All Elite Wrestling - Discussion

Moderators: Marcus, Stanford

improper
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,521
And1: 4,405
Joined: May 23, 2014
     

All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#1 » by improper » Tue Jan 1, 2019 9:01 pm

So it's official.

Image

Along with the announcement of what I assume is the follow-up to All-In, Double or Nothing.

Image

I really hope this is successful, because more good wrestling, especially more good wrestling that can actually draw eyeballs (sorry, Lucha Underground), is always a good thing. Apparently they are partnered with the son of the guy who owns the Jacksonville Jaguars on this, so they should have some pretty solid financial backing.

Anyway, just wanted to create the thread so people can start talking about this if they want to.
Spens1
RealGM
Posts: 13,865
And1: 3,878
Joined: Jun 16, 2015
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#2 » by Spens1 » Tue Jan 1, 2019 11:57 pm

Wrestling needs a good #2, Impact has a horrid TV deal as it stands and ROH is no where near what it used to be. I hope they are able to get some of the underused WWE guys (Rusev, Cesaro, Zayn, Gable, Revival, Good Brothers, even Ziggler finally goes for it) as well as being able to give the top indy guys good contracts (Shane Strickland, Trevor Lee being two of the bigger names which are F.A's).

Also rumours are that Cody will be the main executive and him and the Bucks will be the bookers (look, as long as Cody isn't booking himself to win the world title and the bucks don't book themselves for a 2 year tag team title reign), with the other members of BTE being road agents (SCU mainly).
jakecronus8
RealGM
Posts: 15,997
And1: 7,275
Joined: Feb 06, 2006
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#3 » by jakecronus8 » Wed Jan 2, 2019 12:57 am

Please be good.

ETA: what seemed to kill WCW and TNA was having either non wrestling people manage a wrestling program, or current wrestlers managing said program. Cody and the Bucks as bookers could be a big mistake.
Do it for Chuck
improper
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,521
And1: 4,405
Joined: May 23, 2014
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#4 » by improper » Wed Jan 2, 2019 1:31 am

jakecronus8 wrote:Please be good.

ETA: what seemed to kill WCW and TNA was having either non wrestling people manage a wrestling program, or current wrestlers managing said program. Cody and the Bucks as bookers could be a big mistake.


What killed WCW and TNA was having guys booking that were more interested in putting themselves over than giving the fans what they wanted. It's honestly kind of the same problem WWE has, except it's Vince putting over only the people he likes and to hell with the fans.

The key to running a successful wrestling promotion is giving the people what they want. Pushing the guys they love. Repackaging the guys they don't. Giving them fun, exciting programs that culminate in fun, exciting matches. That's why NXT is awesome. It does all of that. That's why WWE is not. It does very little of that, and the few times it does it's usually by accident.
Spens1
RealGM
Posts: 13,865
And1: 3,878
Joined: Jun 16, 2015
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#5 » by Spens1 » Wed Jan 2, 2019 1:48 am

Russo is a common factor but i agree, i'm a bit worried about Cody and the Bucks booking themselves. I'd be more comfortable if they got an actual booker from elsewhere who has some experience with shows like this and shares their vision (Jimmy Jacobs as head booker or head of a booking committee could work, or they can bring in some experience with a guy like a Dutch Mantell).

Anyway another thing they need is a damn good TV deal, we're hearing about WGN America (cause they showed the all-in preshow) and other networks but they should honestly aim to get onto a really big network, Fox and NBC are out for obvious reasons, as far as i know ABC and PBS won't do wrestling which leaves CBS, as far as i know they don't have any form of combat sports or wrestling.

With Tony Khan on, if I where AEW, i'd be trying to talk to some CBS execs or use Cody's contacts with CW and see if they want to take on wrestling again (i mean they had smackdown in the late 2000's, they may be open to it). if they get on either of those networks, then they're WWE competitors, but to be honest, even if they got TNA circa 07-09 numbers, i'd be happy in truth (then again that would also make them a competitor to RAW).
improper
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,521
And1: 4,405
Joined: May 23, 2014
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#6 » by improper » Wed Jan 2, 2019 1:54 am

If I were them I'd try to get a Netflix or Amazon deal. Instant market of tens of millions.
Spens1
RealGM
Posts: 13,865
And1: 3,878
Joined: Jun 16, 2015
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#7 » by Spens1 » Wed Jan 2, 2019 2:01 am

Who I'd personally like to see on this:

WWE:

Sami Zayn (as a cornerstone piece, for me he's the 2nd or 3rd best wrestler in the company after Bryan and Styles)
Rusev (U.S title aside, he's constantly in the dog house, him and Lana could be big hits outside of the WWE)
Cesaro (it would be about time for him, the disrespect from the WWE, stuff the tag team titles, those are worthless anyway, the man deserves a singles run)
Revival (that tweet, i mean they could be the top tag team along with the bucks)
Apollo Crews (he has a lot of potential, and i mean a lot, he just needs to leave for about 2-3 years and rebuild himself i.e. Drew McIntyre, McIntyre became a jobber then left, became a main event star again and returned to the WWE and looks like he could potentially be world champ)
Sasha Banks (heavily underutilised, she needs a move as well and you can sense her frustration, let her leave and become the face of a division)
Bayley (same story though less frustration, clearly not going to get a sniff of the womans title again despite being one of the best)

Impact:
Rich Swann
Lucha Bros (both of them, Pentagon Jr and Fenix are both stars)
Eli Drake (The guy is too damn good)

Elsewhere:
Shane Strickland
Willie Mack

ROH:
Marty Scurll (eventually, he's obvious)
SCU (are going to join)

NJPW:
Omega (probably with him maining New Japan and AEW being his secondary, he's not as on board as the others, which will be a major blow)
The Young Bucks
Cody Rhodes

They don't need a huge roster, they just need a quality core then. One thing i would say, i'd rather see Hangman Page stay, mainly because i think if he does, he could be the main gaijin face. Jay is getting a massive push but he won't move merch like Omega because of the fact he's such a good heel, too good in some ways. Hangman could be the babyface (now Juice is over, but Hangman i think has more potential).
User avatar
tugs
RealGM
Posts: 16,633
And1: 2,926
Joined: Jul 22, 2010

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#8 » by tugs » Wed Jan 2, 2019 2:10 am

This is exciting. I'd echo the same sentiments for booking. Impossible to not have conflicts of interest being a booker and a wrestler, unless they are settled within the promotion and really are "all in".

And please no more WWE nostalgia acts at the tip of the mountain.
jakecronus8
RealGM
Posts: 15,997
And1: 7,275
Joined: Feb 06, 2006
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#9 » by jakecronus8 » Wed Jan 2, 2019 3:45 am

improper wrote:
jakecronus8 wrote:Please be good.

ETA: what seemed to kill WCW and TNA was having either non wrestling people manage a wrestling program, or current wrestlers managing said program. Cody and the Bucks as bookers could be a big mistake.


The key to running a successful wrestling promotion is giving the people what they want. Pushing the guys they love. Repackaging the guys they don't. Giving them fun, exciting programs that culminate in fun, exciting matches. That's why NXT is awesome. It does all of that. That's why WWE is not.


Wwe's financial returns would disagree.
Do it for Chuck
improper
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,521
And1: 4,405
Joined: May 23, 2014
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#10 » by improper » Wed Jan 2, 2019 3:47 am

Regarding Omega...I don't think he'll announce anything regarding his future until after WrestleKingdom.
improper
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,521
And1: 4,405
Joined: May 23, 2014
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#11 » by improper » Wed Jan 2, 2019 3:49 am

jakecronus8 wrote:Wwe's financial returns would disagree.


I'm not saying WWE isn't successful, but does anyone honestly think it couldn't be more successful right now? The ratings have been dropping consistently for years now, and that's largely because they've pushed away a good chunk of their fan base due to years of horrendous booking and pushing people the fans don't want to see pushed.
Scott Hall
RealGM
Posts: 23,432
And1: 62,605
Joined: May 04, 2015
Location: T-Dot
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#12 » by Scott Hall » Wed Jan 2, 2019 11:49 pm

tugs wrote:This is exciting. I'd echo the same sentiments for booking. Impossible to not have conflicts of interest being a booker and a wrestler, unless they are settled within the promotion and really are "all in".

And please no more WWE nostalgia acts at the tip of the mountain.


They're already recruiting Jericho.... The TV Networks want stars on the show or at least a couple
to help with sponsors etc.

A big problem is Vince hasn't created any new stars in a long time so there isn't a big selection to choose from.

The remaining guys are elderly men and history has shown being a Commish or GM doesn't move the needle
from a rating perspective.
User avatar
tugs
RealGM
Posts: 16,633
And1: 2,926
Joined: Jul 22, 2010

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#13 » by tugs » Thu Jan 3, 2019 7:14 am

Scott Hall wrote:
tugs wrote:This is exciting. I'd echo the same sentiments for booking. Impossible to not have conflicts of interest being a booker and a wrestler, unless they are settled within the promotion and really are "all in".

And please no more WWE nostalgia acts at the tip of the mountain.


They're already recruiting Jericho.... The TV Networks want stars on the show or at least a couple
to help with sponsors etc.

A big problem is Vince hasn't created any new stars in a long time so there isn't a big selection to choose from.

The remaining guys are elderly men and history has shown being a Commish or GM doesn't move the needle
from a rating perspective.
Oh, Jericho I have no problem. The guy is a chameleon and just adapts to the new wrestling environment and constantly changes his gimmick. It's the TNA route I was referring to when they signed "WWE rejects".
Scott Hall
RealGM
Posts: 23,432
And1: 62,605
Joined: May 04, 2015
Location: T-Dot
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#14 » by Scott Hall » Thu Jan 3, 2019 8:39 pm

tugs wrote:
Scott Hall wrote:
tugs wrote:This is exciting. I'd echo the same sentiments for booking. Impossible to not have conflicts of interest being a booker and a wrestler, unless they are settled within the promotion and really are "all in".

And please no more WWE nostalgia acts at the tip of the mountain.


They're already recruiting Jericho.... The TV Networks want stars on the show or at least a couple
to help with sponsors etc.

A big problem is Vince hasn't created any new stars in a long time so there isn't a big selection to choose from.

The remaining guys are elderly men and history has shown being a Commish or GM doesn't move the needle
from a rating perspective.
Oh, Jericho I have no problem. The guy is a chameleon and just adapts to the new wrestling environment and constantly changes his gimmick. It's the TNA route I was referring to when they signed "WWE rejects".


Out of curiosity which guys are you specifically talking about?

For me I was never a fan of the six sided ring and the home grown TNA guys and the X-Division guys. It took me
quite awhile to start liking guys like Styles, Joe and James Storm but as they grew as performers they grew on me.

But one thing I'm worried about with AEW is they sign all their friends like Daniels, Kazarian, the Briscoes,
Jay Lethal etc guys that I've never been interested in that have been around forever.
Spens1
RealGM
Posts: 13,865
And1: 3,878
Joined: Jun 16, 2015
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#15 » by Spens1 » Fri Jan 4, 2019 1:16 am

improper wrote:Regarding Omega...I don't think he'll announce anything regarding his future until after WrestleKingdom.


This, he won't announce anything until after the main event, because if he announces he's going its pretty clear that Tanahashi would be winning the match (unless they go for another dumb WWE type storyline).
Spens1
RealGM
Posts: 13,865
And1: 3,878
Joined: Jun 16, 2015
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#16 » by Spens1 » Fri Jan 4, 2019 1:20 am

tugs wrote:
Scott Hall wrote:
tugs wrote:This is exciting. I'd echo the same sentiments for booking. Impossible to not have conflicts of interest being a booker and a wrestler, unless they are settled within the promotion and really are "all in".

And please no more WWE nostalgia acts at the tip of the mountain.


They're already recruiting Jericho.... The TV Networks want stars on the show or at least a couple
to help with sponsors etc.

A big problem is Vince hasn't created any new stars in a long time so there isn't a big selection to choose from.

The remaining guys are elderly men and history has shown being a Commish or GM doesn't move the needle
from a rating perspective.
Oh, Jericho I have no problem. The guy is a chameleon and just adapts to the new wrestling environment and constantly changes his gimmick. It's the TNA route I was referring to when they signed "WWE rejects".


I agree, i'd rather they sign WWE's more underutilised guys though (i.e. Sami Zayn, Rusev, Cesaro, Almas), guys we know have everything you need to be legit main eventers but Vince and Dunn has some meaningless gripe with them. It would be more like signing a bunch of Christian Cage's for TNA rather than a bunch of elderly Ric Flair's or Hulk Hogan's, if that makes sense.
User avatar
tugs
RealGM
Posts: 16,633
And1: 2,926
Joined: Jul 22, 2010

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#17 » by tugs » Fri Jan 4, 2019 1:49 am

Scott Hall wrote:
Out of curiosity which guys are you specifically talking about?

For me I was never a fan of the six sided ring and the home grown TNA guys and the X-Division guys. It took me
quite awhile to start liking guys like Styles, Joe and James Storm but as they grew as performers they grew on me.

But one thing I'm worried about with AEW is they sign all their friends like Daniels, Kazarian, the Briscoes,
Jay Lethal etc guys that I've never been interested in that have been around forever.


Spens1 wrote:
I agree, i'd rather they sign WWE's more underutilised guys though (i.e. Sami Zayn, Rusev, Cesaro, Almas), guys we know have everything you need to be legit main eventers but Vince and Dunn has some meaningless gripe with them. It would be more like signing a bunch of Christian Cage's for TNA rather than a bunch of elderly Ric Flair's or Hulk Hogan's, if that makes sense.


Same sentiments with Spens, that's why I mentioned nostalgia acts. And on point with the Christian Cage analogy.

It'll be tricky to come up with great stories if they have their buddies on board then you also have the WWE talents. It's like TNA but this time instead of the Hogans they have the Lethals.
Scott Hall
RealGM
Posts: 23,432
And1: 62,605
Joined: May 04, 2015
Location: T-Dot
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#18 » by Scott Hall » Sat Jan 5, 2019 12:30 am

Spens1 wrote:
tugs wrote:
Scott Hall wrote:
They're already recruiting Jericho.... The TV Networks want stars on the show or at least a couple
to help with sponsors etc.

A big problem is Vince hasn't created any new stars in a long time so there isn't a big selection to choose from.

The remaining guys are elderly men and history has shown being a Commish or GM doesn't move the needle
from a rating perspective.
Oh, Jericho I have no problem. The guy is a chameleon and just adapts to the new wrestling environment and constantly changes his gimmick. It's the TNA route I was referring to when they signed "WWE rejects".


I agree, i'd rather they sign WWE's more underutilised guys though (i.e. Sami Zayn, Rusev, Cesaro, Almas), guys we know have everything you need to be legit main eventers but Vince and Dunn has some meaningless gripe with them. It would be more like signing a bunch of Christian Cage's for TNA rather than a bunch of elderly Ric Flair's or Hulk Hogan's, if that makes sense.


I disagree about those guys except for possibly Rusev... I think they all have big glaring flaws. Sami Zayn has one of
the worst looks on the roster and has durability issues and possibly attitude problems. He's good on the mic and good
in the ring and once he turned heel and joined Owens I thought he was used right outside of that corny program with
Lashley.

Cesaro doesn't have good mic skills or a great look but he's a great worker. The Bar is one of the best tag-teams in the
company but as a singles wrestler I wouldn't be interested in watching him as a main event guy.

Almas can barely speak English and also doesn't have a great look. How many guys in the business are actually good
in ring wrestlers but can't talk or look great seem to be a dime a dozen. Still him and Zelina have been a good package
and he's been in some high profile matches on Smackdown its just the roster is to big and he can't get regular TV time.

And one thing about Rusev is I really didn't like his promo this week it borderline sucked. I haven't seen him improve
his body or get better in the ring. Seems to have gotten complacent maybe because he can't get over with Vince.

tugs wrote:
Scott Hall wrote:
Out of curiosity which guys are you specifically talking about?

For me I was never a fan of the six sided ring and the home grown TNA guys and the X-Division guys. It took me
quite awhile to start liking guys like Styles, Joe and James Storm but as they grew as performers they grew on me.

But one thing I'm worried about with AEW is they sign all their friends like Daniels, Kazarian, the Briscoes,
Jay Lethal etc guys that I've never been interested in that have been around forever.


Spens1 wrote:
I agree, i'd rather they sign WWE's more underutilised guys though (i.e. Sami Zayn, Rusev, Cesaro, Almas), guys we know have everything you need to be legit main eventers but Vince and Dunn has some meaningless gripe with them. It would be more like signing a bunch of Christian Cage's for TNA rather than a bunch of elderly Ric Flair's or Hulk Hogan's, if that makes sense.


Same sentiments with Spens, that's why I mentioned nostalgia acts. And on point with the Christian Cage analogy.

It'll be tricky to come up with great stories if they have their buddies on board then you also have the WWE talents. It's like TNA but this time instead of the Hogans they have the Lethals.


For the most part I liked when they signed big name WWE guys. I actually started watching them when they got Angle
and RVD and Mr. Kennedy. Even though Hogan was retired and was gonna be the GM I was interested to see him.

I liked how they sprinkled in the WWE vets and meshed them with the young guys like Styles, Joe, Aries, Roode, EY etc.

It also gave the TNA originals some fresh opponents as opposed to some Indy guys coming in.
Wo1verine
2015 Beat the Commish Champion
Posts: 17,566
And1: 11,761
Joined: Apr 23, 2010
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#19 » by Wo1verine » Sat Jan 5, 2019 12:33 am

Please don't be PG for the love of god!
Image
BrunoSkull
Spens1
RealGM
Posts: 13,865
And1: 3,878
Joined: Jun 16, 2015
     

Re: All Elite Wrestling - Discussion 

Post#20 » by Spens1 » Sat Jan 5, 2019 6:52 am

Scott Hall wrote:
Spens1 wrote:
tugs wrote:Oh, Jericho I have no problem. The guy is a chameleon and just adapts to the new wrestling environment and constantly changes his gimmick. It's the TNA route I was referring to when they signed "WWE rejects".


I agree, i'd rather they sign WWE's more underutilised guys though (i.e. Sami Zayn, Rusev, Cesaro, Almas), guys we know have everything you need to be legit main eventers but Vince and Dunn has some meaningless gripe with them. It would be more like signing a bunch of Christian Cage's for TNA rather than a bunch of elderly Ric Flair's or Hulk Hogan's, if that makes sense.


I disagree about those guys except for possibly Rusev... I think they all have big glaring flaws. Sami Zayn has one of
the worst looks on the roster and has durability issues and possibly attitude problems. He's good on the mic and good
in the ring and once he turned heel and joined Owens I thought he was used right outside of that corny program with
Lashley.

Cesaro doesn't have good mic skills or a great look but he's a great worker. The Bar is one of the best tag-teams in the
company but as a singles wrestler I wouldn't be interested in watching him as a main event guy.

Almas can barely speak English and also doesn't have a great look. How many guys in the business are actually good
in ring wrestlers but can't talk or look great seem to be a dime a dozen. Still him and Zelina have been a good package
and he's been in some high profile matches on Smackdown its just the roster is to big and he can't get regular TV time.

And one thing about Rusev is I really didn't like his promo this week it borderline sucked. I haven't seen him improve
his body or get better in the ring. Seems to have gotten complacent maybe because he can't get over with Vince.


AEW is almost guaranteed to be leaning more on the sports aspect than entertainment (and certainly less variety show than Vince likes it).

Zayn is a legit main eventer and one of the most talented guy on the roster. Fantastic wrestler and yes, he is hands on and demanding on his matches, but that isn't a bad thing. He should be well above the mid card given the guys on raw that get pushes (i mean he is on the same level as Rollins at least). Also that corny Lashley storyline shouldn't be understated, it killed both men involved.

Almas doesn't have a good look, have you seen the guy, its like one of his most defining features, sure he's small but again, won't be an issue in AEW, also he's a big star outside the WWE as La Sombra (he came in as one of the biggest names from Mexico and CMLL and was the leader of one of the most famous factions in Los Ingorbernables). Again, talking won't be an issue because i doubt they'd be stupid enough to not have him have a valet or manager.

Cesaro can't talk but he is super talented and strong in the ring, again, a good valet/manager fixes that immediately.

Everyone in WWE gets complacent and that's the issue, because of that geriatric, everyone gives up and just coasts and it shows in basically everyones work.

Their is rarely a case where people from NXT have better matches on the main roster unless your name is Seth Rollins, AJ Styles or Daniel Bryan. Other than those three, they're either not given the chance or simply just coast.

If those names left and went to AEW, I'd guarantee they'd show way more than at any time in WWE really since, apart from Rusev, they already have shown more (and Rusev has the tools that would make him successful, then again so did Ryback, but then again i don't think Rusev is nearly as dumb as Ryback).

Return to Pro Wrestling