WWE Raw Discussion I

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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1901 » by skbucks1985 » Tue May 23, 2017 8:58 pm

improper wrote:
safi wrote:
improper wrote:
I don't want Enzo anywhere near 205 Live. The show already has enough guys like Dar who can't wrestle a cruiserweight style and drag down matches every week. Enzo is like Dar, except he can't work at all. Dar just works the WWE heavyweight style, which is a poor fit for a division that should strive to put on fast-paced, exciting matches to hook the crowd.


Enzo and Titus are probably the two worst wrestlers on the roster so I'm not disagreeing with you about his in-ring ability. But that shows needs more personalities. And Enzo as this pest heel whose hiding behind this woman is something that I think can have some legs.


I tend to think the problem with 205 Live is less the lack of personalities on the roster and more the lack of compelling wrestling on a week to week basis. When you watch an episode of Lucha Underground, you're pretty much guaranteed to get at least one great match every week. That's just not the case on 205 Live, and so it's struggling. They need to focus more on the actual in-ring wrestling and less on the "sports entertainment." You want to hook the crowd, and you'll do it by giving them fantastic matches. Once they start buying in to these guys as performers (they've already bought in to a couple, like Aries, Neville, and Gallagher), they'll start buying into them as characters.

But they need to get the wrestling aspect down first. The in-ring product should be the most important part of a cruiserweight division. And right now, outside of PPV matches it's just not.


On both main rosters, but especially Smackdown because that's who they follow, you have a lot of really high level performers and a number of guys that can do 99% of what these guys can do with much more fleshed-out characters. And so I don't think a good wrestling match is enough when you have a half-empty arena with the remainder being tired and they don't care about the guys wrestling.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1902 » by skbucks1985 » Tue May 23, 2017 9:04 pm

Dunthreevy wrote:
LittleOzzy wrote:
safi wrote:
Yeah I love it too. I don't expect to see him in the main event or anything like that, but I hope this isn't just some undercard fodder. If he retains the IC Title, or even if he doesn't, I'd love to see a program with him and Ambrose. I think the dynamic between them could be really interesting.


Would love that, would be very Goldust vs. Piper like.

Giving him a real midcard run would be great.



The one thing that I think could be hard to pull off with re-hashing the original Goldust character is all the blatant homophobia that initially got the character over. It's hard to imagine opponents being visibly disturbed by a sexually ambiguous character, without getting a ton of backlash from the LGBTQ community these days.

Ambrose would be the perfect guy to have as the homophobic "tough guy", because he comes across as an idiot anyway, but I just don't see them having the balls to attempt that angle the way they would have back in 1995.


I actually had Ambrose in mind because he'd be a good guy to go the complete opposite direction with it. You do a repeat of the famous Razor Ramon moment where he's feeling up Razor and he does it to Ambrose and at first maybe Ambrose looks perplexed but then gives him a kiss on the cheek and then Goldust looks perplexed and then Ambrose proceeds to beat him up.

Ambrose is supposed to be this crazy guy who you get the feeling has spent a lot of time in some strange places around some strange people. And he would thus be unphased by Goldust attempting to play mind games with him.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1903 » by Dunthreevy » Tue May 23, 2017 9:36 pm

safi wrote:
Dunthreevy wrote:
LittleOzzy wrote:
Would love that, would be very Goldust vs. Piper like.

Giving him a real midcard run would be great.



The one thing that I think could be hard to pull off with re-hashing the original Goldust character is all the blatant homophobia that initially got the character over. It's hard to imagine opponents being visibly disturbed by a sexually ambiguous character, without getting a ton of backlash from the LGBTQ community these days.

Ambrose would be the perfect guy to have as the homophobic "tough guy", because he comes across as an idiot anyway, but I just don't see them having the balls to attempt that angle the way they would have back in 1995.


I actually had Ambrose in mind because he'd be a good guy to go the complete opposite direction with it. You do a repeat of the famous Razor Ramon moment where he's feeling up Razor and he does it to Ambrose and at first maybe Ambrose looks perplexed but then gives him a kiss on the cheek and then Goldust looks perplexed and then Ambrose proceeds to beat him up.

Ambrose is supposed to be this crazy guy who you get the feeling has spent a lot of time in some strange places around some strange people. And he would thus be unphased by Goldust attempting to play mind games with him.


I could see that happening, but then it sorta cuts the legs out from under the story. If Goldust can't play mind games with him, then what is there to keep the feud going? It certainly wouldn't be the matches because 2017 Dean Ambrose isn't going to keep things interesting with his ring work, no matter how good Goldust still is in the ring.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1904 » by skbucks1985 » Tue May 23, 2017 9:57 pm

Dunthreevy wrote:
safi wrote:
Dunthreevy wrote:

The one thing that I think could be hard to pull off with re-hashing the original Goldust character is all the blatant homophobia that initially got the character over. It's hard to imagine opponents being visibly disturbed by a sexually ambiguous character, without getting a ton of backlash from the LGBTQ community these days.

Ambrose would be the perfect guy to have as the homophobic "tough guy", because he comes across as an idiot anyway, but I just don't see them having the balls to attempt that angle the way they would have back in 1995.


I actually had Ambrose in mind because he'd be a good guy to go the complete opposite direction with it. You do a repeat of the famous Razor Ramon moment where he's feeling up Razor and he does it to Ambrose and at first maybe Ambrose looks perplexed but then gives him a kiss on the cheek and then Goldust looks perplexed and then Ambrose proceeds to beat him up.

Ambrose is supposed to be this crazy guy who you get the feeling has spent a lot of time in some strange places around some strange people. And he would thus be unphased by Goldust attempting to play mind games with him.


I could see that happening, but then it sorta cuts the legs out from under the story. If Goldust can't play mind games with him, then what is there to keep the feud going? It certainly wouldn't be the matches because 2017 Dean Ambrose isn't going to keep things interesting with his ring work, no matter how good Goldust still is in the ring.


I think that would force him to become more vicious either with his mind games or just more vicious in general. I don't think they should involve Renee in story lines in general and especially since she's on Smackdown. But they teased going in that direction with Miz a few months ago and could revisit that.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1905 » by iMoreland » Thu May 25, 2017 10:00 pm

Raw is drawing football season numbers when it isn't even football season. Imagine when the season does start, Raw might drop under 2 million this year.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1906 » by improper » Thu May 25, 2017 10:54 pm

iMoreland wrote:Raw is drawing football season numbers when it isn't even football season. Imagine when the season does start, Raw might drop under 2 million this year.


They're just going to keep dropping the longer they refuse to listen to their fans and often actively try to piss them off.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1907 » by Ruzious » Fri May 26, 2017 5:28 pm

improper wrote:
iMoreland wrote:Raw is drawing football season numbers when it isn't even football season. Imagine when the season does start, Raw might drop under 2 million this year.


They're just going to keep dropping the longer they refuse to listen to their fans and often actively try to piss them off.

I think those fans will find reasons to be pissed off no matter what the WWE does. WWE is over-saturated. Then again, I don't own WWE stock or do business with them, so I'm not really concerned about their ratings.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1908 » by improper » Fri May 26, 2017 5:50 pm

Ruzious wrote:
improper wrote:
iMoreland wrote:Raw is drawing football season numbers when it isn't even football season. Imagine when the season does start, Raw might drop under 2 million this year.


They're just going to keep dropping the longer they refuse to listen to their fans and often actively try to piss them off.

I think those fans will find reasons to be pissed off no matter what the WWE does. WWE is over-saturated. Then again, I don't own WWE stock or do business with them, so I'm not really concerned about their ratings.


I disagree. I think the fans are more than willing to praise the WWE when they do things right. The WWE just so rarely does things right.

I mean, look at NXT. It garners almost unanimous praise from the same fans that constantly criticize WWE. Do you know why? Because NXT is well-booked, generally has solid wrestling, and its Takeover specials always knock it out of the park. When you don't constantly give fans stuff to be critical about, they're more than willing to like your content.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1909 » by Polk377 » Tue May 30, 2017 12:47 am

I wonder what this angle between Angle and Graves is about. I would assume it has something to do with Stephanie coming back and will setup his return to the ring.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1910 » by iMoreland » Tue May 30, 2017 2:06 am

And that segment is exactly why ratings are plummeting
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1911 » by detroitKG » Tue May 30, 2017 2:09 am

Yea I turned on Raw for the hell of it...saw Sasha as Rich Swanns back up dancer and Bliss doing a this is your life for Bayley...turned that **** off so fast lmfao...and they wonder why their ratings are ****..
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1912 » by iMoreland » Tue May 30, 2017 2:12 am

Multiple cruiserweight matches/segments, that awful Alexa segment,

If I was in that crowd I'd leave right now. One of the worst Raws in recent memory, and this is a go home show for a PPV. Just embarrassing.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1913 » by Spens1 » Tue May 30, 2017 2:48 am

so is Sasha so far in the doghouse that she's becoming a midcard title on 205 live also?

also you know when the golden truth segment is one of the better segments, you're going to have a bad time.

Also the crowd's delete hand motion.......... yeah it didn't look good in any capacity, no matter how you paint it, it looked downright bad.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1914 » by Spens1 » Tue May 30, 2017 3:16 am

main event wasn't bad aside from the fact that roman is meant to be the FOTC, yet had a very heelish match. What is he, a heel, a face, a tweener?

Everything he says is heel, everything the commentators portray him as is a face, he wrestles a heel style also.

I will say though, i'm now convinced Russo is back in some way. That womans match is Russo 100%, that segment was Russo 100%. That may have been the worst thing i've seen on WWE programming this year.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1915 » by skbucks1985 » Tue May 30, 2017 3:24 am

I don't think Reigns or Joe is going to win the match but they should because they're the ones that have been built up the best over the past few weeks.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1916 » by iMoreland » Tue May 30, 2017 4:21 am

"Let's go Rollins!, Roman Sucks!" - Fans

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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1917 » by loserX » Tue May 30, 2017 4:59 am

Alexa Bliss is so smooth on the mic, but holy SHNIKES was that segment awful. Just agonizingly, excruciatingly bad.

WWE writers have proven that they can't be funny for more than one or two lines of dialogue in a row on their best day, so anything that purports to be a full "comedy" sketch should be shut down immediately. Somebody who obviously has no contact with young girls clearly thought "what do young girls like? Oh I know, mean ex-boyfriend stories! Let's get two people who can't act to do that, it's gold."

And this whole Alexa/Bayley "feud" is just terrible. I can't bring myself to care in the slightest. Anyone feel differently?
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1918 » by improper » Tue May 30, 2017 8:29 am

loserX wrote:Alexa Bliss is so smooth on the mic, but holy SHNIKES was that segment awful. Just agonizingly, excruciatingly bad.

WWE writers have proven that they can't be funny for more than one or two lines of dialogue in a row on their best day, so anything that purports to be a full "comedy" sketch should be shut down immediately. Somebody who obviously has no contact with young girls clearly thought "what do young girls like? Oh I know, mean ex-boyfriend stories! Let's get two people who can't act to do that, it's gold."

And this whole Alexa/Bayley "feud" is just terrible. I can't bring myself to care in the slightest. Anyone feel differently?


I haven't cared about a main roster women's feud in months. The last match I cared about was when Sasha won the title from Charlotte in Charlotte, and that's mostly because it was a No DQ match that was surprisingly good and because I was there live in the arena to watch it.

The problem is that they don't really have enough compelling female wrestlers on the main roster to fill out two divisions, and the general quality of the wrestling hasn't been good enough to salvage it. I mean, the NXT Takeover match between Asuka and Ember Moon was better than any main roster women's match I can remember. The only other women's matches I can think of in WWE that come close (or are better) are also NXT matches (like Sasha/Bayley).

What they should have done was have the women's division on one show and the tag division on the other, as neither division is deep enough to really work for two WWE shows. Even in NXT right now the women's division is Asuka, Ember, and everyone else, although thankfully that's likely to change with the upcoming women's tournament.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1919 » by jakecronus8 » Tue May 30, 2017 11:56 am

Elias Samson is the best thing going on Raw at the moment.
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Re: WWE Raw Discussion I 

Post#1920 » by Ruzious » Tue May 30, 2017 1:38 pm

loserX wrote:Alexa Bliss is so smooth on the mic, but holy SHNIKES was that segment awful. Just agonizingly, excruciatingly bad.

WWE writers have proven that they can't be funny for more than one or two lines of dialogue in a row on their best day, so anything that purports to be a full "comedy" sketch should be shut down immediately. Somebody who obviously has no contact with young girls clearly thought "what do young girls like? Oh I know, mean ex-boyfriend stories! Let's get two people who can't act to do that, it's gold."

And this whole Alexa/Bayley "feud" is just terrible. I can't bring myself to care in the slightest. Anyone feel differently?

Notice they used the world's smallest kendo stick. And that's part of the problem. As much as she's improved her wrestling using the DDT, she's still not believable as someone who can beat up these bigger and more skilled wrestlers - and as a heel, no less, with the smallest arms in wrestling.
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