Game 20: Portland vs Sacramento 7:00pm

[Blaze the Nugz]

Murray has two more years to show he belongs in the league

Interesting to read the Kings board and how down they are on Keegan. Same draft class
as Sharpe and I wonder how enthused either team will be to offer either guy the max
extension every member of that draft class expects.

I've never been in on Keegan. Seems pretty skilled for his size with a good BBIQ, but not very confident and not very athletic. Seems like he could be a glue guy on a contender. Obviously you hope for more out of the #4 pick, so I can see why Kings fans would be down on him.

[Blazinaway]

My opinion on Blanton is that he is a good 7-8th man for a team that needs a willing scorer off the bench. Someone that will not be afraid to shoot when the rest of the bench is composed of non-scorers who are reluctant to try and score. The type of guy you can play or sit depending on team need at the moment. More helpful on a good team that just needs a spark off of the bench.

Do you think if we added him to a Timelord trade that could net us a fairly decent 1st this year? A contending team adding those two off the bench would bolster their chances

[Walton1one]

Huh?

I think I said it looked like he was making some strides, he is a bench player most likely and that is based on if he can find a shred of consistency in his outside shot.

He is just as expendable as Banton, but since POR actually used something of value on him (1st round pick) chances are they are they would be more vested in him than a guy who has bounced around with 3? teams in his 5 subpar years in the NBA.

I have been around far too long and seen many players like him come and go, they are all the same, And they all end up in the same spot, out of the league

Your bias against Banton is pretty clear. By the way you talk about him, he could go off for 50 points for 5 straight games and you would still be making a case about how much he sucks.

No disagreement from me. Yes, I really dislike players of his type. Never met a shot they didn’t like and think every-time they are on the court they have a green light.

The team stands around more times than not when he has the ball and when he does have the ball he is thinking shoot 1st/2nd & 3rd, no matter how bad/forced it is. Those types of players never win you anything but, he is who he is and the blame really falls to Billups (mainly) & Cronin.

If your coach doesn’t call you out for selfish\dumb play and allows you a green light to do whatever you want, a player like Banton is going to take it. It isn’t good for the team or development of young players but Cronin\Billups don’t seem to care about that

The fact that Billups is even still the coach is a joke though, he should have been fired a year ago but apparently Jodi\Vulcan is too cheap

[zzaj]

Huh?

I think I said it looked like he was making some strides, he is a bench player most likely and that is based on if he can find a shred of consistency in his outside shot.

He is just as expendable as Banton, but since POR actually used something of value on him (1st round pick) chances are they are they would be more vested in him than a guy who has bounced around with 3? teams in his 5 subpar years in the NBA.

I have been around far too long and seen many players like him come and go, they are all the same, And they all end up in the same spot, out of the league

Your bias against Banton is pretty clear. By the way you talk about him, he could go off for 50 points for 5 straight games and you would still be making a case about how much he sucks.

No disagreement from me. Yes, I really dislike players of his type. Never met a shot they didn’t like and think every-time they are on the court they have a green light.

The team stands around more times than not when he has the ball and when he does have the ball he is thinking shoot 1st/2nd & 3rd, no matter how bad/forced it is. Those types of players never win you anything but, he is who he is and the blame really falls to Billups (mainly) & Cronin.

If your coach doesn’t call you out for selfish\dumb play and allows you a green light to do whatever you want, a player like Banton is going to take it. It isn’t good for the team or development of young players but Cronin\Billups don’t seem to care about that

The fact that Billups is even still the coach is a joke though, he should have been fired a year ago but apparently Jodi\Vulcan is too cheap

I don't want to come off as a Banton apologist...because I'm really not. He is what he is.

But that "Is" has been the best defending guard on the team this year...yes better than Scoot, Simons or Sharpe. Granted that's not saying much. But I think to pigeon-hole into a shoot-first-second-and-third type player, isn't particularly fair.

As for teammates standing around when he has the ball? That's the same whether it's Scoot, Simons, Deni, or whomever with the ball...
Billups' offense is based on high screen with 4 out and spray out actions off of that single screen or rescreen. There's literally no offball screening or movement by design. That's exactly the OPPOSITE offense that you want for a team full of non-shooters and players who can't attack closeouts reliably. It will almost always end with a tough 1-1 shot or a bailout shot on an evaporating shot-clock.

[dckingsfan]

My opinion on Blanton is that he is a good 7-8th man for a team that needs a willing scorer off the bench. Someone that will not be afraid to shoot when the rest of the bench is composed of non-scorers who are reluctant to try and score. The type of guy you can play or sit depending on team need at the moment. More helpful on a good team that just needs a spark off of the bench.

Banton has most definitely improved year over year on a small sample size. He is shooting .400 from 3-point land, will that continue? His TS% is .546, will that continue? They blow away previous years. If so, yeah - solid 7-8th man.

His D has definitely improved, I doubt that slides back.

If he could learn how to involve his teammates in the offense and the offense numbers and defense holds up - he could be a 6th man.

Edit: I have "kind of" changed my tune on the youngsters just a bit.

Clingan - Keeper
Scoot - Work in progress, don't know
Sharpe - Cut him loose, don't overpay
Walker - Cut him loose
Murray - Cut him loose
Avdija - Great Contract
Camara - Keeper
Banton - Work in progress, don't know

Simons & Ayton are overpays.

That is a bit depressing. Hard to give up on Banton when you have so few youngsters (if you think you are in a rebuild) and he could turn into a two-way player.

[Norm2953]

Most likely Portland would allow Sharpe to enter RFA as opposed to a potential max extension,
especially in an upcoming draft which is loaded with SG prospects

[Brandon-Clyde]

My opinion on Blanton is that he is a good 7-8th man for a team that needs a willing scorer off the bench. Someone that will not be afraid to shoot when the rest of the bench is composed of non-scorers who are reluctant to try and score. The type of guy you can play or sit depending on team need at the moment. More helpful on a good team that just needs a spark off of the bench.

Do you think if we added him to a Timelord trade that could net us a fairly decent 1st this year? A contending team adding those two off the bench would bolster their chances

I would say a team like Denver would be a great fit for both of them since it would give a backup to Jokic and an offensive player they desperately need off of the bench but Denver doesn't have a first this year. OKC could use Timelord but no need for Blanton. The the Knicks are a possibility as they need a center but have enough guards. Blanton could be a solid trade piece that adds value in a larger deal.

[DeBlazerRiddem]

I think Banton is fine as a 6th man type. No he isn't gonna win much on his own but his ability to come in and change the pace of the game and get some buckets without giving up any size is a useful skill in the right coaches hands. I think shot selection is a bigger issue for his efficiency than raw shooting ability, which can be somewhat mitigated by better coaching. I also think he has the feel of a bit of a late bloomer but that's just opinion so we will see but I comped him to Will Barton at one point and I think that's still a reasonable expectation.

If we can package him with someone like TL for good pick then he's not essential but if we are just looking at second rounders I would rather move Simons and groom him as a bench scorer type.

[Shem]

Your bias against Banton is pretty clear. By the way you talk about him, he could go off for 50 points for 5 straight games and you would still be making a case about how much he sucks.

No disagreement from me.

And there goes your credibility...

Yes, I really dislike players of his type.

I'm not a fan of the type of player Scoot is. But you don't see me doing all I can to bring him down any chance I get. I root for players to succeed, not put them down every chance I get. The only people who do that are people who have a personal vendetta.

Let's be honest, if it wasn't for Banton's spark off the bench once he came in the game, I seriously doubt the Blazers win the game last night. If you can't give credit for that, then you got serious problems.

[DusterBuster]

I think Banton is fine as a 6th man type. No he isn't gonna win much on his own but his ability to come in and change the pace of the game and get some buckets without giving up any size is a useful skill in the right coaches hands. I think shot selection is a bigger issue for his efficiency than raw shooting ability, which can be somewhat mitigated by better coaching. I also think he has the feel of a bit of a late bloomer but that's just opinion so we will see but I comped him to Will Barton at one point and I think that's still a reasonable expectation.

If we can package him with someone like TL for good pick then he's not essential but if we are just looking at second rounders I would rather move Simons and groom him as a bench scorer type.

Barton is a great comp. Totally agree. Good throw-in guy for a trade if a team is on the edge of almost making a deal, he’s playing good enough to be the equivalent of like a couple 2nd rounders and cash sort of thing to put a deal over the top to get done. That “added incentives” some teams want.

He also is still a useful player to Portland if not moved.

[DusterBuster]

Most likely Portland would allow Sharpe to enter RFA as opposed to a potential max extension,
especially in an upcoming draft which is loaded with SG prospects

Two separate events imo, but I agree with your first statement. Just resigning Sharpe without letting the market dictate his value is a mistake, but I also wonder if he would get an offer. Not that teams wouldn’t want him, but in the current CBA, I’m not sure how restricted FA will play out.

Teams already have seemed to largely shy away from RFA’s unless they really know they can get them. Seems it’s getting rarer and rarer to see teams put out offers they know will be matched. So just not sure I can see any team wanting to “stick it” to the Blazers enough to make a huge max offer for Sharpe in hopes they match.

Regarding the draft, there’s not a single player on this roster that’s worth the Blazers bypassing in lieu of picking the best player available on the board. The draft is also almost never a “sure thing”, so you can pick a SG but still retain Sharpe and figure it out after. If the rook looks like he’s going to be transcendent, then look to move Shae or see if they can coexist.

[Walton1one]

And there goes your credibility...

If you say so, there have been numerous players througout he years like Banton, and none of them amounted to much, but sure prioritze playing him over other players that the team actually invested valuable assets into (#3 pick, #23 pick, (2) 1st & (2) 2nd round picks), sounds like a winning strategy to me.

I dislike players "like" him, note the difference?

I'm not a fan of the type of player Scoot is. But you don't see me doing all I can to bring him down any chance I get. I root for players to succeed, not put them down every chance I get. The only people who do that are people who have a personal vendetta

This is not a vendetta against the person, that is absurd, but the type of player that he represents, which is completely valid and historically accurate BTW

Also, comparing a 20yr old Scoot to a 25yr old Banton with 4-years & 168 NBA games under his belt (with career averages of 41.3%\30.9% BTW) is ridiculous.

I think this debate has run its course, you want to root for players no matter how they play, I do not, that is how I see it.

[BlazersBroncos]

I mean, we can be nitpicking about Banton but the real story to me is the comparison between himself and Sharpe. Out 7th overall pick has been wholeheartedly outplayed by this over the hill 25 year old vet min chucker.

Banton is a better shooter (This year at least), a better defender, a better passer, gets to the line at a higher rate, has a higher rebound rate, higher block %, higher steal %, best On/Off, better per-100, etc. etc. etc.

The biggest thing that disturbs me with Sharpe is his DBPM - he is in Simons territory this year. Its unacceptable that a 6'6 guy with elite athleticism and a good WS is putting up this bad advanced defensive metrics - on a team playing good defense no less.

Banton is more fun to watch this year so far than Sharpe IMO. Not saying he should be in the long term plans but Sharpe is a freaking ghost 75% of the time and I am quickly getting sick of it.

Banton might take some wild drives but I take that and his competent shooting on 3PT kickouts over Sharpe settling for Dame length 3PT shots for no reason and forcing middies rather than pushing downhill to the rim.

[Walton1one]

Yeah, but Sharpe is 21, Banton is 25, what will Sharpe look like in 4 years? The difference in years matters a lot.

Sharpe is averaging 18 pts on 44.4% FG (15/att) - 28.4 3pt (on 6.2/att) - 3.2 REB - 2.3 AST - 1.9 TO in 30.7 min
52.6% TS% - 48.3% eFG - 24.6% USG (81st percentile)

Banton is averaging 9.9 pts on 43.5% FG (8.1/att) - 40% from 3pt (on 3.4/att) worth noting that his career avg is 30.9%, seriously doubt he will have a 10% increase in 3pt% - 2.4 REB - 2.5 AST - 1.8 TO in 16.6min
53.6% TS% - 51.1% eFG - 26.5% USG (86th percentile)

Sharpe is averaging: 1.07 pts per 2ptFG & .82 pts per 3ptFG - LY .91/1.0
Banton is averaging: .92 pts per 2ptFG & 1.16 pts per 3ptFG - LY .95/.89

Sharpe's 3pt attempts are up by .6
Banton's are down by 2.7

Sharpe's 2pt attempts are up by 1.4
Banton's are down by 6.9

Banton averaging same TO in 1/2 as many minutes as Sharpe (and against bench players)

Sharpe has been better in pts per 2pt attempts with slightly higher (1.4) attempts, which is a good sign. His 3pt shot has struggled so far this year, slightly more attempts but down from 1.0 to .82 pts per 3pt FG. His 3pt shooting is dragging his overall efficiency down

Banton's better TS% & eFG% are being boosted by his 3pt shooting which is up from .89 to 1.16. The question is if this is sustainable?
History would say not, his attempts are down across the board, which is helping inflate his averages (for now), and his shooting history over 4 seasons would point to a regression coming at some point.

[zzaj]

Yeah, but Sharpe is 21, Banton is 25, what will Sharpe look like in 4 years? The difference in years matters a lot.

Sharpe is averaging 18 pts on 44.4% FG (15/att) - 28.4 3pt (on 6.2/att) - 3.2 REB - 2.3 AST - 1.9 TO in 30.7 min
52.6% TS% - 48.3% eFG - 24.6% USG (81st percentile)

Banton is averaging 9.9 pts on 43.5% FG (8.1/att) - 40% from 3pt (on 3.4/att) worth noting that his career avg is 30.9%, seriously doubt he will have a 10% increase in 3pt% - 2.4 REB - 2.5 AST - 1.8 TO in 16.6min
53.6% TS% - 51.1% eFG - 26.5% USG (86th percentile)

Sharpe is averaging: 1.07 pts per 2ptFG & .82 pts per 3ptFG - LY .91/1.0
Banton is averaging: .92 pts per 2ptFG & 1.16 pts per 3ptFG - LY .95/.89

Sharpe's 3pt attempts are up by .6
Banton's are down by 2.7

Sharpe's 2pt attempts are up by 1.4
Banton's are down by 6.9

Banton averaging same TO in 1/2 as many minutes as Sharpe (and against bench players)

Sharpe has been better in pts per 2pt attempts with slightly higher (1.4) attempts, which is a good sign. His 3pt shot has struggled so far this year, slightly more attempts but down from 1.0 to .82 pts per 3pt FG. His 3pt shooting is dragging his overall efficiency down

Banton's better TS% & eFG% are being boosted by his 3pt shooting which is up from .89 to 1.16. The question is if this is sustainable?
History would say not, his attempts are down across the board, which is helping inflate his averages (for now), and his shooting history over 4 seasons would point to a regression coming at some point.

Not to pile on, Walton1, but I'm not sure what age has to do with "disliking players of his type". Shaedon and Banton are basically the same "types". You dislike Shaedon too?

Honestly, I think any team would consider it a MASSIVE success to have picked Banton at #46 in the second round, given how he's played this year. Will it last? Who knows...

EDIT: I get not liking players, for whatever reason...I'm not particularly fond of Scoot or Ayton. But I see no reason to celebrate Banton's successes this year.

[Walton1one]

Sharpe's 3pt %'s are not good so far: 14% from left corner, 20% from right corner, 23% from top of key, left wing 41% & right wing 33% are his hot spots

LY for reference, he was 34% from left corner, 25% from right corner, 36% from top of key, 33% from left wing & 32% from right wing

Shooting better from the wings, but corner 3's are way off as is top of the key.

[zzaj]

Sharpe's 3pt %'s are not good so far: 14% from left corner, 20% from right corner, 23% from top of key, left wing 41% & right wing 33% are his hot spots

LY for reference, he was 34% from left corner, 25% from right corner, 36% from top of key, 33% from left wing & 32% from right wing

Shooting better from the wings, but corner 3's are way off as is top of the key.

I think I heard Marang mention that C&S were most of his makes this year, whereas his pullup/OTD 3s were incredibly low %...

[Walton1one]

Not to pile on, Walton1, but I'm not sure what age has to do with "disliking players of his type". Shaedon and Banton are basically the same "types". You dislike Shaedon too?

Honestly, I think any team would consider it a MASSIVE success to have picked Banton at #46 in the second round, given how he's played this year. Will it last? Who knows...

I don't see the two as linked? What I was referencing was the way they play? Sharpe is almost too passive at times, whereas Banton seems to look for\force his shot a lot. You would think with Banton's length and propensity to drive to the rim, that he would have a better 2pt FG% than Sharpe, but he does not. Sharpe is 60% at the rim, Banton is 48.4%

The age has to do with the likelihood to improve, I think age matters a lot when it comes to that, how can you compare a 21yr old in his 2nd year to a 25yr old in his 4th?

Banton's shooting %'s this year are heavily inflated over what he has done historically (particularly 3pt). I would say the fact that his attempts are way down, are inflating his averages. Will it last is the question, I am betting that it won't.

Sharpe is averaging 15 FGA and shooting 43.6% and that is with his lower 3ptFG% this year

LY when Banton had 15 FGA, he shot 40.8%

Sharpe has already taken 45% of the 3PA he took all of last season, 29% of the amount he took in his rookie year (where he shot at league average at 36%)

Banton is at 35%. It might be that neither is a league average 3ptFG% (36.6% LY) shooter, but Banton (outside of this year) has never even been close to where Sharpe was (36%) in his rookie season.

[Walton1one]

Sharpe's 3pt %'s are not good so far: 14% from left corner, 20% from right corner, 23% from top of key, left wing 41% & right wing 33% are his hot spots

LY for reference, he was 34% from left corner, 25% from right corner, 36% from top of key, 33% from left wing & 32% from right wing

Shooting better from the wings, but corner 3's are way off as is top of the key.

I think I heard Marang mention that C&S were most of his makes this year, whereas his pullup/OTD 3s were incredibly low %...

Yeah the volume of his 3pt attempts are from left wing (7/17) and the top of the key (7/30)

LY, he was 14/42 from left wing and 20/55 from top of the key

How about this, his rookie season, 17% from top of key (9/54), but left wing\right wing 41%/43% and left\right corner 36%\43% more than made up for that. That season he shot from the top of the key less than any of the other 4 other spots beyond the 3pt line.

This year, he has shot from there the most, same with 23/24, but the % was 36% LY, this year 23% so far.

[zzaj]

Sharpe's 3pt %'s are not good so far: 14% from left corner, 20% from right corner, 23% from top of key, left wing 41% & right wing 33% are his hot spots

LY for reference, he was 34% from left corner, 25% from right corner, 36% from top of key, 33% from left wing & 32% from right wing

Shooting better from the wings, but corner 3's are way off as is top of the key.

I think I heard Marang mention that C&S were most of his makes this year, whereas his pullup/OTD 3s were incredibly low %...

Yeah the volume of his 3pt attempts are from left wing (7/17) and the top of the key (7/30)

LY, he was 14/42 from left wing and 20/55 from top of the key

How about this, his rookie season, 17% from top of key (9/54), but left wing\right wing 41%/43% and left\right corner 36%\43% more than made up for that. That season he shot from the top of the key less than any of the other 4 other spots beyond the 3pt line.

This year, he has shot from there the most, same with 23/24, but the % was 36% LY, this year 23% so far.

Just looked it up...

Sharpe -
Catch and shoot = 42% (46% in the past two weeks)
Off the dribble = 17%

Scoot -
C&S = 46%
Off the dribble = 14%

That tracks with what we've seen with the offense looking better with Deni being the initiator.