat a good big man. There's no reason why someone like Punk couldn't get as much offense as he did in his match with Brock, you act like he was hitting him with power bombs or something

It's every reason. Are you really suggesting Crna and HHH couldn't fight Brock straight up and get even a 40/60 split but punk should trade shots? They are booked as being stronger, more dominant, and more legit their careers mostly and Brock used them like chew toys. Cena had to resort to using a weapon. Trips needed a weapon and michaels. Yet Punk had Brock screaming for Paul Heyman to save him, the same Punk who was struggling to beat midcard acts like Kofi convincingly (it wasn't being a heel ADR proves that) and who wasn't even main eventing most his 400 days. It made no sense to work that match like that when two guys who are clearly better and bigger than Punk in history got their ass handed to them by Lesnar, it was a disservice and Indy type match that showed Punks ego if anything, which says something because even a guy like Mayweather got how to sell David vs Goliath and he's the worlds best fighter


And Bryan worked a televised fcw taping with kaval who had been in developmental but he worked fcw live events in his nxt stay just like the other rookies with their agents

[Stanford]

he worked fcw live events in his nxt stay just like the other rookies with their agents

Not at all like other rookies. He was not required to spend any time in Florida. His time there was voluntary, and I'm sure if you asked him, he'd say he could just as well have spent that time in Reseda.

Using Bryan Danielson as an example of independent wrestlers who couldn't work prior to WWE is baffling.

[kblo247]

Okay he was a bad example, as he was trained by the goat at the wwe style as well as regal,,but he still worked Florida and with the other rookies off screen on FCW live tours. The fact he did that to further get away from some Indy habits is a plus in his understanding. The fact Del Rio did it coming from Mexico willingly was a plus as Dos Caras, unlike Sin Cara. There's a number of guys who can't work a real match where they have to sell moves after they've been hit by them, play to a large crowd, and work a certain psychology and isolate body parts or wear someone down. CM Punk was that guy which is why he went to OVW, Styles is that guy which is why wwe won't make him a big offer, same with fallen angel when he's been free, as they don't work anything but total nonstop action in a ring which would piss most wwe vets off.