Blow it Up Trade Ideas

[monopoman]

Trading away Simons is about the dumbest thing the Blazers could ever do period. Kid is 22 and this is only a taste of what's to come, through his first 30 starts he holds the record for made 3's over every other player to ever play.

While a Simons+Dame backcourt may not work out that will only be the case for a few years, eventually Dame will retire or get traded. I have a feeling Dame only has 3-4 more seasons at best as a true all-star caliber player, and that might be a very optimistic guess.

[Wizenheimer]

Trading away Simons is about the dumbest thing the Blazers could ever do period. Kid is 22 and this is only a taste of what's to come, through his first 30 starts he holds the record for made 3's over every other player to ever play.

While a Simons+Dame backcourt may not work out that will only be the case for a few years, eventually Dame will retire or get traded. I have a feeling Dame only has 3-4 more seasons at best as a true all-star caliber player, and that might be a very optimistic guess.

it's too bad Simons is not 6'7 instead of 6'3; but that's the way it is. Obviously, a Dame + PG13 pairing or a Dame + Butler pairing would have a better chance of succeeding that a Dame + Simons pairing. But it also doesn't have to be the case that a Dame/Ant backcourt will just be a reboot of the Dame/CJ backcourt. Simons is really close to CJ's level right now, if not better in some ways. If he takes another step up next season and he and Dame develop better synergy than Dame and CJ did, the pairing could easily succeed.

as far as Blazer defense, I'll remind people that in 2017-18, Portland had the 8th ranked defense in the league. And that was with a Dame/CJ starting back court. The trick is to have a decent defensive roster surrounding Dame/Ant. That season, olshey actually built that kind of roster even though his history suggests that was an accident. The Blazers just have to be mindful of not adding players that are the kinds of defensive screen doors that Crabbe, Melo, & Kanter were. Further, Dame/CJ were never supported by a SG like Hart, and were never coached by somebody like Billups

the addition of Hart illustrates a particular failing of olshey rosters in the Dame/CJ era. Especially when it comes to the 3rd guard in the rotation. Portland went from Napier to Curry to Simons. Those were the 3rd guards backing up Dame/CJ. The basket is still 10' off the floor and most other teams actually have some length in the back court. But olshey-ball was dwarf-ball. Hopefully, Cronin, or whoever the GM is, will give Billups SF options that don't require moving Hart to SF.

as for Dame, my feeling is that people talking about his decline have been way too influenced by how he looked this season playing with an abdominal injury so severe it required corrective surgery. For chrissakes, is was only 10 months ago that Dame averaged 34 & 10 in a playoff series. He had a PER of 30.6, a TS% of .660, and he led all playoff performers in winshare/48, OBPM, and BPM. 10 months ago. Yet, for some dumb reason(s), a lot of people seem to have concluded that Dame's 'decline' is on a Gerald Wallace trajectory rather than a Chris Paul trajectory. It makes no sense

[BlazersBroncos]

Here is my most recent bored at work-trying to not think about WW3 take:

TRADE 1

Portland Trades
Eric Bledsoe G
Didi Louzada F
Lower LP

Detroit Trades
Jerami Grant
Kelly Olynyk (Into TPE)

FREE AGENCY
Anfernee Simons G *** 4 Y 22M AV ***
Jusuf Nurkic C *** 3Y 15M AV ***
Kyle Anderson F *** 4Y MLE ***
Ben McLemore G *** Vet Min ***

NBA DRAFT
FRP – Keegan Murray F
SRP – Ismael Kamagate C (Stashed)

G – Damian Lillard (34) / Anfernee Simons (14)
G – Anfernee Simons (18) / Josh Hart (30)
F – Jerami Grant (28) / Nas Little (20)
F – Kyle Anderson (28) / Keegan Murray (20)
C – Jusuf Nurkic (28) / Kelly Olynyk (20)

Deep Bench – Brandon Williams PG, Keon Johnson G, Ben McLemore GF, Greg Brown F, Justice Winslow F, Trendon Watford FC,

REASONING
The FO and Chauncey clearly want to adjust the image and culture of this team to a gritty, defense first squad that leans on its guards for offense. They do just that.

Grant is the best talent at F we would have since Batum and while imperfect, is a huge upgrade overall. He and Anderson provide a unique defensive duo at Forward with each able to guard SF and PF.

Kelly is taken into the TPE to provide a changeup to Nurkic as a floor spacer and his contract + Winslow equals around 16M, allowing us to potentially flip with a pick for a bigger fish down the line.

Murray is drafted as BPA with the hope he can be instant offense off the bench as a rookie, his showing splits are insane and he plays good enough defense. I think he has a fairly straightforward path to being a Tobias Harris level guy with a good chance to be more in the Granger range.

This team is big, full of try hards, athletic enough, good enough at shooting and filled with positive defenders. There are clear similarities to the teams Chauncey’s Pistons used to put on the floor IMO. Ant isn’t a reliable true 2nd ballhandler but that is alleviated buy the handle / passing of the other guys (For the most part). There are not many snipers, but a slew of 35-38% shooters who also play good defense (Its much harder to find a 40+% 3PT guy who can defend). All the guys have good character, all are known around the league for playing smart and hard. It doesn’t add a true second star, but I think this squad could make noise and if Keegan develops well, be a contender.

[DusterBuster]

Trading away Simons is about the dumbest thing the Blazers could ever do period. Kid is 22 and this is only a taste of what's to come, through his first 30 starts he holds the record for made 3's over every other player to ever play.

While a Simons+Dame backcourt may not work out that will only be the case for a few years, eventually Dame will retire or get traded. I have a feeling Dame only has 3-4 more seasons at best as a true all-star caliber player, and that might be a very optimistic guess.

it's too bad Simons is not 6'7 instead of 6'3; but that's the way it is. Obviously, a Dame + PG13 pairing or a Dame + Butler pairing would have a better chance of succeeding that a Dame + Simons pairing. But it also doesn't have to be the case that a Dame/Ant backcourt will just be a reboot of the Dame/CJ backcourt. Simons is really close to CJ's level right now, if not better in some ways. If he takes another step up next season and he and Dame develop better synergy than Dame and CJ did, the pairing could easily succeed.

as far as Blazer defense, I'll remind people that in 2017-18, Portland had the 8th ranked defense in the league. And that was with a Dame/CJ starting back court. The trick is to have a decent defensive roster surrounding Dame/Ant. That season, olshey actually built that kind of roster even though his history suggests that was an accident. The Blazers just have to be mindful of not adding players that are the kinds of defensive screen doors that Crabbe, Melo, & Kanter were. Further, Dame/CJ were never supported by a SG like Hart, and were never coached by somebody like Billups

the addition of Hart illustrates a particular failing of olshey rosters in the Dame/CJ era. Especially when it comes to the 3rd guard in the rotation. Portland went from Napier to Curry to Simons. Those were the 3rd guards backing up Dame/CJ. The basket is still 10' off the floor and most other teams actually have some length in the back court. But olshey-ball was dwarf-ball. Hopefully, Cronin, or whoever the GM is, will give Billups SF options that don't require moving Hart to SF.

as for Dame, my feeling is that people talking about his decline have been way too influenced by how he looked this season playing with an abdominal injury so severe it required corrective surgery. For chrissakes, is was only 10 months ago that Dame averaged 34 & 10 in a playoff series. He had a PER of 30.6, a TS% of .660, and he led all playoff performers in winshare/48, OBPM, and BPM. 10 months ago. Yet, for some dumb reason(s), a lot of people seem to have concluded that Dame's 'decline' is on a Gerald Wallace trajectory rather than a Chris Paul trajectory. It makes no sense

The NBA, maybe only second to the NFL, has the worst case of short-term memory by fans.

[wjun15]

Here is my most recent bored at work-trying to not think about WW3 take:

TRADE 1

Portland Trades
Eric Bledsoe G
Didi Louzada F
Lower LP

Detroit Trades
Jerami Grant
Kelly Olynyk (Into TPE)

FREE AGENCY
Anfernee Simons G *** 4 Y 22M AV ***
Jusuf Nurkic C *** 3Y 15M AV ***
Kyle Anderson F *** 4Y MLE ***
Ben McLemore G *** Vet Min ***

NBA DRAFT
FRP – Keegan Murray F
SRP – Ismael Kamagate C (Stashed)

G – Damian Lillard (34) / Anfernee Simons (14)
G – Anfernee Simons (18) / Josh Hart (30)
F – Jerami Grant (28) / Nas Little (20)
F – Kyle Anderson (28) / Keegan Murray (20)
C – Jusuf Nurkic (28) / Kelly Olynyk (20)

Deep Bench – Brandon Williams PG, Keon Johnson G, Ben McLemore GF, Greg Brown F, Justice Winslow F, Trendon Watford FC,

REASONING
The FO and Chauncey clearly want to adjust the image and culture of this team to a gritty, defense first squad that leans on its guards for offense. They do just that.

Grant is the best talent at F we would have since Batum and while imperfect, is a huge upgrade overall. He and Anderson provide a unique defensive duo at Forward with each able to guard SF and PF.

Kelly is taken into the TPE to provide a changeup to Nurkic as a floor spacer and his contract + Winslow equals around 16M, allowing us to potentially flip with a pick for a bigger fish down the line.

Murray is drafted as BPA with the hope he can be instant offense off the bench as a rookie, his showing splits are insane and he plays good enough defense. I think he has a fairly straightforward path to being a Tobias Harris level guy with a good chance to be more in the Granger range.

This team is big, full of try hards, athletic enough, good enough at shooting and filled with positive defenders. There are clear similarities to the teams Chauncey’s Pistons used to put on the floor IMO. Ant isn’t a reliable true 2nd ballhandler but that is alleviated buy the handle / passing of the other guys (For the most part). There are not many snipers, but a slew of 35-38% shooters who also play good defense (Its much harder to find a 40+% 3PT guy who can defend). All the guys have good character, all are known around the league for playing smart and hard. It doesn’t add a true second star, but I think this squad could make noise and if Keegan develops well, be a contender.

it's miles better than ur previous scenario but still no where close to a chip against teams like the bucks warriors 76ers suns nets (healthy), heat.

[BlazersBroncos]

Here is my most recent bored at work-trying to not think about WW3 take:

TRADE 1

Portland Trades
Eric Bledsoe G
Didi Louzada F
Lower LP

Detroit Trades
Jerami Grant
Kelly Olynyk (Into TPE)

FREE AGENCY
Anfernee Simons G *** 4 Y 22M AV ***
Jusuf Nurkic C *** 3Y 15M AV ***
Kyle Anderson F *** 4Y MLE ***
Ben McLemore G *** Vet Min ***

NBA DRAFT
FRP – Keegan Murray F
SRP – Ismael Kamagate C (Stashed)

G – Damian Lillard (34) / Anfernee Simons (14)
G – Anfernee Simons (18) / Josh Hart (30)
F – Jerami Grant (28) / Nas Little (20)
F – Kyle Anderson (28) / Keegan Murray (20)
C – Jusuf Nurkic (28) / Kelly Olynyk (20)

Deep Bench – Brandon Williams PG, Keon Johnson G, Ben McLemore GF, Greg Brown F, Justice Winslow F, Trendon Watford FC,

REASONING
The FO and Chauncey clearly want to adjust the image and culture of this team to a gritty, defense first squad that leans on its guards for offense. They do just that.

Grant is the best talent at F we would have since Batum and while imperfect, is a huge upgrade overall. He and Anderson provide a unique defensive duo at Forward with each able to guard SF and PF.

Kelly is taken into the TPE to provide a changeup to Nurkic as a floor spacer and his contract + Winslow equals around 16M, allowing us to potentially flip with a pick for a bigger fish down the line.

Murray is drafted as BPA with the hope he can be instant offense off the bench as a rookie, his showing splits are insane and he plays good enough defense. I think he has a fairly straightforward path to being a Tobias Harris level guy with a good chance to be more in the Granger range.

This team is big, full of try hards, athletic enough, good enough at shooting and filled with positive defenders. There are clear similarities to the teams Chauncey’s Pistons used to put on the floor IMO. Ant isn’t a reliable true 2nd ballhandler but that is alleviated buy the handle / passing of the other guys (For the most part). There are not many snipers, but a slew of 35-38% shooters who also play good defense (Its much harder to find a 40+% 3PT guy who can defend). All the guys have good character, all are known around the league for playing smart and hard. It doesn’t add a true second star, but I think this squad could make noise and if Keegan develops well, be a contender.

it's miles better than ur previous scenario but still no where close to a chip against teams like the bucks warriors 76ers suns nets (healthy), heat.

Well, ya. I dont think we can build a team to truly compete with the elite squads unless we win the lotto or have a star force his way here (lol). But I think this is a 'give em hell' squad that could go deep if the cookie crumbles our way with an outside chance that Keegan develops into a upper tier star and elevates the team to that position. (Also, the team is built to work well around him as well should he surprise and be a great player from the start)

[Norm2953]

I think it absurd to picture Portland under the best of circumstances this summer, putting together
a roster that would challenge the elite teams.

Grant is one summer from wanting to get paid and is hardly the guy to really challenge the Paul George's
of the world. To get that guy, we likely have to draft that guy and its going to take that guy some time
to get acclimated to the league. I continue to wonder how enthusiastic Dame will be after watching
this team lose 15-17 of the remaining games left on the schedule. Portland is fielding a team that has
Ant and Hart as the only players good enough to be in most team's rotation.

I really don't see any better approach than an incremental approach. That likely would displease Dame
but what can they do for the two best players after Dame are both free agents and if Nurk walks, the
team has nobody behind him. Draft two good young players to supplement the players on hand and
either use the non tax MLE or TPE to add another piece (if they can).

Lets say they play Winslow and Hart up front with Nurk and have Dame/Ant at guard at the start of 22/23.
They bring Little, unknown player acquired via TPE or MLE and draft one of Duren, Murray, Jovic, Sharpe,
Murthin, etc with the higher FRP and grab a backup center or one of the big shooting guards who slips
to 14.That team is better than the team we see on the court right now an at least would not be the
embarrassment they are right now, even if Dame asks out.

Be patient for if they stink up the floor next year, the 2023 draft with a superstar like Victor W, is going
to resemble the 2003 draft class.

[BlazersBroncos]

I wonder if CHA would want to get out of Gordon's deal once they max Miles. If so maybe Bledsoe, Winslow, Didi for Gordon? A little draft luck and we get Paolo + sign Anderson to MLE. Use the later LP on someone like Keegan Murray.

G - Damian Lillard / Anfernee Simons
G - Anfernee Simons / Josh Hart
F - Gordon Hayward / Nas Little
F - Kyle Anderson / Keegan Murray
C - Jusuf Nurkic / Paolo Banchero

One can dream.

[GEE]

My dream still, is that ORL lands the #1 and takes Chet, and those crazy ping-pong balls get us into the #2 pick to land Jabari.

Trading Dame to HOU on draft night, for the #2 pick, plus their other best FRP and whatever else we can get from them would be an added bonus IMO, and would give us 4 picks in the top 16. Rebuild done!

The brightness of Dame's star is fading IMO, and a move to HOU would allow him to build/recruit his own team down there(which I don't think will happen here), while enjoying that tax-free money in what is, or was, the 3rd largest NBA market. He would also likely get that extension that Portland, may be hesitant in offering. HOU already has alot of young movable assets on short deals that they could move for win now Vets to put around Dame. No idea if Dame can recruit/build a winner down there, but he surely would get paid a small fortune, expanding and selling his brand/shoes to millions of Chinese NBA fans. Huge untapped market for his music down in H-Town too, I would imagine.

Bring Dame back to Portland for his last year, retire the letter O, and hang it in the rafters as the greatest Blazers' scorer of all time. No Love Lost for Dame... just business, and the best scenario for all IMO.

2022-23 Blazers:
ANT / Williams / Wall(1yr remaining)
Hart / Keon / FRP
Winslow / Little / FRP
Jabari / Watford / Brown
Nurkic / Eubanks / Williams(Duke)

[wjun15]

Crazy Idea but if somehow we can trade Simons to Raptors in a trade for Siakam (i dont know, maybe they want simons instead of van fleet for future? ) AND we gave our pelicans pick to Pistons for Grant:

PG: Dame
SG: Hart
SF: Siakam
PF: Grant
C: Nurkic

would be a killer starting lineup. And Nas playing the 2, 3, and even 4 gives us 4 legit wing defenders. Bring instant offense Brandon Williams off bench. Watford at the backup PF. C = ?

Does this even work salary cap wise?

Or trade Dame in a three way to get Siakam and keep Simons where we will have more flexibility in terms of $$

just a thought

[Cowology]

Greetings Blazer fans - I come in peace!!

I'll preface this by saying I'm of the opinion that you guys should blow it up and send Dame to a contender so he has a chance to win. That said, IF you are still trying to compete I'm curious how you view the Simons/Hart situation. I don't put much stock in "rumors", but if the Blazers actually wanted Jerami Grant then I'd suggest...

Grant/Olynyk for Hart/Bledsoe

The Pistons just waive Bledsoe & add another $15 mil to their cap (effectively erasing Olynyk). Hart's looked fantastic since the trade and I think would be a very good fit next to Cade. I'd rather have him than a mid 1st-rounder who *might* be that good one day.

You wind up absorbing Olynyk, but he's a serviceable bench guy for a "win now" club and it allows you to still have your TPE and all your picks to fill some of the other gaps around Dame/Simons/Grant/Nurkic. Obviously a lot hinges on how you feel about the direction of your club & the Simons/Hart situation, but fire away...

[JRoy]

Greetings Blazer fans - I come in peace!!

I'll preface this by saying I'm of the opinion that you guys should blow it up and send Dame to a contender so he has a chance to win. That said, IF you are still trying to compete I'm curious how you view the Simons/Hart situation. I don't put much stock in "rumors", but if the Blazers actually wanted Jerami Grant then I'd suggest...

Grant/Olynyk for Hart/Bledsoe

The Pistons just waive Bledsoe & add another $15 mil to their cap (effectively erasing Olynyk). Hart's looked fantastic since the trade and I think would be a very good fit next to Cade. I'd rather have him than a mid 1st-rounder who *might* be that good one day.

You wind up absorbing Olynyk, but he's a serviceable bench guy for a "win now" club and it allows you to still have your TPE and all your picks to fill some of the other gaps around Dame/Simons/Grant/Nurkic. Obviously a lot hinges on how you feel about the direction of your club & the Simons/Hart situation, but fire away...

Thanks for the thoughtful post.

POR fans seem to be split on Grant; some see him as the ideal 3rd wheel on a contender.

I see him as 4th-5th best starter on a contender. He’s about to get paid and we would have to overpay a guy who is a nice player but ultimately not the difference maker POR ought to pursue.

[Wizenheimer]

The brightness of Dame's star is fading IMO

you must have that message on speed-dial because it's about the hundredth time you've said it in the last few months

[Norm2953]

It'd be nice to know how Dame's rehab is going.

In his workouts, only the Blazers know if he's looking like the old Dame.

[Cowology]

Greetings Blazer fans - I come in peace!!

I'll preface this by saying I'm of the opinion that you guys should blow it up and send Dame to a contender so he has a chance to win. That said, IF you are still trying to compete I'm curious how you view the Simons/Hart situation. I don't put much stock in "rumors", but if the Blazers actually wanted Jerami Grant then I'd suggest...

Grant/Olynyk for Hart/Bledsoe

The Pistons just waive Bledsoe & add another $15 mil to their cap (effectively erasing Olynyk). Hart's looked fantastic since the trade and I think would be a very good fit next to Cade. I'd rather have him than a mid 1st-rounder who *might* be that good one day.

You wind up absorbing Olynyk, but he's a serviceable bench guy for a "win now" club and it allows you to still have your TPE and all your picks to fill some of the other gaps around Dame/Simons/Grant/Nurkic. Obviously a lot hinges on how you feel about the direction of your club & the Simons/Hart situation, but fire away...

Thanks for the thoughtful post.

POR fans seem to be split on Grant; some see him as the ideal 3rd wheel on a contender.

I see him as 4th-5th best starter on a contender. He’s about to get paid and we would have to overpay a guy who is a nice player but ultimately not the difference maker POR ought to pursue.

The Pistons board is pretty split on him too. Some think he works fine with Cade/Bey, but I don't like him taking shots from our youth. He's a solid 2-way player who brings good defense, but is a piss poor rebounder (my biggest complaint).

Many would disagree, but I think he's best as your 2nd/3rd option. A lot of his 3's do come off catch & shoot situations, but at his core he's still an iso-scorer. Nobody wants an iso-scorer as their 4th/5th option. You want those guys able to play off your superstars and be effective without needing the ball in their hands.

I've previously equated him to somebody like Tobias, who has struggled since Embiid/Harden have been dominating the ball. It's guys like Maxey who have thrived with all the attention those guys draw. You can put Grant in that situation and he'll be OK, but it's not his strength and he probably won't be super happy about it.

Now whether he's actually good enough to be your 2nd/3rd option on a contender is another story entirely. Maybe, but probably not. I guess it depends on the team. He's not that far behind somebody like Middleton. If you have a solid team then he can fill the role, but he's not the type of guy that is going to elevate you all by himself (as evident by the Pistons record).

[Norm2953]

Give my regards to Vege whom I've gone back and forth with for perhaps 10 years when we used
to argue over the merits of Detroit trading Tayshaun Prince to Portland for Nicolas Batum.

Pistons are actually one of my favorite teams. I was happy for them when Sheed helped them win
a championship with Chauncey. They are doing what Blazer management is afraid of doing which
is build slowly and carefully. Teams that have the patience to do a proper rebuild can get the job
done if management has hired great personnel guys and have the discipline to manage their cap
to not hard cap themselves for a team that can't win a championship.

[wjun15]

Greetings Blazer fans - I come in peace!!

I'll preface this by saying I'm of the opinion that you guys should blow it up and send Dame to a contender so he has a chance to win. That said, IF you are still trying to compete I'm curious how you view the Simons/Hart situation. I don't put much stock in "rumors", but if the Blazers actually wanted Jerami Grant then I'd suggest...

Grant/Olynyk for Hart/Bledsoe

The Pistons just waive Bledsoe & add another $15 mil to their cap (effectively erasing Olynyk). Hart's looked fantastic since the trade and I think would be a very good fit next to Cade. I'd rather have him than a mid 1st-rounder who *might* be that good one day.

You wind up absorbing Olynyk, but he's a serviceable bench guy for a "win now" club and it allows you to still have your TPE and all your picks to fill some of the other gaps around Dame/Simons/Grant/Nurkic. Obviously a lot hinges on how you feel about the direction of your club & the Simons/Hart situation, but fire away...

Thanks for the thoughtful post.

POR fans seem to be split on Grant; some see him as the ideal 3rd wheel on a contender.

I see him as 4th-5th best starter on a contender. He’s about to get paid and we would have to overpay a guy who is a nice player but ultimately not the difference maker POR ought to pursue.

Grant is an excellent 3rd wheel. but the question is is Simons ready for a 2nd wheel on a contending team...

[Goldbum]

So let's say we get Grant for the Pels pick and the TPE.
Then we package
Hart
Didi
Watford
Both second round picks
4
Christian Wood

Starters:
Dame
Ant
Grant
Wood
Nurkic

BENCH:
Keon
Winslow
Our pick(Eason/Murray or Duren)
GB3
Eubanks
Dunn
Nas

2 way:
B.Will

IDK if we could get them both and keep our pick but I like that team

[Case2012]

I’m good on Wood. Don’t like his motor and demeanor at all and for someone that fought hard to stay in the league he seems a bit entitled. Having said that, I don’t think he’s worth Hart straight up let alone what you’ve attached.

[HoopsFanAZ]

1. Lillard, Simons, and Hart look like a legit 3-guard line-up. [I’d prefer not to touch it unless Lillard is traded in a complete overhaul to go young … and IMHO this team could look like the Suns, now, pretty quickly.]

2. Nurkic needs a backup. Not seeing it on the team.
3. Little and Ingles at the 3? Already on the team.
4. Grant for the N.O. pick? Playing both forward spots. Having 3 forwards who can shoot would be a nice change.
5. A legit PF drafted. And still need a free agent veteran PF/C who can move and bang and defend …
6. Watford, Winslow, Brown and Eubanks in a free-for-all, cage match, royal rumble for available minutes.

7. EBEC (Bledsoe) is for trades as filler (Grant) or option paid off. Keon Johnson is athletic and a project. The rest are end of the bench candidates who should get beaten out vs. free agents.

IMHO, that’s a top 5 playoff team in the West given good health. Contending? Maybe. Get them all together with Billups and find out.