Think you will keep Ayton or try and trade him?

[JRoy]

Hope that his run of solid play fools another him into thinking he’s the real deal.

He isn’t and it would great if he were some other teams problem.

Wouldn't be so great if Cronin was the one being fooled..

Fool me once….you can’t get fooled.

[zzaj]

The issue I have with Ayton is that he would be incredibly impactful if defense was his #1 priority. Instead, he plays C- level man and positional defense most of the time, which counteracts any 12 foot jumpshot he could ever possibly make.

After about 3 passes Ayton is lost on defense, and FORGET trying to defend a high PnR--he gets roasted on those 95% of the time...to the point that teams with good PnR, hunt him on offense because they know they are going to get a wide open shot nearly every time.

To cap it all off, 'DominAyton' has some kind of delusional grandeur thing going on which (IMHO) keeps him from realizing his true potential. What he could really use is a coach kicking his a$$...like REALLY kicking his a$$ so that it either breaks his fragility or makes him a better player. But there are no coaches like that in the NBA anymore...they can't get away with it.

I'd like to see Ayton average 10 points, 13 rebounds, 2 blocks, 1.5 steals and 8 trips to the FT line a night...but that will never happen

[PDXKnight]

Hope that his run of solid play fools another him into thinking he’s the real deal.

He isn’t and it would great if he were some other teams problem.

Wouldn't be so great if Cronin was the one being fooled..

he already was

substantial rumors that he coveted Ayton for 2 years before landing him in the Dame trade

I'm anticipating Cronin will re-sign him and it wouldn't be for 15-20M/year. Be at least what he's making right now

Man I hope you're wrong on that one. But can't say I expect you to be

[Wizenheimer]

Wouldn't be so great if Cronin was the one being fooled..

he already was

substantial rumors that he coveted Ayton for 2 years before landing him in the Dame trade

I'm anticipating Cronin will re-sign him and it wouldn't be for 15-20M/year. Be at least what he's making right now

Man I hope you're wrong on that one. But can't say I expect you to be

Cronin signed Grant for 33M/year when the cap was 136M. If he re-signs Ayton when the cap is 170M a contract similar to Grant would be 41M/year. Similar for Simons. I'm about 60% convinced he'll re-sign both for a combined 70-80M/year

[zzaj]

he already was

substantial rumors that he coveted Ayton for 2 years before landing him in the Dame trade

I'm anticipating Cronin will re-sign him and it wouldn't be for 15-20M/year. Be at least what he's making right now

Man I hope you're wrong on that one. But can't say I expect you to be

Cronin signed Grant for 33M/year when the cap was 136M. If he re-signs Ayton when the cap is 170M a contract similar to Grant would be 41M/year. Similar for Simons. I'm about 60% convinced he'll re-sign both for a combined 70-80M/year

I know it’s blasphemous in Portland…but I do sometimes wonder what would have happened if Lillard would have been traded BEFORE Grant got paid and BEFORE Billups…since Lillard had a hand in both, especially Billups. They also would have likely gotten max value at that time.

[PDXKnight]

Man I hope you're wrong on that one. But can't say I expect you to be

Cronin signed Grant for 33M/year when the cap was 136M. If he re-signs Ayton when the cap is 170M a contract similar to Grant would be 41M/year. Similar for Simons. I'm about 60% convinced he'll re-sign both for a combined 70-80M/year

I know it’s blasphemous in Portland…but I do sometimes wonder what would have happened if Lillard would have been traded BEFORE Grant got paid and BEFORE Billups…since Lillard had a hand in both, especially Billups. They also would have likely gotten max value at that time.

Would've had to be a season before, jerami was promised that extension long before It happened for some dumb reason & no one has the ganas to stand up to klutch

[zzaj]

Cronin signed Grant for 33M/year when the cap was 136M. If he re-signs Ayton when the cap is 170M a contract similar to Grant would be 41M/year. Similar for Simons. I'm about 60% convinced he'll re-sign both for a combined 70-80M/year

I know it’s blasphemous in Portland…but I do sometimes wonder what would have happened if Lillard would have been traded BEFORE Grant got paid and BEFORE Billups…since Lillard had a hand in both, especially Billups. They also would have likely gotten max value at that time.

Would've had to be a season before, jerami was promised that extension long before It happened for some dumb reason & no one has the ganas to stand up to klutch

Yeah, I'm bad at remembering timeline and years things happened...Wiz is good at that.

If Lillard was traded that year it would have been around the time of the Gobert trade, and his value would have been sky high--who knows how many draft picks the Blazers would be sitting on now. Of course it's all speculative. It's incredibly rare, and usually unpopular with casual fans for a team to trade their best player in their prime...I feel like the Dallas trade is a bit of an outlier.

[Wizenheimer]

I know it’s blasphemous in Portland…but I do sometimes wonder what would have happened if Lillard would have been traded BEFORE Grant got paid and BEFORE Billups…since Lillard had a hand in both, especially Billups. They also would have likely gotten max value at that time.

Would've had to be a season before, jerami was promised that extension long before It happened for some dumb reason & no one has the ganas to stand up to klutch

Yeah, I'm bad at remembering timeline and years things happened...Wiz is good at that.

If Lillard was traded that year it would have been around the time of the Gobert trade, and his value would have been sky high--who knows how many draft picks the Blazers would be sitting on now. Of course it's all speculative. It's incredibly rare, and usually unpopular with casual fans for a team to trade their best player in their prime...I feel like the Dallas trade is a bit of an outlier.

the only concrete facts we have are the reports that Dame asked for a trade came out on July 1. Grant signed his new deal 8 days later on the 9th

it's pretty safe to assume that Dame had asked for a trade before the reports came out. From the things Dame had said before the draft, I'd say there's a decent chance that Dame asked for a trade as soon as it became apparent that the Blazers were keeping Scoot instead of leveraging that #3 pick in a trade. And from what happened after the ask, I'd say it's safe to assume that Dame thought Cronin had lied to him about his intentions to build a veteran team around Dame

as PDXKnight said, it's entirely possible that Cronin and Grant had reached an informal agreement on a new deal as early as the summer of 2022 after Grant arrived in Portland. He was going to be playing on the final year of his previous contract and it was still the previous CBA in force. That would limit his base salary in any extension to 120% of his current salary. That would have dropped him down to a 24M base/1st-year salary in an extension

I'm seeing people trying to blame Dame for Grant's contract. Dame had nothing to do with it other than saying he liked Grant when Grant was a Piston. Trading for Grant and giving him that new deal? that was all Cronin

[zzaj]

Would've had to be a season before, jerami was promised that extension long before It happened for some dumb reason & no one has the ganas to stand up to klutch

Yeah, I'm bad at remembering timeline and years things happened...Wiz is good at that.

If Lillard was traded that year it would have been around the time of the Gobert trade, and his value would have been sky high--who knows how many draft picks the Blazers would be sitting on now. Of course it's all speculative. It's incredibly rare, and usually unpopular with casual fans for a team to trade their best player in their prime...I feel like the Dallas trade is a bit of an outlier.

the only concrete facts we have are the reports that Dame asked for a trade came out on July 1. Grant signed his new deal 8 days later on the 9th

it's pretty safe to assume that Dame had asked for a trade before the reports came out. From the things Dame had said before the draft, I'd say there's a decent chance that Dame asked for a trade as soon as it became apparent that the Blazers were keeping Scoot instead of leveraging that #3 pick in a trade. And from what happened after the ask, I'd say it's safe to assume that Dame thought Cronin had lied to him about his intentions to build a veteran team around Dame

as PDXKnight said, it's entirely possible that Cronin and Grant had reached an informal agreement on a new deal as early as the summer of 2022 after Grant arrived in Portland. He was going to be playing on the final year of his previous contract and it was still the previous CBA in force. That would limit his base salary in any extension to 120% of his current salary. That would have dropped him down to a 24M base/1st-year salary in an extension

I'm seeing people trying to blame Dame for Grant's contract. Dame had nothing to do with it other than saying he liked Grant when Grant was a Piston. Trading for Grant and giving him that new deal? that was all Cronin

I do remember lots of rumors/speculation that Lillard purposely waited to ask out until after Grant got his contract. Whether it's true or not, who knows. I also recall a Blazers Edge piece speculating that part of the reason Grant got the money he did was because of the possibility of getting stuck in another rebuild. I have a hard time believing that, but again...who knows.

I do find the timing of Lillard asking out the day after Grant inked his deal to be a bit suspicious. On the surface, that feels like a favor to a friend/teammate.

[Tim Lehrbach]

I opposed trading Lillard at all, but it is highly probable that trading him in 2021 or 2022 would have served the franchise better than trading him in 2023.

[PDXKnight]

I opposed trading Lillard at all, but it is highly probable that trading him in 2021 or 2022 would have served the franchise better than trading him in 2023.

Yeah if we had a redo on that situation we probably could've landed a couple more firsts and started the rebuild sooner if we move on from dame in 2022. But at least we didn't wait one more year as it would've been a catastrophe at that point. Seemed like I'm the summer judging by the KAT trade the cap reality was already set

[BlazersBroncos]

We used the 7th pick on a center. If we are in a spot to pay Ayton 20M+ summer of 2026 then DC must have really not developed - because by his 3rd year Clingan should 100% be a starter to even come close to justifying his draft position. And spending 20M+ on a backup C is something no well run team does.

There is no 'good' scenario where Ayton is resigning with PDX - it means we swung and missed on DC and that would stink.

NOTE - despite his really rough offense DC is still showing very good advanced stats - albeit in limited PT. His OnCourt per 100poss is 2nd on the team. His On/Off per 100poss is 3rd on the team. His WS48 is 3rd on the team. His DBPM is 2nd on the team. His ORB rate of 18% is very elite and his DRB rate of 26.5 is excellent.

There are alot of good metrics showing DC should develop into a starting C by Y3. If that doesnt happen, he must either have suffered an injury or remained Joel Pryzbilla level on offense (Vanilla Gorilla actually had a career OBPM close to DC's rookie year of -2.8 - fun fact, DC is -2.6 OBPM in ~600 rookie minutes - Pryzbilla played nearly 2000 minutes his first 3 years in the league and his average OBPM over those 3 seasons was -5.16 - thats like being the Michael Jordan of sucking on offense bad.

[PDXKnight]

Well looks like if this injury is anything serious ayton is gonna be a huge expiring to shop in 2025-26 at this point.

[Wizenheimer]

I do find the timing of Lillard asking out the day after Grant inked his deal to be a bit suspicious. On the surface, that feels like a favor to a friend/teammate.

well, Grant signed his deal on July 9, Shams reported that there was an agreement on June 30.

posters on another forum have mentioned the reporting that Dame asked Cronin for a trade a day or two after the draft and Cronin asked him to keep it quiet until July 1. I do remember something like that, not the particulars and I don't feel like googling it

and I think it's pretty naive to think that there could be an agreement in place 10 days before Grant's contract is signed, and turn around and believe that Cronin didn't know Dame asked for a trade before it was reported in media

you'd have to hold a pretty low opinion on Lillard's integrity, maybe Grant's too, to believe he double-crossed the Blazers and possibly colluded with Grant to engineer a new contract

as I said earlier, I think it's quite probable that in the summer of 2022 Cronin and Grant agreed that the Blazers would give him a new deal the following off-season. I'd bet substantial money that Cronin asked about an extension that summer, but that would have been bad business by Grant and his agent