CJ TRADE IDEAS

[BlazersBroncos]

I might be just trying to talk myself into this, but does anyone know that Tobias has near identical advanced defensive metrics to Pascal? And is a much better shooter? And post similar APG on similar USG?

Call me crazy, but I take Harris + PHI Asset + Keeping our FRP's over Simmons or Pascal - Losing multiple of FRP (Which it will take)

I say that because, despite who we add I dont think we become a contender. So I want to keep those picks for when Dame asks out, which I think happens regardless of who amongst the three above guys we add. So add Harris, give us some false hope for 1-3 seasons and then have all our draft capital when the rebuild starts.

It sucks to think like that, but its the harsh reality of the NBA, especially the small market NBA.

I posted it about a week ago, but CJ for Harris + Milton puts us in a good position. It allows us to move Simons and avoid paying him, as Milton is due money a year later. It balances our roster and puts us in a spot to move DJJ + Simons for something (Thad?) and it keeps all our FRP for the inevitable Dame trade request. Hell, maybe we can keep Simons and get Thad for 2 future SRP or something?

G - Damian Lillard (34) / Anfernee Simons (14)
G - Norman Powell (30) / Shake Milton (10) / Anfernee Simons (8)
F - Robert Covington (30) / Shake Milton (10) / Thad Young (8)
F - Tobias Harris (32) / Thad Young (16)
C - Jusuf Nurkic (28) / Cody Zeller (20)

I dont get how that isnt clearly a better roster. Just accept the Harris and move on.

[BNM]

I might be just trying to talk myself into this, but does anyone know that Tobias has near identical advanced defensive metrics to Pascal? And is a much better shooter? And post similar APG on similar USG?

Call me crazy, but I take Harris + PHI Asset + Keeping our FRP's over Simmons or Pascal - Losing multiple of FRP (Which it will take)

I say that because, despite who we add I dont think we become a contender. So I want to keep those picks for when Dame asks out, which I think happens regardless of who amongst the three above guys we add. So add Harris, give us some false hope for 1-3 seasons and then have all our draft capital when the rebuild starts.

It sucks to think like that, but its the harsh reality of the NBA, especially the small market NBA.

I posted it about a week ago, but CJ for Harris + Milton puts us in a good position. It allows us to move Simons and avoid paying him, as Milton is due money a year later. It balances our roster and puts us in a spot to move DJJ + Simons for something (Thad?) and it keeps all our FRP for the inevitable Dame trade request. Hell, maybe we can keep Simons and get Thad for 2 future SRP or something?

G - Damian Lillard (34) / Anfernee Simons (14)
G - Norman Powell (30) / Shake Milton (10) / Anfernee Simons (8)
F - Robert Covington (30) / Shake Milton (10) / Thad Young (8)
F - Tobias Harris (32) / Thad Young (16)
C - Jusuf Nurkic (28) / Cody Zeller (20)

I dont get how that isnt clearly a better roster. Just accept the Harris and move on.

I like your reasoning, but the moves you suggested puts the team about $7 million over the tax threshold. Not sure if Jody and the Vulcans will sign off on being a tax paying team while treading water waiting for Dame to demand a trade.

Of course the tax penalty might just be for one season (Young is a $14 million expiring contract), but we are currently just under the tax threshold and already have a $9.7 million expiring deal in DJJ.

Harris makes about $5 million more per year than CJ, so that ties our hands more than our current roster going forward. I get that you have to spend money (in POR's case, overspend) if you hope to compete in this league, but I'm not sure if Tobias Harris is enough of a difference maker to justify his contract (he's owed over $115 million for the next three seasons).

[BNM]

How about a 3-team trade between POR, PHI and TOR.

POR:
OUT = CJ, Simons, Little, Elleby
IN = Siakam, Boucher, Curry

PHI:
OUT = Simmons, Curry
IN = CJ, Dragic

TOR:
OUT: Siakam, Dragic, Boucher
IN = Simmons, Simons, Little, Elleby

Portland and Philadelphia steal way too much value.

Most Toronto fans wouldn't trade Siakam for Simmons straight up, let alone include Boucher and Dragic.

Simons, Little, and Elleby don't have the value outside of Portland that you think that they do.

Simmons/CJ/Siakam all make about the same salary-wise. So realistically, the trade would need to be a straight swap with Portland trading two 1sts to Toronto to justify taking a flyer on Simmons' contract, and Philadelphia realizing Simmons doesn't have the value that they think he has. But more likely, the 76ers let Simmons build some of his value back during the regular season, then trade him at the trade deadline. As Kanter, Whiteside, etc. have proven, there's a big difference between being not playable in the playoffs and being not playable.

You left out this part:

POR and PHI throw in draft picks/pick swaps as needed to make it happen. Which I intentionally bolded for emphasis in my original proposal.

I actually place very little value on Simons Little and Elleby. I included them to make the salaries work. They are young and cheap. If one of them ends up being a keeper (most likely Simons), it's a bonus for TOR.

Edit: In additional to draft capital, the incentive for TOR is none of Siakam, Boucher, Dragic or CJ fit their rebuilding plans. No point in holding onto assets that will only hinder your rebuild. Simmons is still young and clearly has the most potential upside of anyone included in this trade. Highest risk, but also highest potential reward. TOR is in a place where they can afford that gamble much more than win now teams like POT and PHI.

[JasonStern]

POR and PHI throw in draft picks/pick swaps as needed to make it happen. Which I intentionally bolded for emphasis in my original proposal.

The 76ers aren't including picks in a McCollum/Simmons swap. And if they were giving up picks, why wouldn't they keep Siakam for themselves?

[BNM]

POR and PHI throw in draft picks/pick swaps as needed to make it happen. Which I intentionally bolded for emphasis in my original proposal.

The 76ers aren't including picks in a McCollum/Simmons swap. And if they were giving up picks, why wouldn't they keep Siakam for themselves?

.

I said "as needed". If picks aren't needed, they wont be included.

They have Harris at the 4, who is a good fit next to Embiid and is on a huge contract Neither Harris, nor Siakam are well suited to playing the 3, or the 5. So, they'd have about $75 million a year tied up in two players who are at their best playing the same position.

CJ is a better fit for their current needs than the redundant Siakam. He gives them the spacing the need for Embiid and is capable of creating his own shot (much more so than Harris or Siakam).

Unless PHI has another trade lined up for Harris, but that's a totally different scenario.

[PDXKnight]

I wonder if something around cj for Myles turner or sabonis would be doable? I’d prefer Domontas but doubt indy would want to part with him as much but even a turner + lamb for cj + first might hold some merit.

I doubt houston would really pony up much for cj but wonder if even a cj for gordon + augustin would hold some merit but feels like a value gap that houston would have to fill

[HoopsFanAZ]

On this page of the thread ...

I'm good with CJ in a deal for one of Simmons, Siakam, and Harris. Simmons would be picks added by PTD. Siakam with Little added and more. For Harris, add in contracts to make the $$$ better for Portland avoiding "too much" tax. In other words, a player with size who plays D at their position significantly more than CJ? Sign me up!

I hope Lillard is unhappy enough to get one of these trades done. I could be persuaded on other players, too.

[Jsun947]

I keep feeling like for Philly upgrading Seth Curry to CJ is less valuable than downgrading Harris to a PF that fits worse with Embiid like Siakam.

Maybe Harris + Simmons + Curry for Siakam + CJ + Dragic would make Philly a better team but I’m not convinced.

[BlazersBroncos]

I keep feeling like for Philly upgrading Seth Curry to CJ is less valuable than downgrading Harris to a PF that fits worse with Embiid like Siakam.

Maybe Harris + Simmons + Curry for Siakam + CJ + Dragic would make Philly a better team but I’m not convinced.

I am no CJ stan, but there is a huge difference between Seth and CJ. Seth is a off ball 3PT shooter, CJ is a guy who can get buckets when the game is on the line. This lineup is much more balanced for PHI:

G - CJ McCollum / Tyrese Maxey / Jaden Springer
G - Danny Green / Seth Curry / Isaiah Joe
F - Matisse Thybulle / Furkan Korkmaz / Gary Clark
F - Ben Simmons / Paul Reed / Georges Niang
C - Joel Embiid / Andre Drummond / Charles Bassey

It puts Simmons in his natural PF position, gives them a guard that can create and opens PT for Paul Reed who is ready for a rotation role IMO (Most PHI fans agree w/ this).

[ecuhus1981]

Hello!

I'm a Nets fan, and in full disclosure, I'm under an indefinite posting ban from the Trades and Transactions board. (That's why I'm not posting this there.) Some mods feel that my Brooklyn trades are too slanted in my own team's favor. Well, this one doesn't involve my team, so hopefully you know that I have no agenda. I just want to see and hear feedback.

Here it is:

https://fanspo.com/nba/s/general/trades/7Jm4pBAfnhmZmh/cavs-sixers-and-blazers

CLE trades Nance/Osman/Sexton/22CLE1st/24CLE1st/26CLE1st for McCollum/Thybulle/Joe
The Cavaliers add size and defense on the perimeter.
Garland, McCollum, Okoro, Mobley, Allen
Rubio, Windler, Thybulle, Wade, Love


PHI trades Simmons/Thybulle/Joe/23PHI1st/27PHI1st for Lillard/Jones/Osman
The Sixers push all-in to challenge for a title.
Lillard, Green, Korkmaz, Harris, Embiid
Curry, Milton, Jones, Osman, Drummond


POR trades Lillard/McCollum/Jones for Simmons/Nance/Sexton/22CLE1st/23PHI1st/24CLE1st/26CLE1st/27PHI1st
The Blazers retool while staying competitive, and trim $30mil in payroll.
Sexton, Powell, Covington, Simmons, Nurkic
Simons, McLemore, Snell, Nance, Zeller

[JRoy]

No thank you from POR.

That team has no present and no future.

[BNM]

POR trades Lillard/McCollum/Jones for Simmons/Nance/Sexton/22CLE1st/23PHI1st/24CLE1st/26CLE1st/27PHI1st
The Blazers retool while staying competitive, and trim $30mil in payroll.
Sexton, Powell, Covington, Simmons, Nurkic
Simons, McLemore, Snell, Nance, Zeller

That is not a competitive team in the West. Unless you are competing for most ping pong balls.

[BlazersBroncos]

POR trades Lillard/McCollum/Jones for Simmons/Nance/Sexton/22CLE1st/23PHI1st/24CLE1st/26CLE1st/27PHI1st
The Blazers retool while staying competitive, and trim $30mil in payroll.
Sexton, Powell, Covington, Simmons, Nurkic
Simons, McLemore, Snell, Nance, Zeller

That is not a competitive team in the West. Unless you are competing for most ping pong balls.

Even worse, its not bad enough either to get the ping pong balls needed to rebuild. Its a reset with purgatory in mind. The absolute worse direction we could take.

[Tomjas]

Sixers fan here

As an outsider, I find it hard to believe that CJ will be traded before training camp given his close relationship with Dame

Far more likely to be a deadline deal if the team isn’t going anywhere

As far as the Sixers are concerned, obviously everything revolves around the Simmons situation

If the relationship is broken, then give me CJ any day as he actually fits

If the relationship is salvageable, then give me CJ for Tobias any day

Lost in all the Simmons noise is the fact that it’s Tobias who doesn’t fit with Ben or Joel because he’s not a catch & shoot guy, his 3pa is going down and he likes to operate from the mid range in

Look up the stats

Ben - Joel duo is elite

Tobias with either one is a big drop off

CJ is an outside gunner who can handle the ball and his defensive deficiencies can be hidden by Joel and Ben

He makes far more sense for us than Tobias

Unfortunately, it’s down to more than that

[JRoy]

CJ for Harris and Thybulle works

[Myth]

CJ for Harris and Thybulle works

Sure, for us that is.

[JRoy]

CJ for Harris and Thybulle works

Sure, for us that is.

They can take Simons too.

Please.

[DeBlazerRiddem]

Now that we have Nance it wouldn't make as much sense to trade CJ for Harris. Then we would end up with too many PFs and not enough guards. Plus Harris lack of defense at PF is a bigger problem for a team to hide than CJs lack of defense at guard.

Although I agree Thybulle would be a nice player to have. However I would love to have a player like that supporting Dame/CJ but not so much instead of them. But alas Olshey is allergic to defense playing guards, he has always been in on the score-first guards for both starters and backups. Which to be fair those type do dominate the class of elite PGs but for backup level guards I think many contenders should have that scrappy in your face perimeter defender.

[GEE]

How about a 3-way: POR/CLE/PHI

Portland trades: CJ to PHI
Cleveland trades: Love and Mobley to POR
Philly trades: Harris to CLE

Blazers get a more balanced roster, an NBA champion that I think can still ball hard for 20mpg / for 2 more years, and get one less year of CJ's money. Portland also gets a rookie that should be able to play right away with spot minutes to begin with, and a gradual increase. Better than Zeller day 1, and will eventually have all of his minutes.

Cleveland moves on from Love and his $60 mil, at the cost of a big "Blue chip" while getting Harris, a highly skilled PF they can easily pair with Lauri and Allen, to make for a decent 3-man PF/C rotation.

Philly gets much needed perimeter shooting, while clearing out the painted area for Simmons to operate more efficiently with Joel. The three bigs were one too many IMO, and CJ could be an All-Star for them next year, especially if the Sixers look like contenders.

BLAZERS ROSTER:
Dame / Simons
Powell
ROCO / Little
Nance Jr. / Love
Nurkic / Mobley

[DeBlazerRiddem]

Love is cooked, he isn't providing meaningful minutes for anyone anymore.


Although if we trade Dame, eating Love and getting Mobley would be a fantastic return for CJ, I just don't believe the Cavs will do that.